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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Preston on July 28, 2002, at 22:41:04
Hi, I am currently taking Zoloft and it helps me with my depression, but I still have very little motivation and have a really hard time focusing on things (even the things that I am most interested in). My doctor has suggested that I stop Zoloft and start Wellbutrin. Has anybody noticed that they could focus better as a result of taking Wellbutrin? Or has anyone taken Zoloft and Wellbutrin together and been satisfied?
Posted by LostBoyinNC1 on July 29, 2002, at 0:30:49
In reply to Wellbutrin to help focus and motivation?, posted by Preston on July 28, 2002, at 22:41:04
> Hi, I am currently taking Zoloft and it helps me with my depression, but I still have very little motivation and have a really hard time focusing on things (even the things that I am most interested in). My doctor has suggested that I stop Zoloft and start Wellbutrin. Has anybody noticed that they could focus better as a result of taking Wellbutrin? Or has anyone taken Zoloft and Wellbutrin together and been satisfied?
yeah, that could be a good idea. Wellbutrin is mildly dopaminergic and thus has some mild stimulant feel to it. One psychiatrist I had described it as having an almost Ritalin effect. He also told me that Wellbutrin is being used some in Attention Deficit Disorders, which means it should improve your cognition. However, Wellbutrin is NOT an amphetamine!
Wellbutrin is one of the few "fun" antidepressants. It has few to no side effects, doesnt interfere with sex at all. Some say it causes mild insomnia due to its stimulant properties, thats about the only bad thing I ever heard about it. Also, it doesnt cause weight gain and many lose a few pounds on it rather than gain weight like is typical on SSRIs.
I made my first partial recovery from a very deep, severe, retarded depression years ago on 400 mg Wellbutrin SR. And now Im having about the best AD effect Ive ever had from the MAOI Parnate, which is heavily dopaminergic. Wellbutrin is only mildly dopaminergic. Ive decided that the people out there who claim dopamine has nothing to do with severe depression are full of shit. Id like to see more dopaminergic antidepressants developed. I think there are ways they could do it that would be safe.
Also, another potently dopaminergic antidepressant that was very effective at fighting severe, melancholic depression was a drug called nomifensine. It was only marketed briefly back in the eighties and withdrawn by the FDA for some rare blood disease it was purported to cause. But it was supposed to be quite effective. Certainly more effective than SSRIs.
We need more dopaminergic antidepressants developed. Period.
Posted by cybercafe on July 29, 2002, at 1:41:33
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin to help focus and motivation?, posted by LostBoyinNC1 on July 29, 2002, at 0:30:49
do you think stimulants like ritalin or adderall etc would be good for depression then?... btw hasn't dopamine in the nucleus accumbens or globus pallidus been shown to be a common pathway for all antidepressant medications as well as ECT?
Posted by LostBoyinNC1 on July 29, 2002, at 11:40:57
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin to help focus -- lostboy, posted by cybercafe on July 29, 2002, at 1:41:33
>
> do you think stimulants like ritalin or adderall etc would be good for depression then?
>
> ... btw hasn't dopamine in the nucleus accumbens or globus pallidus been shown to be a common pathway for all antidepressant medications as well as ECT?Yeah, amphetamines have been a treatment for refractory depression forever. However they cant be used if you have psychotic tendencies. Also, many psychiatrists wont prescribe amphetamines to anybody except ADD patients, due to bullshit legal/liability reasons. Thats how it is here in the USA at least. The type of depression amphetamines can be most helpful in would be severe, retarded or melancholic depression with "pseududementia" as Max Fink describes it. Where you have slowed thinking and cognitive problems from severe depression.
Posted by allisonm on July 29, 2002, at 15:46:10
In reply to Wellbutrin to help focus and motivation?, posted by Preston on July 28, 2002, at 22:41:04
I've taken Wellbutrin for chronic refractory depression for 3 years, usually with another antidepressant. It's the best drug I've taken, but it cannot take care of my depression alone. (So far I have not found anything that has brought me completely out of it.) I currently am taking Zoloft with WB. I have not been on the Zoloft for long -- maybe a month. I am feeling pretty good/OK at the moment. Time will tell.
Posted by Geezer on July 29, 2002, at 15:52:32
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin to help focus and motivation?, posted by LostBoyinNC1 on July 29, 2002, at 0:30:49
> > Hi, I am currently taking Zoloft and it helps me with my depression, but I still have very little motivation and have a really hard time focusing on things (even the things that I am most interested in). My doctor has suggested that I stop Zoloft and start Wellbutrin. Has anybody noticed that they could focus better as a result of taking Wellbutrin? Or has anyone taken Zoloft and Wellbutrin together and been satisfied?
>
> yeah, that could be a good idea. Wellbutrin is mildly dopaminergic and thus has some mild stimulant feel to it. One psychiatrist I had described it as having an almost Ritalin effect. He also told me that Wellbutrin is being used some in Attention Deficit Disorders, which means it should improve your cognition. However, Wellbutrin is NOT an amphetamine!
>
> Wellbutrin is one of the few "fun" antidepressants. It has few to no side effects, doesnt interfere with sex at all. Some say it causes mild insomnia due to its stimulant properties, thats about the only bad thing I ever heard about it. Also, it doesnt cause weight gain and many lose a few pounds on it rather than gain weight like is typical on SSRIs.
>
> I made my first partial recovery from a very deep, severe, retarded depression years ago on 400 mg Wellbutrin SR. And now Im having about the best AD effect Ive ever had from the MAOI Parnate, which is heavily dopaminergic. Wellbutrin is only mildly dopaminergic. Ive decided that the people out there who claim dopamine has nothing to do with severe depression are full of shit. Id like to see more dopaminergic antidepressants developed. I think there are ways they could do it that would be safe.
>
> Also, another potently dopaminergic antidepressant that was very effective at fighting severe, melancholic depression was a drug called nomifensine. It was only marketed briefly back in the eighties and withdrawn by the FDA for some rare blood disease it was purported to cause. But it was supposed to be quite effective. Certainly more effective than SSRIs.
>
> We need more dopaminergic antidepressants developed. Period.
>
>I completely agree on the dopaminergic meds. I took nomifensine in the 80s - as I recall it did work. I was too busy with hypomania to mess with any drug (except some Dexadrine and Valium abuse) at that point. Only to be expected; anything that works the FDA will prevent us from having. The blood problem you mention was real but I will bet no more common than the big seizure whoop-la we get about Wellbutrin, (can't prove this, just sounds likely).
Regards
Geezer
Posted by terra miller on July 29, 2002, at 17:16:42
In reply to Wellbutrin to help focus and motivation?, posted by Preston on July 28, 2002, at 22:41:04
big time focus and motivation. especially in the first months, there's so much energy to do stuff it's amazing....
terra
Posted by LostBoyinNC1 on July 29, 2002, at 17:59:22
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin to help focus and motivation? » LostBoyinNC1, posted by Geezer on July 29, 2002, at 15:52:32
> >
>
> I completely agree on the dopaminergic meds. I took nomifensine in the 80s - as I recall it did work. I was too busy with hypomania to mess with any drug (except some Dexadrine and Valium abuse) at that point. Only to be expected; anything that works the FDA will prevent us from having. The blood problem you mention was real but I will bet no more common than the big seizure whoop-la we get about Wellbutrin, (can't prove this, just sounds likely).
>
> Regards
>
> Geezer
Yeah, I heard nomifensine was awesome. Its a shame they took it off the market. Maybe they took it off the market cause at that time Eli Lilly was getting ready to market Prozac and didnt want any competition? Im just speculating wildly. Drug companies are scared to develop dopaminergic antidepressants, as they are scared to investigate antidepressants that work on the opiate system. We suffer as a result.
>
>
Posted by cybercafe on July 29, 2002, at 22:34:30
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin to help focus -- lostboy, posted by LostBoyinNC1 on July 29, 2002, at 11:40:57
> Yeah, amphetamines have been a treatment for refractory depression forever. However they cant
hmmm... when i asked my (old) doc, he claimed they were too addictive ...
>amphetamines can be most helpful in would be severe, retarded or melancholic depression with "pseududementia" as Max Fink describes it. Where you have slowed thinking and cognitive problems from severe depression.
... okay.. but what about anergic atypical depression? ... i mean you melancholic dudes already aren't eating or sleeping, what's going to happen if you start taking speed? ... whereas us atypical guys could use a little less sleep and less food (i find sleep deprivation is actually quite helpful for mood) ..... plus we are supposed to have "leaden paralysis"... though i wonder what the diff is between leaden paralysis and psychomotor slowing of limbs... or anergia ...
Posted by awake at last on July 30, 2002, at 9:29:06
In reply to Wellbutrin to help focus and motivation?, posted by Preston on July 28, 2002, at 22:41:04
> Hi, I am currently taking Zoloft and it helps me with my depression, but I still have very little motivation and have a really hard time focusing on things (even the things that I am most interested in). My doctor has suggested that I stop Zoloft and start Wellbutrin. Has anybody noticed that they could focus better as a result of taking Wellbutrin? Or has anyone taken Zoloft and Wellbutrin together and been satisfied?
**************************************************
I spent 3 years in the same stooper trying to figure out how to get my old self back. Doctors put me through many anti-depressants that for the most part were to no avail. Wellbutrin was one of the better experiences I had, it at least didn't interefere with my already ailing sex drive, though I felt somewhat better, I still found it hard to concentrate and was still tired. My new wonder-drug - Provigil. After insisting that my problem wasn't depression (although I was becoming depressed by the doctor's inability to find the reason I was tired, unmotivated and un able to concentrate), I finally had a doctor put me through a sleep study. Wa-lah, I have narcolepsy.....I never would have guessed that because I don't just fall over asleep (caterplexy). Provigil (modafinil) is a new alert drug - much better than Ritalin or Adderall because it isn't a meth. The bad side affects have been nil. The positive side effects, I can read a book now and remember what I read, I can watch an entire movie without falling asleep, and an added plus - I don't have the constant craving for sweets to boost my energy level (losing weight now without trying).
The only thing I have to be careful about is now that I have the energy to do things, I have to make myself go to bed on time. Falling asleep is easy once I lie down, but with my new energy, I find myself wanting to stay up and do things that I haven't been able to do in years.
Posted by Shawn. T. on July 30, 2002, at 18:14:53
In reply to Wellbutrin to help focus and motivation?, posted by Preston on July 28, 2002, at 22:41:04
Wellbutrin definitely picked up my focus and motivation. The only problems I had were insomnia and a bit of agitation at times. I started taking Remeron to deal with that, and now I am definitely able to focus better than I have been able to in years. If you enjoy reading scientific motivation on this sort of thing, check out the following link. I am going to do something like that sometime. I think it would be neat to have a site where you could just click on a bunch of links to studies on whatever drugs you are interested in.
http://www.geocities.com/borg_aw/articles/bupntran.htm
Shawn
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