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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 30. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by wsj on December 29, 2003, at 22:08:12
i'm 48 days on parnate 70mg/day. it has helped a lot w/ depression. there is one problem i'm currently having. lately, every time i take a dose 1, 2, or 3 pills at a time (doesn't seem to matter), shortly after i experience a craving to lay down and take a nap. this isn't like me at all > i am a life long insomniac that used to get by fine on 6 hours a night sleep, and never ever nap. currently i take 20mg/ ambien a night and get a good 7-8 hours sleep, but after taking my morning parnate dose i could take a nap. the shut eye time feels good but i have to much to do to sleep that much! if i'm doing this at 48 days on parnate does it still have a possibility of getting better or should i be starting provigil or some another stim.
thanks for any advice!
wsj
Posted by brussell on December 30, 2003, at 2:02:47
In reply to P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by wsj on December 29, 2003, at 22:08:12
Hey wsj, thanks for your previous good advice on MAOIs.
How long have you been on your current dose?
Every time I up my dose, I get fatigued (but feel better) and want to doze most of the day. After a few days at that dose, the fatigue and daytime sleepiness tends to go away, (and my insomnia comes back!).
I also have a question:
I'm on 50mg/day (3 first thing in the morning, 2 at five) and so far for me the AD effect of Parnate has been like Welbutrin on steroids.
I keep my morning dose on my nightstand, and take it when I first wake up around seven, feeling horrible and sure I can't bear to get out of bed. Half an hour later, I start to feel that I might be able to face the day after all, and I get up and actually stay relatively busy most of the day. I need the afternoon "hit" or I crash into an evening depression.
Welbutrin was similar in that it helped me with the horrible endogenous morning depression, but not nearly as well as Parnate (on WB, I still wasn't good for much of anything till after lunch).
What interests me is that neither Welbutrin nor Parnate really makes me feel more optimistic about life, or especially "not-depressed". I still feel miserable, I'm just able to get a lot more out of each day (although not as much as I want).
Many of my problems may be due to the holidays, which are typically weeks of suicidal misery for me, and have been actually endurable on the Parnate. I might feel wonderful in a few weeks.
What aspects of your depression did Parnate help the most with, and did you ever reach the point when you subjectively felt much less depressed, as opposed to more energized and functional?
Thanks a lot.
P.S. What's provigil? Are there actually stimulants that you can take on MAOIs?
Posted by cubbybear on December 30, 2003, at 3:38:48
In reply to P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by wsj on December 29, 2003, at 22:08:12
> . there is one problem i'm currently having. lately, every time i take a dose 1, 2, or 3 pills at a time (doesn't seem to matter), shortly after i experience a craving to lay down and take a nap. this isn't like me at all > i am a life long insomniac that used to get by fine on 6 hours a night sleep, and never ever nap.
You should divide your doses, especially if you're on a high dose. I normally take 30 mg/day and divide it--20 mg, around 8-9 AM, and 10 mg. around lunchtime. You shouldn't take Parnate any later than early afternoon, however, since that might contribute to insomnia.
if i'm doing this at 48 days on parnate does it still have a possibility of getting better or should i be starting provigil or some another stim.
The only thing I can say here is, are you sure that taking a stimulant with Parnate is OK? Something tells me that this is contraindicated. Better check it out.
>
> thanks for any advice!
> wsj
Posted by cybercafe on December 30, 2003, at 3:46:55
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by cubbybear on December 30, 2003, at 3:38:48
> > . there is one problem i'm currently having. lately, every time i take a dose 1, 2, or 3 pills at a time (doesn't seem to matter), shortly after i experience a craving to lay down and take a nap. this isn't like me at all > i am a life long insomniac that used to get by fine on 6 hours a night sleep, and never ever nap.
>
> You should divide your doses, especially if you're on a high dose. I normally take 30 mg/day and divide it--20 mg, around 8-9 AM, and 10 mg. around lunchtime. You shouldn't take Parnate any later than early afternoon, however, since that might contribute to insomnia.
>
> if i'm doing this at 48 days on parnate does it still have a possibility of getting better or should i be starting provigil or some another stim.
>
> The only thing I can say here is, are you sure that taking a stimulant with Parnate is OK? Something tells me that this is contraindicated. Better check it out.
>
> >
> > thanks for any advice!
> > wsj
>
>i take parnate + ritalin SR
Posted by wsj on December 30, 2003, at 23:41:04
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question? » wsj, posted by brussell on December 30, 2003, at 2:02:47
> How long have you been on your current dose?
..........."35 days at 70mg"
> Every time I up my dose, I get fatigued (but feel better) and want to doze most of the day. After a few days at that dose, the fatigue and daytime sleepiness tends to go away, (and my insomnia comes back!).
> I also have a question:
> I'm on 50mg/day (3 first thing in the morning, 2 at five) and so far for me the AD effect of Parnate has been like Welbutrin on steroids.
> I keep my morning dose on my nightstand, and take it when I first wake up around seven, feeling horrible and sure I can't bear to get out of bed. Half an hour later, I start to feel that I might be able to face the day after all, and I get up and actually stay relatively busy most of the day. I need the afternoon "hit" or I crash into an evening depression.
> Welbutrin was similar in that it helped me with the horrible endogenous morning depression, but not nearly as well as Parnate (on WB, I still wasn't good for much of anything till after lunch).
> What interests me is that neither Welbutrin nor Parnate really makes me feel more optimistic about life, or especially "not-depressed". I still feel miserable, I'm just able to get a lot more out of each day (although not as much as I want).
> Many of my problems may be due to the holidays, which are typically weeks of suicidal misery for me, and have been actually endurable on the Parnate. I might feel wonderful in a few weeks.
> What aspects of your depression did Parnate help the most with, and did you ever reach the point when you subjectively felt much less depressed, as opposed to more energized and functional?........."i know it has stopped the real lows > i just have not had them w/ parnate > i tend to stay on even keel! but i am hoping i have not received the full effect yet, which i've read can take 3 months. seems like the second week or so my optimism peeked > since then i have not really had a significant improvement. this nap thing worries me b/c i don't want to have to take stims > just more cyclical ups and downs. right now i am missing the relaxing effects of klonopin, but not the memory or lack of focus."...........
> Thanks a lot.
> P.S. What's provigil? Are there actually stimulants that you can take on MAOIs?
.................."light stimulant > the one they call the smart pill. pdoc has given approval if i want to try.
cybercafe takes ritalin SR."...................best to ya!
wsj
Posted by wsj on December 30, 2003, at 23:52:19
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by cubbybear on December 30, 2003, at 3:38:48
> You should divide your doses, especially if you're on a high dose. I normally take 30 mg/day and divide it--20 mg, around 8-9 AM, and 10 mg. around lunchtime. You shouldn't take Parnate any later than early afternoon, however, since that might contribute to insomnia.
...................."w/ ambien i have no insomnia. i sleep soundly for 7 to 9 hours. i have been dividing my doses, even going so far as biting pills in half to take 5mg."............
> The only thing I can say here is, are you sure that taking a stimulant with Parnate is OK? Something tells me that this is contraindicated. Better check it out.
>
............"my pdoc has approved provigil and as you might see from his post cycbercafe takes ritilan SR. i think the rules are changing w/ maoi's depending of course on the patient."...................................
best to ya!wsj
Posted by wsj on December 30, 2003, at 23:57:48
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by cybercafe on December 30, 2003, at 3:46:55
> i take parnate + ritalin SR............"why did you start ritalin SR? why does your pdoc perscribe a stim when most will not? does the ritalin SR stop day time napping? what dose and when do you take it?"............
best to ya!
thanks
wsj
Posted by cybercafe on December 31, 2003, at 4:31:39
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! » cybercafe, posted by wsj on December 30, 2003, at 23:57:48
>
> > i take parnate + ritalin SR
>
> ............"why did you start ritalin SR? why does your pdoc perscribe a stim when most will not? does the ritalin SR stop day time napping? what dose and when do you take it?"............it is necessary for ADD ... ritalin SR 40 mg tid or at least 40, 30, 20
Posted by Defective on May 18, 2011, at 16:07:47
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question? » wsj, posted by brussell on December 30, 2003, at 2:02:47
Hi, I saw your messages on the Dr. Bob board and I was wondering if you could please answer a quick question. I started Parnate 13 days ago, day 1 I took 20 mg, day 2-8 I I took 30 mg, day 10-11 I took 40 mg, and the last two days I've been on 50 mg. I haven't felt anything yet and I was instructed to go up to 60 tomorrow. Based on your experience and others on the message board, when would you expect me to feel an anti-depressant response? Thanks in advance for any advice you may have to share with me.
Best,
Defective
Posted by WAS on May 19, 2011, at 17:59:53
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by Defective on May 18, 2011, at 16:07:47
> Hi, I saw your messages on the Dr. Bob board and I was wondering if you could please answer a quick question. I started Parnate 13 days ago, day 1 I took 20 mg, day 2-8 I I took 30 mg, day 10-11 I took 40 mg, and the last two days I've been on 50 mg. I haven't felt anything yet and I was instructed to go up to 60 tomorrow. Based on your experience and others on the message board, when would you expect me to feel an anti-depressant response? Thanks in advance for any advice you may have to share with me.
>
> Best,
>
> Defective
>
It took me 5 weeks and a dosage of 100 mg./day before I felt any effect. One day I woke up and went out on my back porch and realized that I did not want to die. I could not believe it at first. The relief was indescribable. It took another several weeks and a gradual increase in dosage to 130 mg./day for me to get free of most other signs and symptoms, but I always have been a slow responder to meds and always have needed ultra high dosages. Stick with it and best wishes.WAS
Posted by Defective on May 19, 2011, at 19:28:38
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question? » Defective, posted by WAS on May 19, 2011, at 17:59:53
Thank you so much for your response. I've seen several postings on sites that contain patients reviews of medications where these people indicate that they felt all better in a week. It's hard to believe that this isn't some sort of placebo response or medication induced mania. I was getting a little discouraged after reading those reviews, but your response gives me hope. Thank you so much for your help. I've wanted to die for about 29 years, so I'm looking forward to walking out onto my porch and realizing that I feel differently as well. Best of luck to you.
Posted by WAS on May 19, 2011, at 20:51:08
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by Defective on May 19, 2011, at 19:28:38
I know exactly what you mean, man, that sinking feeling of "it's not working, I'm not responding as quickly as other people." I was lucky that I had a Doc who would say to me "When did you turn into 'other people?' What makes you think you could or should respond like 'other people'?" So all I could do was hang in there as we pushed the dosage to levels that even she was uncomfortable with at first, until some little ratchet let go and a spring relaxed and I was sort of puzzled as I thought to myself, "Oh. Of course. This is what is feels like not to want to die. Huh."
So, hang in there, man. It will happen, and it won't take another 29 years, I think I can promise that! Drop us a post here, I want to hear about it.WAS
Posted by jaclinhyde on May 22, 2011, at 19:03:58
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by Defective on May 18, 2011, at 16:07:47
I remember the first time I took Parnate. It was about 3 weeks in and I called the doctor extremely upset because I felt no different. He told me to just give it a little bit more time. No joke it was about 3 days later I went to bed depressed and woke up the next morning with the grey cloud gone! Be patient (I know that is easier said than done), maoi's rarely fail so just wait it out. You will have that bright and shiny morning too.
Posted by Defective on May 23, 2011, at 17:57:31
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by jaclinhyde on May 22, 2011, at 19:03:58
Thank you so much for your response Jaclin. I'm glad that there is still hope. The drowsiness and low blood pressure are killing me. I face planted a wall yesterday and look like I went 12 rounds with Mike Tyson.
Best,
Defective
Posted by deepreason on May 23, 2011, at 21:57:22
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by Defective on May 23, 2011, at 17:57:31
> Thank you so much for your response Jaclin. I'm glad that there is still hope. The drowsiness and low blood pressure are killing me. I face planted a wall yesterday and look like I went 12 rounds with Mike Tyson.
>
> Best,
>
> DefectiveStay patient, once they kick in properly you'll find things like the face plant funny!
I'm a month or so into my Nardil dosage and the world really is a different place now. My social anxiety and depression are a joke. I whistle and sing when I get up (really!) have loads of motivation and am the really annoying bugger who talks to everyone in waiting rooms and on buses etc. :D
Posted by Defective on May 23, 2011, at 22:21:30
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by deepreason on May 23, 2011, at 21:57:22
I actually did find it funny, In fact the idea that I hide out like Howard Hughes from the rest of the world all day is pretty funny when you really think about. I mean, who does that? Having no energy over the last two years and insomnia, as well as failing about 12 different antidepressants isn't humorous, but I still see the funny side of my behavior, despite being insanely depressed. I'm really glad you are doing much better and I'm looking forward to being that annoying guy who talks to everyone too at some point.
Howard Hughes
Posted by Deahoidar on May 24, 2011, at 1:14:04
In reply to P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by wsj on December 29, 2003, at 22:08:12
Some people report Parnate to be activating. A small percentage of users experience excessive daytime somnolence (EDS). I happen to be one of them. Like clockwork, the afternoons bring an overwhelming sleepiness. The kind that has you dreaming while awake. Almost like narcolepsy.
I wish it were otherwise. I've used (and benefited from) Parnate for well over 10 years. I have had to reduce my dose to avoid these "sleep attacks". Now I'm at such a low dose that the Parnate isn't beneficial.
I hope you are able to find a way to deal with the sleepiness. Might want to consider modafinil, if you haven't already. I have found it to be helpful, but not a complete fix.
Good luck.
Posted by jaclinhyde on May 29, 2011, at 18:00:25
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by Defective on May 23, 2011, at 17:57:31
> Thank you so much for your response Jaclin. I'm glad that there is still hope. The drowsiness and low blood pressure are killing me. I face planted a wall yesterday and look like I went 12 rounds with Mike Tyson.
>
> Best,
>
> DefectiveOuch! I hear you, the low blood pressure is a bitch but your body will acclimate to it soon enough. You may look like Mike Tyson but you will soon feel like you won the fight, lol!
Terri
Posted by jaclinhyde on May 29, 2011, at 18:03:50
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by deepreason on May 23, 2011, at 21:57:22
> > Thank you so much for your response Jaclin. I'm glad that there is still hope. The drowsiness and low blood pressure are killing me. I face planted a wall yesterday and look like I went 12 rounds with Mike Tyson.
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > Defective
>
> Stay patient, once they kick in properly you'll find things like the face plant funny!
>
> I'm a month or so into my Nardil dosage and the world really is a different place now. My social anxiety and depression are a joke. I whistle and sing when I get up (really!) have loads of motivation and am the really annoying bugger who talks to everyone in waiting rooms and on buses etc. :DIsn't it amazing how different the world looks after an maoi kicks in? Life just becomes worth living again. Keep us updated Defective, we care.
Terri
Posted by jaclinhyde on May 29, 2011, at 18:07:07
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by Defective on May 23, 2011, at 22:21:30
> I actually did find it funny, In fact the idea that I hide out like Howard Hughes from the rest of the world all day is pretty funny when you really think about. I mean, who does that? Having no energy over the last two years and insomnia, as well as failing about 12 different antidepressants isn't humorous, but I still see the funny side of my behavior, despite being insanely depressed. I'm really glad you are doing much better and I'm looking forward to being that annoying guy who talks to everyone too at some point.
>
> Howard HughesThe Parnate won't fail you like the rest. It is good that you can see the humor in things though. And when you feel like babbling we are here to babble back, lol.
Terri
Posted by jaclinhyde on May 29, 2011, at 18:12:01
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question? » wsj, posted by Deahoidar on May 24, 2011, at 1:14:04
> Some people report Parnate to be activating. A small percentage of users experience excessive daytime somnolence (EDS). I happen to be one of them. Like clockwork, the afternoons bring an overwhelming sleepiness. The kind that has you dreaming while awake. Almost like narcolepsy.
>
> I wish it were otherwise. I've used (and benefited from) Parnate for well over 10 years. I have had to reduce my dose to avoid these "sleep attacks". Now I'm at such a low dose that the Parnate isn't beneficial.
>
> I hope you are able to find a way to deal with the sleepiness. Might want to consider modafinil, if you haven't already. I have found it to be helpful, but not a complete fix.
>
> Good luck.I actually have Narcolepsy but find that modafinil (Provigil) tears my stomach up horribly. Adderall worked the best for it but with the Parnate that is a no-no so I am using Daytrana patches (methylphenidate) which is not contraindicated with maoi's even though my local pharmacist cringes whenever I go for a refill. :-)
Terri
Posted by jackford on May 31, 2011, at 23:42:29
In reply to P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by wsj on December 29, 2003, at 22:08:12
I'm considering Parnate, saw this recent thread, and am wondering how onerous the dietary restrictions are, in real life. Cheese, meat, beer, and wine are regular parts of my diet, and it would be quite hard to cut all that out. Cut back, yes, but eliminate, I don't know if I could do that.
Thanks so much in advance to anyone with experience to share.
Posted by Defective on June 1, 2011, at 18:43:38
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by jackford on May 31, 2011, at 23:42:29
> I'm considering Parnate, saw this recent thread, and am wondering how onerous the dietary restrictions are, in real life. Cheese, meat, beer, and wine are regular parts of my diet, and it would be quite hard to cut all that out. Cut back, yes, but eliminate, I don't know if I could do that.
>
> Thanks so much in advance to anyone with experience to share.If you are going to take the medication and you aren't an idiot, you will follow the restrictions. If you eat certain foods that are restricted, your blood pressure can skyrocket and you risk the chance of dying. You can eat non-aged meat and drink any beer that isn't from the tap. If you are more concerned about the diet than your depression, then you aren't really that depressed, and should maybe get some more exercise or do occasional therapy. Anyone who is depressed is far more concerned about alleviating their condition than they are about restricting their diet. Best of luck to you and don't mess around with the diet.
Posted by Deputy Racer on June 2, 2011, at 17:51:07
In reply to Re: P A R N A T E - U S E R S ! question?, posted by Defective on June 1, 2011, at 18:43:38
>
> If you are going to take the medication and you aren't an idiot, ... If you are more concerned about the diet than your depression, then you aren't really that depressed, ... Anyone who is depressed is far more concerned about alleviating their condition than they are about restricting their diet.Please do not post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down. The original poster expressed a valid concern regarding a medication, and the policy of this site requires that responses are respectful.
If you have any questions regarding the posting policies on this site, please read the FAQ, located at http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil Follow ups to this action should be directed to the Administration board and should themselves be civil.
Dr Bob has ultimate authority over all administrative issues on this site, and may choose at any time to revise or reverse any action taken by a deputy.
Deputy Racer
Posted by Defective on June 3, 2011, at 17:41:35
In reply to Please be civil » Defective, posted by Deputy Racer on June 2, 2011, at 17:51:07
Is this directed at me? If I made anyone feel bad about anything, I sincerely apologize, but I don't have the faintest clue which post you are referring to. I posted yesterday for the first time in a while, so I will review that post and see if there was anything in there that could have possibly been misinterpreted.
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