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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 25. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Daisym on February 14, 2006, at 0:55:22
I think I don't know how to use therapy right now.
I'm coming out of a very bad patch with my therapist -- we usually dance so smoothly together but this time he stepped on my toes. It hurt and it has taken a lot of sessions to process what happened and why. And things are very volatile at home, too much anger for me to deal with.
The flip side is that work is more under control than it has been for months. I started an infant/child mental health fellowship that is rigorous and VERY cool (I trained all weekend with T. Berry Brazelton, himself!) and I am busy, busy with commitments here, there and everywhere.
Which is an old coping mechanism for me. I get myself totally busy and overwhelmed so I don't have time for my feelings. And it works, up to a point. The difference now is that I have therapy everyday that pokes and prods those feelings back into action. I can't ignore them for very long. But I'm feeling so conflicted. If I can stay busy and productive, why do I need so much therapy? How is it that I can be doing fairly well all day and I go in at 4pm and fall apart? This feels eerily like when I started therapy -- the hurting that comes on after sessions and hangs around for hours.
Like tonight. There are huge waves of pain and nothing seems to be helping. But I finished writing my grant paper. How can this be? How can I be such an internal mess and external success? Am I indulging myself this hurt? I keep thinking I should try harder to put it away and not go to therapy so much. Most people don't go this much -- what am I doing to myself?
Especially if I don't know how to use therapy to make me feel better right now, why am I still going?
Posted by All Done on February 14, 2006, at 1:49:28
In reply to Too much Therapy?, posted by Daisym on February 14, 2006, at 0:55:22
Hi, Daisy.
My therapist always likes to remind me that sometimes it's not necessarily clear what path we're on. He usually reminds me of that when I'm wondering why I'm there. Therapy takes on many different forms and we go forward and backward, and sometimes I think we stand still a bit, too.
Maybe you can use this time to work on rebuilding the connection with your therapist. All the pieces are there - some of them just need to be put back in place. So, go as often as you need to in order to do that and you'll be dancing with him again, that I know.
It's okay to be in therapy "just" for *you*. It's okay to make yourself a priority. You deserve to feel better.
Hugs,
Laurie
Posted by B2chica on February 14, 2006, at 9:45:32
In reply to Too much Therapy?, posted by Daisym on February 14, 2006, at 0:55:22
Daisy...i'm SO proud of you!
do you know what your doing?you are taking all your pain and anger and channeling it into something greaet! you work. This is what's supposed to happen. those feelings don't just go away, you can't keep them bottled up, but it's not good to let them out in violence either...you did EXACTLY what you're supposed to do.
allowed those intense emotions transcend into something good and productive!
congrats!sorry you are feeling such pain though.
and i ask myself the same question about therapy, why am i still going. when my old t left, this one i can't talk to yet i keep going. it's like a crutch for me right now. i'm just not ready to let go, even if she isn't helping me. and that's ok. cuz i'm doing what i feel i need to do to cope with things.
even though i feel terrible cuz i have all these things that i let out and now i can't talk about them cuz i'm not comfortable or feel safe.maybe soon we will.
HTH
b2c.
Posted by Racer on February 14, 2006, at 12:27:44
In reply to Too much Therapy?, posted by Daisym on February 14, 2006, at 0:55:22
I'm of two minds on that question, Dais, because one part of me worries that you're donig wiht therapy what you do with your work: being goal oriented, pushing to finish it, to Get It Done. I don't think therapy works that way. Which is not to say that I don't want to go every day, twice a day, to get it done faster...
And then i htink, "well, that sounds as though she's kinda compartmentalizing it -- emotions only after work." That is productive, in a way, but the long term goal is to be able to integrate emotions into your life, right?
Oh, whoops -- apparently my minds can't do math, because there's also another part of me saying, "Daisy, Honey, if you need it, keep doing it." And I think, for now, it's not worth looking at whether you're Doing Therapy Perfectly. It's better to go if you need to, and you can cut back, or adjust so that you go more when you need more, etc.
Of course, my therapist works three days a week, so I can't see her every day, but she usually has open slots I can fit into if I need extra. If that's not the case for you, and I think it's not, then I don't know what to suggest.
Hang in, Daisy. You've shaken yourself off your foundations over the past year or two, so now give yourself time for the new foundation to settle, and to hug the bedrock.
Posted by annierose on February 14, 2006, at 13:52:05
In reply to Too much Therapy?, posted by Daisym on February 14, 2006, at 0:55:22
I'm of the thinking that it's okay to throw yourself into work occasionally as a productive way to deal with our angst. Don't beat yourself for that. Everyone needs a way to "escape" and work is a healthy choice as long as you are not working 80+ hours each and every week. And it sounds like this new fellowship is exciting and challenging and bring new life to your work day. That's all good, good, good.
Remember, sometimes when we learn a new dance step it takes practice to get it just right. Maybe you are moving forward into therapy with more complicated dance moves so it is going to take more than a few sessions before you are dancing smoothly again.
My T would say that it makes perfect sense that we feel like falling apart within their office walls. They become our emotional center (especially the more we go per week). Let him catch you if you are falling. It's okay to indulge yourself in this hurt. It's still fresh. It wants your attention. Don't worry about how often you go. I understand. I question myself as well. But I know I am gathering strength, moving forward, even if it's at a snail's pace.
I'm sorry things are volatile at home. It does make everything else seem more difficult. Darn those husbands.
(((((((((((dasiy)))))))))))))
Posted by fallsfall on February 14, 2006, at 14:17:17
In reply to Too much Therapy?, posted by Daisym on February 14, 2006, at 0:55:22
>If I can stay busy and productive, why do I need so much therapy?
Because there is more to life than being busy and productive?
Therapy does change over the course of time. And it takes some time to figure out how to do the "new" therapy. For me, that period is pretty painful because I don't know what is expected, I don't know what to do, I don't know what to not do. For a planner like me, that isn't much fun. But it has been worth it to me to stick it out and figure it out.
I'm in one of those transitions now, too. And I hate it. But I know I'm not done, so I have to figure out how to keep going.
You are probably at a place where you will deepen your relationship with your therapist. That can be pretty scary stuff. It can also be the rewarding stuff.
Stumble along for a little while. You'll figure it out.
(((((Daisy)))))
Falls.
Posted by Gee on February 14, 2006, at 21:21:40
In reply to Too much Therapy?, posted by Daisym on February 14, 2006, at 0:55:22
It's easier to stay super busy than to feel. I do the same thing.
Feel what you feel. Maybe talk to your t about not feeling when you're busy. My t pushed me to do small things for myself everyday while I was busy. It's helped me learn to let go a bit every now and then.
Good luck and hang in there Daisy
Posted by fairywings on February 14, 2006, at 23:01:35
In reply to Too much Therapy?, posted by Daisym on February 14, 2006, at 0:55:22
Sounds like you're using work as a distraction...to deal with the pain, and then therapy as your release at the end of the day. That doesn't sound so bad except that it sounds like work and home are incredibly stressful, and you worry that therapy isn't going anywhere. Maybe think of it like something you deserve after a long hard day at work....like a massage, or manicure, except for your mental health.I don't really think we can always help the way we feel inside. It's just there, even if some therapies say we can overcome it w/our thinking. I've had meds be off and have been on the edge, so why can't that be true just because that's the way it is at the time. I'm sorry things are so overwhelming right now. Wish you could bask in the sun poolside somewhere.
fw
Posted by Pfinstegg on February 14, 2006, at 23:31:32
In reply to Re: Too much Therapy? » Daisym, posted by fairywings on February 14, 2006, at 23:01:35
I feel that I know what you are talking about. Your T, like mine, is so empathic. We discovered, together, that regressing every day to all the trauma and suffering of childhood was not ideal, any longer. I feel certain that it was vital to do, and helped tremendously, but that it's now equally important for me to utilize my adult self on some days. We did so much together that was helpful, but now I do need to have more time for the adult me who wants to contribute to the world. Like you- what could be more wonderful that implementing a training fellowship with what you learned with Berry Brazelton!
I now see my analyst three times a week, rather than five times, and I like what is happening. It still means the world to me to be able to see him, but there is more room for my own adult life, which is becoming richer. It may be different for you- you and he will know what is best to do- and when to do it.
Just so that you don't feel alone with it, we, too have gone through mutual hurt feelings, and survived to have an even stronger relationship. That is probably bound to happen in very intensive therapy, don't you think?
Posted by Daisym on February 15, 2006, at 0:31:11
In reply to Re: Probably not » Daisym, posted by All Done on February 14, 2006, at 1:49:28
Isn't it amazing that what last week what I really wanted was to just fix our relationship and this week I just want to run from therapy and him? I hate this.
And I'm still not OK with it being "just" for me. I need to need it. I can't just want it.
sigh
Posted by Daisym on February 15, 2006, at 0:35:25
In reply to Re: Too much Therapy?, posted by B2chica on February 14, 2006, at 9:45:32
You are doing really hard work, B2. It takes great courage to start with someone new. I hope it doesn't feel like starting over though...but rather picking up a new guide on your journey. One who was recommended and has not only your best interests at heart but a duty to the faith your old therapist put in her.
I wish I could be as brave as you are. Lend me some courage, OK?
Posted by Daisym on February 15, 2006, at 0:41:58
In reply to Re: Too much Therapy?, posted by Racer on February 14, 2006, at 12:27:44
I feel like the bedrock is sitting on me. It is just therapy hangover. Do you ever feel like that? Isn't it strange that as I pick up the pieces and move on, I feel worse. I'm thinking today that there has been this really huge thing going on at work for nearly a year. It might be almost over. Good or bad outcome, it will be over. And I've done everything I can, so now I pretty much just wait. Perhaps part of the pain pouring forth is a year's worth of exhaustion.
I work well under pressure and when I get on a roll like this, I want to just stay in the narrow band width of competency. But I'm so afraid of crashing because I don't think I know how to land. I'll just stop and drop.
question is, "how far is the drop?"
Posted by Daisym on February 15, 2006, at 0:49:38
In reply to Re: Too much Therapy? » Daisym, posted by annierose on February 14, 2006, at 13:52:05
****It's okay to indulge yourself in this hurt ****
Is it? Where is the line between wallowing and healing? How will I know I've crossed over? How do I know if this pain is about what happened to me, my marriage and all that...or is it about my need for my therapist? I tell him I fall apart because he allows it. If he didn't allow it, would it go away?
It is too much for my brain. I do appreciate the support.
Posted by Daisym on February 15, 2006, at 0:52:11
In reply to Re: Too much Therapy? » Daisym, posted by fallsfall on February 14, 2006, at 14:17:17
Falls,
I know how hard you are working. I'm trying to follow your example. But the truth is, I don't want to work right now. I want to just go in and sit and be soothed. I want a place to cry. That's it. The rest is too much right now.
But I'll never allow myself to do that. I wouldn't get an A in therapy then, would I? I hope you are right and this is going to deepen things and not always feel like this. Because right now, it just isn't worth it.
Posted by Daisym on February 15, 2006, at 0:57:19
In reply to Re: Too much Therapy? » Daisym, posted by Gee on February 14, 2006, at 21:21:40
Thanks Gee,
What did you end up doing for yourself? This is definately something I need to learn.
Focus at work is definately good though.
Thanks for the support.
Posted by Daisym on February 15, 2006, at 1:02:20
In reply to Re: Too much Therapy? » Daisym, posted by fairywings on February 14, 2006, at 23:01:35
The pool sounds nice. I think you deserve it too. We'll meet there at 5 for drinks, OK?
Do you ever wonder if your therapy would be different if you went on a Sat morning instead of a Monday afternoon? I'm just rambling, trying to figure out what this sadness is and how it relates to therapy.
I need a psychic, not a psychotherapist.
Posted by Daisym on February 15, 2006, at 1:09:22
In reply to Balancing therapy and life, posted by Pfinstegg on February 14, 2006, at 23:31:32
I was hoping you would chime in...how does it feel to "only" go 3x a week? In theory it sounds good, but whenever I try to actually move myself back, I freak out and fall apart. It feels like abandonment, even though it is ME that brings up cutting back! I just can't get a handle on what to do, on what is best. My therapist is very patient, he tells me it takes years sometimes of in and out of this kind of trauma. And we spend weeks working on work issues and husband issues. So my adult self is very present in therapy.
And yet...the younger parts insist on showing up. I essentially told him off last Thursday from a young angry side that felt ignored. And then these horrible stories pour out, with such offensive details. I WANT him to hear it, and I HATE that I want him to hear it.
I really want to know, how did you put things back together after he hurt you? How did you deal with the fact that you hurt him?
Sometimes I wonder what i've gotten myself into doing this analysis.
Posted by antigua on February 15, 2006, at 7:18:19
In reply to Too much Therapy?, posted by Daisym on February 14, 2006, at 0:55:22
Hi Daisy,
Wish I knew the answer. I think it's how far down the track do you want to go, do you feel it's safe to go, and how much you feel you need to go. It's so hard sometimes, but you know that sometimes that's when the greatest healing happens.I'm wondering if I'm reaching the end of therapy. After telling my mother, I feel so much better. Not luck a huge weight has been lifted, as I thought I would, but just little things. I feel like i'm in a healing phase, but I don't know if that means I'm done or not. I am relying on my T to help lead me through this.
I've been concentrating on my little girls and the funniest thing has happened. I find that they are protecting me too; they won't let me do things that fit my old patterns.
But I feel sad at the same time. Not that it might be over; that's not it at all. As if this is as far as I'm going and I'm learning to accept that. It doesn't fill my head all the time. But I don't have work to keep me busy! I have to get a job now. Actually, I want to get a job now so that I can be more productive.
Best to you Daisy, hang in there,
antigua
Posted by B2chica on February 15, 2006, at 10:29:12
In reply to Re: Too much Therapy? » B2chica, posted by Daisym on February 15, 2006, at 0:35:25
> I wish I could be as brave as you are. Lend me some courage, OK?
you ARE and then some...but i'll send you vibes of courage, i can create it but can't seem to use it...here it is. the x symbolizes two swords crossing, this is your armor. you are safe.
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXb2c.
Posted by Pfinstegg on February 16, 2006, at 1:27:23
In reply to Re: Balancing therapy and life » Pfinstegg, posted by Daisym on February 15, 2006, at 1:09:22
The hurt part was very hard- but also very interesting. We were in one of those non-verbal moments, when my infant part felt so much pain and loneliness. I was lying down, and he got up from beside me and moved around the room. It was so unusual- and frightening! Then he came back, and told me that my (unspoken) pain was hurting him a lot. And that he knew how much it was hurting me. I was very hurt by the abandonment, though it was short-lived, and felt terrible, also, to have hurt him. Getting over it- well, we just talked and talked about it- for weeks! Gradually, the sense of mutual trust and warmth rebuilt, and we were both able to be more comfortable with the tough issues (the neediness, the rage, the fear..). In the process, those feelings lost some of their intensity, I'm really simplifying here, as our relationship is tremendously complicated, with younger parts having their own particular feelings towards him- usually at odds with the feelings other parts have. We both felt that I was better enough to try less sessions. Sometimes, I really miss the daily ones, but I also like having two whole days a week as a grown-up only. They feel real. And I feel he's with me those days, in spirit, cheering me on. It's not set in stone, though; if I really need more, I can ask for them. An awful lot goes on in those three sessions, though, and a little more rest in between is welcome.
I should say that I've had two EMDR sessions, which helped a lot in decreasing the intensity of that particular pain. I'm going to continue that- with other traumatic areas. We need to identify them quite clearly before we do it.
I do hope you work it out comfortably- for you. Just looking on, it seems to me that what you are doing at work is so creative and valuable, and is a sign of your increased strength and health. It doesn't just seem like an obsessive pre-occupation.
Posted by annierose on February 16, 2006, at 6:37:20
In reply to Re: Balancing therapy and life, posted by Pfinstegg on February 16, 2006, at 1:27:23
I know what you mean when you write that on days when you do not see your T, you feel that he is with you. I feel that all the time.
My T was recently on vacation and when she returned I told her that I still felt her presence. She asked me, "How do you envision me?" It was uncomfortable to share, but I told her "You have your arm gently around my shoulders, like a warm hug. Encouraging me that it's okay, okay to talk to someone, okay to say what you are thinking." She didn't respond, or maybe she did and I can't remember. But I guess she was smiling.
Congratulations (if that's appropriate) to reducing to 3 times a week. I imagine that it must seem hard and difficult at times. I'm glad that you feel good about your new schedule. And that your T is still with you when your not with him. How is your T with you on those days?
Posted by Pfinstegg on February 16, 2006, at 20:40:09
In reply to Re: Balancing therapy and life » Pfinstegg, posted by annierose on February 16, 2006, at 6:37:20
He's just stolen into my heart, somehow, by always being so caring, and putting up with all my storms of feeling with so much calmness and well, you know..he's just always been so great. I thought I would never be able to introject him that way, and would always need his actual presence, but I don't quite as much now, Well, I DO, but not quite as much!
Posted by Daisym on February 17, 2006, at 1:49:37
In reply to Re: Balancing therapy and life, posted by Pfinstegg on February 16, 2006, at 1:27:23
Thank you for sharing all that. I'm always surprised at what similiar tracks our therapy takes. The hurt I felt was more of a rejection than abandonment but his acknowledgement that I hurt him, and that the intensity of our relationship could reach such a painful peak was a bit devastating. And I was humiliated that *I* had pushed it to this point. And on and off angry with him for being so painfully honest.
It has been two weeks and we have talked a lot about how this rupture has effected both of us and our relationship. I was surprised when he told me how upset he was and how he was afraid I might run from therapy. And he worried about regaining my trust. It has been interesting because there have been two full sessions where I have shared very painful memories since then, and I half wondered if they weren't the easiest way to reattach. But as I read your response, it occurs to me that there *are* different part that need to trust him in different ways. So seeing if he can hear these terrible things might be a way of testing him...I don't know.
Can I ask another question? How did you arrive at cutting back? For me, if he brings it up I will freak out for sure. And everytime I bring it up. I make myself upset. Maybe it is still too soon. I had a flashback today that was scary and it wasn't something I'd seen before. So apparently there are still some new memories I haven't accessed yet. God, this really stinks.
Posted by fairywings on February 17, 2006, at 15:29:23
In reply to Re: Too much Therapy? » fairywings, posted by Daisym on February 15, 2006, at 1:02:20
> The pool sounds nice. I think you deserve it too. We'll meet there at 5 for drinks, OK?
I think I got lost on my way to the pool! ; )
>
> Do you ever wonder if your therapy would be different if you went on a Sat morning instead of a Monday afternoon? I'm just rambling, trying to figure out what this sadness is and how it relates to therapy.I hope you find some answers to the sadness. Seems with the hurt you've had, the sadness would be normal.
I usually go Tues. or Th. evenings bec. of the kids schedules - I think he's not there most Saturdays.
>
> I need a psychic, not a psychotherapist.LOL
fw
Posted by Pfinstegg on February 19, 2006, at 18:51:53
In reply to Re: Balancing therapy and life » Pfinstegg, posted by Daisym on February 17, 2006, at 1:49:37
You know, I've been going daily for three years, and I've gotten quite a bit more confident and stable. Making sure I take account of the "parts"- treat them really respectfully myself, and even have "meetings" inside my own head, so that I know what each one feels, and they get to know more abut one another- and then share everything with my T- all this has helped me a lot. As usual, we talked about it "forever", and it just began to seem right.
If it's a terrifying thought, and brings up fears of rejection or abandonment, I'd say don't torment yourself about it at all right now. The reconnection sounds much more important.
This is the end of the thread.
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