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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 33. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Eggy on September 5, 2003, at 23:10:15
I pushed 1 too many times. I am so stupid. I feel like dying or killing someone. Once before I told my therapist I was going to quit coming to him. I did cancel 1 appointment. Now he is going to be gone for 2 weeks and I flipped when he told me. I did it again. I told him I was going to change therapist. I called his office and they told me he said if I cancelled any appointments he would not see me anymore. Ever. I would have to find a new therapist. And like some stupid know it all jerk I said "He doesn't want to see me anyway" and said cancel them. I also cancelled my appointments with my pdoc. I have been seeing this therapist for 2 years. 2 years! I am so stupid. He was awesome and I had to go and mess up my life again. I hate myself so much. I am dying now. truly dying. I left him but he left me for good. He is the only person in the whole world I trusted. Now I killed it. I hate myself.
Posted by fallsfall on September 5, 2003, at 23:20:28
In reply to I ticked off T. He sais he will NEVER see me again, posted by Eggy on September 5, 2003, at 23:10:15
I'm sorry.
2 years is a long time. You get comfortable in 2 years.
My experience is that when a therapist says something like that, he means it. I'm sorry.
Maybe you can still see your pdoc. Perhaps he can give you continuity while you look for another therapist. You can ask your pdoc for recommendations (even if he won't see you anymore - and I bet he will) for a new therapist. You could also get recommendations from your GP, from any friends you have who are therapists. When you meet with a potential therapist remember that you are interviewing them. If you don't feel comfortable, find another.
You can make it through this. If you start feeling unsafe, please call your pdoc or go to an Emergency Room.
Let us know how this is going for you. I know that I changed therapists recently, so I understand that part. Other people will have other connections to what you have posted. We'll help you through.
Posted by Dinah on September 5, 2003, at 23:33:36
In reply to I ticked off T. He sais he will NEVER see me again, posted by Eggy on September 5, 2003, at 23:10:15
Oh, I'm so sorry. Please try not to hate yourself over it. It was unfortunate, but most of us blow up from time to time. This happened to me with a very good pdoc who I had only seen a few times while I was in a Wellbutrin induced agitated state. And I must have quit my therapist five or six times. To his credit, he never let me burn my bridges and he always took me back. So don't feel like you've done something unspeakably horrible. It was an interplay between both your therapist and you. He chose his part of it, just as my therapist chose to handle it a different way.
Fallsfall is right. You can get through this, as hard as it seems now. Since it's the weekend, maybe you can spend some time making a list of therapists, or questions for potential therapists. Something to remind you that there are other alternatives.
Posted by Eggy on September 6, 2003, at 11:36:44
In reply to Re: I ticked off T. He sais he will NEVER see me again » Eggy, posted by Dinah on September 5, 2003, at 23:33:36
I cried all night. My eyes look like watermelons. Not once did he ever say anything that would make me think this was coming. He promised me he would be there forever. No matter what. And I blew it. I am Borderline personality so I push and push and this is the first time anyone ever pushed back. I am a fool. My husband stayed up with me most the night trying to convince me things will get better. I have limited choices on who I see. Most of the T's in my insurance plan are in his practice. They will not switch patients like that. I couldn't do it anyway. My PDOC is in the same practice. Who cares I quit my meds anyway. Why am I so stupid? His office was perfect. He even had a painting I did hanging up in his office. I bet he gives that back. I'll burn it. He must not have cared at all because he knows what I could do to myself. He ditched me so I would go away. He doesn't care if I go away.
Posted by Adia on September 6, 2003, at 12:41:26
In reply to Re: I ticked off T. He sais he will NEVER see me again, posted by Eggy on September 6, 2003, at 11:36:44
Hi Eggy,
I am really sorry this happened and you are hurting so much...
I am not in a very good shape to give suggestions about this, because I am here terrified of losing my therapist..
but..I am a very stubborn person and even though this is not the best thing to do, I guess I would try at least to write him a letter and send it to him, explaing what happened to me, why I reacted the way I did, how much I truly want to go on working with him and how sorry I am.
I don't know exactly how things have been for you and him ..but I would try at least to let him know how important he's been for me and he still is...
If he refuses to talk with you or doesn't want to work with you, I agree with fallsfall and Dinah that there must be other alternatives...
Maybe you can talk with your Pdoc? Maybe he could give some support to you till you find someone or till this works out somehow?
I truly wish I could help more,
Don't be so hard on yourself, we all make mistakes...
Please hang in there...
SOrry I can't be of much help today, but I wanted to let you know I understand and you are not alone,
Adia.
. PDOC is in the same practice. Who cares I quit my meds anyway. Why am I so stupid? His office was perfect. He even had a painting I did hanging up in his office. I bet he gives that back. I'll burn it. He must not have cared at all because he knows what I could do to myself. He ditched me so I would go away. He doesn't care if I go away.
Posted by justyourlaugh on September 6, 2003, at 13:25:13
In reply to Re: I ticked off T. He sais he will NEVER see me again » Eggy, posted by Adia on September 6, 2003, at 12:41:26
its okay eggy to mess up..make bad choices..
you have to move on..
this is a test from him...he knows how you are hurting...make some important changes in your life today...be brave my friend..be brave..
we are all here supporting you even if we cant hold your hand ..we are in your heart.
j
Posted by judy1 on September 6, 2003, at 13:55:18
In reply to I ticked off T. He sais he will NEVER see me again, posted by Eggy on September 5, 2003, at 23:10:15
It is SO tough to have a borderline personality- you can't stop yourself from pushing and pushing-always against the people you care most about. the only positive I can give you is you WILL grow out of it, I don't know your age is but there is a maturing out (I've done it myself). Since I have done what you did, the way I handled it was to find someone who specialized in borderline disorders, they tend to be more patient then other therapists. it took a while to find her, but she really did help me a great deal. what are your options under your insurance? can you afford to go private? If not, speak to whoever handles the mental health part of your insurance and get some names of people outside your ex-therps group. you don't want to have a 'difficult' label (been there too) so the best thing is to find someone who doesn't know your ex-therp and just explain things didn't work out. you will get through this, you're very fortunate to have a supportive spouse. try to mend things with your pdoc to have some continuity. take care, judy
Posted by fallsfall on September 6, 2003, at 18:28:51
In reply to Re: I ticked off T. He sais he will NEVER see me again, posted by Eggy on September 6, 2003, at 11:36:44
Judy's suggestion of finding a therapist who specializes in BPD is a good one. You may find that your insurance has a short list of "preferred providers", but would allow you to choose a different provider and pay 80%, while you pay 20%. That might expand your possibilities.
I am Borderline, too, it is very difficult. Have you heard of DBT? It is a kind of therapy (there are two books: "Cognitive-Behavioral Treatment of Borderline Personality Disorder" and "Skills Training Manual for Treating Borderline Personality Disorder" - they are written for therapists, but they have a lot of information about what it means to be Borderline, and how to deal with Borderline clients). It is probably the leading therapy for BPD. I did 6 months of the skills training group and I really thought that it was helpful. If you could find a DBT therapist or DBT Skills Training Group, I would definately recommend it.
I'm hoping that you are still taking your meds. If you stopped, please consider taking them again. I don't think that this would be a good time to add the stress of withdrawal and not having meds that you need to the stress that you have. Some of the meds have awful withdrawal symptoms.
You talked to your pdoc, and she said to talk to your therapist - that is pretty standard. But your pdoc didn't say that she wouldn't see you anymore, did she? You could call on Monday and reschedule some appointments with her. I left a therapist in the same group as my pdoc (across the hall from each other), and I still see my pdoc.
You said: He must not have cared at all because he knows what I could do to myself. He ditched me so I would go away. He doesn't care if I go away.
I know how you are feeling, but I think that he does care very much. Limits and boundaries are very hard for us Borderlines - VERY hard. But for us to make progress and get more under control, we have to learn to accept them. My guess is that your therapist is trying to help you learn that. It is a very hard lesson.
Please be sure if you are unsafe that you call your pdoc or go to the Emergency room.
There is another good board just for BPD that you might want to visit: http://pub69.ezboard.com/bashrisen40890
Please keep in touch
Posted by Eggy on September 7, 2003, at 0:20:36
In reply to Re: I ticked off T. He sais he will NEVER see me again » Eggy, posted by fallsfall on September 6, 2003, at 18:28:51
How do I find a therapist that specializes or even knows much about borderline? I am going to go to a day group starting this week. For two weeks. Might as well call it daycare. My husband will NOT leave me by myself. I go tomorrow at 5 to be assessed. Which means I will be alone all day because my kids have football games about 2 hours away and I won't be able to go or I will miss my appointment. It worries me to be alone because of the self injury stuff. I am trying so hard to be big and brave. And good. I am 34 but I feel like a kid! I'm not going back on my meds. Screw them. If I do I feel like I am giving in to the mind mess. I am Bi-polar too. What a great deal!! Why do I try so hard to overcome all of this? Is it worth it? I will though. Everytime I log on and see I have a reply I get a little more hope. Just knowing someone cares and understands. I really want to find a therapist who knows about BPD. I think that would help. I feel more hopeful but so sad. Depression sux doesn't it!
Posted by fallsfall on September 7, 2003, at 7:12:10
In reply to Re: I ticked off T. He sais he will NEVER see me again, posted by Eggy on September 7, 2003, at 0:20:36
First, ask your pdoc for a referral to someone who has experience with BPD. Here are some sites where you can find lists of DBT/BPD therapists:
http://www.bpdcentral.com/resources/therapist/main.shtml
http://www.mhsanctuary.com/borderline/bpdlist.htm
This one has a good summary of how to find a DBT Therapist. The link to search, however, isn't working, but you can type it in and it is fine - but I couldn't find a way to search for a therapist... http://tara4bpd.org/DBT.htm
National
Borderline Personality Disorder
Resource and Referral Center
1-888-4-TARA APD
Will give you names of DBT therapistshttp://www.mental-health-today.com/bpd/bpdlist.htm
When you have to be alone tomorrow, can you have a friend come to keep you company? Could you go to a mall and walk around? I find that it helps me if I go out where there are people.
I'm glad you are going to a day group. Hopefully it won't just be daycare, but you'll be able to learn something there and become stronger. I would certainly ask the people there if they know about DBT or BPD therapists in your area. They are the people most likely to know.
You said: I'm not going back on my meds. Screw them. If I do I feel like I am giving in to the mind mess.
I'm not quite understanding what you mean. It seems to me that if you don't go back on your meds that you are screwing YOU - not screwing them. The meds aren't helping or hurting them. Can you tell me what "the mind mess" is? The reason I'm concerned is that I have seen friends who were doing OK, but then stopped their meds and went down really quickly. I know that there are times when I think that if I really fall apart, that I'll get the help that I need. But I'm beginning to understand that I can get that help even if I don't fall apart. And then I don't have to claw my way back up from falling apart.
I'm glad that you are determined to make it. It is really, really hard. But there are people to help, and it sounds like your husband is pretty supportive.
Yes, Depression is the pits
Posted by justyourlaugh on September 7, 2003, at 9:00:31
In reply to Re: I ticked off T. He sais he will NEVER see me again » Eggy, posted by fallsfall on September 7, 2003, at 7:12:10
eggy we have alot in common..
i am 34 with kids and..in a day program for 3 more weeks..
i wouldnt be able to go everyday with my medication..and i even have found myself laughing and making jokes..i had a woman ask about my scars..i handeled it beautifully..i am finding answers to my questions as well..
..
go in with a possitive attitude,,
have a little fun eggy..let go of the hurt for a bit..
j
Posted by Eggy on September 7, 2003, at 20:26:44
In reply to Re: I ticked off T. He sais he will NEVER see me again » Eggy, posted by fallsfall on September 7, 2003, at 7:12:10
What I meant about the meds was...if I take them I am giving in to the fact that I am sick. I went to my assesment today. I am not sure when I get to start day group. Maybe not until next week. The lady I had to see was an hour late because she was with a suicide attempt in the ER. That made me realize I have to get well. Get better. I do not want to end up in room 13 with the other patient. The suicide room. I will not do that!
Posted by fallsfall on September 7, 2003, at 21:21:53
In reply to fallsfall, posted by Eggy on September 7, 2003, at 20:26:44
I understand completely about not wanting to admit being sick by taking meds. But read your original post one more time. Can you see things in the post that are not particularly healthy behavior? If you want me to point some out for you I will (and if you have trouble finding more than a couple, please ask). These behaviors tell me (and you?) that you are sick. None of us want to be sick. But ignoring it doesn't make it go away. If you knew a diabetic who didn't take their insulin, would you think that they didn't have diabetes anymore? No, you would just worry about them because they would be getting sicker.
I don't want to have to worry about you. If you take your meds now, and go to your day group, and get hooked up with a therapist, and work really hard then you'll get better (I truly believe this). Once you are better, THEN you can decide if you need to continue the meds. In the meantime, not taking them makes it harder for you to get better.
Suicide is very scary. Unfortunately, suicide is something that us Borderlines do. We do that until we learn other ways to cope. You and I are at risk. I have had my best friends attempt suicide (and come dangerously close). I have sat next to their hospital beds worrying if they will make it. I am so glad that you don't want to follow that route. You (and I) have to work hard to avoid that. We need to take our meds, and go to therapy and work so, so hard.
I'm glad that you went for the assessment. That was a big step in taking care of yourself and getting on the road to being healthier. I hope your group starts soon.
There is no shame in being Borderline (though we do have a lousy reputation). YOU didn't do anything to get this way. Probably you are a little predisposed to it, and things happened while you were growing up that made it hard to learn effective ways of coping. But YOU will need to recover from it - noone can do that for you.
Please keep in touch
Posted by Eggy on September 8, 2003, at 8:33:15
In reply to Am I sick? » Eggy, posted by fallsfall on September 7, 2003, at 21:21:53
I found a therapist. I had left a message on her answering machine Friday. I had forgot I did that but she just called and wants me to be there at 11. She said that maybe group wasn't a good thing right now after talking to me. But that she would and could help me. She has counseled Borderlines before. She says she even saw me 12 years ago when I was in a psych ward. I don't remember. But she did. I still miss my therapist. But I was really mad at him and was seriously considering harming him to get him to stay. I think it is a good thing for me to get away from him. I have never seen a female therapist. Never thought I would. I have always seen a male therapist because I have issues about my father and I thought a male therapist could help. I think it only hurt. I think I got attached. I feel somewhat hopeful now. Not so dead. I am going to be honest with her. Try to be anyway. I thought I was honest with michael but now I see I was hiding so many things that only hurt my therapy. I love you guys. You are holding me in there. But don't leave me yet. This new therapist might be a vampire!!
Posted by judy1 on September 8, 2003, at 9:47:20
In reply to I have good news, posted by Eggy on September 8, 2003, at 8:33:15
That's wonderful!- especially the part that she has experience with treating borderlines. I can't tell you how critical that is in your recovery. Please let us know how things go today.
take care, judy
Posted by fallsfall on September 8, 2003, at 10:30:31
In reply to I have good news, posted by Eggy on September 8, 2003, at 8:33:15
That is so wonderful! I'll be waiting to hear how your appointment goes. Honesty is so important (and sometimes it is so hard!).
There is sunshine, after all.
Posted by Adia on September 8, 2003, at 11:14:12
In reply to I have good news, posted by Eggy on September 8, 2003, at 8:33:15
Hi Eggy,
That's so great! Let us know how it goes...I hope that you feel comfortable with her and can start building trust with her...
Honesty is the most important thing and yet it is so hard to open your heart and let someone close...
I hope it goes well today :o)
let us know..
lots of support,
Adia.> I found a therapist. I had left a message on her answering machine Friday. I had forgot I did that but she just called and wants me to be there at 11. She said that maybe group wasn't a good thing right now after talking to me. But that she would and could help me. She has counseled Borderlines before. She says she even saw me 12 years ago when I was in a psych ward. I don't remember. But she did. I still miss my therapist. But I was really mad at him and was seriously considering harming him to get him to stay. I think it is a good thing for me to get away from him. I have never seen a female therapist. Never thought I would. I have always seen a male therapist because I have issues about my father and I thought a male therapist could help. I think it only hurt. I think I got attached. I feel somewhat hopeful now. Not so dead. I am going to be honest with her. Try to be anyway. I thought I was honest with michael but now I see I was hiding so many things that only hurt my therapy. I love you guys. You are holding me in there. But don't leave me yet. This new therapist might be a vampire!!
Posted by Eggy on September 8, 2003, at 19:43:30
In reply to Re: I have good news » Eggy, posted by Adia on September 8, 2003, at 11:14:12
She is awesome!!!! So easy to talk to. Knows just what I am thinking. Ask questions which Michael NEVER did. She didn't make me feel inferior about anything at all. She said I had value. Yes value. My mouth fell open and my mind went blank. Me and value. Those two words were never spoken together in the same sentence. I'm still stumped. She was stumped too. She almost laughed because I was so dumbfounded. This is when she said "Oh yes we have some work to do" Value. I just love it. She said my husband married me because he must have known I was valuble. I told her NO. I was pretty and loved sex. Then we both laughed. I laughed!!! What a joy. I am so happy. She is good. Really good. And only 15 minutes away!!
Posted by Dinah on September 8, 2003, at 19:57:51
In reply to Re: I have BETTER news, posted by Eggy on September 8, 2003, at 19:43:30
That's great Eggy. I'm so happy you landed in a safe place.
Posted by fallsfall on September 8, 2003, at 21:54:53
In reply to Re: I have BETTER news, posted by Eggy on September 8, 2003, at 19:43:30
I am so happy for you!! This is wonderful. It is so nice to click with a therapist and feel comfortable. Enjoy!
Posted by noa on September 13, 2003, at 13:15:32
In reply to Re: I have BETTER news, posted by Eggy on September 8, 2003, at 19:43:30
That's so wonderful! Good for you for picking yourself up and finding a new therapist, and this one sounds very promising, indeed.
Posted by Eggy on September 18, 2003, at 8:35:10
In reply to Re: I have BETTER news. » Eggy, posted by noa on September 13, 2003, at 13:15:32
Michael my therapist that said he couldn't see me anymore came back from California and called me yesterday. He said this "Look whose back" I said "That's nice to know" he said, "How are you doing?" I said, "I have some things there I need to pick up. When can I get them?" He was puzzled. I could tell he was somewhat at a loss for words. He couldn't believe that I didn't sit around the whole time in self-pity waiting for him to get back (I sort of did but he doesn't have to know that) He actually was still going to be my therapist. He never once acted like he said he wouldn't. He sort of stammered out "UH so Uh have you hooked up with someone else already". And I said "Actually I have". He said "So do you want to come by today and see me and we can talk and maybe you can get your stuff. I was so confused. Because I wanted to say, "I want you back...please take me back." but instead I said " No my husband will pick my stuff up. Just throw my journals away and put my other things in an envelope and he will be there after work." The journal thing killed him. He loved me doing those journals. 2 years worth.
But this morning I don't know what to think. I want to go back to him. I like my new therapist and I don't want to lose her. I miss him terribly. I am dying to lay on his couch and talk to him. I am so upset and confused. I even cut up my arm a few minutes ago. But I know not going back to get my things was a good step. I am a tad bit suicidal. Just thinking about it a little. Why did he have to call after what he said and did??? Why didn't he just leave it where it left off? I think what he did was inappropriate but it still got to me. I can feel myself sliding back down into that pit of dark sludge! Somewhere in this body is a happy person. I have seen her. I wish she would bounce out and take over and tell Michael to kiss her butt.
Posted by noa on September 18, 2003, at 14:32:57
In reply to Confusing Call from old therapist, posted by Eggy on September 18, 2003, at 8:35:10
When is your next appointment with the new therapist? I think you should go see her to process this before you decide what to do.
I don't know what to think either--except that my gut tells me that you are getting such conflicting messages from Michael and that is one thing you do not need from a therapist. If you are anything like me, chances are you have had plenty of those kind of mixed and confusing messages (crazy making) from people in your life and that is hard enough. Therapists are supposed to try to NOT replicate that kind of confusing stuff.
SO, my gut is giving me very uncomfortable feelings about him, but I, of course, can't judge from over here, not being you and all, only knowing a bit about this, etc.
So that is why I suggest holding off on deciding and talking with the new therapist about it to try to process what is going on.
Posted by fallsfall on September 18, 2003, at 14:51:37
In reply to Confusing Call from old therapist, posted by Eggy on September 18, 2003, at 8:35:10
I agree with Noa that you should talk to your new therapist.
I think it was fine to send your husband after your things.
Two things that strike me are:
1. If a therapist makes a threat (I won't see you any more) they should not back out of it. Otherwise, how do you know when to believe them?
2. Are you in Psychoanalysis? You talk about a couch. I have read that Psychoanalysis is not good for Borderlines because there isn't enough structure. What kind of therapy does the new therapist do?
Let us know how it goes.
Posted by Eggy on September 18, 2003, at 15:55:03
In reply to Re: Confusing Call from old therapist » Eggy, posted by fallsfall on September 18, 2003, at 14:51:37
I am going to talk to my new therapist on Monday. And also get this...my P-doc was in with my T(same practice) and he had his secretary call today to tell me that he has mailed me a letter to explain in detail why he can no longer be my doctor. I didn't ask for that. I could care less about HIM!
About the type of therapy I get...yep the ol couch therapy. No CBT or much else around here. But My new T has already done more for me or at least made me think more than Michael ever did. Maybe it is because she is a woman.
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