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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 19 to 43 of 43. Go back in thread:
Posted by Twinleaf on October 14, 2012, at 23:13:49
In reply to Re And, posted by phillipa on October 14, 2012, at 21:44:30
I think it is easy for each of us to imagine how terrible it is not to be able to taste or small - you have everyone's empathy and understanding on that. But everyones life, including yours, is so much more complex; many things have undoubtedly contributed to your present distress, and a number of them happened to you before you lost your taste and smell. Some things, like your anxiety and depression, and your interpersonal issues (your mother's illness and death, your estrangement from your children and the issues with your husband), you can make much better through proper medication and psychotherapy. The other issues, like aging and losses to your health can not be - not for you, and not for anyone. I am very sad to see that you can't see the difference between the real things which you can personally do to give yourself a good life, and the basic facts of aging which everyone faces. But you have shown, over and over, that you can't. So much good, caring advice has been given to you here, because you seemed to be requesting it. I think you have turned down every suggestion which was ever made! I keep thinking that, with your training and knowledge, you will readily see that the way forward for you is primarily through therapy, with the support of medications which are reasonably safe and effective. But, sadly, this is just not the case. Maybe it is better if you don't ask for advice which you have no intention of taking, or even considering.
Posted by Beckett on October 15, 2012, at 11:59:49
In reply to Re: Re And, posted by Twinleaf on October 14, 2012, at 23:13:49
Phillipa, going back to Twinleaf's first post, so much could come from replacing your current pdoc. I remember when you asked him about therapy and he said no, no therapy for you. I was shocked. Think about the Duke idea. I looked at their website. It seemed very service oriented and patient friendly. Even if you decide against Duke, I really think you need a new pdoc.
Posted by Twinleaf on October 18, 2012, at 6:30:22
In reply to Re: Last time I Ask for Med Advise As Know Some Get Fr » SLS, posted by phillipa on October 14, 2012, at 0:31:48
Looking back over this thread, I see that it started out with Phillipa explaining that she wanted to take some of the suggestions she has been given, but that fear of side-effects and of doctors making poor choices had prevented her from doing so. Several posters responded very positively to this, suggesting finding a really good pdoc, perhaps at Duke, and building a trusting relationship without making much in the way of med changes, at least at first. This really did seem to address Phillipa's real fears, and show that we understood and respected them. We have all had many of the same fears and experiences with pdoc's that she has.
I think Phillipa's fears took over once again, even with the very benign suggestions she was given, causing her to reject them.
Phillipa, would you be willing to think over the advantages for you of finding a doctor you could trust, who would understand you and work with you?
Posted by zazenducke on October 18, 2012, at 6:36:18
In reply to Re: Last time I Ask for Med Advise As Know ..., posted by Twinleaf on October 18, 2012, at 6:30:22
Posted by Twinleaf on October 18, 2012, at 6:45:29
In reply to Hi Twinny!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. (nm) » Twinleaf, posted by zazenducke on October 18, 2012, at 6:36:18
Posted by SLS on October 18, 2012, at 8:05:49
In reply to Re: Last time I Ask for Med Advise As Know ..., posted by Twinleaf on October 18, 2012, at 6:30:22
Twinleaf:
Thanks for this.
Phillipa:I'm afraid that some of us have been very frustrated by your not finding health and happiness through what is perceived as perpetual inaction. I don't know of a single person who wishes bad upon you. The whole board cares about you - each of us in our own way. I apologize that my frustration has shown so much. I would love to somehow light a fire under your butt to motivate you seek changes in your life that will bring you happiness - if not blissful content. As Twinleaf has suggested, it may not be a lack of motivation that discourages you from making changes in your treatment, but rather, fear. I can see how fear of medication side effects would trump any motivation you have for making changes. I guess trying to light a fire under you butt accomplishes very little but to burning and hurt you. I can't promise you that I won't say the wrong things to you in the future. I can see myself continuing to be frustrated. Sorry...
:-)
- Scott
------------------------------------
> Looking back over this thread, I see that it started out with Phillipa explaining that she wanted to take some of the suggestions she has been given, but that fear of side-effects and of doctors making poor choices had prevented her from doing so. Several posters responded very positively to this, suggesting finding a really good pdoc, perhaps at Duke, and building a trusting relationship without making much in the way of med changes, at least at first. This really did seem to address Phillipa's real fears, and show that we understood and respected them. We have all had many of the same fears and experiences with pdoc's that she has.
>
> I think Phillipa's fears took over once again, even with the very benign suggestions she was given, causing her to reject them.
>
> Phillipa, would you be willing to think over the advantages for you of finding a doctor you could trust, who would understand you and work with you?
Posted by zazenducke on October 18, 2012, at 8:14:20
In reply to Re: Last time I Ask for Med Advise As Know ..., posted by SLS on October 18, 2012, at 8:05:49
Please leave your fantasies concerning Miss Phillipa's butt in the gutter where they belong. Blissfulness indeed. As if. Your frustration is no excuse. Get a grip man. This is a married lady.
>
> I'm afraid that some of us have been very frustrated by your not finding health and happiness through what is perceived as perpetual inaction. I don't know of a single person who wishes bad upon you. The whole board cares about you - each of us in our own way. I apologize that my frustration has shown so much. I would love to somehow light a fire under your butt to motivate you seek changes in your life that will bring you happiness - if not blissful content. As Twinleaf has suggested, it may not be a lack of motivation that discourages you from making changes in your treatment, but rather, fear. I can see how fear of medication side effects would trump any motivation you have for making changes. I guess trying to light a fire under you butt accomplishes very little but to burning and hurt you. I can't promise you that I won't say the wrong things to you in the future. I can see myself continuing to be frustrated. Sorry...
>
> :-)
>
>
> - Scott
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
>
> > Looking back over this thread, I see that it started out with Phillipa explaining that she wanted to take some of the suggestions she has been given, but that fear of side-effects and of doctors making poor choices had prevented her from doing so. Several posters responded very positively to this, suggesting finding a really good pdoc, perhaps at Duke, and building a trusting relationship without making much in the way of med changes, at least at first. This really did seem to address Phillipa's real fears, and show that we understood and respected them. We have all had many of the same fears and experiences with pdoc's that she has.
> >
> > I think Phillipa's fears took over once again, even with the very benign suggestions she was given, causing her to reject them.
> >
> > Phillipa, would you be willing to think over the advantages for you of finding a doctor you could trust, who would understand you and work with you?
>
>
Posted by ChicagoKat on October 18, 2012, at 9:48:47
In reply to Sir have you no shame? » SLS, posted by zazenducke on October 18, 2012, at 8:14:20
Dear Phillipa,
I don't know you well enough to know whether anything that has been said about you is true or not. But I wanted to tell you that I care, and to let you know that I hate to see people arguing over what is best for you. I hope it doesn't upset you too much. But, whether one of the posters is right or wrong, I just truly wish for you a solution to end your suffering. I am here if you need to talk.Katxxxxx
> Please leave your fantasies concerning Miss Phillipa's butt in the gutter where they belong. Blissfulness indeed. As if. Your frustration is no excuse. Get a grip man. This is a married lady.
> >
> > I'm afraid that some of us have been very frustrated by your not finding health and happiness through what is perceived as perpetual inaction. I don't know of a single person who wishes bad upon you. The whole board cares about you - each of us in our own way. I apologize that my frustration has shown so much. I would love to somehow light a fire under your butt to motivate you seek changes in your life that will bring you happiness - if not blissful content. As Twinleaf has suggested, it may not be a lack of motivation that discourages you from making changes in your treatment, but rather, fear. I can see how fear of medication side effects would trump any motivation you have for making changes. I guess trying to light a fire under you butt accomplishes very little but to burning and hurt you. I can't promise you that I won't say the wrong things to you in the future. I can see myself continuing to be frustrated. Sorry...
> >
> > :-)
> >
> >
> > - Scott
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> >
> > > Looking back over this thread, I see that it started out with Phillipa explaining that she wanted to take some of the suggestions she has been given, but that fear of side-effects and of doctors making poor choices had prevented her from doing so. Several posters responded very positively to this, suggesting finding a really good pdoc, perhaps at Duke, and building a trusting relationship without making much in the way of med changes, at least at first. This really did seem to address Phillipa's real fears, and show that we understood and respected them. We have all had many of the same fears and experiences with pdoc's that she has.
> > >
> > > I think Phillipa's fears took over once again, even with the very benign suggestions she was given, causing her to reject them.
> > >
> > > Phillipa, would you be willing to think over the advantages for you of finding a doctor you could trust, who would understand you and work with you?
> >
> >
>
>
Posted by phillipa on October 19, 2012, at 10:47:44
In reply to Re: Sir have you no shame?, posted by ChicagoKat on October 18, 2012, at 9:48:47
I tried in vain to reply yesterday but site wouldn't allow. I tried cutting luvox in half and nearly fainted. For some reason my brain needs this med. No idea why. It just is what it is I saw the worthless pdoc yesterday and left feeling worse as he doesn't get it. If I had the energy or strength left might try another. but frankly I've given up. It is what it is. I will continue to try my darndest to feel better on own till last dying breathe. Those with money insurance are truly blessed and I'd be a liar if didn't say I'm envious. Please don't criticise what I do or cant do as I live in different skin. And it hurts to be criticised all the time even at home. It feels like bullying here. But since I respect and like you guys I will continue to try and learn from others and hopefully be able to help others if not myself. I do try. But I don't have the strength. Phillipa
Posted by ChicagoKat on October 19, 2012, at 14:45:11
In reply to Re: Sir have you no shame? » ChicagoKat, posted by phillipa on October 19, 2012, at 10:47:44
awwww Phillipa, your post brought tears to my eyes. I know you are in a different skin, and that you have obstacles, like lack of good insurance in your path. I understand. And I also understand that one gets tired and needs a break from trying. But please know, I just know everyone here on PB loves you. And they say things that seem hurtful to you, but they really mean well and want to help; though they don't quite understand the situation you're in. You are so supportive and caring to us all, I don't think PB would ever be quite the wonderful place it is if it weren't for you. I wish so much that I could help you feel better. Just promise to take care of yourself. And take a break if you need to, but in the end, never give up, OK girlfriend?
Love,
Kat> I tried in vain to reply yesterday but site wouldn't allow. I tried cutting luvox in half and nearly fainted. For some reason my brain needs this med. No idea why. It just is what it is I saw the worthless pdoc yesterday and left feeling worse as he doesn't get it. If I had the energy or strength left might try another. but frankly I've given up. It is what it is. I will continue to try my darndest to feel better on own till last dying breathe. Those with money insurance are truly blessed and I'd be a liar if didn't say I'm envious. Please don't criticise what I do or cant do as I live in different skin. And it hurts to be criticised all the time even at home. It feels like bullying here. But since I respect and like you guys I will continue to try and learn from others and hopefully be able to help others if not myself. I do try. But I don't have the strength. Phillipa
Posted by Twinleaf on October 19, 2012, at 16:42:31
In reply to Re: Sir have you no shame? » phillipa, posted by ChicagoKat on October 19, 2012, at 14:45:11
I worry that if you stay with such an uncaring, unhelpful pdoc, you will gradually feel more and more unselfconfident and unworthy of truly helpful, respectful care. He seems to be having such a negative effect on you.
Posted by phillipa on October 19, 2012, at 21:13:50
In reply to Choices..., posted by Twinleaf on October 19, 2012, at 16:42:31
I know & agree. So I'm in charge of my care. I again went back to original dose of luvox. Not that this is perfect far from it. But it is what it is for now. If younger would get out of Dodge. Can't stand the state never cold. Was a wossy and didn't leave. I did like the old pdoc she asked what I wanted to try and she'd let me do as I thought best. And this gave me a feeling of control. Never abused meds never have. I have to keep on truckin so to speak. Phillipa
Posted by Twinleaf on October 20, 2012, at 8:40:27
In reply to Re: Choices... » Twinleaf, posted by phillipa on October 19, 2012, at 21:13:50
Maybe you can begin spacing out your visits to him, and get many of your refills by phone (since they don't change). He really does seem like a pdoc to avoid!
To go back to the more central question on these threads: I have never intended to say or do anything which would feel like bullying to you, but I think you are saying that suggestions ( a new pdoc, psychotherapy for the interpersonal aspects of your situation) feel like you are being bullied, or perhaps pressured and controlled would be more accurate. If this is the situation, we should not be offering any suggestions at all. Can you clarify this for us? Does every suggestion feel like bullying, or too much pressure, to you?
I really think everyone's intention is to try to help you solve the real difficulties which you describe; no-one wants to cause any further harm. Because you give excellent advice on the boards yourself, I guess everyone assumes that you would welcome it also. I think you can help everyone treat you the way you would like to be treated by clarifying this situation.There is one thing you mentioned which is distressing to me: you said you wanted to continue to help others here. You can certainly do that, and have a tremendous amount of knowledge and experience to offer. But the main thing every one of us has to offer here is ourselves, in particular, the ways we have succeeded in rising to the challenges of mental/ emotional illness. People post here looking for renewed hope and for new ways of dealing with their problems. Advice from someone who has given up, or who always rejects advice herself, is not very valuable to anyone. What would mean a lot to people is seeing you overcome your own problems. That would be truly inspiring and encouraging to everyone reading here.
Posted by phillipa on October 20, 2012, at 10:09:29
In reply to Re: Choices... » phillipa, posted by Twinleaf on October 20, 2012, at 8:40:27
Twinleaf no you don't bully me that was more in reference to some what I'd call snide comments from some that seem to take light illnesses of any type. There is so much you don't know about my past life and experiences with pdocs I can't even begin to explain. Take the one who who had me committed cause I had just been told I again needed to undergo treatment for lymes. Because I called upset I endured the most horrible nightmare of my life. Which ended after about 12 hours as soon as the doc at that facility validated that I truly had an appointment at the infection control docs that day. I was immediately discharged to make that appointment. The horror remains to this day or wouldn't remember it while spontaneously writing me. Of course I never saw that doc again. Then the one who was young and put into a calculator how to detox me from benzos which I didn't want. One week later was in a neurologists office with a BP of 180 systolic and forget diastolic. The neurologist was furious at that doc and said it was withdrawal and immedidately wrote a script for the medication and said to get a new pdoc. That's when I found my old pdoc and had a good one for me. She & I & my husband would banter back and forth and she gave me the feeling of control she knew I needed to take meds. During those years I was on trileptal, Deplin, lamictal, the luvox, valium, started low dose xanax & lexapro. I wasn't afraid to try what she suggested as had her private telephone number which she said call anytime if you are upset. And permission to up or down a med on my own. Add the traumas of just a few a back with so many diagnosis I won't name them. The osteoporosis and the doc that fired me as I asked questions about reclast IV which at the time was 5mg IV and is used for bone metastatic disease. So many people developed organ failure and death even that a few years later the FDA lowered to dose for osteoporosis to l-2.5mg IV once a year. Hence the idea of Duke I could never do as those are the young doc "practicing" medicine for the first time. I don't know what my personal answer is. But I do listen to you suggestions and do google other docs and even go to their websites. Seems now the trend here is for cash only. The really good docs that is. Add what I just was messaged from a facebook friend about my united healthcare add on to medicaire and she worked for them said they wouldn't reimburse employees for proceedures if they were overweight, smoked, or in anyway had not taken care of themselves. So this is todays dilemma. So far have had good luck with them. But I now avoid docs whenever I can. From experience go looking and guaranteed for me anyway something will be found wrong. Lack of money doesn't help and nothing can be done about this. So after this long and uncalled for diarrhea of the mouth. I do value your suggestions. I read and google what others have found valuable. But I trust me before docs. I haven't read this under submit yet so no spelling checks or other but I wrote from my heart just up as late bed. Criticism from any isn't what I need suggestions are welcome. And I do appreciate each and everyone. And I'm as frustrated as I have caused you to feel. I apologize for that. I do get a feeling of contributing if it's something I know. There is such a wealth of knowledge on this board. Lets be gentle with each other. Deal? Love Phillipa
Posted by Willful on October 20, 2012, at 10:38:40
In reply to Re: Last time I Ask for Med Advise As Know Some Get Fr » Willful, posted by phillipa on October 14, 2012, at 21:38:32
Just in case you had me among others in mind when you spoke about feeling bullied, I wanted to say first of all, I had no intention of bullying you.
I'm actually annoyed with myself that I put energy and time into trying to help-- especially since in the past I've tried to help, only to have my ideas rejected, criticized, and ignored by you. I remember the whole 'maybe I should try emsam' conundrum., which after a whole lot of attention and support and encouragement led to your, at the last minute, saying-- oh, never mind, my pdoc, or somebody I ran into the other day at the supermarket, or some random pharmacist, said it's not a good idea. You never thanked the people who had tried to help you through your anxieties and had stuck with you. I'm glad there are people here who are more forgiving and open-hearted than I am. But that sort of interaction drives people away form this board over time more than anything else, in my opinion-- or Bob's absence would have brought people back.
There are just so many times that people here reach out to another and receive no thanks. That is very discouraging and has made me at least come here very infrequently and respond even less frequently.
Really I don't know why I ever come here. I guess mostly nostalgia for a few people I've read over the years, whose lives have in some small way touched mine.
Posted by Twinleaf on October 20, 2012, at 10:42:23
In reply to Re: Choices... » Twinleaf, posted by phillipa on October 20, 2012, at 10:09:29
You are describing a situation where you have been repeatedly traumatized by doctors, and you now want to avoid them at all costs. I do need to go back to my original question: should we avoid ever suggesting a new doctor or mental health professional of any kind when you express distress about the feelings you are having or the situation you find yourself in? Is it traumatizing for us to do that? You so often tell people to consult their doctors that it is hard to know!
Posted by Willful on October 20, 2012, at 10:43:11
In reply to Re: Choices... » phillipa, posted by Twinleaf on October 20, 2012, at 8:40:27
I just read Twinleaf's last post, after I just posted, and I guess in my own way, I'm agreeing with what she said.
I too take heart in other people's successes here, and also the hope and commitment they show to getting better in the face of difficulties. I truly admire so many people here who, despite all they've been through, continue to believe in a better future--
Posted by Willful on October 20, 2012, at 10:44:26
In reply to Re: Choices... I have to agree, posted by Willful on October 20, 2012, at 10:43:11
PS just to clarify: by the time I posted it was actually her next to last post.
Posted by phillipa on October 20, 2012, at 21:13:40
In reply to Re: Choices..., posted by Twinleaf on October 20, 2012, at 10:42:23
I refer myself to different medical docs all the time. The time is coming when the ability to select or even afford medical care will be on a voucher system. Based on age, how well you have taken care of your health, Weight, Cholesterol, And there will not be the choices we have right now. Are you keeping up with the political news? I am. Will I seek out anoter pdoc? Well the best in Charlotte now have just pay out of pocket. Accept no insurance. Others have joined hospitals. My neighbors just became pay cash only. So in reality I'm lucky to have one that accepts my medicaire. Two here and I have one recommended by the one that is pay cash only now. And with the price of gas? Will I drive 4 hours? I think not. Per RN law I'm legally obligated whether actively working or not to always even here in real life to recommend calling your own doc. I do miss my old one. But retired and in VA now. Don't fret about it. I will continue to do as I have in a civil way. Same way I practiced Nursing. If I don't like what is said to me. I ignore it Phillipa
Posted by Twinleaf on October 20, 2012, at 23:43:57
In reply to Re: Choices... » Twinleaf, posted by phillipa on October 20, 2012, at 21:13:40
Because of all the stress and frustration which has appeared to arise here on Babble both for you and for the posters making suggestions to you, I still need to know: should we not give any further advice about docs or mental health practitioners to you? What you do yourself is of course your own choice.
Posted by Dinah on October 21, 2012, at 1:02:41
In reply to Re: Choices... » Twinleaf, posted by phillipa on October 20, 2012, at 10:09:29
Phillipa, I feel the same way about most docs. One of my doctors lately told me that if I needed to decide if I trusted her, because she could only work with me if I trusted her. She was right. I didn't trust her. She had answered some questions about some medications that were shortly after yanked off the market in such a way that I realized I knew more than she did about where they stood with the FDA.
Now I've got a doctor I trust. He proved his competence to me by knowing far more than I did, and catching something all my other doctors had missed. Still, if he suggested a new med, I'd check it out. I would hope he'd be pleased that I would do that.
I think what people are saying is that if you don't have a doctor you can trust, you owe it to yourself to find a new one. You need to keep looking. Because the doctor I quit was right. If I couldn't trust her, she really couldn't help me. I'm glad I moved on.
But I know that there is no change before its time. When you're ready to make changes, you will. Not all the encouragement in the world will make you make those changes a minute before that. What it might do is help you keep those possibilities in mind. I always joke with my therapist that I rejected everything he said for the first few hundred times he said it. But eventually it sinks in, and may even become something I think of as my own idea. Had he pushed, I wouldn't have changed any faster. Had he given up, I might not have changed at all.
Fortunately he usually wasn't so invested that my changing was more important to him than it was to me. And fortunately, I was never shy of telling him when he forgot.
Posted by phillipa on October 21, 2012, at 21:06:57
In reply to Re: Choices... » phillipa, posted by Dinah on October 21, 2012, at 1:02:41
Dinah thanks also encouraging words from you. Seems that I must regain some stability on own first. Time for change to me isn't when things are going poorly but when I feel better. Phillipa
Posted by Dinah on October 22, 2012, at 7:59:13
In reply to Re: Choices... » Dinah, posted by phillipa on October 21, 2012, at 21:06:57
Well, keep an open mind about that. Try saying to yourself instead that you aren't ready to change at this time. That leaves the possibility that you will change when you're ready, no matter how you feel when you are ready. It might be when you're feeling better and have more resolve and energy. Or it might be when you're feeling bad enough that the pain and anxiety of the current situation outweighs the anxiety of change.
I'm not sure that you need to explain or apologize for not being ready. Someone is ready or they aren't. Others can respond to you or not, knowing that you may not be ready.
Posted by Twinleaf on October 23, 2012, at 7:08:16
In reply to Re: Choices... » Dinah, posted by phillipa on October 21, 2012, at 21:06:57
Phillipa, I do feel hurt and disappointed that you will not answer my question. This has happened every time you have expressed emotional distress here, and I have responded with suggestions. Each time, I am told a number of reasons why each thing can't be done, am insulted along the way ("do you read the newspapers? (I read three)), and eventually ignored, never having been thanked or shown appreciation in any way. I am not ever saying that you should follow any of my suggestions- only you know what's best for you. But appreciation for my caring and efforts, and an absence of hostile comments, would have been much more appropriate- and helpful towards continuing dialogue.
As things stand, I will never make any further comments to any of your posts.
Posted by SLS on October 23, 2012, at 8:08:49
In reply to Re: Last time I Ask for Med Advise As Know Some Get Fr, posted by Willful on October 20, 2012, at 10:38:40
Hi Willful.
> Really I don't know why I ever come here. I guess mostly nostalgia for a few people I've read over the years, whose lives have in some small way touched mine.I know that you realize how intelligent you are. I thought it might be nice to offer you a mirror to see that others also see you as being caring and generous. You and I don't always agree on things, but this is not a bad thing. It serves as a kind of reality check for me. I try not to let my ego get in the way of open-mindedness and objectivity. However, I can still use some practice with this.
Have a good day.
- Scott
This is the end of the thread.
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