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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by mair on February 17, 2005, at 17:04:05
I had a difficult session today - one of those where it was a struggle to express myself. I knew yesterday it would be awful, and I probably should have cancelled it.
The crux is that I spent most of yesterday cataloging how far behind I am - mostly at work - everything I've been putting off; everything I should have done that I haven't; everything I don't get done during the day because I'm distracted by other things; everything I'm disorganized about; everything I forget to do etc. The more I thought about these things the more I could see how worthless I can be and how much I can disappoint other people, and how much my lack of work production affects my family in a couple of different ways. I also saw that I couldn't talk to my T about any of them.
Thinking about that made me realize that I really don't like to present myself in a bad light to my T. I'll talk in generalities about negatives, but not specifics. I don't know whether it is that I'm worried about my T's opinion of me, or whether I just don't want to have to spend a lot of time facing up to all the things I do wrong.
My T posited a theory that she's never fully verbalized before. She thinks that I draw on her for a more positive view of myself - that I can't generate that positive sense of self on my own, at least not usually. My father used to tease me pretty mercilessly about the same things over and over - In my 40's he was still teasing me about something that happened when I was 5, and because I was shy and sensitive, his teasing had more the feel of ridicule than of simple fun. She thinks that taught me that letting people know negative things about me posed the risk that I would be held up for ridicule. Because I rely so much on my T to give me a positive view of me, I can't risk losing that by letting her know more about me, so she says.
Maybe she's right about the risk of revelation, although I'm not sure I buy into the theory that I'm dependent on her to give me a positive sense of self; I'm not sure I usually take in the message that she likes me or cares for me or has a favorable opinion of me. But if she's right, it seems pretty pathetic and a pretty insecure foundation for a positive self view.
I have one more session scheduled before I'll miss 2 sessions while she's gone on vacation. I feel a little humiliated for having struggled so much and I can't see anything positive coming out of a session right before she leaves. either I'll keep struggling and feel upset and anxious or to avoid that, she'll use the session to talk about harmless "filler" material. I think those sessions are frustratingly pointless.
I'm incredibly anxious about going back there next week. I told her as I was leaving that I wasn't sure it made sense for us to meet again until she comes back. Unfortunately I didn't have time to explain that to her before I left.
I'm not sure whether I should cancel or not. I've never cancelled a session before for anything other than a schedule conflict. I don't know what it would feel like or how she'd respond.
Does anyone do this? Lying about why I can't come is not an option.
Mair
Posted by rockymtnhi on February 17, 2005, at 20:37:43
In reply to Sense of Self Redux, posted by mair on February 17, 2005, at 17:04:05
As I was reading your post, I wondered if you are 'unavailable' to do your work because you are consumed emotionally with other things.
Lying will only cause you to be disappointed in yourself. Please share your struggle with your T.
Take care.
Posted by Daisym on February 17, 2005, at 21:28:41
In reply to Sense of Self Redux, posted by mair on February 17, 2005, at 17:04:05
I've tried to cancel several times because i was anxious about the probable topic or because I was upset with my therapist (or myself). He usually wants to talk about the need to cancel, what I'm feeling about that and why I'm running away. Most of the time I end up going in and we end up discussing it face to face.
I think sharing with your therapist the parts of you that you aren't proud of is a protection against abandonment and shame. You might not need her for your self esteem, but you might need her to like you, which is perfectly understandable. I think it is really hard in any situation to say, "I'm not good at this, or I've failed at that." We all want to put our best foot forward, don't you think?
I think this is a really great topic to explore with her. I hope you go to your next appointment. Take in your post if nothing else to help you get started.
I'm sorry it was so hard.
Posted by Dinah on February 17, 2005, at 21:46:59
In reply to Sense of Self Redux, posted by mair on February 17, 2005, at 17:04:05
> ... or to avoid that, she'll use the session to talk about harmless "filler" material. I think those sessions are frustratingly pointless.
Ooooh Mair! That's just what final sessions before an impenetrable separation should be. You don't want to risk a crisis right before you'll be unable to see her.
Which doesn't mean that it has to be pointless or filler. I call them bonding sessions, but that doesn't mean that we do nothing but share stories of childhood vacations, tho truthfully I adore those. Sometimes we approach issues, but we do it a bit differently. He doesn't push, or "challenge". It's all lighter, maybe teasing. But sometimes issues get addressed quite nicely that way too.
I know teasing doesn't come easier to you than it does to me (I probably have an advantage in a young child there). But shyly bringing up the topic that you may be not revealing the unloveliest parts of yourself (in your eyes) because you don't want her to see you as unlovely doesn't have to be all heavy and serious. It can be a wry acknowledgement that you care about her, and care about her good opinion. Or a wry acknowledgement that you care a bit too much about what everyone thinks of you, and that you tend to do that with everyone. Whatever the truth is.
It's the tone that matters in the final session before a break. And sometimes the knowledge that the tone can't turn ugly makes saying things almost easier, you know? Oh, maybe it's not for everyone.
But for me, I get as affectionate as a puppy in the last session before a break. And within that affection, I can say things I couldn't say otherwise. I don't know, maybe feeling affectionate as a pup also makes me as open and trusting as a pup. But maybe that's not true of everyone.
(But I would wish for everyone that it did. It's really a very good feeling.)
Posted by mair on February 18, 2005, at 16:44:27
In reply to Re: Sense of Self Redux, posted by rockymtnhi on February 17, 2005, at 20:37:43
I wasn't able to go in and tell her in specific terms what I didn't want to talk to her about but I could tell her that I hadn't wanted to come because there were things I couldn't talk about, and I was able to talk with her about general categories of what those "things" were. I've told her many times in the past that I wanted to cancel a session. I told her yesterday that one reason I don't cancel sessions is that I can't lie about why I'm cancelling. If I could just call up and leave a message like I've got to take my kid to the doctor, that would be one thing. But my message would be more on the order of I can't come because there are things I don't want to talk about and I don't want to spend an awkward 50 minutes trying not to talk about the things that are on my mind. I'm pretty sure that she'd call me back and talk me into coming in. If I'm going to be talked into retracting my cancellation, there doesn't seem to much point to cancelling to begin with.
Just not showing doesn't seem to be a viable alternative either - I'm so reliable about coming and coming on time that I really do think she'd worry if I just failed to show up.
Her big point to me yesterday is that even though I couldn't talk much about the things really bothering me, she learned alot more from the things I could say than she would have known if I hadn't shown up altogether.
I know she's right; it's just so damn uncomfortable.
Mair
Posted by mair on February 18, 2005, at 17:09:24
In reply to Re: Sense of Self Redux » mair, posted by Daisym on February 17, 2005, at 21:28:41
I decided today that what I've been putting myself through is just my own private version of hell. I lapse into thinking obsessively about what I view as massive failures, mostly centered around work. I get really stuck thinking about these things and they seem so huge that I can't talk to my T about them. So I go in and blunder through an awkward session where I talk around the things I can't talk about in detail. Then I leave her office feeling a little humiliated both by the enormity of the failures and by my difficulty discussing them with her. She pointed out to me that given the strength of my hyper-critical super ego, the stuff I'm holding back is probably pretty minor. And all these little things I haven't done would probably engender a "so what" reaction from someone else, but they just are looming so large to me now - large enough to create a huge amount of pain - large enough to make me feel thoroughly worthless and slightly suicidal, but not in a way that mobilizes me to actually get them done.
My T tried to point out to me that I need to hold onto the fact that I don't always feel as negative about myself as I do now. My response to that is that I have 2 sets of data - the negative stuff and the more positive stuff. When I'm feeling better about myself, it's because I've just sort of swept the negative stuff under the carpet, sort of like sticking your head in the sand and pretending the bad stuff isn't there. But the negative stuff is still there whether I always acknowledge it or not. When I'm feeling as I do now, it's not that I'm denying the positive stuff, it's just of so much less import than the rawer negative data.
And when you think about it, as long as I can't verbalize it, there no reason for it not to keep spinning, at least until I find a way to stick my head back into the sand.
Mair
Posted by mair on February 18, 2005, at 17:15:08
In reply to Re: Sense of Self Redux, posted by Dinah on February 17, 2005, at 21:46:59
Dinah - your pre-vacation sessions sound so much more fun than mine. The last time my T went on vacation, we had this really heavy session right before - it had nothing to do with her going away; it was just a function of what we were working on at the time.
I feel like I left everything in such a mess when I left there yesterday; I can't imagine what could happen in one session to make me feel better about it.
The sessions I think of as being pretty worthless are the ones that are purely informational - where we're not talking about feelings at all, but just about something factual that's happening with one of my kids for instance. I'm sure they're helpful in their own way. At least she has a notion of what is happening with my kids and she can use that in some context. These just seem like non-productive discussions to me.
Mair
Posted by littleone on February 18, 2005, at 18:21:49
In reply to Sense of Self Redux, posted by mair on February 17, 2005, at 17:04:05
> My T posited a theory that she's never fully verbalized before. She thinks that I draw on her for a more positive view of myself - that I can't generate that positive sense of self on my own, at least not usually.
Hi mair, I'm sure I'm projecting a lot here, but is it perhaps not so much that you need her to generate a positive sense of self for you. But rather that you generate an uncertain sense of self and look to her for confirmation? I'm kind of thinking like a mirroring type of thing, but not exactly.
> I'm not sure whether I should cancel or not. I've never cancelled a session before for anything other than a schedule conflict. I don't know what it would feel like or how she'd respond.
>
> Does anyone do this?I've never cancelled unless I had something else I couldn't get out of. But I'm actually seriously considering cancelling the next few sessions. I'm lucky in that I won't have to talk to my T to cancel. He has a secretary I can call. But I could still never tell her why I wasn't going. I'm pretty sure she'd pass it on to my T.
So I'm just saying "I can't make my appointment" so it kind of sounds like maybe a time conflict and I don't have to lie about it. Reframing isn't just a T's perogative.
Posted by Dinah on February 18, 2005, at 19:44:32
In reply to My own private version of hell » Daisym, posted by mair on February 18, 2005, at 17:09:24
I think our work issues are really closely aligned, Mair.
I'm floundering again and my therapist's sensible suggestion that I not try to cover it up is so scary to me that I can't bring myself to do it. I just keep praying I'll pull myself together and get in the flow. If I do I know I can do the work. I just can't seem to get there.
This is the end of the thread.
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