![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Pritzker on October 10, 2000, at 18:11:36
I am so glad to have found this site. I have visted this website a couple of times before, but I never realized that I can carry on social relationships on here. This is exactly what I have been looking for-- a safe and nonphysical way of communication.
I am a pre-med student in an accrediated college. My current dream is to be a MD/PHD candidate. Since I have gotton a C and a C+ in my Organic Chemistry classes, and I had to take time off from school for psychological reasons, the dream of Medical School seem impossible. Not to mention expecting the government to consider me as a MD/PHD student. Whenever, I think of this, I feel so depressed. Like last night, I has a good cry about it; and then I went back to my Biochemistry reading. Anyway, the real dilemna I have is the following: When I resumed my studies, I was committed to periodically see a staff member at the SrC building (long-term therapy). I really resented the fact that I had to go see this DR.T. After a very short while, I became very attracted and attached to the secure environment and staff members at the SrC building. The main problem with me is that I look down upon my fellow students since they do not have any credientials (unlike the professionals at the SrC building).
So, basically, I do not have any social relationships with anyone (except for those in my head). Through time and therapy with Dr.T, I have began to open up and become more animated toward the people around me. However, I still feel deeply attracted to the staff members at SrC (mainly Dr.T of course, Dr.Si, who is the director and a classical gentlemen, Mrs. W who has such a magical presence, and finally, this young witty guy called Dr.H who I have a crush on). The dilemna is that I often fantasize about these four staff members from SrC. I dearly want to be their friends, their colleagues, their buddies. I crave, I live for those kind of relationships with credientialled professionals. For instance, I work as a research assistant for this post-doc and through the usuage of therapeutic tactics I picked up from my own experience, I have successfully won him over such that our relationship now is on a buddy/colleague level rather than Mentor/student. I love this kind of interaction between us. However, this postdoc is just a lay civilian. It is just so much harder to win over the four staff members at SrC because they are all highly, very highly trained therapists and extremely intuitive and intelligent. So, in a way, I do look upon it as a challenge to win these professionals over. Let me re-introduce them before going on: Dr. T is a licensed social worker and has a Ph.D in social work; Dr. Si is a psychiatrist and the director of SrC (classical gentlemen, but a bit too serious); Dr. H who I have a crush on is also a psychiatrist (but he is extremely witty, intelligent, and most importantly a modern guy), and finally there is Mrs. W who I love to observe outside the SrC arena (she is a licensed social worker and she must be studying for a Ph.D or something because she likes to read intensively in a coffee shop on campus). In addition, there is M and K who are the receptionists of SrC (M has a very gentle and motherly presence and K is a little bit brittle and sharp at times). Finally, there is
Dr. S (not to be confused with Dr. Si)--Dr. S seemly awlfully wicked to me from our one time face-to-face meeting because she tried to push pills on me. I hate pills or chemical substance of any kind because it go against my confidence of my natural biochemical organism. To illustrate how much I hate pills, I thought about taking a bunch of sleeping pills, cold pills, synthetic alcohol in mixture when I contemplated suicide. I am firmly rooted in the belief that pills of any kind taken for a prolong period is bad for you. Psychotherapy or rather my own will and self-esteem works much much better for me. Although, at times it is a struggle to go through those dark, depressive periods cold. When I come out of the withdraw, I feel so cleansed. Now, back to my adoration for the staff members at SrC. I still do not have any friends from the student population. In fact, I have always felt that students are so naive and loose. Plus, I am not going to school to become a student, but rather a professional
physician. So, I think that is why I love to become friends with the people at SrC. In addition, I feel it is so much safer to align myself with them since their head must be screwed on pretty right to work in that building. I have high documented confidence in the kind of people that work at SrC. Enough that, now I am going to tell you about my problem in relation to the four above mentioned staff members of SrC:1) Mrs.W -- Mrs. W who is the licensed social worker who has a lyrical voice and fluid movement. Also, she is the only one who is young enough to be constrained to the strict boundaries of the academic therapeutic practice. She has a tendency to establish her physical presence at a popular coffee shop on campus. I love to stare at her, watch her, follow her when I see her. I have been forbidden by Dr.Si who is the director and the fatherly freudian figure of SrC to not talk to Mrs. W. But he did not say I could watch her if I see her outside of SrC! Ha! Ha! My fantasy in regard to Mrs. W is to drink coffee with her and just chat with her in general. Perhaps tell her about my woes and then let her lyrical and soothing voice consol me and put me into a trance. Oh, how I wish for that! Mrs. W, be my buddy and I'll give you my devoted loyalty.
2) Dr. T --My very experienced therapist. Dr.T is extremely strong emotionally (a bit weak on the analytical side-- a little slow or something). But she is catching on. Anyway, I like her because she can not be pushed around. I used to go to a therapist who if you praise him in therapy, he actually respond to it (meanwhile, I of course am thinking: go back to school, go see a therapist and deal with whatever insecurity you have). But Dr.T by the grace of God, time, and experiences has developed into a very secure and bounded therapist. I feel extremely safe to bound my troubles off her. At the beginning, she was a bit authoritian. But, in my interactions with professionals, I expect respect, and the willingness to acknowledge me as an equal. So, gradually over time, I think she is beginning to respond to me as most lay professionals do. That proves that my charisma and personality is genuine and on target (since we assuming DR. T is the ideal therapist). At least I am not totally crazy. Whew, that is a relief. As I mentioned before, I have been continually bothered by the fact that I had to go see her periodically as conditional to my status as a student. Recently, from my transferences upon her, my direct statement of discomfort over this conditional rule, and whatever other way of communication I could think of conscious and unconscious, she finally got the message after one year of our continual therapy sessions. Last session, she stated the classical termination statement(s) (you know, not having to see her unless some urgency develops or something to that effect). I think that was a very correct move on her part since now she and in a way SrC has put complete control and confidence into my hands. And I wouldn't let them down. Now, if I decide to go see her again, it would completely, absolutely be from my heart and mind. I love that! To earn that control back means a great deal to me. Now, my fantasies about her (almost every day; constantly). The theme is always to work side by side
with her in terms of assisting subjects in crisis. In our last session, I finally saw that flicker of respect and recognition that I am so use to seeing in other professional parties. For her to finally genuinely feel that is a great testment to me that despite my nervous breakdowns, depression, and suicidal thoughts, I am not completely off the track. I have always always felt so much more comfortable with adults of status than with students at large. I have always won respect, awe, recognition from adults and yet failed to establish meaningful relationships with students. Bottom line: It feels so right to be with these professionals and so awkward and uneasy with students. Why? I am still working on it. For the sake of my sanity, I can not just sit and wait for the students to catch up. I desperately want to have the kind of relationships that students have with their fellow students. But, I just can not no matter how hard I try. I am so jealous of students and their innocence. Relationships
for me has always been established on the basis of self-interest and personal goals. To give up my selfishness would be to loose my hold on my personhood. I just couldn't do it. Dr.T, she rocks in more ways than one (whatever that means)!3) Dr.H -- cute, young, successful, intelligent, and has a witty personality. I actually have never met Dr.H in person. I got to know him through chance meetings and from his websites. In my fantasy world, he is going to always be unmarried. Like I mentioned above, Dr.H is a psychiatrist. However, from what I can observed and conclude from the available data, he does not seem to fit the classical, serious, mute freudian type of a psychiatrist. First of all, Dr.H is a master of the Internet. Freud using the Web, come-on... Off-hand, I would think that Dr. H's therapy techniques are very mobile, radical with restraints, and a breath of fresh air. I would love to have a session with him just to satisify my curiosity. It does not even have to be in SrC. My fantasy regarding him would be to go on a semi-formal date with him where he can just analyze me to his heart content. And I can just silently observe and hypothesize and of course fantasize away to my hearts content. That would be the ultimate
date in my book. It would be great if our "date" would conclude with him kissing me on the back of my hand or on my cheek like a proper gentlemen or prince. Reality check! You know the only two sources of data gathering I have on Dr.H is the chance meeting on campus or at SrC; and from his websites and e-mails. It gives me a conflicting picture of him. From his websites, e-mails, telephone message (computer geez has a computerized musical message recorder--go figure); anyway, from the ex-SrC setting, Dr.H comes across as a witty intelligent guy. Yet, from what I observed at SrC, he is a serious but boyish curious psychiatrist. That is the only place he acts remotely like a psychiatrist. Wierd guy-- must be a genius or something. Wierd, just wierd. But I am very mad and hurt by him. I e-mailed him recently with a proposal for a therapy based Internet club. However, he must have figured out that I am a client at SrC because he has not returned my e-mail yet. Probably never will! I hate him!
I hate him so much for giving me false hope. For a while there we had a sort of back-and-forth e-mail exchange going under a false pretense on my part. Then, I must have slipped and he figured out who I am. Now, he does not write back to me anymore. I am so hurt since I was really counting on him to brighten my day. I know that he did not meant for this to happen since I set myself up for this. But where am I going to find a cute, successful, witty, and most importantly, safe and stable gentlemen again. Not to mention cute (I saw him in a tight body suit on a summer day once). Wow! The whole package.4) Dr. Si-- the "big cheese"; although Dr.T would feel a pinch of jealousy to hear me say this. What can I say? A classical gentlemen. Old and experienced. He lives on the same street as I do. I have never seen him on the street through (it is a long, long street). But I have called his house and not say anything just to hear his voice and his wife's voice. He is a very kind and caring man. But he has a whole institution to run, so he is stern and serious but a good man. I can still recall our one and only meeting. I was totally, uterally silent (long psychoanalytical training for that amount of restraint). During that time, he relaxed by writing in a notebook (classical therapy method that one do not see much these days!). One of my fantasy of him of course borders on the stories of being in that intense therapeutic setting again and getting him to break his restraint and to talk and respond to me. It would be a challenge I would gladly take on just for the heck of it. I was so jealous of this one 2nd year Medical student. I saw Dr. Si talking to her in a very relaxed way (leaning against the wall)for almost an hour, in the Medical School lobby. Oh, why oh why can't you talk to me like that, Dr. Si. I would go to the Medical School and become a 2nd year Medical student just to have this one chance of looking in your eye and hold a genuine yet relaxed conversation with you. Come on, give me a chance, forget that I once was in crisis-- see me in a professional light. Be my buddy! My other fantasies of Dr. Si are along the lines of parental (fatherhood). It is very tempting for me to see him as my father. A wise, old, and experienced guy who is kind and a therapist...perfect, ideal father for me. Too bad it is ideal and therefore by definition, unachievable. I bet Mrs. W and some of the younger therapists at SrC also regard Dr. Si as a parental counselor. I think that is part of the reason why I want to be in Mrs. W's shoes because then I can be encumbered under the wings of Dr.Si.
So, everybody and anybody who bothered to read up to this point, thank you foremost; and help me. Help me by responding to this thread and be my realsistic buddies that I crave so much at this point in my development. After extensive thoughts, and this LONG e-mail, it has made me realize the futility of my fantasies about Mrs.W, Dr.T, Dr.H, and Dr. Si. I could never be aligned with them because their line of work encumbers them behind the walls of SrC building. For me to wish to be their buddies would be literally like pounding against the wall until I am just drained of energy. And I still suffering from occasional short bouts of depression, do not have any energy to spare. I still feel deep down inside the dream of one day becoming a physician burning a hole in my heart. I want it, I want it so bad because doctorship is such a worthy cause and a noble cause. I truly feel that I would be happy as a physician, and more importantly as a healer in a community. The one thing my "nervous breakdown" has
made me realize is the absolute necessity of status and respect that I need to feel happy. Hopefully, ten or fifteen years from now, I would grow out of that need (but right now, I can't without going totally depressed and withdrawn). So, my proposal to the readers of this network is to give me feedback (any and all feedback). I desperately need responses from real people. In return, I promise, to read and consider your troubles and woes and to respond to your e-mails. I need to feel like a healer, a buddy, and a friend.
Cordially and sincere thanks for reading all the way to the conclusion,
YOURS TRULY
Posted by Pritzker on October 10, 2000, at 19:53:53
In reply to Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by Pritzker on October 10, 2000, at 18:11:36
> Please! Write something/anything under my thread. Please.
I am so glad to have found this site. I have visted this website a couple of times before, but I never realized that I can carry on social relationships on here. This is exactly what I have been looking for-- a safe and nonphysical way of communication.
>
> I am a pre-med student in an accrediated college. My current dream is to be a MD/PHD candidate. Since I have gotton a C and a C+ in my Organic Chemistry classes, and I had to take time off from school for psychological reasons, the dream of Medical School seem impossible. Not to mention expecting the government to consider me as a MD/PHD student. Whenever, I think of this, I feel so depressed. Like last night, I has a good cry about it; and then I went back to my Biochemistry reading. Anyway, the real dilemna I have is the following: When I resumed my studies, I was committed to periodically see a staff member at the SrC building (long-term therapy). I really resented the fact that I had to go see this DR.T. After a very short while, I became very attracted and attached to the secure environment and staff members at the SrC building. The main problem with me is that I look down upon my fellow students since they do not have any credientials (unlike the professionals at the SrC building).
> So, basically, I do not have any social relationships with anyone (except for those in my head). Through time and therapy with Dr.T, I have began to open up and become more animated toward the people around me. However, I still feel deeply attracted to the staff members at SrC (mainly Dr.T of course, Dr.Si, who is the director and a classical gentlemen, Mrs. W who has such a magical presence, and finally, this young witty guy called Dr.H who I have a crush on). The dilemna is that I often fantasize about these four staff members from SrC. I dearly want to be their friends, their colleagues, their buddies. I crave, I live for those kind of relationships with credientialled professionals. For instance, I work as a research assistant for this post-doc and through the usuage of therapeutic tactics I picked up from my own experience, I have successfully won him over such that our relationship now is on a buddy/colleague level rather than Mentor/student. I love this kind of interaction between us. However, this postdoc is just a lay civilian. It is just so much harder to win over the four staff members at SrC because they are all highly, very highly trained therapists and extremely intuitive and intelligent. So, in a way, I do look upon it as a challenge to win these professionals over. Let me re-introduce them before going on: Dr. T is a licensed social worker and has a Ph.D in social work; Dr. Si is a psychiatrist and the director of SrC (classical gentlemen, but a bit too serious); Dr. H who I have a crush on is also a psychiatrist (but he is extremely witty, intelligent, and most importantly a modern guy), and finally there is Mrs. W who I love to observe outside the SrC arena (she is a licensed social worker and she must be studying for a Ph.D or something because she likes to read intensively in a coffee shop on campus). In addition, there is M and K who are the receptionists of SrC (M has a very gentle and motherly presence and K is a little bit brittle and sharp at times). Finally, there is
> Dr. S (not to be confused with Dr. Si)--Dr. S seemly awlfully wicked to me from our one time face-to-face meeting because she tried to push pills on me. I hate pills or chemical substance of any kind because it go against my confidence of my natural biochemical organism. To illustrate how much I hate pills, I thought about taking a bunch of sleeping pills, cold pills, synthetic alcohol in mixture when I contemplated suicide. I am firmly rooted in the belief that pills of any kind taken for a prolong period is bad for you. Psychotherapy or rather my own will and self-esteem works much much better for me. Although, at times it is a struggle to go through those dark, depressive periods cold. When I come out of the withdraw, I feel so cleansed. Now, back to my adoration for the staff members at SrC. I still do not have any friends from the student population. In fact, I have always felt that students are so naive and loose. Plus, I am not going to school to become a student, but rather a professional
> physician. So, I think that is why I love to become friends with the people at SrC. In addition, I feel it is so much safer to align myself with them since their head must be screwed on pretty right to work in that building. I have high documented confidence in the kind of people that work at SrC. Enough that, now I am going to tell you about my problem in relation to the four above mentioned staff members of SrC:
>
> 1) Mrs.W -- Mrs. W who is the licensed social worker who has a lyrical voice and fluid movement. Also, she is the only one who is young enough to be constrained to the strict boundaries of the academic therapeutic practice. She has a tendency to establish her physical presence at a popular coffee shop on campus. I love to stare at her, watch her, follow her when I see her. I have been forbidden by Dr.Si who is the director and the fatherly freudian figure of SrC to not talk to Mrs. W. But he did not say I could watch her if I see her outside of SrC! Ha! Ha! My fantasy in regard to Mrs. W is to drink coffee with her and just chat with her in general. Perhaps tell her about my woes and then let her lyrical and soothing voice consol me and put me into a trance. Oh, how I wish for that! Mrs. W, be my buddy and I'll give you my devoted loyalty.
>
> 2) Dr. T --My very experienced therapist. Dr.T is extremely strong emotionally (a bit weak on the analytical side-- a little slow or something). But she is catching on. Anyway, I like her because she can not be pushed around. I used to go to a therapist who if you praise him in therapy, he actually respond to it (meanwhile, I of course am thinking: go back to school, go see a therapist and deal with whatever insecurity you have). But Dr.T by the grace of God, time, and experiences has developed into a very secure and bounded therapist. I feel extremely safe to bound my troubles off her. At the beginning, she was a bit authoritian. But, in my interactions with professionals, I expect respect, and the willingness to acknowledge me as an equal. So, gradually over time, I think she is beginning to respond to me as most lay professionals do. That proves that my charisma and personality is genuine and on target (since we assuming DR. T is the ideal therapist). At least I am not totally crazy. Whew, that is a relief. As I mentioned before, I have been continually bothered by the fact that I had to go see her periodically as conditional to my status as a student. Recently, from my transferences upon her, my direct statement of discomfort over this conditional rule, and whatever other way of communication I could think of conscious and unconscious, she finally got the message after one year of our continual therapy sessions. Last session, she stated the classical termination statement(s) (you know, not having to see her unless some urgency develops or something to that effect). I think that was a very correct move on her part since now she and in a way SrC has put complete control and confidence into my hands. And I wouldn't let them down. Now, if I decide to go see her again, it would completely, absolutely be from my heart and mind. I love that! To earn that control back means a great deal to me. Now, my fantasies about her (almost every day; constantly). The theme is always to work side by side
> with her in terms of assisting subjects in crisis. In our last session, I finally saw that flicker of respect and recognition that I am so use to seeing in other professional parties. For her to finally genuinely feel that is a great testment to me that despite my nervous breakdowns, depression, and suicidal thoughts, I am not completely off the track. I have always always felt so much more comfortable with adults of status than with students at large. I have always won respect, awe, recognition from adults and yet failed to establish meaningful relationships with students. Bottom line: It feels so right to be with these professionals and so awkward and uneasy with students. Why? I am still working on it. For the sake of my sanity, I can not just sit and wait for the students to catch up. I desperately want to have the kind of relationships that students have with their fellow students. But, I just can not no matter how hard I try. I am so jealous of students and their innocence. Relationships
> for me has always been established on the basis of self-interest and personal goals. To give up my selfishness would be to loose my hold on my personhood. I just couldn't do it. Dr.T, she rocks in more ways than one (whatever that means)!
>
> 3) Dr.H -- cute, young, successful, intelligent, and has a witty personality. I actually have never met Dr.H in person. I got to know him through chance meetings and from his websites. In my fantasy world, he is going to always be unmarried. Like I mentioned above, Dr.H is a psychiatrist. However, from what I can observed and conclude from the available data, he does not seem to fit the classical, serious, mute freudian type of a psychiatrist. First of all, Dr.H is a master of the Internet. Freud using the Web, come-on... Off-hand, I would think that Dr. H's therapy techniques are very mobile, radical with restraints, and a breath of fresh air. I would love to have a session with him just to satisify my curiosity. It does not even have to be in SrC. My fantasy regarding him would be to go on a semi-formal date with him where he can just analyze me to his heart content. And I can just silently observe and hypothesize and of course fantasize away to my hearts content. That would be the ultimate
> date in my book. It would be great if our "date" would conclude with him kissing me on the back of my hand or on my cheek like a proper gentlemen or prince. Reality check! You know the only two sources of data gathering I have on Dr.H is the chance meeting on campus or at SrC; and from his websites and e-mails. It gives me a conflicting picture of him. From his websites, e-mails, telephone message (computer geez has a computerized musical message recorder--go figure); anyway, from the ex-SrC setting, Dr.H comes across as a witty intelligent guy. Yet, from what I observed at SrC, he is a serious but boyish curious psychiatrist. That is the only place he acts remotely like a psychiatrist. Wierd guy-- must be a genius or something. Wierd, just wierd. But I am very mad and hurt by him. I e-mailed him recently with a proposal for a therapy based Internet club. However, he must have figured out that I am a client at SrC because he has not returned my e-mail yet. Probably never will! I hate him!
> I hate him so much for giving me false hope. For a while there we had a sort of back-and-forth e-mail exchange going under a false pretense on my part. Then, I must have slipped and he figured out who I am. Now, he does not write back to me anymore. I am so hurt since I was really counting on him to brighten my day. I know that he did not meant for this to happen since I set myself up for this. But where am I going to find a cute, successful, witty, and most importantly, safe and stable gentlemen again. Not to mention cute (I saw him in a tight body suit on a summer day once). Wow! The whole package.
>
> 4) Dr. Si-- the "big cheese"; although Dr.T would feel a pinch of jealousy to hear me say this. What can I say? A classical gentlemen. Old and experienced. He lives on the same street as I do. I have never seen him on the street through (it is a long, long street). But I have called his house and not say anything just to hear his voice and his wife's voice. He is a very kind and caring man. But he has a whole institution to run, so he is stern and serious but a good man. I can still recall our one and only meeting. I was totally, uterally silent (long psychoanalytical training for that amount of restraint). During that time, he relaxed by writing in a notebook (classical therapy method that one do not see much these days!). One of my fantasy of him of course borders on the stories of being in that intense therapeutic setting again and getting him to break his restraint and to talk and respond to me. It would be a challenge I would gladly take on just for the heck of it. I was so jealous of this one 2nd year Medical student. I saw Dr. Si talking to her in a very relaxed way (leaning against the wall)for almost an hour, in the Medical School lobby. Oh, why oh why can't you talk to me like that, Dr. Si. I would go to the Medical School and become a 2nd year Medical student just to have this one chance of looking in your eye and hold a genuine yet relaxed conversation with you. Come on, give me a chance, forget that I once was in crisis-- see me in a professional light. Be my buddy! My other fantasies of Dr. Si are along the lines of parental (fatherhood). It is very tempting for me to see him as my father. A wise, old, and experienced guy who is kind and a therapist...perfect, ideal father for me. Too bad it is ideal and therefore by definition, unachievable. I bet Mrs. W and some of the younger therapists at SrC also regard Dr. Si as a parental counselor. I think that is part of the reason why I want to be in Mrs. W's shoes because then I can be encumbered under the wings of Dr.Si.
>
> So, everybody and anybody who bothered to read up to this point, thank you foremost; and help me. Help me by responding to this thread and be my realsistic buddies that I crave so much at this point in my development. After extensive thoughts, and this LONG e-mail, it has made me realize the futility of my fantasies about Mrs.W, Dr.T, Dr.H, and Dr. Si. I could never be aligned with them because their line of work encumbers them behind the walls of SrC building. For me to wish to be their buddies would be literally like pounding against the wall until I am just drained of energy. And I still suffering from occasional short bouts of depression, do not have any energy to spare. I still feel deep down inside the dream of one day becoming a physician burning a hole in my heart. I want it, I want it so bad because doctorship is such a worthy cause and a noble cause. I truly feel that I would be happy as a physician, and more importantly as a healer in a community. The one thing my "nervous breakdown" has
> made me realize is the absolute necessity of status and respect that I need to feel happy. Hopefully, ten or fifteen years from now, I would grow out of that need (but right now, I can't without going totally depressed and withdrawn). So, my proposal to the readers of this network is to give me feedback (any and all feedback). I desperately need responses from real people. In return, I promise, to read and consider your troubles and woes and to respond to your e-mails. I need to feel like a healer, a buddy, and a friend.
>
>
>
>
> Cordially and sincere thanks for reading all the way to the conclusion,
> YOURS TRULY
>
>
>
Posted by Mark H. on October 10, 2000, at 20:07:50
In reply to Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by Pritzker on October 10, 2000, at 18:11:36
Dear Pritzker,
Your self-statements suggest to me that you might want to look for other fields in which to train.
You wrote, "Relationships for me has always been established on the basis of self-interest and personal goals. To give up my selfishness would be to loose my hold on my personhood."
The waning of personal ambition and self-interest is the beginning of compassion. In the end, little else counts except what we have given to and done for others. To whatever extent what you are doing is "about you," it is not about helping others. Unfortunately, there are already too many doctors, social workers and psychologists who do not understand this.
I strongly recommend that you print out your letter and share it with your therapists, bring them into your trust, and trust them with your fantasies.
You are wonderfully honest and courageous in asking for realistic feedback. I hope my taking you at your word by responding this way is not offensive to you.
Sincerely,
Mark H.
Posted by Pritzker on October 10, 2000, at 20:51:04
In reply to Re: Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by Mark H. on October 10, 2000, at 20:07:50
> Mark,
Thank you so much for posting a follow-up. I still have some time before devoting myself to a life-long career. I would whole-heartly welcome all and any responses from the general public. It feels good to stand as is in the general public because for a long time, I internally know how I feel; but I know that it would be frowned upon. Thank you for being honest and insightful. That is exactly what I need to hear. This is a great bulletin!
Cordially,
PritzkerDear Pritzker,
>
> Your self-statements suggest to me that you might want to look for other fields in which to train.
>
> You wrote, "Relationships for me has always been established on the basis of self-interest and personal goals. To give up my selfishness would be to loose my hold on my personhood."
>
> The waning of personal ambition and self-interest is the beginning of compassion. In the end, little else counts except what we have given to and done for others. To whatever extent what you are doing is "about you," it is not about helping others. Unfortunately, there are already too many doctors, social workers and psychologists who do not understand this.
>
> I strongly recommend that you print out your letter and share it with your therapists, bring them into your trust, and trust them with your fantasies.
>
> You are wonderfully honest and courageous in asking for realistic feedback. I hope my taking you at your word by responding this way is not offensive to you.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Mark H.
Posted by allisonm on October 10, 2000, at 21:30:38
In reply to Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by Pritzker on October 10, 2000, at 18:11:36
Just some observations and opinions. You asked for feedback. I do not intend to offend.
If the people at the clinic are the professionals you say they are, then you will never have a social or collegial relationship with any of them. You are wasting your time. Have you any other interests besides following these people around campus and calling them at home? If you want to be a professional, this is not the way to begin.
I have fantasized about my psychiatrist. I have put him on a pedestal. I have kept the thought of him in my head as a source of comfort when trying to get through difficult moments. From what I have read, I believe this is normal. However, you seem to have carried this to the entire clinic -- putting the entire staff on some pedestal. It is too much.
You mention how medicine is such a noble cause, but from the sound of your post you seem more enamored with being a doctor and being among people with status than with helping anyone. I think you should consider another profession. When you get older, job status becomes much less important than it is for twentysomethings. Then you will be left with just your work. If you didn't love it to begin with, if you only got into it for status, you are bound to be disappointed when you mature.
It is regrettable that you feel above your fellow students. I suspect that you are missing out on a lot. I would suggest that you need to find other activities besides fixating on the clinic staff. I would suggest that you need a more balanced life with a variety of interests.
The attitude that you apparently have about people who are not professionals seems to be inhibiting your ability to socialize and identify with other people of your age and status. If you were to become a doctor, what of your patients? What will you think of them? How will you connect with patients if you cannot connect with non-professional people now? Could you feel and show compassion if you have no respect for them? If you were a patient, you would you want a doctor with your cuurrent attitude attending to you?
Finally, I think you should consider medication because from the sound of your post I don't think therapy is doing enough. Wanting to go into psychiatry yet thinking that your own mental fortitude will pull you through depression etc. seems (to me at least) arrogant and shows a disbelief in the very profession you want to explore.
Best regards.
Posted by Pritzker on October 10, 2000, at 21:57:33
In reply to Re: Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by allisonm on October 10, 2000, at 21:30:38
> Thank you Allisonm. Your response, combined with Marx's is pretty much what I expected. Which is why I never voiced it until now, under these particular circumstances. But it is a bit of relief to see it in written words rather than have them buried in my nagging mind. Although, I still have to admit, it is a bit scary (not offending) to read it from another person.
Cordially,
LeiJust some observations and opinions. You asked for feedback. I do not intend to offend.
>
> If the people at the clinic are the professionals you say they are, then you will never have a social or collegial relationship with any of them. You are wasting your time. Have you any other interests besides following these people around campus and calling them at home? If you want to be a professional, this is not the way to begin.
>
> I have fantasized about my psychiatrist. I have put him on a pedestal. I have kept the thought of him in my head as a source of comfort when trying to get through difficult moments. From what I have read, I believe this is normal. However, you seem to have carried this to the entire clinic -- putting the entire staff on some pedestal. It is too much.
>
> You mention how medicine is such a noble cause, but from the sound of your post you seem more enamored with being a doctor and being among people with status than with helping anyone. I think you should consider another profession. When you get older, job status becomes much less important than it is for twentysomethings. Then you will be left with just your work. If you didn't love it to begin with, if you only got into it for status, you are bound to be disappointed when you mature.
>
> It is regrettable that you feel above your fellow students. I suspect that you are missing out on a lot. I would suggest that you need to find other activities besides fixating on the clinic staff. I would suggest that you need a more balanced life with a variety of interests.
>
> The attitude that you apparently have about people who are not professionals seems to be inhibiting your ability to socialize and identify with other people of your age and status. If you were to become a doctor, what of your patients? What will you think of them? How will you connect with patients if you cannot connect with non-professional people now? Could you feel and show compassion if you have no respect for them? If you were a patient, you would you want a doctor with your cuurrent attitude attending to you?
>
> Finally, I think you should consider medication because from the sound of your post I don't think therapy is doing enough. Wanting to go into psychiatry yet thinking that your own mental fortitude will pull you through depression etc. seems (to me at least) arrogant and shows a disbelief in the very profession you want to explore.
>
> Best regards.
Posted by Mark H. on October 10, 2000, at 22:45:42
In reply to Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by Pritzker on October 10, 2000, at 18:11:36
Dear Lei,
Driving home this evening, I realized that the same qualities that could make for a difficult career in the conventional helping professions might serve you very well in other areas. Your intensely thorough interest in and observations of people, their mannerisms and behaviors, what their gestures and personal styles say about them, their interactions with one another, your speculations about their needs and intentions, could make you a fabulous writer of short stories and novels, or, if your medical interests persist, perhaps a keenly valuable forensicist or forensic anthropologist.
I'm sure my thinking of the latter reflects having just read "Anil's Ghost" this weekend, the latest novel by Ondaatje about a pathologist who returns to her birthplace in Sri Lanka to do human rights research for an international organization. It takes an almost obsessive interest in detail to unravel the mysteries of a crime scene, and relatively few people have the inherent skills.
Also, if you haven't read it already, I'd like to recommend an article in the July 10 issue of the New Yorker titled, "The Good Doctor," about an American physician who has spent many years amongst the poor in Haiti. I think you would really enjoy it. I have never read a more inspiring piece about medicine.
I appreciate your courage in sharing such a revealing level of your self, and especially your openness to comments that could be taken as critical.
Best wishes,
Mark H.
Posted by Pritzker on October 10, 2000, at 22:59:34
In reply to Re: Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by Mark H. on October 10, 2000, at 20:07:50
> Marx,
I wish that it is as simple as sharing everything with the therapists. But, aside from Dr.T, the other three therapists really have no contact with me at all. Plus, SrC actually consist of about 18 therapists total, each with their own offices and set of clients. It would not be feasible for me to call them all together and confess my adoration of them. Plus, what would I say? It would just be too bizzare. The other therapists do not really know me. In fact, Dr.H do not even know that I exist.
Please respond if you can,
PritzkerDear Pritzker,
>
> Your self-statements suggest to me that you might want to look for other fields in which to train.
>
> You wrote, "Relationships for me has always been established on the basis of self-interest and personal goals. To give up my selfishness would be to loose my hold on my personhood."
>
> The waning of personal ambition and self-interest is the beginning of compassion. In the end, little else counts except what we have given to and done for others. To whatever extent what you are doing is "about you," it is not about helping others. Unfortunately, there are already too many doctors, social workers and psychologists who do not understand this.
>
> I strongly recommend that you print out your letter and share it with your therapists, bring them into your trust, and trust them with your fantasies.
>
> You are wonderfully honest and courageous in asking for realistic feedback. I hope my taking you at your word by responding this way is not offensive to you.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Mark H.
Posted by Pritzker on October 10, 2000, at 23:28:23
In reply to Re: Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by Mark H. on October 10, 2000, at 22:45:42
> Dear Mark (sorry about your name early),
It is wonderful and surprizing to know that someone would actually think of me just because of something that I wrote. It shows caring. Thank you for your thoughts on my behalf. It is wierd to contemplate that some total stranger would think of me.
Cordially,
PritzkerDear Lei,
>
> Driving home this evening, I realized that the same qualities that could make for a difficult career in the conventional helping professions might serve you very well in other areas. Your intensely thorough interest in and observations of people, their mannerisms and behaviors, what their gestures and personal styles say about them, their interactions with one another, your speculations about their needs and intentions, could make you a fabulous writer of short stories and novels, or, if your medical interests persist, perhaps a keenly valuable forensicist or forensic anthropologist.
>
> I'm sure my thinking of the latter reflects having just read "Anil's Ghost" this weekend, the latest novel by Ondaatje about a pathologist who returns to her birthplace in Sri Lanka to do human rights research for an international organization. It takes an almost obsessive interest in detail to unravel the mysteries of a crime scene, and relatively few people have the inherent skills.
>
> Also, if you haven't read it already, I'd like to recommend an article in the July 10 issue of the New Yorker titled, "The Good Doctor," about an American physician who has spent many years amongst the poor in Haiti. I think you would really enjoy it. I have never read a more inspiring piece about medicine.
>
> I appreciate your courage in sharing such a revealing level of your self, and especially your openness to comments that could be taken as critical.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Mark H.
Posted by shar on October 10, 2000, at 23:35:08
In reply to Re: Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by Mark H. on October 10, 2000, at 22:45:42
I would like to encourage you not to assume that professional standing is equivalent to having your head screwed on right or being a "together" person. Being human automatically means we are better at some things than others, and we are just flat out not very together all the time.
In my schooling the unwritten law was that one studied/did research on the things that they had issues with. So, if someone studied sexual behavior, or happiness, or self-disclosure, that was a sort of clue about them.
Also in school, I heard students who were to become counselors adamantly deny that they had ever been in therapy or had a need for it. Is there something wrong (and scary) with that picture?
Good luck to you and whatever steps you take on making your own real life fuller and richer.
Shar
Posted by Pritzker on October 11, 2000, at 0:11:59
In reply to Re: Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by shar on October 10, 2000, at 23:35:08
> Shar,
It is so exciting that I have all these Follow-ups under my topic now. It is a very warm feeling to receive all these replies.
I feel that I have to defend for the therapists at SrC. They all have at least 10-15 years of clinical experiences prior to their establishment at SrC. I know what most of you guys are thinking. How come I ended up with four therapists when there should only be one. The truth is that there is only one therapist, Dr.T. It is just that when I came back from my leave of absence, I kind of manipulated Mrs.W to think that I am a new student. So, she and I kind of established a therapeutic relationship before she realized that I was a bit over her head. And then Dr.Si, the director got involved and I was very impressive by his gentlemenship. Dr. H, who I never met face-to-face has a big presence in the psychotherpy arena on the web, so that is how I got attached to him. But, I feel that I need to make it clear that it is purely my fault that I ended up idolizing four therapists. Hey, I was desperate!
For me, the main clue that the staff at SrC are good therapists is because there is a raw presence of kindership among the members. This kind of presentation can not be faked. It is hard to describe except for you guys to believe me that as far as I can think of, the bondship that I see among these therapists can only be a result of constant and continual back-and-forth communication. I know that the staff have one-hour of "meeting" in the conference room every day and on occasion, laughter would seep through the closed-doors. There is just a sense of familiness and raw bondship among these people. Something that I found to be humbling and I am very envious of them.
Please keep talking to me. I just love it that people are actually responding to my thoughts. Thoughts that I had thought were so disturbing to the community-at-large that until now, I have kept in the recess of my soul.
Cordially,
PritzkerI would like to encourage you not to assume that professional standing is equivalent to having your head screwed on right or being a "together" person. Being human automatically means we are better at some things than others, and we are just flat out not very together all the time.
>
> In my schooling the unwritten law was that one studied/did research on the things that they had issues with. So, if someone studied sexual behavior, or happiness, or self-disclosure, that was a sort of clue about them.
>
> Also in school, I heard students who were to become counselors adamantly deny that they had ever been in therapy or had a need for it. Is there something wrong (and scary) with that picture?
>
> Good luck to you and whatever steps you take on making your own real life fuller and richer.
> Shar
Posted by Pritzker on October 11, 2000, at 5:35:29
In reply to Re: Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by Pritzker on October 10, 2000, at 19:53:53
> > Please give me more feedbacks. I only have four different people writing to me thus far. More please. My dream is to have as long a list of feedbacks as Dr.Bob's postings.
Thanks,
PritzkerPlease! Write something/anything under my thread. Please.
>
> I am so glad to have found this site. I have visted this website a couple of times before, but I never realized that I can carry on social relationships on here. This is exactly what I have been looking for-- a safe and nonphysical way of communication.
> >
> > I am a pre-med student in an accrediated college. My current dream is to be a MD/PHD candidate. Since I have gotton a C and a C+ in my Organic Chemistry classes, and I had to take time off from school for psychological reasons, the dream of Medical School seem impossible. Not to mention expecting the government to consider me as a MD/PHD student. Whenever, I think of this, I feel so depressed. Like last night, I has a good cry about it; and then I went back to my Biochemistry reading. Anyway, the real dilemna I have is the following: When I resumed my studies, I was committed to periodically see a staff member at the SrC building (long-term therapy). I really resented the fact that I had to go see this DR.T. After a very short while, I became very attracted and attached to the secure environment and staff members at the SrC building. The main problem with me is that I look down upon my fellow students since they do not have any credientials (unlike the professionals at the SrC building).
> > So, basically, I do not have any social relationships with anyone (except for those in my head). Through time and therapy with Dr.T, I have began to open up and become more animated toward the people around me. However, I still feel deeply attracted to the staff members at SrC (mainly Dr.T of course, Dr.Si, who is the director and a classical gentlemen, Mrs. W who has such a magical presence, and finally, this young witty guy called Dr.H who I have a crush on). The dilemna is that I often fantasize about these four staff members from SrC. I dearly want to be their friends, their colleagues, their buddies. I crave, I live for those kind of relationships with credientialled professionals. For instance, I work as a research assistant for this post-doc and through the usuage of therapeutic tactics I picked up from my own experience, I have successfully won him over such that our relationship now is on a buddy/colleague level rather than Mentor/student. I love this kind of interaction between us. However, this postdoc is just a lay civilian. It is just so much harder to win over the four staff members at SrC because they are all highly, very highly trained therapists and extremely intuitive and intelligent. So, in a way, I do look upon it as a challenge to win these professionals over. Let me re-introduce them before going on: Dr. T is a licensed social worker and has a Ph.D in social work; Dr. Si is a psychiatrist and the director of SrC (classical gentlemen, but a bit too serious); Dr. H who I have a crush on is also a psychiatrist (but he is extremely witty, intelligent, and most importantly a modern guy), and finally there is Mrs. W who I love to observe outside the SrC arena (she is a licensed social worker and she must be studying for a Ph.D or something because she likes to read intensively in a coffee shop on campus). In addition, there is M and K who are the receptionists of SrC (M has a very gentle and motherly presence and K is a little bit brittle and sharp at times). Finally, there is
> > Dr. S (not to be confused with Dr. Si)--Dr. S seemly awlfully wicked to me from our one time face-to-face meeting because she tried to push pills on me. I hate pills or chemical substance of any kind because it go against my confidence of my natural biochemical organism. To illustrate how much I hate pills, I thought about taking a bunch of sleeping pills, cold pills, synthetic alcohol in mixture when I contemplated suicide. I am firmly rooted in the belief that pills of any kind taken for a prolong period is bad for you. Psychotherapy or rather my own will and self-esteem works much much better for me. Although, at times it is a struggle to go through those dark, depressive periods cold. When I come out of the withdraw, I feel so cleansed. Now, back to my adoration for the staff members at SrC. I still do not have any friends from the student population. In fact, I have always felt that students are so naive and loose. Plus, I am not going to school to become a student, but rather a professional
> > physician. So, I think that is why I love to become friends with the people at SrC. In addition, I feel it is so much safer to align myself with them since their head must be screwed on pretty right to work in that building. I have high documented confidence in the kind of people that work at SrC. Enough that, now I am going to tell you about my problem in relation to the four above mentioned staff members of SrC:
> >
> > 1) Mrs.W -- Mrs. W who is the licensed social worker who has a lyrical voice and fluid movement. Also, she is the only one who is young enough to be constrained to the strict boundaries of the academic therapeutic practice. She has a tendency to establish her physical presence at a popular coffee shop on campus. I love to stare at her, watch her, follow her when I see her. I have been forbidden by Dr.Si who is the director and the fatherly freudian figure of SrC to not talk to Mrs. W. But he did not say I could watch her if I see her outside of SrC! Ha! Ha! My fantasy in regard to Mrs. W is to drink coffee with her and just chat with her in general. Perhaps tell her about my woes and then let her lyrical and soothing voice consol me and put me into a trance. Oh, how I wish for that! Mrs. W, be my buddy and I'll give you my devoted loyalty.
> >
> > 2) Dr. T --My very experienced therapist. Dr.T is extremely strong emotionally (a bit weak on the analytical side-- a little slow or something). But she is catching on. Anyway, I like her because she can not be pushed around. I used to go to a therapist who if you praise him in therapy, he actually respond to it (meanwhile, I of course am thinking: go back to school, go see a therapist and deal with whatever insecurity you have). But Dr.T by the grace of God, time, and experiences has developed into a very secure and bounded therapist. I feel extremely safe to bound my troubles off her. At the beginning, she was a bit authoritian. But, in my interactions with professionals, I expect respect, and the willingness to acknowledge me as an equal. So, gradually over time, I think she is beginning to respond to me as most lay professionals do. That proves that my charisma and personality is genuine and on target (since we assuming DR. T is the ideal therapist). At least I am not totally crazy. Whew, that is a relief. As I mentioned before, I have been continually bothered by the fact that I had to go see her periodically as conditional to my status as a student. Recently, from my transferences upon her, my direct statement of discomfort over this conditional rule, and whatever other way of communication I could think of conscious and unconscious, she finally got the message after one year of our continual therapy sessions. Last session, she stated the classical termination statement(s) (you know, not having to see her unless some urgency develops or something to that effect). I think that was a very correct move on her part since now she and in a way SrC has put complete control and confidence into my hands. And I wouldn't let them down. Now, if I decide to go see her again, it would completely, absolutely be from my heart and mind. I love that! To earn that control back means a great deal to me. Now, my fantasies about her (almost every day; constantly). The theme is always to work side by side
> > with her in terms of assisting subjects in crisis. In our last session, I finally saw that flicker of respect and recognition that I am so use to seeing in other professional parties. For her to finally genuinely feel that is a great testment to me that despite my nervous breakdowns, depression, and suicidal thoughts, I am not completely off the track. I have always always felt so much more comfortable with adults of status than with students at large. I have always won respect, awe, recognition from adults and yet failed to establish meaningful relationships with students. Bottom line: It feels so right to be with these professionals and so awkward and uneasy with students. Why? I am still working on it. For the sake of my sanity, I can not just sit and wait for the students to catch up. I desperately want to have the kind of relationships that students have with their fellow students. But, I just can not no matter how hard I try. I am so jealous of students and their innocence. Relationships
> > for me has always been established on the basis of self-interest and personal goals. To give up my selfishness would be to loose my hold on my personhood. I just couldn't do it. Dr.T, she rocks in more ways than one (whatever that means)!
> >
> > 3) Dr.H -- cute, young, successful, intelligent, and has a witty personality. I actually have never met Dr.H in person. I got to know him through chance meetings and from his websites. In my fantasy world, he is going to always be unmarried. Like I mentioned above, Dr.H is a psychiatrist. However, from what I can observed and conclude from the available data, he does not seem to fit the classical, serious, mute freudian type of a psychiatrist. First of all, Dr.H is a master of the Internet. Freud using the Web, come-on... Off-hand, I would think that Dr. H's therapy techniques are very mobile, radical with restraints, and a breath of fresh air. I would love to have a session with him just to satisify my curiosity. It does not even have to be in SrC. My fantasy regarding him would be to go on a semi-formal date with him where he can just analyze me to his heart content. And I can just silently observe and hypothesize and of course fantasize away to my hearts content. That would be the ultimate
> > date in my book. It would be great if our "date" would conclude with him kissing me on the back of my hand or on my cheek like a proper gentlemen or prince. Reality check! You know the only two sources of data gathering I have on Dr.H is the chance meeting on campus or at SrC; and from his websites and e-mails. It gives me a conflicting picture of him. From his websites, e-mails, telephone message (computer geez has a computerized musical message recorder--go figure); anyway, from the ex-SrC setting, Dr.H comes across as a witty intelligent guy. Yet, from what I observed at SrC, he is a serious but boyish curious psychiatrist. That is the only place he acts remotely like a psychiatrist. Wierd guy-- must be a genius or something. Wierd, just wierd. But I am very mad and hurt by him. I e-mailed him recently with a proposal for a therapy based Internet club. However, he must have figured out that I am a client at SrC because he has not returned my e-mail yet. Probably never will! I hate him!
> > I hate him so much for giving me false hope. For a while there we had a sort of back-and-forth e-mail exchange going under a false pretense on my part. Then, I must have slipped and he figured out who I am. Now, he does not write back to me anymore. I am so hurt since I was really counting on him to brighten my day. I know that he did not meant for this to happen since I set myself up for this. But where am I going to find a cute, successful, witty, and most importantly, safe and stable gentlemen again. Not to mention cute (I saw him in a tight body suit on a summer day once). Wow! The whole package.
> >
> > 4) Dr. Si-- the "big cheese"; although Dr.T would feel a pinch of jealousy to hear me say this. What can I say? A classical gentlemen. Old and experienced. He lives on the same street as I do. I have never seen him on the street through (it is a long, long street). But I have called his house and not say anything just to hear his voice and his wife's voice. He is a very kind and caring man. But he has a whole institution to run, so he is stern and serious but a good man. I can still recall our one and only meeting. I was totally, uterally silent (long psychoanalytical training for that amount of restraint). During that time, he relaxed by writing in a notebook (classical therapy method that one do not see much these days!). One of my fantasy of him of course borders on the stories of being in that intense therapeutic setting again and getting him to break his restraint and to talk and respond to me. It would be a challenge I would gladly take on just for the heck of it. I was so jealous of this one 2nd year Medical student. I saw Dr. Si talking to her in a very relaxed way (leaning against the wall)for almost an hour, in the Medical School lobby. Oh, why oh why can't you talk to me like that, Dr. Si. I would go to the Medical School and become a 2nd year Medical student just to have this one chance of looking in your eye and hold a genuine yet relaxed conversation with you. Come on, give me a chance, forget that I once was in crisis-- see me in a professional light. Be my buddy! My other fantasies of Dr. Si are along the lines of parental (fatherhood). It is very tempting for me to see him as my father. A wise, old, and experienced guy who is kind and a therapist...perfect, ideal father for me. Too bad it is ideal and therefore by definition, unachievable. I bet Mrs. W and some of the younger therapists at SrC also regard Dr. Si as a parental counselor. I think that is part of the reason why I want to be in Mrs. W's shoes because then I can be encumbered under the wings of Dr.Si.
> >
> > So, everybody and anybody who bothered to read up to this point, thank you foremost; and help me. Help me by responding to this thread and be my realsistic buddies that I crave so much at this point in my development. After extensive thoughts, and this LONG e-mail, it has made me realize the futility of my fantasies about Mrs.W, Dr.T, Dr.H, and Dr. Si. I could never be aligned with them because their line of work encumbers them behind the walls of SrC building. For me to wish to be their buddies would be literally like pounding against the wall until I am just drained of energy. And I still suffering from occasional short bouts of depression, do not have any energy to spare. I still feel deep down inside the dream of one day becoming a physician burning a hole in my heart. I want it, I want it so bad because doctorship is such a worthy cause and a noble cause. I truly feel that I would be happy as a physician, and more importantly as a healer in a community. The one thing my "nervous breakdown" has
> > made me realize is the absolute necessity of status and respect that I need to feel happy. Hopefully, ten or fifteen years from now, I would grow out of that need (but right now, I can't without going totally depressed and withdrawn). So, my proposal to the readers of this network is to give me feedback (any and all feedback). I desperately need responses from real people. In return, I promise, to read and consider your troubles and woes and to respond to your e-mails. I need to feel like a healer, a buddy, and a friend.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Cordially and sincere thanks for reading all the way to the conclusion,
> > YOURS TRULY
> >
> >
> >
Posted by Noa on October 11, 2000, at 10:02:56
In reply to Re: Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by Mark H. on October 10, 2000, at 22:45:42
Piggy-backing on Mark's observations of choice of career.....from this limited impression I have of you, my thoughts are that you would make a better researcher than helping professonal, and perhaps going with the PhD rather than the MD might be something to think about. What makes me say this? Not just (as has been pointed out) what aspects of your self-experience would get in the way of working directly with people, but also, what would add to your abilities as a researcher. Namely, your ability to get totally absorbed in a line of thinking, totally preoccupied with knowing more about something. That persistence would serve well if you were questing after the answer to a research problem, as would your love of careful observations. As for your level of preoccupation, I would imagine it could make attending to your studies at present quite a challenge. BTW, why are you so opposed to medication (evil dr. so-and-so, and all)?
Posted by CybilDisobedience on October 16, 2000, at 21:30:42
In reply to Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by Pritzker on October 10, 2000, at 18:11:36
Hi Zip Welcome to the site!! I hope you will not be disappointed . I applaud your openess but I hope you will not leave yourself open to undue criticism. The world including the PB world is often not what it appears to be at first glance.
I don't think your therapist is serving you very well. To use a technical phrase she doesn't seem to have a clue!!! Have you thought of getting a consult with someone from a different school of therapy?
It seems like a cognitive behavioural approach might help you with your goals. It also seems like a structured support group might be of more use to you. Maybe a Recovery group or Emotions Anonymous or a group specifically for social anxiety. Are you getting all this stuff about transferences and manipulation, etc from the therapist? It doesn't seem to be helping you much. In fact I think you are taking entirely too much blame on yourself. If you are trying to manipulate people, I would say you aren't very good at it at all. If you were such a good manipulator why isn't everybody doing exactly what you want?
I think your fantasies were not that big a deal except that they are interfering with the rest of your life. You want to be accepted by an intelligent (in your judgement) group of people who are engaged in helping people (in your opinion). What's wrong with that?? What's wrong with wanting to be listened to and understood and accepted? What's wrong with wanting to be part of a group that is trying to help people? It's only a problem because of the group you chose. You can't practice therapy without a license and you can't socialize with someone you're in therapy with. If you know what you want, you just need to find somewhere else to get it. It's nothing to be ashamed of.If Dr H is not your therapist then there is nothing ethically to prevent his having a social relationship with you. You are not prevented from socializing with all therapists in the world. I assumed you were referring to young Dr Bob when you wrote and took the liberty of discussing with my own Pdoc the ethics of a relationship with said Dr B. He said it would be perfectly ethical to have a relationship with Dr B but only with his permission! Unfortunately, that may prove to be a problem. In the unlikely (but not impossible) event that he was looking for a 19 year old girlfriend, trying to hook up with him by posting on his site was probably a bad move :-) That doesn't mean you're not his equal, you are. I think this idea that you are just this side of boiling bunny rabbits ( see Fatal Attraction video) because you have a crush on these people is ridiculous.
I thought your idea of a super long thread was a charmingly goofy (in a nice way) of asking for help and support. And again it was nothing to be ashamed of. When you think of this Dark side of you, remember that many people have fantasies and obsessions and crushes that they never talk about. I don't think it's that dark at all and I think you were brave to post them. At the same time I think you do need help to sort things out and find a way to get the things you want and need.
I may not be able to post a lot, but I look forward to reading your posts. Thank you for taking the time to write and for trusting a world full of strangers with your dreams and fantasies.
I think there is a special bond between the legions (and I'm sure there probably are legions) of people who have considered suicide while taking Organic Chemistry. And a C+ is worthy of praise in my opinion. So I send you special good wishes while you study for your midterms. Thanks for coming by!
> I am so glad to have found this site. I have visted this website a couple of times before, but I never realized that I can carry on social relationships on here. This is exactly what I have been looking for-- a safe and nonphysical way of communication.
>
> I am a pre-med student in an accrediated college. My current dream is to be a MD/PHD candidate. Since I have gotton a C and a C+ in my Organic Chemistry classes, and I had to take time off from school for psychological reasons, the dream of Medical School seem impossible. Not to mention expecting the government to consider me as a MD/PHD student. Whenever, I think of this, I feel so depressed. Like last night, I has a good cry about it; and then I went back to my Biochemistry reading. Anyway, the real dilemna I have is the following: When I resumed my studies, I was committed to periodically see a staff member at the SrC building (long-term therapy). I really resented the fact that I had to go see this DR.T. After a very short while, I became very attracted and attached to the secure environment and staff members at the SrC building. The main problem with me is that I look down upon my fellow students since they do not have any credientials (unlike the professionals at the SrC building).
> So, basically, I do not have any social relationships with anyone (except for those in my head). Through time and therapy with Dr.T, I have began to open up and become more animated toward the people around me. However, I still feel deeply attracted to the staff members at SrC (mainly Dr.T of course, Dr.Si, who is the director and a classical gentlemen, Mrs. W who has such a magical presence, and finally, this young witty guy called Dr.H who I have a crush on). The dilemna is that I often fantasize about these four staff members from SrC. I dearly want to be their friends, their colleagues, their buddies. I crave, I live for those kind of relationships with credientialled professionals. For instance, I work as a research assistant for this post-doc and through the usuage of therapeutic tactics I picked up from my own experience, I have successfully won him over such that our relationship now is on a buddy/colleague level rather than Mentor/student. I love this kind of interaction between us. However, this postdoc is just a lay civilian. It is just so much harder to win over the four staff members at SrC because they are all highly, very highly trained therapists and extremely intuitive and intelligent. So, in a way, I do look upon it as a challenge to win these professionals over. Let me re-introduce them before going on: Dr. T is a licensed social worker and has a Ph.D in social work; Dr. Si is a psychiatrist and the director of SrC (classical gentlemen, but a bit too serious); Dr. H who I have a crush on is also a psychiatrist (but he is extremely witty, intelligent, and most importantly a modern guy), and finally there is Mrs. W who I love to observe outside the SrC arena (she is a licensed social worker and she must be studying for a Ph.D or something because she likes to read intensively in a coffee shop on campus). In addition, there is M and K who are the receptionists of SrC (M has a very gentle and motherly presence and K is a little bit brittle and sharp at times). Finally, there is
> Dr. S (not to be confused with Dr. Si)--Dr. S seemly awlfully wicked to me from our one time face-to-face meeting because she tried to push pills on me. I hate pills or chemical substance of any kind because it go against my confidence of my natural biochemical organism. To illustrate how much I hate pills, I thought about taking a bunch of sleeping pills, cold pills, synthetic alcohol in mixture when I contemplated suicide. I am firmly rooted in the belief that pills of any kind taken for a prolong period is bad for you. Psychotherapy or rather my own will and self-esteem works much much better for me. Although, at times it is a struggle to go through those dark, depressive periods cold. When I come out of the withdraw, I feel so cleansed. Now, back to my adoration for the staff members at SrC. I still do not have any friends from the student population. In fact, I have always felt that students are so naive and loose. Plus, I am not going to school to become a student, but rather a professional
> physician. So, I think that is why I love to become friends with the people at SrC. In addition, I feel it is so much safer to align myself with them since their head must be screwed on pretty right to work in that building. I have high documented confidence in the kind of people that work at SrC. Enough that, now I am going to tell you about my problem in relation to the four above mentioned staff members of SrC:
>
> 1) Mrs.W -- Mrs. W who is the licensed social worker who has a lyrical voice and fluid movement. Also, she is the only one who is young enough to be constrained to the strict boundaries of the academic therapeutic practice. She has a tendency to establish her physical presence at a popular coffee shop on campus. I love to stare at her, watch her, follow her when I see her. I have been forbidden by Dr.Si who is the director and the fatherly freudian figure of SrC to not talk to Mrs. W. But he did not say I could watch her if I see her outside of SrC! Ha! Ha! My fantasy in regard to Mrs. W is to drink coffee with her and just chat with her in general. Perhaps tell her about my woes and then let her lyrical and soothing voice consol me and put me into a trance. Oh, how I wish for that! Mrs. W, be my buddy and I'll give you my devoted loyalty.
>
> 2) Dr. T --My very experienced therapist. Dr.T is extremely strong emotionally (a bit weak on the analytical side-- a little slow or something). But she is catching on. Anyway, I like her because she can not be pushed around. I used to go to a therapist who if you praise him in therapy, he actually respond to it (meanwhile, I of course am thinking: go back to school, go see a therapist and deal with whatever insecurity you have). But Dr.T by the grace of God, time, and experiences has developed into a very secure and bounded therapist. I feel extremely safe to bound my troubles off her. At the beginning, she was a bit authoritian. But, in my interactions with professionals, I expect respect, and the willingness to acknowledge me as an equal. So, gradually over time, I think she is beginning to respond to me as most lay professionals do. That proves that my charisma and personality is genuine and on target (since we assuming DR. T is the ideal therapist). At least I am not totally crazy. Whew, that is a relief. As I mentioned before, I have been continually bothered by the fact that I had to go see her periodically as conditional to my status as a student. Recently, from my transferences upon her, my direct statement of discomfort over this conditional rule, and whatever other way of communication I could think of conscious and unconscious, she finally got the message after one year of our continual therapy sessions. Last session, she stated the classical termination statement(s) (you know, not having to see her unless some urgency develops or something to that effect). I think that was a very correct move on her part since now she and in a way SrC has put complete control and confidence into my hands. And I wouldn't let them down. Now, if I decide to go see her again, it would completely, absolutely be from my heart and mind. I love that! To earn that control back means a great deal to me. Now, my fantasies about her (almost every day; constantly). The theme is always to work side by side
> with her in terms of assisting subjects in crisis. In our last session, I finally saw that flicker of respect and recognition that I am so use to seeing in other professional parties. For her to finally genuinely feel that is a great testment to me that despite my nervous breakdowns, depression, and suicidal thoughts, I am not completely off the track. I have always always felt so much more comfortable with adults of status than with students at large. I have always won respect, awe, recognition from adults and yet failed to establish meaningful relationships with students. Bottom line: It feels so right to be with these professionals and so awkward and uneasy with students. Why? I am still working on it. For the sake of my sanity, I can not just sit and wait for the students to catch up. I desperately want to have the kind of relationships that students have with their fellow students. But, I just can not no matter how hard I try. I am so jealous of students and their innocence. Relationships
> for me has always been established on the basis of self-interest and personal goals. To give up my selfishness would be to loose my hold on my personhood. I just couldn't do it. Dr.T, she rocks in more ways than one (whatever that means)!
>
> 3) Dr.H -- cute, young, successful, intelligent, and has a witty personality. I actually have never met Dr.H in person. I got to know him through chance meetings and from his websites. In my fantasy world, he is going to always be unmarried. Like I mentioned above, Dr.H is a psychiatrist. However, from what I can observed and conclude from the available data, he does not seem to fit the classical, serious, mute freudian type of a psychiatrist. First of all, Dr.H is a master of the Internet. Freud using the Web, come-on... Off-hand, I would think that Dr. H's therapy techniques are very mobile, radical with restraints, and a breath of fresh air. I would love to have a session with him just to satisify my curiosity. It does not even have to be in SrC. My fantasy regarding him would be to go on a semi-formal date with him where he can just analyze me to his heart content. And I can just silently observe and hypothesize and of course fantasize away to my hearts content. That would be the ultimate
> date in my book. It would be great if our "date" would conclude with him kissing me on the back of my hand or on my cheek like a proper gentlemen or prince. Reality check! You know the only two sources of data gathering I have on Dr.H is the chance meeting on campus or at SrC; and from his websites and e-mails. It gives me a conflicting picture of him. From his websites, e-mails, telephone message (computer geez has a computerized musical message recorder--go figure); anyway, from the ex-SrC setting, Dr.H comes across as a witty intelligent guy. Yet, from what I observed at SrC, he is a serious but boyish curious psychiatrist. That is the only place he acts remotely like a psychiatrist. Wierd guy-- must be a genius or something. Wierd, just wierd. But I am very mad and hurt by him. I e-mailed him recently with a proposal for a therapy based Internet club. However, he must have figured out that I am a client at SrC because he has not returned my e-mail yet. Probably never will! I hate him!
> I hate him so much for giving me false hope. For a while there we had a sort of back-and-forth e-mail exchange going under a false pretense on my part. Then, I must have slipped and he figured out who I am. Now, he does not write back to me anymore. I am so hurt since I was really counting on him to brighten my day. I know that he did not meant for this to happen since I set myself up for this. But where am I going to find a cute, successful, witty, and most importantly, safe and stable gentlemen again. Not to mention cute (I saw him in a tight body suit on a summer day once). Wow! The whole package.
>
> 4) Dr. Si-- the "big cheese"; although Dr.T would feel a pinch of jealousy to hear me say this. What can I say? A classical gentlemen. Old and experienced. He lives on the same street as I do. I have never seen him on the street through (it is a long, long street). But I have called his house and not say anything just to hear his voice and his wife's voice. He is a very kind and caring man. But he has a whole institution to run, so he is stern and serious but a good man. I can still recall our one and only meeting. I was totally, uterally silent (long psychoanalytical training for that amount of restraint). During that time, he relaxed by writing in a notebook (classical therapy method that one do not see much these days!). One of my fantasy of him of course borders on the stories of being in that intense therapeutic setting again and getting him to break his restraint and to talk and respond to me. It would be a challenge I would gladly take on just for the heck of it. I was so jealous of this one 2nd year Medical student. I saw Dr. Si talking to her in a very relaxed way (leaning against the wall)for almost an hour, in the Medical School lobby. Oh, why oh why can't you talk to me like that, Dr. Si. I would go to the Medical School and become a 2nd year Medical student just to have this one chance of looking in your eye and hold a genuine yet relaxed conversation with you. Come on, give me a chance, forget that I once was in crisis-- see me in a professional light. Be my buddy! My other fantasies of Dr. Si are along the lines of parental (fatherhood). It is very tempting for me to see him as my father. A wise, old, and experienced guy who is kind and a therapist...perfect, ideal father for me. Too bad it is ideal and therefore by definition, unachievable. I bet Mrs. W and some of the younger therapists at SrC also regard Dr. Si as a parental counselor. I think that is part of the reason why I want to be in Mrs. W's shoes because then I can be encumbered under the wings of Dr.Si.
>
> So, everybody and anybody who bothered to read up to this point, thank you foremost; and help me. Help me by responding to this thread and be my realsistic buddies that I crave so much at this point in my development. After extensive thoughts, and this LONG e-mail, it has made me realize the futility of my fantasies about Mrs.W, Dr.T, Dr.H, and Dr. Si. I could never be aligned with them because their line of work encumbers them behind the walls of SrC building. For me to wish to be their buddies would be literally like pounding against the wall until I am just drained of energy. And I still suffering from occasional short bouts of depression, do not have any energy to spare. I still feel deep down inside the dream of one day becoming a physician burning a hole in my heart. I want it, I want it so bad because doctorship is such a worthy cause and a noble cause. I truly feel that I would be happy as a physician, and more importantly as a healer in a community. The one thing my "nervous breakdown" has
> made me realize is the absolute necessity of status and respect that I need to feel happy. Hopefully, ten or fifteen years from now, I would grow out of that need (but right now, I can't without going totally depressed and withdrawn). So, my proposal to the readers of this network is to give me feedback (any and all feedback). I desperately need responses from real people. In return, I promise, to read and consider your troubles and woes and to respond to your e-mails. I need to feel like a healer, a buddy, and a friend.
>
>
>
>
> Cordially and sincere thanks for reading all the way to the conclusion,
> YOURS TRULY
>
>
>
Posted by Rzip on October 16, 2000, at 22:17:28
In reply to Re: Medical fantasies and the cute Dr.H, posted by CybilDisobedience on October 16, 2000, at 21:30:42
> I am so glad that someone understand what I am going through this week. When I said I am really behind in my schoolwork, I wasn't joking. It is surreal what I have to know by Friday. Both my Biochem and Physics midterms are this Friday. Boy oh boy.
So how are you doing this week? Looking forward to hearing from you.
Something in common,
Yours trulyHi Zip Welcome to the site!! I hope you will not be disappointed . I applaud your openess but I hope you will not leave yourself open to undue criticism. The world including the PB world is often not what it appears to be at first glance.
>
> I don't think your therapist is serving you very well. To use a technical phrase she doesn't seem to have a clue!!! Have you thought of getting a consult with someone from a different school of therapy?
> It seems like a cognitive behavioural approach might help you with your goals. It also seems like a structured support group might be of more use to you. Maybe a Recovery group or Emotions Anonymous or a group specifically for social anxiety. Are you getting all this stuff about transferences and manipulation, etc from the therapist? It doesn't seem to be helping you much. In fact I think you are taking entirely too much blame on yourself. If you are trying to manipulate people, I would say you aren't very good at it at all. If you were such a good manipulator why isn't everybody doing exactly what you want?
> I think your fantasies were not that big a deal except that they are interfering with the rest of your life. You want to be accepted by an intelligent (in your judgement) group of people who are engaged in helping people (in your opinion). What's wrong with that?? What's wrong with wanting to be listened to and understood and accepted? What's wrong with wanting to be part of a group that is trying to help people? It's only a problem because of the group you chose. You can't practice therapy without a license and you can't socialize with someone you're in therapy with. If you know what you want, you just need to find somewhere else to get it. It's nothing to be ashamed of.
>
> If Dr H is not your therapist then there is nothing ethically to prevent his having a social relationship with you. You are not prevented from socializing with all therapists in the world. I assumed you were referring to young Dr Bob when you wrote and took the liberty of discussing with my own Pdoc the ethics of a relationship with said Dr B. He said it would be perfectly ethical to have a relationship with Dr B but only with his permission! Unfortunately, that may prove to be a problem. In the unlikely (but not impossible) event that he was looking for a 19 year old girlfriend, trying to hook up with him by posting on his site was probably a bad move :-) That doesn't mean you're not his equal, you are. I think this idea that you are just this side of boiling bunny rabbits ( see Fatal Attraction video) because you have a crush on these people is ridiculous.
>
> I thought your idea of a super long thread was a charmingly goofy (in a nice way) of asking for help and support. And again it was nothing to be ashamed of. When you think of this Dark side of you, remember that many people have fantasies and obsessions and crushes that they never talk about. I don't think it's that dark at all and I think you were brave to post them. At the same time I think you do need help to sort things out and find a way to get the things you want and need.
>
> I may not be able to post a lot, but I look forward to reading your posts. Thank you for taking the time to write and for trusting a world full of strangers with your dreams and fantasies.
>
> I think there is a special bond between the legions (and I'm sure there probably are legions) of people who have considered suicide while taking Organic Chemistry. And a C+ is worthy of praise in my opinion. So I send you special good wishes while you study for your midterms. Thanks for coming by!
>
>
>
> > I am so glad to have found this site. I have visted this website a couple of times before, but I never realized that I can carry on social relationships on here. This is exactly what I have been looking for-- a safe and nonphysical way of communication.
> >
> > I am a pre-med student in an accrediated college. My current dream is to be a MD/PHD candidate. Since I have gotton a C and a C+ in my Organic Chemistry classes, and I had to take time off from school for psychological reasons, the dream of Medical School seem impossible. Not to mention expecting the government to consider me as a MD/PHD student. Whenever, I think of this, I feel so depressed. Like last night, I has a good cry about it; and then I went back to my Biochemistry reading. Anyway, the real dilemna I have is the following: When I resumed my studies, I was committed to periodically see a staff member at the SrC building (long-term therapy). I really resented the fact that I had to go see this DR.T. After a very short while, I became very attracted and attached to the secure environment and staff members at the SrC building. The main problem with me is that I look down upon my fellow students since they do not have any credientials (unlike the professionals at the SrC building).
> > So, basically, I do not have any social relationships with anyone (except for those in my head). Through time and therapy with Dr.T, I have began to open up and become more animated toward the people around me. However, I still feel deeply attracted to the staff members at SrC (mainly Dr.T of course, Dr.Si, who is the director and a classical gentlemen, Mrs. W who has such a magical presence, and finally, this young witty guy called Dr.H who I have a crush on). The dilemna is that I often fantasize about these four staff members from SrC. I dearly want to be their friends, their colleagues, their buddies. I crave, I live for those kind of relationships with credientialled professionals. For instance, I work as a research assistant for this post-doc and through the usuage of therapeutic tactics I picked up from my own experience, I have successfully won him over such that our relationship now is on a buddy/colleague level rather than Mentor/student. I love this kind of interaction between us. However, this postdoc is just a lay civilian. It is just so much harder to win over the four staff members at SrC because they are all highly, very highly trained therapists and extremely intuitive and intelligent. So, in a way, I do look upon it as a challenge to win these professionals over. Let me re-introduce them before going on: Dr. T is a licensed social worker and has a Ph.D in social work; Dr. Si is a psychiatrist and the director of SrC (classical gentlemen, but a bit too serious); Dr. H who I have a crush on is also a psychiatrist (but he is extremely witty, intelligent, and most importantly a modern guy), and finally there is Mrs. W who I love to observe outside the SrC arena (she is a licensed social worker and she must be studying for a Ph.D or something because she likes to read intensively in a coffee shop on campus). In addition, there is M and K who are the receptionists of SrC (M has a very gentle and motherly presence and K is a little bit brittle and sharp at times). Finally, there is
> > Dr. S (not to be confused with Dr. Si)--Dr. S seemly awlfully wicked to me from our one time face-to-face meeting because she tried to push pills on me. I hate pills or chemical substance of any kind because it go against my confidence of my natural biochemical organism. To illustrate how much I hate pills, I thought about taking a bunch of sleeping pills, cold pills, synthetic alcohol in mixture when I contemplated suicide. I am firmly rooted in the belief that pills of any kind taken for a prolong period is bad for you. Psychotherapy or rather my own will and self-esteem works much much better for me. Although, at times it is a struggle to go through those dark, depressive periods cold. When I come out of the withdraw, I feel so cleansed. Now, back to my adoration for the staff members at SrC. I still do not have any friends from the student population. In fact, I have always felt that students are so naive and loose. Plus, I am not going to school to become a student, but rather a professional
> > physician. So, I think that is why I love to become friends with the people at SrC. In addition, I feel it is so much safer to align myself with them since their head must be screwed on pretty right to work in that building. I have high documented confidence in the kind of people that work at SrC. Enough that, now I am going to tell you about my problem in relation to the four above mentioned staff members of SrC:
> >
> > 1) Mrs.W -- Mrs. W who is the licensed social worker who has a lyrical voice and fluid movement. Also, she is the only one who is young enough to be constrained to the strict boundaries of the academic therapeutic practice. She has a tendency to establish her physical presence at a popular coffee shop on campus. I love to stare at her, watch her, follow her when I see her. I have been forbidden by Dr.Si who is the director and the fatherly freudian figure of SrC to not talk to Mrs. W. But he did not say I could watch her if I see her outside of SrC! Ha! Ha! My fantasy in regard to Mrs. W is to drink coffee with her and just chat with her in general. Perhaps tell her about my woes and then let her lyrical and soothing voice consol me and put me into a trance. Oh, how I wish for that! Mrs. W, be my buddy and I'll give you my devoted loyalty.
> >
> > 2) Dr. T --My very experienced therapist. Dr.T is extremely strong emotionally (a bit weak on the analytical side-- a little slow or something). But she is catching on. Anyway, I like her because she can not be pushed around. I used to go to a therapist who if you praise him in therapy, he actually respond to it (meanwhile, I of course am thinking: go back to school, go see a therapist and deal with whatever insecurity you have). But Dr.T by the grace of God, time, and experiences has developed into a very secure and bounded therapist. I feel extremely safe to bound my troubles off her. At the beginning, she was a bit authoritian. But, in my interactions with professionals, I expect respect, and the willingness to acknowledge me as an equal. So, gradually over time, I think she is beginning to respond to me as most lay professionals do. That proves that my charisma and personality is genuine and on target (since we assuming DR. T is the ideal therapist). At least I am not totally crazy. Whew, that is a relief. As I mentioned before, I have been continually bothered by the fact that I had to go see her periodically as conditional to my status as a student. Recently, from my transferences upon her, my direct statement of discomfort over this conditional rule, and whatever other way of communication I could think of conscious and unconscious, she finally got the message after one year of our continual therapy sessions. Last session, she stated the classical termination statement(s) (you know, not having to see her unless some urgency develops or something to that effect). I think that was a very correct move on her part since now she and in a way SrC has put complete control and confidence into my hands. And I wouldn't let them down. Now, if I decide to go see her again, it would completely, absolutely be from my heart and mind. I love that! To earn that control back means a great deal to me. Now, my fantasies about her (almost every day; constantly). The theme is always to work side by side
> > with her in terms of assisting subjects in crisis. In our last session, I finally saw that flicker of respect and recognition that I am so use to seeing in other professional parties. For her to finally genuinely feel that is a great testment to me that despite my nervous breakdowns, depression, and suicidal thoughts, I am not completely off the track. I have always always felt so much more comfortable with adults of status than with students at large. I have always won respect, awe, recognition from adults and yet failed to establish meaningful relationships with students. Bottom line: It feels so right to be with these professionals and so awkward and uneasy with students. Why? I am still working on it. For the sake of my sanity, I can not just sit and wait for the students to catch up. I desperately want to have the kind of relationships that students have with their fellow students. But, I just can not no matter how hard I try. I am so jealous of students and their innocence. Relationships
> > for me has always been established on the basis of self-interest and personal goals. To give up my selfishness would be to loose my hold on my personhood. I just couldn't do it. Dr.T, she rocks in more ways than one (whatever that means)!
> >
> > 3) Dr.H -- cute, young, successful, intelligent, and has a witty personality. I actually have never met Dr.H in person. I got to know him through chance meetings and from his websites. In my fantasy world, he is going to always be unmarried. Like I mentioned above, Dr.H is a psychiatrist. However, from what I can observed and conclude from the available data, he does not seem to fit the classical, serious, mute freudian type of a psychiatrist. First of all, Dr.H is a master of the Internet. Freud using the Web, come-on... Off-hand, I would think that Dr. H's therapy techniques are very mobile, radical with restraints, and a breath of fresh air. I would love to have a session with him just to satisify my curiosity. It does not even have to be in SrC. My fantasy regarding him would be to go on a semi-formal date with him where he can just analyze me to his heart content. And I can just silently observe and hypothesize and of course fantasize away to my hearts content. That would be the ultimate
> > date in my book. It would be great if our "date" would conclude with him kissing me on the back of my hand or on my cheek like a proper gentlemen or prince. Reality check! You know the only two sources of data gathering I have on Dr.H is the chance meeting on campus or at SrC; and from his websites and e-mails. It gives me a conflicting picture of him. From his websites, e-mails, telephone message (computer geez has a computerized musical message recorder--go figure); anyway, from the ex-SrC setting, Dr.H comes across as a witty intelligent guy. Yet, from what I observed at SrC, he is a serious but boyish curious psychiatrist. That is the only place he acts remotely like a psychiatrist. Wierd guy-- must be a genius or something. Wierd, just wierd. But I am very mad and hurt by him. I e-mailed him recently with a proposal for a therapy based Internet club. However, he must have figured out that I am a client at SrC because he has not returned my e-mail yet. Probably never will! I hate him!
> > I hate him so much for giving me false hope. For a while there we had a sort of back-and-forth e-mail exchange going under a false pretense on my part. Then, I must have slipped and he figured out who I am. Now, he does not write back to me anymore. I am so hurt since I was really counting on him to brighten my day. I know that he did not meant for this to happen since I set myself up for this. But where am I going to find a cute, successful, witty, and most importantly, safe and stable gentlemen again. Not to mention cute (I saw him in a tight body suit on a summer day once). Wow! The whole package.
> >
> > 4) Dr. Si-- the "big cheese"; although Dr.T would feel a pinch of jealousy to hear me say this. What can I say? A classical gentlemen. Old and experienced. He lives on the same street as I do. I have never seen him on the street through (it is a long, long street). But I have called his house and not say anything just to hear his voice and his wife's voice. He is a very kind and caring man. But he has a whole institution to run, so he is stern and serious but a good man. I can still recall our one and only meeting. I was totally, uterally silent (long psychoanalytical training for that amount of restraint). During that time, he relaxed by writing in a notebook (classical therapy method that one do not see much these days!). One of my fantasy of him of course borders on the stories of being in that intense therapeutic setting again and getting him to break his restraint and to talk and respond to me. It would be a challenge I would gladly take on just for the heck of it. I was so jealous of this one 2nd year Medical student. I saw Dr. Si talking to her in a very relaxed way (leaning against the wall)for almost an hour, in the Medical School lobby. Oh, why oh why can't you talk to me like that, Dr. Si. I would go to the Medical School and become a 2nd year Medical student just to have this one chance of looking in your eye and hold a genuine yet relaxed conversation with you. Come on, give me a chance, forget that I once was in crisis-- see me in a professional light. Be my buddy! My other fantasies of Dr. Si are along the lines of parental (fatherhood). It is very tempting for me to see him as my father. A wise, old, and experienced guy who is kind and a therapist...perfect, ideal father for me. Too bad it is ideal and therefore by definition, unachievable. I bet Mrs. W and some of the younger therapists at SrC also regard Dr. Si as a parental counselor. I think that is part of the reason why I want to be in Mrs. W's shoes because then I can be encumbered under the wings of Dr.Si.
> >
> > So, everybody and anybody who bothered to read up to this point, thank you foremost; and help me. Help me by responding to this thread and be my realsistic buddies that I crave so much at this point in my development. After extensive thoughts, and this LONG e-mail, it has made me realize the futility of my fantasies about Mrs.W, Dr.T, Dr.H, and Dr. Si. I could never be aligned with them because their line of work encumbers them behind the walls of SrC building. For me to wish to be their buddies would be literally like pounding against the wall until I am just drained of energy. And I still suffering from occasional short bouts of depression, do not have any energy to spare. I still feel deep down inside the dream of one day becoming a physician burning a hole in my heart. I want it, I want it so bad because doctorship is such a worthy cause and a noble cause. I truly feel that I would be happy as a physician, and more importantly as a healer in a community. The one thing my "nervous breakdown" has
> > made me realize is the absolute necessity of status and respect that I need to feel happy. Hopefully, ten or fifteen years from now, I would grow out of that need (but right now, I can't without going totally depressed and withdrawn). So, my proposal to the readers of this network is to give me feedback (any and all feedback). I desperately need responses from real people. In return, I promise, to read and consider your troubles and woes and to respond to your e-mails. I need to feel like a healer, a buddy, and a friend.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Cordially and sincere thanks for reading all the way to the conclusion,
> > YOURS TRULY
> >
> >
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This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Social | Extras | FAQ
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