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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 19 of 19. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Lamdage22 on November 8, 2022, at 0:53:57
Hi Guys, I am being emotionally abused by both parents. One is controling and manipulating me with the help of his financial resources, the other one shames me for not having a handle on my life.
Posted by SLS on November 8, 2022, at 11:30:06
In reply to Im in trouble. Please help, posted by Lamdage22 on November 8, 2022, at 0:53:57
> Hi Guys, I am being emotionally abused by both parents. One is controling and manipulating me with the help of his financial resources, the other one shames me for not having a handle on my life.
>
>I encourage you to consider writing a (civil) letter describing how you experience life. Educate them about mood disorders, and that how your depressive thoughts and feelings are beyond your control. You have a brain disorder, not a characterological weakness. Explain that your inability to function and create a healthy and independent life for yourself is impossible with the way your illness affects your thoughts, feelings, motivation, and energy level. Your illness is no more under your control than Parkinsons or epilepsy would be.
Be truthful about how their behavior affects you, and how it sabotages your efforts to move forward in life. Print out education materials to accompany your letter. They will see that doctors and scientists affirm everything you have explained to them. You love them and need them. Let them know that.
Good luck.
- Scott
Posted by Lamdage22 on November 9, 2022, at 12:49:10
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help » Lamdage22, posted by SLS on November 8, 2022, at 11:30:06
Ok were not on the same page here. Most people dont get it, even if they have all the details which I cant give. I will restrict my posts to what is being dealt with here.
Posted by SLS on November 9, 2022, at 22:30:33
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help, posted by Lamdage22 on November 9, 2022, at 12:49:10
> Ok were not on the same page here. Most people dont get it, even if they have all the details which I cant give. I will restrict my posts to what is being dealt with here.
Were you insulted by what I said?
I found what I wrote to be positive and constructive. Most of all, it's true.
I don't know what page you say that you are on that's different from mine. Can you be specific?
Thank you.
Regardless of what page you are on, if you reject my explanation of the biological underpinnings of mood disorders, I guarantee that you are on the wrong one.
You owe it to yourself to consider the facts and opinions offered by people with a far longer course of illness, decades of study of mental illness, the brain, and therapeutics. I have been exposed to drugs that you will NEVER see, and are likely to never know about.
I won.
Do as you please.
- Scott
Posted by Lamdage22 on November 10, 2022, at 3:45:11
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help » Lamdage22, posted by SLS on November 9, 2022, at 22:30:33
Sorry, but you don't know me and thus you don't know wether the origin of my problems is biological or psychosocial. Your suggestions would put more power into the hands of those that tend to abuse it.
Was I offended? Maybe a little bit, but more so disappointed. You tried to help, so thank you for that.
Posted by Lamdage22 on November 10, 2022, at 3:48:48
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help, posted by Lamdage22 on November 10, 2022, at 3:45:11
My therapist fixed me to the point of functioning again. He doesn't agree with you, I'm sure. It is impossible to know with certainty where the problems come from, even less possible with very little information. You didn't win, you showed us that you have a one size fits all approach.
Posted by Lamdage22 on November 10, 2022, at 5:19:00
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help » Lamdage22, posted by SLS on November 9, 2022, at 22:30:33
>I have been exposed to drugs that you will NEVER see, and are likely to never know about.
>
> I won.I am not competitive in the way that you are.
Posted by Lamdage22 on November 10, 2022, at 10:57:30
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help, posted by Lamdage22 on November 10, 2022, at 5:19:00
You meant the best with your post and I was a callous in my response. My apologies. To give some perspective, I literally had the worst phone call of my life and that inspired this thread.
Posted by SLS on November 10, 2022, at 22:32:44
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help, posted by Lamdage22 on November 10, 2022, at 3:45:11
I was very disappointed by what you wrote, too.
> Sorry, but you don't know me.
Why should I have to? You did a pretty good job of posting descriptions regarding your family dynamics. You cried out for help. I made a suggestion to you that you write a letter to your parents. That's better than anything you have yet come up with - or at least that I'm aware of. Whatever you tried obviously doesn't work. Try something different if you need so much help. If not, then stop asking for it.
> and thus you don't know wether the origin of my problems is biological or psychosocial. Your suggestions would put more power into the hands of those that tend to abuse it.
How did you come to this conclusion? Do you have any facts or evidence to present? Can you explain the dynamics of cause and effect? You are being rather cryptic. Can you please explain in detail how my suggestions put power into the hands of those who tend to abuse it. What were my suggestions?The ball is in your court. Prove what you stated so assertively about the dangers I represent - or retract it.
How
>
> Was I offended? Maybe a little bit, but more so disappointed.What are you disappointed by?
> You tried to help,
Goddam right! You need a lot of it as portrayed by your first post and subject line.
> so thank you for that.
You are welcome.
- Scott
Posted by SLS on November 11, 2022, at 11:26:43
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help, posted by Lamdage22 on November 10, 2022, at 3:48:48
Folks, please take the time to read this entire post. I need no affirmations. I leave it to you to evaluate its worth.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lamdage:> My therapist fixed me to the point of functioning again. He doesn't agree with you, I'm sure.
You (and perhaps your doctor) are talking about YOU specifically. YOU are the one who first generalized your beliefs that drugs don't work and that nutraceuticals are more effective. I believe that this is contrary to fact.
In fact, it is B U L L S H I T, and I am calling you out on it. Do you really want to influence people to give up on drugs entirely in favor of your ideas? That is the most consequential and dangerous aspect of your writing.
You are the who one that first generalized your and projected your experiences and beliefs upon everyone else. Not good. As you have said on your behalf, I don't know your doctor at all. However, I have no reason whatsoever to trust anything he has to say regarding the pathology of mood disorders. However, his opinions have absolutely no import with me. None.
I want to steer others who are reading this away from your misinformation. The repercussions of people rejecting psychopharmacology because of you, regardless of the disease being treated, is dangerous. Do you want to be responsible for a suicide by someone who listened to you? I am all but certain that my writing has universally reduced rather than increased the suicidality of others. It is my intention to give hope to others, not definitive therapeutic answers. I leave that up to the individual and their doctors. I certainly have opinions, but I am careful to specify that they are mine only. One size does not fit all when dealing with psychiatric / psychological pathologies.
As I have already indicated, I do not believe that one size fits all. I doubt I made that clear enough. I apologize for that. I have *always* maintained that somatic treatments + psychotherapy was most often more effective than somatic treatments alone - even if just for getting rid of the psychosocial stress that precipitates psychological, biological, and emotional dysfunctions in the first place. Without a reduction in the psychosocial / psychological stress an initial response is harder to elicit, and allows it to continue. This even applies to completely psychological depressions. Often, the first episode of depression is triggered by either by *chronic* psychosocial stress or a paroxysmal trauma (like loss of a spouse). However, as time passes, relapsing depressive episodes begin to occur spontaneously, and in the absence of triggering stressors.
> It is impossible to know with certainty where the problems come from,
According to whom? You again?
Have you ever seen a fluorodeoxyglucose PET scan of a depressed brain compared to a healthy one? Yes or no?
Can you name any of the various biomarkers that indicate a biological diathesis for depression? Yes or no. There are quite a few of them that have been discovered. What brought you to conclude that it was impossible to diagnose biogenic mood disorders? Did your doctor tell you that? If not, you have some catching up to do.
> even less possible with very little information.
How much information do you believe I have? How would you know?
> You didn't win, you showed us that you have a one size fits all approach."
First of all, I did win, you *ssh*l*. I am in remission because of my wholly pharmacological treatmenet.
Question: How are YOU doing these days?
"I'm in trouble. Please help."
Answer: Not good.
Perhaps your nutraceutical approach is worthless to YOU. It ain't working.
Speak for yourself or provide citations in the medical literature that proves that Scott couldn't possibly have won with an exclusively pharmacological strategy. After all, I did. Explain *that*.
I won.
I won.
I won.
If you have no psychiatric diagnosis of a major mental illness, then what DO you have (according to your doctor)?
As you said, I don't know you well enough. I only know what you wrote. I also don't know your doctor. I trust Linkadge and the abstracts and articles I find on Medline / PubMed. I am all but certain that there are very few clinical practitioners who know one tenth of what Linkadge knows about neurophysiology and pharmacology. Linkadge has proven himself to be an excellent repository of information and advanced abilities for critical thinking. I choose my sources carefully. I have enough of them right now that I don't need to add your doctor to my list.
So, what is your opinion of what I wrote here?
I won.
- Scott
Posted by SLS on November 11, 2022, at 11:48:21
In reply to Im in trouble. Please help, posted by Lamdage22 on November 8, 2022, at 0:53:57
Hi, Lamdage.
Are there any notable research clinicians or research institutions that you have availed yourself of?
=--------------------------------------------------------
Have you ever heard of Frederick Quitkin?
Have you ever heard of Wilma Harrison?
Have you ever heard of Patrick McGrath?
Have you ever hard of Baron Shopsin?
Have you ever heard of Matthew Smith?
Have you ever heard of William Z. Potter?
Have you ever heard of Mark Schmidt?
Have you ever heard of Malcolm Kaswan?
Have you ever heard of Jeffrey Apter?
-----------------------------------------------
These are the RESEARCH investigators whose brains I had the privilege of picking beginning in 1982.Are you impressed?
Please show me some respect.
- Scott
Posted by SLS on November 11, 2022, at 12:03:15
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help » Lamdage22, posted by SLS on November 11, 2022, at 11:48:21
> I am not competitive in the way that you are.
I am not competing with you.
You are just wrong, and you feel like sh*t.
Please don't compete with me. You have already lost.
Keep doing what you're doing for you, and leave your misinformation unsaid.
When I say, "I won", I mean that I AM IN REMISSION.
It took 40 years of treatment beginning with my swallowing my first pill of imipramine in the spring of 1982. I am now in remission. I worked for it. That ought to mean something to you. It was a long and painful odyssey. I won. I even chose all of the drugs and dosages that are working magic for me. I guess I am just compulsively competitive.
Have you won?
Perhaps I know how to cure me better than you and your doctor know how to cure you.
I deserve your respect and gratitude.
- Scott
Posted by Lamdage22 on November 12, 2022, at 0:08:11
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help » SLS, posted by SLS on November 11, 2022, at 12:03:15
Take a chill pill. You don't sound well.
Posted by Lamdage22 on November 12, 2022, at 4:07:53
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help, posted by Lamdage22 on November 12, 2022, at 0:08:11
Please do not spread misinformation about me.
https://dr-bob.org/babble/20220530/msgs/1120413.html
It seemed to me that you extrapolated that every psych disorder on the planet is biological. That was the point where I decided not to argue with you. Do you extrapolate to everyone? If not, then your message arrived here differently than you meant it.
Your repeated suggestion to me was to take the med again that made me psychotic "MAOI". It harmed me very much. By the way, arent you doing the same thing? Didn't MAOI cause psychosis and the loss of your marriage? Please correct me if I am wrong. As far as I know, you are not on a Neuroleptic to protect from psychosis happening again.
I expect an apology for your insult(s) and demeaning speech. I only read bits and pieces because what you are saying is not very reasonable or curing.
Posted by Lamdage22 on November 12, 2022, at 4:12:22
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help, posted by Lamdage22 on November 12, 2022, at 4:07:53
And yes I do realize that MAOI is not a med but a class of meds. But you are on the exact same med that made you psychotic as far as I am informed.
Posted by Lamdage22 on November 12, 2022, at 9:57:37
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help » Lamdage22, posted by SLS on November 11, 2022, at 11:26:43
I read it now despite of the insulting tone and actual insults. I think I havent said drop all your meds and take valerian anywhere. If I said something along those lines, it was a long time ago. I got angry because I was harmed by an MAOI. Very much so. My goal was to tell people that there is hope and it doesnt end when there are no more meds to try.
You said I was feeling like sh*t days after the initial post when actually I wasnt. My approach hasnt failed. You seem to want it to, which is sad.
I think you are coming from a different severity where things are different. I was never bed ridden etc. for longer periods.
Posted by SLS on November 12, 2022, at 13:53:39
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help, posted by Lamdage22 on November 12, 2022, at 0:08:11
> Take a chill pill. You don't sound well.
>
>How do I sound to you?
How would you know whether I am well or unwell? You never asked. Your retort is hackneyed, and not at all clever.
To satisfy your benevolent concern for me, I will react here to your statement.
I am feeling great!
To others: Remission is worth your continued effort. Don't give up. For the life of me, I don't know why I never did. Perhaps my mental illness left me pathologically positive and hopeful. Actually, that wasn't it. I had known how remission feels very early in my treatment history. Those experiences were the carrot. If you don't have your own carrot, trust mine.
Lamdage: Remission might have been there for you and your doctor to have, but you sabotaged your treatment, and your doctor can't be so extraordinary to leave you begging for help.
I will not read any of your subsequent posts along this thread.
Have fun in your misery.
Just don't add to other people's fun by inflicting them with your misinformation and errant conclusions.
Nothing works for you. You are young, ignorant, and inexperienced. Why would you presume to have an expertise that you so obviously don't.
One more thought...
F*ck you.
- Scott
Posted by SLS on November 14, 2022, at 14:16:39
In reply to Re: Im in trouble. Please help, posted by SLS on November 12, 2022, at 13:53:39
Oops.
I forgot about Andrew Nierenberg.
- Scott
Posted by jay2112 on November 14, 2022, at 20:30:24
In reply to Im in trouble. Please help, posted by Lamdage22 on November 8, 2022, at 0:53:57
Look, nobody is BETTER than anyone else, no matter how great you are. This is supposed to be a SUPPORT board, not a neo-fascist 'chop down each other' board. So, c'mon....here, try some Canadian cannabis....ok..ok...just, we are all friends, so let's act that way, 'k folks. :) Peace & Love....
Jay
This is the end of the thread.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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