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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Daisym on March 30, 2006, at 1:38:54
I'm having such a hard week. My guys came home for spring break and I'm finding all the boy energy overwhelming. It makes me tense and upset. I was lucky enough to be able to take Saturday "off" and go play with Fallsfall and Racer. But Sat night I was tired and they were rowdy and I found myself in a huge black hole by midnight, feeling suicidal. It freaked me out to feel so bad, I knew it had to be more than just the energy.
I brought all this into therapy on Monday and my therapist thought maybe I felt bad because of all the tension between myself and my husband. That felt right but there was more to it than that. We talked about how bad it felt to not be able to pull yourself out enough to be there and connect with your kids. He advocated that I take time for myself, but I'm trying to enjoy them while they are here. Tuesday we worked on this again, and I mentioned that one of my sons and my husband are having a harder time getting along this visit. It is hard for me to be in the middle of this, too much tension and anger. My therapist asked me if I felt like I needed to protect my husband, even if I thought he was wrong. I hadn't thought of that but my answer was, "Isn't that what I always do?" And then I insisted we stop talking about it.
So he waited, and waited and waited. And then he leaned forward and very quietly said, "Are you in trouble for not wanting to defend him anymore?" I burst into tears and said, "No, I'm in trouble for telling on him." And we both knew I wasn't talking about my husband anymore. But then I really lost it. I told him how hard it was to know that any second all hell was going to break loose because you told. And I was so worried that my kids somehow knew about the abuse, that it was written all over me because I told. I also said that I had been waiting and waiting for him to say, "Since you are now able to tell other people, I feel OK about transferring you to..." He kept shaking his head and at one point I put my hands on the sides of my face to try and stop the stream of words flying out of my mouth. He said, "Don't do that...let it out. It needs to come out." We talked a long time about this fear and the group and my fantasy of taking care of him by diluting my need with this other support. He told me over and over again that he could take care of himself, that I didn't need to do that. He is worried about me going to group when he is on vacation but I told him I could take care of myself around that. He wondered if he should talk with the group therapist but again I told him I would take care of that.
I also told him, through the tears, how every part of me felt about telling other people. We went through all the age states. And I told him about the increase in flashbacks that are happening. I didn't expect to have such a volatile outburst. It felt like it came out of nowhere and I just couldn't stop.
He didn't rush me but when I finally quieted down, he asked me how we could make his voice saying "you are not in trouble" more powerful than the one saying, "boy are you gonna get it." I told him that his voice was more powerful but at 2am it was so hard to reach inside myself and find him. This was at 11:45am. At 3:30pm I got a voice mail from him saying, "I just want to reassure you that you are not in trouble. And I'm not going to leave you and I will work with you, "myself" until the very end of all of this stuff. It will be OK." It was so sweet and just the perfect message. So of course, I hit the wrong button and immediately deleted the message. I was so upset that without thinking and no pride, I called him and said that the message was perfect, but that I, like an idiot, deleted it. And could he please call and leave it for me again. Because I NEEDED that message. Well, he did! and he was pretty great about it all today. He said he could understand deleting it, and then wanting it back. I don't think I convinced him deleting it was an accident.
Today he told me that we are doing really good work, that we are getting to what needs to be talked about. And he knows how hard it is for me. I admitted that I was really nervous about coming today because I did not see that melt down coming at all yesterday. I have no idea where all those tears where hiding. And I suspect they aren't all cried yet.
My therapist said he suspected that too, but that was just fine with him. Because, (hadn't he said this a million times?) the best therapy happens spontaneously.
How can I be this glad that I have a therapist who will meet these needs and be this mortified for having them at? I think the psyche is twisted.
Posted by Tamar on March 30, 2006, at 7:09:14
In reply to Still Needy - Big Trigger, posted by Daisym on March 30, 2006, at 1:38:54
> I'm having such a hard week. My guys came home for spring break and I'm finding all the boy energy overwhelming.
Because it’s boys or because it’s a lot of energy? Sorry, wasn’t sure which you meant.
> And I was so worried that my kids somehow knew about the abuse, that it was written all over me because I told.
The way you phrased that resonates so much with me. I often feel that my experience of rape is written all over me. And I don’t want my kids to see it, even though they’re too young to understand. And I don’t want anyone else to see it either; the idea that it can be seen makes me feel vulnerable to revictimization.
A couple of weeks ago I cut myself a lot, and I realised that the cutting was a way of writing it on the surface. So I decided to write with a pen instead of a knife. I wrote all kinds of things all over my body. And then it was definitely written all over me. I used indelible pen, so it took a few days to wash off, and although I didn’t write anywhere that would be visible with clothes on, it was visible whenever I was undressed. And then, once it had all washed off, I realised how part of my difficulty is that it is invisible. And I wonder if that’s part of the issue for you. After all, if it had in fact been written all over you, someone would have rescued you. But abusers hide their abuse and make sure it can’t be seen.
And I also realised when I wrote on myself that me pain and my experience was already inscribed all over me. In other words, being raped is inscribed on my body and my mind. I can’t wash it off like I washed off the pen; it’s like a series of scars. I don’t want to show them to people, but I also don’t want to continue to be ashamed of them. So for me, it’s both visible and invisible, and neither feels comfortable.
> I also told him, through the tears, how every part of me felt about telling other people. We went through all the age states. And I told him about the increase in flashbacks that are happening. I didn't expect to have such a volatile outburst. It felt like it came out of nowhere and I just couldn't stop.
It’s hard when that happens. And I wonder if the desire to tell other people is partly a hope that if other people know about it you’ll be safer; not just the age states who remember and want to be rescued, but also in your current life. I’m sure you know from your professional experience that an abused child can usually only be helped if he or she finds a way to tell, and the fear of consequences can prevent a child telling. And yet, one thing that I think is different now (compared with when I was a kid) is that a great many adults are aware of the extent of the problem of child sexual abuse. So I think (and I hope) that children who tell nowadays are more likely to be believed and protected from their abusers. And maybe you deserve some of that being believed, even though it was years ago and you are no longer a child. Do you feel that telling other people would be helpful to you? What does your therapist think about it?
> So of course, I hit the wrong button and immediately deleted the message. I was so upset that without thinking and no pride, I called him and said that the message was perfect, but that I, like an idiot, deleted it. And could he please call and leave it for me again. Because I NEEDED that message. Well, he did! and he was pretty great about it all today. He said he could understand deleting it, and then wanting it back. I don't think I convinced him deleting it was an accident.
That was a lovely message. It’s great that he got it exactly right. Maybe he thinks your unconscious deleted it on purpose, even if you believed consciously that it was an accident. In which case, perhaps you might remind yourself that you deserve that message and that it won’t get you in any trouble?
> How can I be this glad that I have a therapist who will meet these needs and be this mortified for having them at? I think the psyche is twisted.
Yeah, sometimes it feels as if the psyche is twisted! I guess it takes time to get used to the idea that you are allowed to have those needs, after years of denying them. If it were anyone else, you’d understand instantly that their needs are acceptable; but it’s always harder to believe it of ourselves, isn’t it?
I’m so glad you have such a great therapist.
Tamar
Posted by fallsfall on March 30, 2006, at 7:52:45
In reply to Still Needy - Big Trigger, posted by Daisym on March 30, 2006, at 1:38:54
I'm so glad that those tears do come, that you can let them out. You must be drowning in all those tears. It is spring - the flowers need the water.
His message was wonderful. And I'm so glad he left it for you again. And he will be there *himself* for you until you don't need him to be anymore (not until you don't THINK you need him to be... but until you really don't need him to be).
I know what you mean about the kids being home. I understand the overwhelm, and I understand the guilt that you should be able to "do" it, and the regret if you take any time off that you will miss them being there and lose that moment. It is OK to realize that, as much as you love to have them around, that they really disrupt your equillibrium.
So, how was group?
Posted by TherapyGirl on March 30, 2006, at 9:00:14
In reply to Still Needy - Big Trigger, posted by Daisym on March 30, 2006, at 1:38:54
Daisy, I'm so sorry you're having such a hard time this week, but thankful that you are able to both write about it here and process it with your therapist. He sounds like he understands perfect, most of the time, what you need and is willing to give it to you.
<<How can I be this glad that I have a therapist who will meet these needs and be this mortified for having them at? I think the psyche is twisted.>>
I think this is a "natural" occurrence for abused children -- we are taught that we are bad, pathetic, selfish, whatever, for needing the grown-ups around us to take care of us and/or protect us. It's no surprise to me that so many of us feel mortified for needing anything from anyone.
Hang in there, Daisy, and keep sharing when you can.
Posted by antigua on March 30, 2006, at 12:16:11
In reply to Still Needy - Big Trigger, posted by Daisym on March 30, 2006, at 1:38:54
I'm glad your boys are home, but I can understand the overwhelming energy. At our house, we are sitting on a landmine, waiting for college letters to come in. The dynamics in our house are explosive right now and all I want to do is hide under the covers. I can't protect either my husband or son from each other; all I can try to do is be there for both of them. It's ugly.
I saw my T yesterday and she pointed out how my anxiety about my son ties back to all the abandonment I went through as a kid. Great to know, but it's still no fun.
I've been dealing so much w/the present that my little girls have had no chance to come out and play.
Take care Daisy,
I'm glad your T is there for you--he always is, you know.
best,
antigua
Posted by Poet on March 30, 2006, at 12:20:45
In reply to Still Needy - Big Trigger, posted by Daisym on March 30, 2006, at 1:38:54
Hi Daisy,
I hate feeling needy and dependent on someone, which is probably a major factor in why in therapy I refuse to talk about certain issues.
My T keeps telling me that she won't judge me, nothing I say will cause her to abandon me, but the words (and definitely never tears) just don't come out.
As she says, we have a relationship, it's okay to depend on that relationship, so I guess that's her way of saying it's okay to feel needy. I'm not ready to accept it, but I am nowhere close to the progress you've made in therapy, so please let yourself lean on your T. Don't beat yourself up for feeling needy.
((((Daisy))))
Poet
Posted by All Done on March 30, 2006, at 15:05:11
In reply to Still Needy - Big Trigger, posted by Daisym on March 30, 2006, at 1:38:54
(((((Daisy))))),
You know how much I wish I could make this easier for you.
I told my T I don't understand how I'm supposed to need him so much, tell him what I need, and then, he's going to meet some of those needs but not all of them. It makes me so scared. I want to know beforehand which ones he can meet and which ones he can't. As an adult, I'm not used to acting with so much uncertainty. Kids are fearless. I feel like a four-year old with the added bonus of the fear learned by a 33-year old.
Sorry for the tangent.
I worry a lot about being *there* for my son when I'm with him. I understand the guilt of not feeling in the moment, but I have discovered, that I'm much better with him when I can get a little rejuvenation. Unfortunately, the need to rejuvenate doesn't always come at the best time. So, I muddle through until it's a good time to take a break. In the big scheme of things, he's not going to remember the week or so where I wasn't exactly myself as much as he's going to remember the next few weeks where I focus my attention on him when I'm with him. And neither am I.
My T recently told me it's a good thing for my son to see that his Mommy has an emotional life. He doesn't need to see *all* of it, but it's okay, if he knows I'm not happy all the time. You're a great mom, Daisy. Try not to let one week make you forget that.
I'm glad your T left you the message he did. It's so important to have something to go back to when your mind doesn't seem to let you hang on.
Hugs, (((Daisy))).
Laurie
Posted by orchid on March 30, 2006, at 18:27:34
In reply to Still Needy - Big Trigger, posted by Daisym on March 30, 2006, at 1:38:54
Hi Daisy,
I am sorry you are having a hard time. But I find the part that you said about "Still Needy" a bit worriesome. I think working through csa needs A LOT of time and understanding and rehashing everything out and relearning new things. It takes quite a bit of time. Is there any way you can give yourself *full permission* to be completely childlike and give your full trust to your therapist and permit yourself to need him as much as you want and for as long as you want?I generally think it is not a good idea to need a therapist or be dependant on them that much. But I think in your situation, it is warranted, and plus your therapist has proven over and over again, that he is completely trustworty and *will not* let you down. I believe you can trust him 100 %, and give yourself the full permission to depend on him as much as you need till you get this fully sorted out.
Sometimes when very bad things happen to us, we just need to talk about it again and again and again and again, and for someone to console us again and again and again and again, and after sometime, it kind of becomes ok. I am glad you have your therapist who understands this perfectly.
Posted by rubenstein on April 1, 2006, at 8:42:43
In reply to Still Needy - Big Trigger, posted by Daisym on March 30, 2006, at 1:38:54
Daisym
You have such a wonderful therpaist but what a tough session. It is os wierd but I had many of the same feelings this week and the past with my therapsit. Being afraid he was going to leave me, being afraid of being to needy, wanting to take care of him. Still, yesterday, I as waiting for the words that he didn't want to see me anymore. This is so hard. I hope things are going better for you. Tkae care of yourself
rachel
Posted by annierose on April 1, 2006, at 15:09:55
In reply to Still Needy - Big Trigger, posted by Daisym on March 30, 2006, at 1:38:54
How are you doing this weekend?
This is the end of the thread.
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