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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 5 to 29 of 29. Go back in thread:
Posted by SusanG on April 28, 2002, at 17:02:49
In reply to 'My Poor Joe', posted by kazoo on April 28, 2002, at 0:10:06
Kazoo, I have a suggestion though you may not feel you are ready for it. I highly recommend you read a book called "The Art of Forgiveness" by Robin Casarjian. Now, before you dismiss this idea by saying, "I'll be damned if I forgive anyone!", let me just say that you don't have to be ready to do so to benefit from this book. It's about you and what this is doing to you, not about letting anyone off the hook or excusing what has been done. I'll bet your local library has it, maybe even on tape which means you can just pop it in and listen away. I encourage you consider it, even if you don't think you want to. Take care.
Posted by kazoo on April 29, 2002, at 0:32:03
In reply to 'My Poor Joe', posted by kazoo on April 28, 2002, at 0:10:06
> http://www.geocities.com/mypoorjoe/
>
> kazooLet me tell you why I called the site "My Poor Joe" (and I should have included this on the site itself, as I will soon).
A little history first ...
My brother Joseph was killed in 1994 by "indifference," the unpardonable sin in my book. He had a problem with alcohol and wandered into an unprotected construction site in the middle of a typical New England town, in view of 6 people working on the small room. The temperature dropped to 4 degrees on January 7, and he froze to death. He couldn't get out when he woke up and used his cigarette lighter to find the door. When he did find the door, he was just too weak and cold to smash it open. But the point is that here was a man in this small room under construction, with all sorts of people around, yet not one helped him. Not one. And they locked him in. So, this was clear case of manslaughter, yet the Connecticut State Police thought otherwise ("Just another drunk dying.").
I've lived in this Peyton Place for 48 years, and they know my family, and all knew my brother Joseph.
But not one had the decency to help him.
Not one.
My parents, especially my mother, were devastated, and never quite got over it.
My Ma saved all of Joe's papers, books, personal items in a file cabinet by her rocking chair in her bedroom.
Night after night she would sit there going through these papers, crying "My poor Joe ... my poor Joe."
My heart ached so much seeing her do this.
And I saw this year, after year, after year.
And my heart ached year, after year, after year.
And where was my sister?
Where was that horrible, self-centered, ego-centric, narcisstic, mean-spirited, black-hearted, bitch-sister of mine at the time of his death?
She was in Arizona, at a spa.
When I called her with this news, she had three days to return for the wake and funeral.
She did not return.
She didn't care.
She was just like those people who locked Joe in that room.
I was devastated.
My whole family, as well as Joe's family, was devastated.
And this was the way my sister, the "new" Ms. Moreau, treated everybody in my family for many years prior, and still doing.
Now, with unexpected death of my mother, she is circling around like a vulture, ripping off anything she can.
She even appropriated my parent's burial money.
You have no idea of what I am going through.
I know this kind of thing happens all the time with others, and in all these years I cared for my mother (as well as for Joe and my father), I received NO HELP AT ALL from my sister whom I would rather see suffering with excruciating pain, if not six feet under.
So, there's the reason for "My Poor Joe."
As far as forgiveness goes: this will not happen.
My sister is no more.
She, as well as my nephews and niece, stink.
I apologize for the bitterness.
I am under quite a strain with the appearance of a new ulcer.
Thank you all for all your kind words.
But you have to live through something like this (as some have told me here) to really "appreciate" the depths of depravity that some incurr on others.
"My poor Joe ..."
kazoo
Posted by scared on April 29, 2002, at 2:57:42
In reply to 'My Poor Joe', posted by kazoo on April 28, 2002, at 0:10:06
you need help - you are so full of hate, that you have become just as evil as the object of your hatred
you ought to be prosecuted for the trash that you put up on those websites
sick
Posted by judy1 on April 29, 2002, at 3:51:05
In reply to Re: 'My Poor Joe' Reason for the title., posted by kazoo on April 29, 2002, at 0:32:03
for your obvious pain. I understand not being able to forgive, but look at the power you've given your sister by allowing her to affect you so deeply. I am a survivor of sexual abuse and I wear my hate on scars that I've inflicted on my body, I see no difference here kazoo- how much of your life are you willing to lose to such an unworthy person? I sincerely hope you begin to heal soon. Take care of yourself- Judy
Posted by beardedlady on April 29, 2002, at 7:08:23
In reply to kazoo - you are sick and wrong, posted by scared on April 29, 2002, at 2:57:42
This, I believe, is a shining example of what Dr. Bob would call accusatory, hurtful, and unsupportive. Not that you have to support Kazoo's web site, but there are other ways of helping someone you think is "sick." And if the person in question has some mental health issues (as we all do), name calling is certainly not the way to help him get better.
beardy : (>
Posted by SusanG on April 29, 2002, at 7:38:19
In reply to I'm so sorry..... » kazoo, posted by judy1 on April 29, 2002, at 3:51:05
Kazoo, Judy is so right, the forgiveness is for you, to help you lessen your very justified anger and hatred that are tearing you up. It could free you from at least some of this horrible pain you are in. I know it is difficult to hear the "f" word right now, so don't think of it as "forgiving". Think of it as releasing yourself from the pain and the powerful hold this person has on you; she is not worth the emotional toll you are paying. I really think you could benefit from reading that book (listening to it on tape is even better)even though I'm sure the concept of forgiving is one you can't or don't want to imagine. But please consider doing it for you. 'Nuff said by me on this.
Posted by tina on April 29, 2002, at 7:38:20
In reply to kazoo - you are sick and wrong, posted by scared on April 29, 2002, at 2:57:42
all your feelings. SOmetimes when you have nowhere and no one to let it out at, you must scream it out somewhere and Kazoo screams it at the Poor Joe site. It's not sick, it's actually healthy.
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 29, 2002, at 8:12:37
In reply to accusatory posts » scared, posted by beardedlady on April 29, 2002, at 7:08:23
> you need help - you are so full of hate, that you have become just as evil as the object of your hatred
>
> you ought to be prosecuted for the trash that you put up on those websites
>
> scared> This, I believe, is a shining example of what Dr. Bob would call accusatory, hurtful, and unsupportive. Not that you have to support Kazoo's web site, but there are other ways of helping someone you think is "sick." And if the person in question has some mental health issues (as we all do), name calling is certainly not the way to help him get better.
>
> beardy : (>I just want to second what Beardy said.
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Bob
PS: Further follow-ups or complaints about posts should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration; otherwise, they may be deleted. Thanks.
Posted by CtrlAlt n Del on April 29, 2002, at 10:07:46
In reply to Re: 'My Poor Joe' Reason for the title., posted by kazoo on April 29, 2002, at 0:32:03
Kazoo..
I've nothing to say..take care sweetness
Posted by IsoM on April 29, 2002, at 11:12:13
In reply to Re: 'My Poor Joe' Reason for the title., posted by kazoo on April 29, 2002, at 0:32:03
All I can say is "oh, my God..."
I have no words to describe what's been done to you, your Mom, & brother. I'm so SO sorry, Kazoo. I'm completely dumb-struck that anyone supposedly human could be so inhuman. I don't know what to say.For your sake, is there anyway that you can deal with the pain & righteous rage without it consuming you? I don't want you to go through the rest of your life like your Mom did. Like I said before, forgiveness is only when there's something to forgive - and there's no repentance obviously on your demon-sister's part. But is there any therapy that can teach/help you deal with the hatred & rage so it won't consume you? Any resources where you live? Please find some way to deal with all this pain before it irreparably harms you too. You don't want 'her' to win again.
To anyone who may condemn you, they have no idea what something like this does to a person(s). Ignore such comments please but find a way to deal with all this that will help you heal. The scar will always remain but I'd hate to see it fester under the surface until its poison spreads throughout. You're a wonderful person, Kazoo. You deserve to feel better.
Posted by IsoM on April 29, 2002, at 11:18:35
In reply to kazoo - you are sick and wrong, posted by scared on April 29, 2002, at 2:57:42
Scared, until you've been in Kazoo's shoes & mind, don't judge her. What you wrote is not supportive of her or others. Please consider rephrasing your comments in a kinder way next time - you'll reach more people with open minds if done in a more considerate way.
> > "you are so full of hate, that you have become just as evil as the object of your hatred"
please don't accuse others
> > "you ought to be prosecuted for the trash that you put up on those websites"
please don't make rash judgements of others
> > "sick"
yes, Kazzo's sick - sick with a painful heart, not her mind.
Posted by Shar on April 29, 2002, at 13:07:14
In reply to PLEASE be civil » scared, posted by IsoM on April 29, 2002, at 11:18:35
Kazoo,
I am like IsoM. So shocked, disbelieving that people can be so inhumane; that your family has been so traumatized, your mom's heart was broken. God, it is almost too much to bear to think of being the one watching over the family all of that time, trying to keep things afloat.If you ever forgive your uncaring relatives, it will probably take a lot of time to get there. This strikes so deep in your heart. Your anger is understood. I hope that somehow you can shift something around so you aren't hurting yourself with ulcers and the like. I don't know the answer to that one--something that will achieve some measure of psychological distance. Maybe meditation if you do that, biofeedback, you know, just using your mind to regulate or normalize your body functions (blood pressure, breathing, pulse) back to normal for 10 minutes a day. Forgiveness is nice and will probably come, but I doubt if it's right around the corner. In the meantime, you are in pain.
Shar
Posted by Krazy Kat on April 29, 2002, at 16:26:12
In reply to 'My Poor Joe', posted by kazoo on April 28, 2002, at 0:10:06
here's an entirely different perspective - revenge is the best medicine. if i were to share this with my hubby, that would be his Immediate response.
murder is not a good option, as it compromises your own safety. she obviously could care less what you think of her. hitting her financially is probably the best revenge of all. or take away whatever else is the most precious to her? her "significant other" as you mentioned, or her freedom? does she run in a social circle that you could ostracize her from?
hmmm. I mean this very seriously. kharma.
i wish sar were here to comment - she'd have a good one.
will think of you, kazoo.
- kk
Posted by SusanG on April 29, 2002, at 19:09:02
In reply to Any Help At All? » kazoo, posted by IsoM on April 29, 2002, at 11:12:13
I withdraw my suggestion of "forgiveness". I know you are not at all in a place to even consider it, not at this time, maybe never. I guess what I am trying to say is what others have said here without the "f" word. That is that this is clearly so painful for you and I hope you can come to a point where you will let go of some of the anger, hate, and pain since at this point it serves no purpose but to make you miserable. Like IsoM mentioned, maybe there are resources to help you get through this pain, whether or not you end up forgiving. And please understand that I do not mean that by forgiving you are in any way removing the responsibility from those who have done horrible things to your family. It is all about you finding peace. I hope you do.
Posted by scared on April 29, 2002, at 22:19:07
In reply to Re: please be civil » scared, posted by Dr. Bob on April 29, 2002, at 8:12:37
I have reported the libel to Yahoo and geocities.com; hopefully, they will remove the trash that kazoo so sickenly posted.
sick
shame
Posted by Shar on April 29, 2002, at 22:53:06
In reply to So, libel is OK then???, posted by scared on April 29, 2002, at 22:19:07
You know, Scared's post and action is one of a few recent threats to people based on what they've said on this board. I'm uncomfortable with the idea that my posts will be used against me or others, based on somebody sitting in judgment about what I say, and then "reporting" it to whatever authorities can be found to listen.
Can you ban such a person permanently? Or, would you consider it?
Shar
Posted by scared on April 29, 2002, at 23:11:37
In reply to Dr. Bob---reporting others is not so supportive., posted by Shar on April 29, 2002, at 22:53:06
If you don't libel someone, then you can't be reported, right?
If you *do* libel someone, like kazoo did (I'm sure kazoo's mom is saddened by kazoo's actions.), then you deserve to be reported, no?
P.S. I'll be re-registering under a new name/IP address.
Posted by Zo on April 30, 2002, at 1:32:29
In reply to 'My Poor Joe', posted by kazoo on April 28, 2002, at 0:10:06
Posted by beardedlady on April 30, 2002, at 6:31:39
In reply to Re: Dr. Bob---reporting others is not so supportive., posted by scared on April 29, 2002, at 23:11:37
Scared:
I have no idea why the actions of Kazoo would bother you so much. Nor do I understand why you'd want to be a part of the community you've threatened and sneered at since your first post here. (Sorry, but I don't remember you from much earlier than this week.)
It seems to me, though, that this has touched you very deeply--to the point of wishing to hurt others. I hope you are able to get some help.
Two last comments, though. In order for something to be libel, it has to be false. And I believe Kazoo's mother is dead.
beardy : (>
Posted by beardedlady on April 30, 2002, at 6:59:42
In reply to libel, etc. » scared, posted by beardedlady on April 30, 2002, at 6:31:39
Is this really the kind of response we have to limit ourselves to when threatened by someone we'd like to see severely punished? Do you think it's natural--or even desireable--to reply in a way that supports a person like scared? And do you think it's possible to ignore someone whose speech is really hurtful, hateful, spiteful?
I know that responding to it is not productive. But it's instinct. Even reading the posts is like slowing down to glimpse an accident. But don't you think you could give us a little leeway to protect our territory? Can't the board dogs just come out and pee everywhere?
Yes, you're right. Then the whole place would stink instead of a couple scared little spots. Questions answered, then, I suppose.
beardy
Posted by kazoo on May 2, 2002, at 3:10:23
In reply to kazoo - you are sick and wrong, posted by scared on April 29, 2002, at 2:57:42
> you need help - you are so full of hate, that you have become just as evil as the object of your hatred
>
> you ought to be prosecuted for the trash that you put up on those websites
>
> sickAm I sick?
Yes, I am sick.
And I'm tired, too.
Put them together you get "Sick & Tired."Mr. Sick meet Mr. Tired:
SICK: "Hello, how are you?
TIRED: "I'm tired."
SICK: "Is that a fact?"
TIRED: "You tell me. You're the one that's sick."
SICK: "But I can't. I'm too sick to determine anything."
TIRED: "Is that a fact?"
SICK: "?"There's no legalities here with "prosecution."
There's something called FREE SPEECH ON LINE endorsed by the ACLU.
I'm a card carrying member of that fine organization: http://www.aclu.org
Besides, I couldn't care less if I am prosecuted. I have more lawyer friends than you can shake a stick at.
But out of courtesy to you (and others), I removed the vulgarities.I plan to add to this site as events unfold.
And lastly, if you should happen to be standing in my shoes one of these days, then maybe you will get some inkling of what I'm going through, and of the barbaric nature of someone with no heart, conscience, ethics or morals.
By the way, I didn't use the word "WHORE" in the sexual sense applicable only to women, but in the "money" sense, as in MONEY WHORE, applicable to men as well. It was never my intention to offend any gender or person in the group. My site is directed to my sister exclusively.
But for your edification, some of the biggest SEXUAL WHORES I've known, been with, and tricked with, were the male prostitutes along Central Park West, NYC.
Thank you for your opinion; however, it changes nothing in the way I feel.
(a very depressed) kazoo
Posted by Willow on May 2, 2002, at 21:32:37
In reply to Re: kazoo - you are sick and wrong 'Thank you' » scared, posted by kazoo on May 2, 2002, at 3:10:23
> Am I sick?
I wouldn't go so far as to say that you are sick, but grieving yes, and that you don't have a family network to share the grief with.
> And I'm tired, too.
You once inquired "chronic" what. I'm chronically tired. Is it caused by my body shutting down or my mind, or is there a relation between the two? Some of these questions are better left to philosphers and scientists, us regular folk should just go dancing.> Besides, I couldn't care less if I am prosecuted. I have more lawyer friends than you can shake a stick at.
Kazoo, you are full of contradictions. It wasn't too long ago I recall you telling lawyer jokes.
> But out of courtesy to you (and others), I removed the vulgarities.
and out of respect for yourself. Don't forget in this difficult time, you are a valued member of our little cyber community. The past twelve months for you haven't been kind. In my heart I hope you are able to find leisure activities even if it's work to help move these events into your past.
> And lastly, if you should happen to be standing in my shoes one of these days,You know nothing would make me happier then to be able to stand on your toes and dance an evening away.
> My site is directed to my sister exclusively.
Few things have caused me personal pain as strong as that that my siblings have done. Sadly how I've protected myself from futures happenings is distancing myself from their families, but this solution has also been at a cost to me. My nieces may grow up only knowing me as an acquaintance, not the aunt that I feel I am. I just have enough faith and trust to believe that all in all things will work out. And sometimes these family hurts are better left hidden.
> (a very depressed) kazoo
I'm going to make a remark about meds. They seem to have been helping me, but they're not a cure. Perhaps with the help of a trusting physician/therapist you may be able to find some help.Inside you I believe ther still is that fun loving guy. I want to be able to see him shine again. I wish I could hold you, wipe away your tears concerning the injustices in this world, and listen as you purge yourself of past imagined and real demons.
Whispering Willow
Posted by shar on May 3, 2002, at 0:03:57
In reply to Oh Precious! » kazoo, posted by Willow on May 2, 2002, at 21:32:37
Kazoo,
Hope you are hanging in. I do that a lot...just hang. Sometimes that is quite an accomplishment. Willow is right, this has been a year in which life has thrown you some powerful curves, and we all do the best we can under those conditions...holding on to that last inch of rope...Here's to a good grip.Shar
Posted by kazoo on May 3, 2002, at 1:53:40
In reply to Kazoo, posted by shar on May 3, 2002, at 0:03:57
> Here's to a good grip.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Be careful where (and what!) you grip.That's not a handle you're holding!
:-) a smiling kazoo
Posted by wendy b. on May 3, 2002, at 8:52:43
In reply to Re: Kazoo » shar, posted by kazoo on May 3, 2002, at 1:53:40
> > Here's to a good grip.
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> Be careful where (and what!) you grip.
>
> That's not a handle you're holding!
>
> :-) a smiling kazoo
HE'S BACK! With that same frisky attitude!Here's a toast to the resilience of the human spirit!
heart going out to you, Kazoo-Meister,Wendy
This is the end of the thread.
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