![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 86 to 110 of 114. Go back in thread:
Posted by ed_uk on June 18, 2005, at 10:38:58
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott » SLS, posted by TamaraJ on June 18, 2005, at 10:20:59
Hi T!
>Wellbutrin
Perhaps you won't need to increase your Well dose any further. Maybe, after a couple more weeks on your current dose, you'll be feeling much better...
Ed xx
Posted by TamaraJ on June 18, 2005, at 12:42:56
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott » TamaraJ, posted by ed_uk on June 18, 2005, at 10:38:58
> Hi T!
>
> >Wellbutrin
>
> Perhaps you won't need to increase your Well dose any further. Maybe, after a couple more weeks on your current dose, you'll be feeling much better...
>
-- I wonder. Oh, no, decisions, decisions. I think I am going to try 200mg (in two doses) tomorrow or Monday just to see if I can tolerate it and to see if it makes me feel even better. What the heck, it's still not a high dose. I have also been taking Pregnenolone and DHEA (in very small doses) for a couple of weeks. I think they have helped in some way as well. My hormones were totally screwed up from the Depo months ago, so perhaps the Pregnenolone and DHEA are helping to bring them back into balance. Who knows. All I know is that I want to be me again, and I think (and hope and pray) that I am almost there.
Tamara
xoxo
Posted by ed_uk on June 18, 2005, at 14:27:30
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott » ed_uk, posted by TamaraJ on June 18, 2005, at 12:42:56
Hi T!
>I think I am going to try 200mg (in two doses) tomorrow or Monday just to see if I can tolerate it and to see if it makes me feel even better.
I hope it helps :-) .......and it doesn't make you irritable :-O
Ed xxx
Posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 15:45:19
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL?, posted by SLS on June 18, 2005, at 7:48:06
> Hi.
>
> > When I took Wellbutrin I had more physical energy but I had no inner motivation or enjoyment of it.
>
>
> This is a common description of the nature of response to Wellbutrin. People who react this way to Wellbutrin often gain the motivation and enjoyment when a serotonergic is added to it (SSRIs, Effexor, Cymbalta). For a friend of mine, the addition of Effexor did the trick. The improvement in her depression and the attendant increases in functionality and enjoyment of life was marvelous to watch. She had spent most of her life in a state of moderate depression; fighting every day just to maintain a job and take out the garbage. She later switched the Effexor to Lexapro and now feels even better. I think the switch helped clear her mind, which had been left a bit foggy by the Effexor.
>
> Wellbutrin + SRI are complementary. That which one lacks, the other has and vice-versa. In addition, the Wellbutrin can act to reverse the apathy and sexual side effects of the SRI.
>
>
> - Scott
>Unfortunately the Wellbutrin also increased anxiety for me. And the insomnia was a big problem. I know I could add more Klonopin to counteract the anxiety and a sleeping med to counteract the insomnia but I get to the point of thinking okay I'm taking one med for this and another to counteract the effects of the first med and so on. I remember your post about if you want to play you've gotta pay but I guess I'm just stubborn and not quite miserable enough to be willing to put up with four sets of side effects.
In my heart I want to be med free or conquer this with a minimum of medication plus supplements and exercise. I don't know if this will work but I've never tried it before so I might as well give it at least as long of a shot as I have given specific meds. And I keep hoping that my former abuse of pain meds was a large part of the cause of my depression and that now that I'm free of that, I can get better depression wise (with time).
Marsha
>
Posted by TamaraJ on June 18, 2005, at 16:00:58
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL?, posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 15:45:19
Marsha,
Have you tried Paxil? Paxil was the first AD I was prescribed, at a time when I was experiencing my first ever depression. It was an agitated depression, which meant LOTS of anxiety. Within 3 weeks of starting Paxil my anxiety had subsided significantly, and the depression had started to lift. It was a great med for me for about 7 years, and I regret having stopped taking the low maintenance dose I was on because, when I experienced a second depressive episode, the Paxil didn't work again. Some people say it is very sedating, but I never had a problem with sedation, and I took it early in the morning. You could also look at taking Paxil and nortriptyline together. It might be a good combo. The nort seems to be quite effective for anxiety and panic attacks, not mention being sedating so it could help in the sleep area.
Hope you find a combo that works for you with as few side effects as possible. Good luck, and take care.
Tamara
Posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 16:12:51
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott » SLS, posted by TamaraJ on June 18, 2005, at 10:20:59
I just don't get it. It's just unfathomable to me how people can manage these doses without crippling side effects. At 25mg of nortriptyline my mouth was so dry I couldn't speak half the time. And at 150mg Wellbutrin, I couldn't sleep more than a couple hours at a time. I think my problem isn't so much that I'm med resistant it's that I just can't tolerate a therapeutic dose of anything.
Yes, I'm a whiny baby.
Marsha
Posted by TamaraJ on June 18, 2005, at 16:19:14
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott, posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 16:12:51
Were you taking the nort during the day? I only take it at night, so the only time I have dry mouth is early in the morning. And, did you know you can get Wellbutrin SR in 100mg tablets? If you can't tolerate 150mg, ask your doc for 100mg and see how you do on that dose. I seem to recall Minnie saying a while ago that she had some problems on the 150mg tablet, but when she went to 200mg (one dose of 2x100mg), she was fine. I, too, experienced irritability on 150mg. I am going to try 200mg (in 2 doses though) tomorrow.
Tamara
> I just don't get it. It's just unfathomable to me how people can manage these doses without crippling side effects. At 25mg of nortriptyline my mouth was so dry I couldn't speak half the time. And at 150mg Wellbutrin, I couldn't sleep more than a couple hours at a time. I think my problem isn't so much that I'm med resistant it's that I just can't tolerate a therapeutic dose of anything.
>
> Yes, I'm a whiny baby.
>
> Marsha
Posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 16:19:42
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? » 4WD, posted by TamaraJ on June 18, 2005, at 16:00:58
> Marsha,
>
> Have you tried Paxil? Paxil was the first AD I was prescribed, at a time when I was experiencing my first ever depression. It was an agitated depression, which meant LOTS of anxiety. Within 3 weeks of starting Paxil my anxiety had subsided significantly, and the depression had started to lift. It was a great med for me for about 7 years, and I regret having stopped taking the low maintenance dose I was on because, when I experienced a second depressive episode, the Paxil didn't work again. Some people say it is very sedating, but I never had a problem with sedation, and I took it early in the morning. You could also look at taking Paxil and nortriptyline together. It might be a good combo. The nort seems to be quite effective for anxiety and panic attacks, not mention being sedating so it could help in the sleep area.
>
> Hope you find a combo that works for you with as few side effects as possible. Good luck, and take care.
>
> Tamara
Hi Tamara,Thanks for the suggestion but I think I must have pretty much an opposite chemistry from yours. When I tried switching from Effexor to Paxil last summer, I started getting panicky within a week or two. And nortriptyline made me more anxious also.
OTOH, the Paxil panickyness might just have been from going off Effexor too rapidly. It might be worth trying again once the anxiety I'm having right now gets better. I'm still only off Effexor for about three months and I'm hoping that's part of the source of the anxiety.
Then on the Other other hand, I have paradoxical reactions to a lot of meds. Who knows?
Marsha
Posted by TamaraJ on June 18, 2005, at 16:27:00
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? » TamaraJ, posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 16:19:42
Hi Marsha,
I experienced the same thing when I started Paxil - increased anxiety and panic - for about the first 3 weeks or so. At first I was freaking out. The last thing I wanted was more freaking anxiety. I spoke to my doctor and she told me that it was likely just start-up side effects, and it would subside after 2 to 3 weeks. She also gave me a small script for Xanax to use during the adjustment phase. And, after about 3 weeks, the anxiety subsided (was pretty much gone, actually), and I didn't really need the Xanax anymore (or too often). But, as you say, we are all different, so Paxil may not have been the right med for you. Or, between the withdrawal from Effexor and the start-up side effects of Paxil, you experienced really severe anxiety and panic. It's so hard to tell.
How long did you try the nort for? Again, the incredible anxiety could have been start-up side effects. I was a bit more agitated when I started nort, but that went away as my body adjusted to the med.
Tamara
> Hi Tamara,
>
> Thanks for the suggestion but I think I must have pretty much an opposite chemistry from yours. When I tried switching from Effexor to Paxil last summer, I started getting panicky within a week or two. And nortriptyline made me more anxious also.
>
> OTOH, the Paxil panickyness might just have been from going off Effexor too rapidly. It might be worth trying again once the anxiety I'm having right now gets better. I'm still only off Effexor for about three months and I'm hoping that's part of the source of the anxiety.
>
> Then on the Other other hand, I have paradoxical reactions to a lot of meds. Who knows?
>
> Marsha
>
Posted by ed_uk on June 18, 2005, at 18:29:48
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott, posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 16:12:51
>At 25mg of nortriptyline my mouth was so dry I couldn't speak half the time.
Perhaps you're a slow metaboliser of TCAs. You might benefit from a very low dose eg. 10mg nort.
~Ed
Posted by SLS on June 18, 2005, at 19:33:21
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL?, posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 15:45:19
Hi.
> Unfortunately the Wellbutrin also increased anxiety for me.
This might be an unappealing idea, but the addition of an SSRI, Effexor, or Cymbalta might take care of the anxiety quite nicely.
Do you experience any body aches or pains?
> And the insomnia was a big problem.
I hate to do this to you, but one hell of a potent combination would be an SRI + Wellbutrin + Remeron. The Remeron would treat the insomnia and add quite a punch to the other drugs to treat the depression and anxiety. You might not need any benzodiazepines at all.
> I know I could add more Klonopin to counteract the anxiety and a sleeping med to counteract the insomnia but I get to the point of thinking okay I'm taking one med for this and another to counteract the effects of the first med and so on.
I know. Things can become quite a mess, especially when they don't work. When they do work, someone becomes a genius.
> I remember your post about if you want to play you've gotta pay but I guess I'm just stubborn and not quite miserable enough to be willing to put up with four sets of side effects.
Again, you might need only two drugs total.
> In my heart I want to be med free or conquer this with a minimum of medication plus supplements and exercise.
Go for it. The drugs will always be there to come back to if you need them.
> I don't know if this will work but I've never tried it before so I might as well give it at least as long of a shot as I have given specific meds. And I keep hoping that my former abuse of pain meds was a large part of the cause of my depression and that now that I'm free of that, I can get better depression wise (with time).
Stranger things have happened. I think the combination of pregnenelone + DHEA sounds interesting. I guess the DHEA acts as a guarantee that enough androgen will become available should much of the pregnenelone be converted to progesterone. From what I understand, women tend to profit more from the addition of DHEA than men do, and it acts as both an antidepressant and anxiolytic.
Supplements are not my forte, so I'll leave the rest to the "Alternative" board. I wish I had the energy to read more. I would love to become more familiar with alternative treatments.
Good luck!
- Scott
Posted by SLS on June 18, 2005, at 20:13:08
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott, posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 16:12:51
Hi.
> I just don't get it. It's just unfathomable to me how people can manage these doses without crippling side effects.
Slower titrations? Many of the side effects lessen greatly with time.
> At 25mg of nortriptyline my mouth was so dry I couldn't speak half the time.
The first time I took a TCA, I experienced dry mouth along with profuse sweating, blurred vision, constipation, abnormal orgasms, intense itching, elevated heart rate, and a few other things. This stuff appeared after the first dose. Within a few weeks, I was not so emotionally reactive to the side effects, especially because they had dissipated somewhat.
25mg of nortriptyline is probably equal to 50mg of imipramine with regard to side effects and somewhere between 50-75mg of imipramine with regard to therapeutic effect. That's a pretty high dosage to start at if you tend to be sensitive to side effects or are a poor-metabolizer of tricyclics. Most people need 75mg of nortriptyline. If in doubt, taking a blood test is often helpful in serving as a guide to dosing. If you are a poor metabolizer (P450 2D6) of TCAs, you will need substantially less drug to reach a therapeutic level as well as less drug to precipitate side effects.
> And at 150mg Wellbutrin, I couldn't sleep more than a couple hours at a time.
Insomnia has always been a good sign for me that I will respond to a medication. It is imperative that you not let insomnia prevent you from fully exploring the therapeutic potential of a drug. It should be treated as aggressively as the depression itself. You can't stop Wellbutrin until you get to 300mg. If I were to let insomnia cause me to abort my first trial of Parnate + desipramine, I would never have attained remission. I took both Ativan and Halcion to treat the antidepressant-induced insomnia. It worked well. There are several strategies to cope with insomnia besides warm milk. Don't be afraid to use them.
Allow three weeks for any one dosage to demonstrate its efficacy and side effect profile.
> I think my problem isn't so much that I'm med resistant it's that I just can't tolerate a therapeutic dose of anything.
Whatever can go wrong does go wrong? I know the feeling. Perhaps you need to titrate dosages of medication at a rate half of that of the average person. I am unwilling to accept that you cannot tolerate the medications that will give you your life back.
> Yes, I'm a whiny baby.I am also unwilling to accept this statement. Things have been hard for you. You are not responsible for the way these drugs affect you. In addition, you might not have been adequately prepared by your physician to have a full appreciation of the potential side effects of these drugs before beginning to take them.
Who cares? Whine all you want. Something good may come of it.
- Scott
Posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 22:06:54
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? » 4WD, posted by TamaraJ on June 18, 2005, at 16:27:00
> Hi Marsha,
>
> I experienced the same thing when I started Paxil - increased anxiety and panic - for about the first 3 weeks or so. At first I was freaking out. The last thing I wanted was more freaking anxiety. I spoke to my doctor and she told me that it was likely just start-up side effects, and it would subside after 2 to 3 weeks. She also gave me a small script for Xanax to use during the adjustment phase. And, after about 3 weeks, the anxiety subsided (was pretty much gone, actually), and I didn't really need the Xanax anymore (or too often). But, as you say, we are all different, so Paxil may not have been the right med for you. Or, between the withdrawal from Effexor and the start-up side effects of Paxil, you experienced really severe anxiety and panic. It's so hard to tell.
>
> How long did you try the nort for? Again, the incredible anxiety could have been start-up side effects. I was a bit more agitated when I started nort, but that went away as my body adjusted to the med.
>
> Tamara
>
> > Hi Tamara,
> >
> > Thanks for the suggestion but I think I must have pretty much an opposite chemistry from yours. When I tried switching from Effexor to Paxil last summer, I started getting panicky within a week or two. And nortriptyline made me more anxious also.
> >
> > OTOH, the Paxil panickyness might just have been from going off Effexor too rapidly. It might be worth trying again once the anxiety I'm having right now gets better. I'm still only off Effexor for about three months and I'm hoping that's part of the source of the anxiety.
> >
> > Then on the Other other hand, I have paradoxical reactions to a lot of meds. Who knows?
> >
> > Marsha
> >
>
>I think I tried both of them for about three weeks. Maybe I'm just too impatient. Maybe it was withdrawal from Effexor. As you say, it's just so hard to tell. I do remember getting really bad restless legs on the Paxil by the second or third day so I wasn't too motivated to stick it out. And Klonopin also gives me restless legs if I take it in the afternoon or at night so adding more of it would have compounded that problem.
I'm so glad you've found a combo that seems to be working for you. AT first I was ticked off cause somebody was getting well and it wasn't me. You know? But it gives me hope that it is possible to find a good treatment. Mine is out there somewhere. And right now I'm not deeply depressed; just apathetic and lethargic and anhedonic. ANd the anxiety has gotten some better and I'm not suicidal anymore. So that's a lot.
Marsha
Posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 22:24:04
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott » 4WD, posted by ed_uk on June 18, 2005, at 18:29:48
> >At 25mg of nortriptyline my mouth was so dry I couldn't speak half the time.
>
> Perhaps you're a slow metaboliser of TCAs. You might benefit from a very low dose eg. 10mg nort.
>
> ~Ed
I think I'm a slow metabolizer in general. I could never take more than about 50mg of Effexor, my Celexa maximum dose is 10-15mg, on Prozac I took 20mg 2-3 times a week and .5 mg of Klonopin controls anxiety fairly well. I also get drunk on two beers. OTOH I could gulp down 30mg of hydrocodone and feel just fine.You know it's upsetting that there are specific protocols for treatment of every possible kind and variation of cancer but no treatment protocol for various symptoms/type of depression beyond simply SSRIs or SNRIs for MDD and mood stabilizers for bipolar. It makes me want to get in the boat with Linkadge and either use my own power to row like hell (quit all drugs and let my brain rebalance itself) or just sink the d*** thing.
Marsha
Posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 22:33:12
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? » 4WD, posted by SLS on June 18, 2005, at 19:33:21
> Stranger things have happened. I think the combination of pregnenelone + DHEA sounds interesting. I guess the DHEA acts as a guarantee that enough androgen will become available should much of the pregnenelone be converted to progesterone. From what I understand, women tend to profit more from the addition of DHEA than men do, and it acts as both an antidepressant and anxiolytic.
>Thanks, Scott. I am switching to a new Pdoc (first appt is June 30). He's a two hour drive away but one of the clinics where he works is called Mental Health and Natural Medicine and he's considered a holistic practitioner. The DHEA sounds like a great idea. That's one I hadn't considered. I don't know much about supplements either but I'm learning. And you make a really good point - the drugs will still be there to come back to. I'm not quitting my Celexa/Klonopin yet though. And maybe I'll try adding Lamictal to that. And I still have one ace in the hole. I responded well to imipramine back in 1987 before I was taken off it and put on Prozac so I can always try that again. Maybe it's been long enough that my body would think it was a whole new drug.
Marsha
Posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 22:47:56
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott » 4WD, posted by SLS on June 18, 2005, at 20:13:08
> Hi.
>
> > I just don't get it. It's just unfathomable to me how people can manage these doses without crippling side effects.
>
> Slower titrations? Many of the side effects lessen greatly with time.
>
> > At 25mg of nortriptyline my mouth was so dry I couldn't speak half the time.
>
> The first time I took a TCA, I experienced dry mouth along with profuse sweating, blurred vision, constipation, abnormal orgasms, intense itching, elevated heart rate, and a few other things. This stuff appeared after the first dose. Within a few weeks, I was not so emotionally reactive to the side effects, especially because they had dissipated somewhat.
>
> 25mg of nortriptyline is probably equal to 50mg of imipramine with regard to side effects and somewhere between 50-75mg of imipramine with regard to therapeutic effect. That's a pretty high dosage to start at if you tend to be sensitive to side effects or are a poor-metabolizer of tricyclics. Most people need 75mg of nortriptyline. If in doubt, taking a blood test is often helpful in serving as a guide to dosing. If you are a poor metabolizer (P450 2D6) of TCAs, you will need substantially less drug to reach a therapeutic level as well as less drug to precipitate side effects.
>
> > And at 150mg Wellbutrin, I couldn't sleep more than a couple hours at a time.
>
> Insomnia has always been a good sign for me that I will respond to a medication. It is imperative that you not let insomnia prevent you from fully exploring the therapeutic potential of a drug. It should be treated as aggressively as the depression itself. You can't stop Wellbutrin until you get to 300mg. If I were to let insomnia cause me to abort my first trial of Parnate + desipramine, I would never have attained remission. I took both Ativan and Halcion to treat the antidepressant-induced insomnia. It worked well. There are several strategies to cope with insomnia besides warm milk. Don't be afraid to use them.
>
> Allow three weeks for any one dosage to demonstrate its efficacy and side effect profile.
>
> > I think my problem isn't so much that I'm med resistant it's that I just can't tolerate a therapeutic dose of anything.
>
> Whatever can go wrong does go wrong? I know the feeling. Perhaps you need to titrate dosages of medication at a rate half of that of the average person. I am unwilling to accept that you cannot tolerate the medications that will give you your life back.
>
> > Yes, I'm a whiny baby.
>
> I am also unwilling to accept this statement. Things have been hard for you. You are not responsible for the way these drugs affect you. In addition, you might not have been adequately prepared by your physician to have a full appreciation of the potential side effects of these drugs before beginning to take them.
>
> Who cares? Whine all you want. Something good may come of it.
>
>
> - Scott
>
Scott, you are incredibly good to spend so much time responding to posts like this. I can't imagine how you can be so compassionate and so involved while you are so depressed yourself. It's just amazing. I think I'd be better off if I spent more time trying to help other people instead of spending so much time focusing on what's wrong with me and how to fix it. You are a truly good person and you deserve to get well. Thank you again for your help and caring. And you know, you're right. I'd be willing to tolerate almost any side effect --if it came with remission. It's when you get the full side effects without remission (or with only a slight improvement)that it's so frustrating. But your stoicism makes me more willing to tolerate it myself next time around.Marsha
Posted by ed_uk on June 19, 2005, at 10:41:10
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott » ed_uk, posted by 4WD on June 18, 2005, at 22:24:04
Hi Marsha,
Perhaps you could try some meds that you've tried before but at much lower doses eg. nortriptyline. Could be helpful.....
~Ed
Posted by linkadge on June 20, 2005, at 20:04:58
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott (nm), posted by 4WD on June 19, 2005, at 22:47:23
I am doing surprisingly better off meds in many respects.
THe amount of time that my brain spent doing crap that was totally counterproductive is absolutely amazing.
I am taking a time released multivitamin, exercise, some fish oil, extra magnesium and niacin, a little periactin if I get that lingering hight cortisol type of feeling.
I am trying to let go of the notion that one pill will solve it all, instead I am trying to treat my symptoms with a host of different tools.
I am still trying to keep my foot in the medication door for one reason or another.
I am not going to lie to you and say that I am euphoric etc. But I can say to you that there were a group of very negative and destrutive side effects that have vanished.I am definately living a lot more in the present.
Just wish me luck that it will continue.
Linkadge
Posted by linkadge on June 20, 2005, at 20:06:08
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott (nm), posted by 4WD on June 19, 2005, at 22:47:23
Oh, and periactin plus high dose vitamin C is profoundly calming to me. Both have strong anti-cortisol properties.
Linkadge
Posted by ed_uk on June 20, 2005, at 20:21:58
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott, posted by linkadge on June 20, 2005, at 20:06:08
Hi Link!
Does Periactin make you very drowsy? Antihistamines always knock me out!
~Ed
Posted by SLS on June 20, 2005, at 20:54:20
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott, posted by linkadge on June 20, 2005, at 20:04:58
Linkadge,
I offer you nothing but my sincerest of well wishes that you be successful in your attainment of health and happiness. You contribute a lot to this website and help to change people's lives for the better through your informative posts and intellectual synthesis of ideas and conclusions. Despite our differences of opinion on some issues, I always make it a priority of mine to read your posts. Don't stop trying. You will get there.
Have you ever considered keeping a daily mood-chart? It might help you optimize your treatment regimen and determine whether or not there is any cyclicity to any changing mood states there might be. It would also be important to keep notes of daily treatment parameters as well as significant psychosocial events, good or bad, which might correlate with your reported mood states.
I like to use this chart:
http://home.att.net/~sl.schofield3/medicine/mood_chart_beam.pdf
You'll need the Adobe Acrobat Reader program to view and print the file. The program can be found here:
http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep2.html
- Scott
Posted by linkadge on June 21, 2005, at 6:47:46
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott » linkadge, posted by SLS on June 20, 2005, at 20:54:20
Cool, I can give this a try.
The suicidal state seems to be binary for me. It's just like whammo, like a swich goes on (or off) and I just want to die more than anything else. It can come right out of the blue. There semes to be no transition.
Usually a very very dark thought pops into my head. Sometimes strange thoughts that are very loose tangential. Sometimes its just an overwhelming thought of irriversable brain dammage, and in an instant nothing else matters to me. In these moments it is as if all the reality around me just ceases to exist. I cannot hear anything or see anything (so to speak)
These states seem to flick off just as quickly.
I don't really call it cycling because I don't feel much change in my mood at all. I don't really feel happy or sad, its just fine,fine,fine,fine,suicidal,fine,fine.
I wouldn't be so bothered by it, but it is of extreme intensity.
Like I have always told people. I am not depressed, I am suicidal. Thats the only way I can see it.
Linkadge
Posted by SLS on June 21, 2005, at 8:00:35
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott, posted by linkadge on June 21, 2005, at 6:47:46
Linkadge.
It occured to me along another thread (before I read this post) that you are fighting impulsive thoughts - suicide in particular. Have you ever tried Trileptal? It is often used to reduce impulsivity along with anger. It combines very well with Zyprexa to treat borderline personality disorder. I am not suggesting that you have BPD, but I wanted to demonstrate one of its uses. I'll leave to you the conjecture as to why it might work.
You are brilliant. Never let anyone tell you differently. One day, you will no longer be distracted by the obstacles that now exist for you, and you will be able to focus your mind on how to work your way towards happiness and fulfillment. Don't let an impulse terminate such a young life before it has the chance to get there.
There is magic in allotropic medicine, whether it come from a plant or a test-tube. There is more magic to come from electrical or electromagnetic interventions, and still more from microarrays and gene manipulations. These things will happen while you are still a young man. They will not happen for me until I am well into middle-age or older. Don't you dare conclude that your life is over. Given your present circumstances, such a conlusion is erroneous and illogical. Please continue to correctly conclude that your thoughts of suicide are intrusive and impulsive, and that they are amplified by a powerful mind exercising variable interpretations of questionable information.
Trileptal + Zyprexa?
- Scott
Posted by ed_uk on June 21, 2005, at 8:13:32
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott » linkadge, posted by SLS on June 21, 2005, at 8:00:35
Hi Scott,
>You are brilliant.
I think Link should become a neuroscientist (if he wants to).
~Ed
Posted by SLS on June 21, 2005, at 8:46:40
In reply to Re: Anyone TIRED on Wellbutrin XL? - ? for Scott » SLS, posted by ed_uk on June 21, 2005, at 8:13:32
> Hi Scott,
>
> >You are brilliant.
>
> I think Link should become a neuroscientist (if he wants to).
>
> ~EdThat's what I wanted to do before my illness ripped apart my ability to read, learn, and remember. I wanted to be a research clinical psychopharmacologist.
- Scott
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.