![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 30. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by pathetic_n_useless on October 17, 2001, at 8:54:33
Hi. I'm 24 yrs old. I've been depressed and suffered with PTSD and panic attacks for about 5 yrs. i saw a psychiatrist a few times but he decided I wasn't depressed at all but had a personality disorder (borderline I think). He says no medication will help me. I havent seen him for a year because he was judgmental and got angry with me for taking too long for an appointment (45 mins instead of the usual 10!) and wrote this in a letter to my GP and psychologist.We just didnt geton. Unfortunately in the UK there is a shortage of psychiatrists and there is no other one that I can see. My GP has tried 3 drugs (mirtazapine up to 45mg, paroxetine up to 60 and efexor up to 150) he now says he doesnt hink medication will help. I've been having CBT for 2 years but still feel just as suicidal and self harm a lot.My psychologist thinksI am depressed and have PTSD but not borderline personality disorder. I tried to hang myself and i told my GP. He just said go back to see him in a month and when I did he said there was no point in doing so if I wasnt on medication. I feel so alone and depressed and spend most of my time in bed because I just dont see the point or how things will get any better. I don't know what to do anymore.
Posted by Phil on October 17, 2001, at 12:53:45
In reply to what do I do now?, posted by pathetic_n_useless on October 17, 2001, at 8:54:33
You're not pathetic and useless, but you need help quick. I don't know how things work across the pond but I would beat on every door and ring every University until I found some son of a bitch that didn't have their head up their ass.
Since Dr. Bob was recently there I wonder if he could help?Phil
Posted by DaveAAA on October 17, 2001, at 15:04:54
In reply to Re: what do I do now? Dr. Bob-please, any input?, posted by Phil on October 17, 2001, at 12:53:45
> You're not pathetic and useless, but you need help quick. I don't know how things work across the pond but I would beat on every door and ring every University until I found some son of a bitch that didn't have their head up their ass.
> Since Dr. Bob was recently there I wonder if he could help?
>
> PhilHI,
If your that suicidal and you don't think you can
wait for any med trials, you should consider ECT.
It almost always works, and Columbia University
has come up with a combo of meds that are good
at preventing relapse. I'm sort of in the same
boat as you. I've been trying to do the ECT but
have been too scared. I tried a few several
years ago, and they weren't that bad. No meds
have worked for me eitherDave
Posted by Roo on October 17, 2001, at 16:00:56
In reply to Re: what do I do now? , posted by DaveAAA on October 17, 2001, at 15:04:54
Dave--
just curious--did the ECT help? If you tried it
before, why are you scared?
Posted by Noa on October 17, 2001, at 16:36:44
In reply to what do I do now?, posted by pathetic_n_useless on October 17, 2001, at 8:54:33
Other members of this board have talked about this kind of response from psychiatrists in the UK. It seems they are a bit behind the times. Hopefully, one of the UK posters will provide some ideas of how to access psychiatric help that is more up to date on psychopharmocological options. Nikki?
Posted by Edward on October 17, 2001, at 17:27:46
In reply to what do I do now?, posted by pathetic_n_useless on October 17, 2001, at 8:54:33
If you have PTSD it is important that you start seeing a good therapist who you trust and get on with so that you can go over and come to terms with your past. I am also english, and I have a friend who suffers from PTSD. She has been in therapy for a couple of years and I have seen her gradually getting better. She still finds things difficult, but things are still improving for her. Anti-depressants are rarely a solution in themselves for this kind of problem, but can help to "take the edge off" strong feelings of unhappiness. My friend says that they make her numb (which can be a good thing).
I'm very disappointed with your psychiatrist. Are you absolutely certain that your psychologist can't arrange for you to meet another? It's very important that you get the right help because you _can_ get better. Make sure you're as assertive as you feel able to be about what you think would help- different anti-depressants, a new therapist.
I hope you're going to be OK :-D
Ed
ps- i'm sure you're not pathetic OR useless
Posted by pathetic_n_useless on October 18, 2001, at 7:26:12
In reply to Re: what do I do now? , posted by DaveAAA on October 17, 2001, at 15:04:54
Hmm only option i have to get help is go through my GP. That's how it works over here! He says no other psychiatrist I can see. As for ECT- highly unlikely! There's no way they'd give me it so totally hopeless. I don't know why i bother anymore. Nothing to help me.
Posted by Gracie2 on October 18, 2001, at 19:26:57
In reply to Re: what do I do now? , posted by pathetic_n_useless on October 18, 2001, at 7:26:12
Darling there is help. If you have read some of my other posts you know I've been a complete lunatic at times and I am better now.
In my opinion, the pyschiatrist you had the misfortune to see is unworthy of his credentials nd deserves to have diplomas ripped from the wall. What an idiot.
It is my opinion that if you are suicidal and unable to function, you need hospital treatment.
This idea scares many people, thinking of being tied to their beds and subjected to all manner of strange scientific experiments. If it used to be this way, ala Frances Farmer, times have changed.
There are many concerned professionals, doctors, nurses and social workers whose only interest is in helping you feel better. With their help, therapy and the right medications, they can give you a life that you enjoy living.
Hope you consider this...best wishes.
-Gracie
Posted by Kat26 on October 20, 2001, at 11:44:49
In reply to Re: what do I do now? , posted by Gracie2 on October 18, 2001, at 19:26:57
I want to agree with the last post: THERE IS HELP. Me too I have suffered veyr long and htought it may well be hopeless... only to realize later how many blessings wer still waiting for me.
Don't give up pleaseKat
Posted by PaulB on October 24, 2001, at 12:31:13
In reply to what do I do now?, posted by pathetic_n_useless on October 17, 2001, at 8:54:33
> Hi. I'm 24 yrs old. I've been depressed and suffered with PTSD and panic attacks for about 5 yrs. i saw a psychiatrist a few times but he decided I wasn't depressed at all but had a personality disorder (borderline I think). He says no medication will help me. I havent seen him for a year because he was judgmental and got angry with me for taking too long for an appointment (45 mins instead of the usual 10!) and wrote this in a letter to my GP and psychologist.We just didnt geton. Unfortunately in the UK there is a shortage of psychiatrists and there is no other one that I can see. My GP has tried 3 drugs (mirtazapine up to 45mg, paroxetine up to 60 and efexor up to 150) he now says he doesnt hink medication will help. I've been having CBT for 2 years but still feel just as suicidal and self harm a lot.My psychologist thinksI am depressed and have PTSD but not borderline personality disorder. I tried to hang myself and i told my GP. He just said go back to see him in a month and when I did he said there was no point in doing so if I wasnt on medication. I feel so alone and depressed and spend most of my time in bed because I just dont see the point or how things will get any better. I don't know what to do anymore.
I am from the UK myself and under the NHS have seen both a Psychiatrist and Psychologist. I would suggest:
-Amino acids-L-Tyrosine, 5-HTP, L-Tryptophan
-short-term use of benzodiazepines NOW. If your current GP will not prescribe them another will for 2 weeks.
-Private pyschiatrist(if you can afford it)-Priory, Cromwell etc
-You did not mention your family or friends, can they not help you emotionally and finacially, perhaps with the private psychiatrist.
-MAOI's can be especially effective for refractory depressivesI really do wish you the best of luck. Take care.
PaulB
Posted by pathetic_n_useless on October 25, 2001, at 6:16:50
In reply to Re: what do I do now?, posted by PaulB on October 24, 2001, at 12:31:13
thanks for your help. I am seeing a differnt GP next week but don't hold out much hope. I think she will probably say the same thing as the rest- not much we can do.My family don't know much abotu whats going on and are not very supportive. I havent seen my friends for over almost a year, I don't really see anyone. Ah well. Maybe I should just stuff all of it.
Posted by Gracie2 on October 29, 2001, at 21:36:22
In reply to Re: what do I do now?, posted by pathetic_n_useless on October 25, 2001, at 6:16:50
What's this mash about seeing another "GP"? You need a psychiatrist. If you had a broken femur that needed a rod would you let your GP do it? Of course not; although he could try to keep you stabalized until an orthopedic surgeon took over,
he is not qualified to treat you for such a serious injury.
You need a specialist, a good psychiatrist familiar with psychiatric medication and the workings of the mind. Try not to be discouraged by your bad experience with one psychiatrist. Like every other profession - from policemen to cooks - there are some who are not very good and others who are excellent. Even if there aren't many in your area, I would drive a great distance to see a competent psychiatrist. (I would walk a mile for a Camel, haha - oops, dating myself).
Please keep trying.
-Gracie
Posted by pathetic_n_useless on October 30, 2001, at 5:24:12
In reply to Re: what do I do now?, posted by Gracie2 on October 29, 2001, at 21:36:22
>
> What's this mash about seeing another "GP"? You need a psychiatrist. If you had a broken femur that needed a rod would you let your GP do it? Of course not; although he could try to keep you stabalized until an orthopedic surgeon took over,
> he is not qualified to treat you for such a serious injury.
> You need a specialist, a good psychiatrist familiar with psychiatric medication and the workings of the mind. Try not to be discouraged by your bad experience with one psychiatrist. Like every other profession - from policemen to cooks - there are some who are not very good and others who are excellent. Even if there aren't many in your area, I would drive a great distance to see a competent psychiatrist. (I would walk a mile for a Camel, haha - oops, dating myself).
> Please keep trying.
> -Gracie
Seeing another psychiatrist is difficult. There's 2 that cover the part of the city where i live. So my GP is limited to referring me to them. One is the one I saw, the other is off sick long term. I can't drive any distance to see another psychiatrist because I'd have to go private and there is no way I can afford it and I'd still have to be referred.So there isn't another psych I can see. That's the problem
Posted by pathetic_n_useless on October 30, 2001, at 12:14:28
In reply to Re: what do I do now?, posted by pathetic_n_useless on October 30, 2001, at 5:24:12
Well the GP out me back on mirtazapine (remeron). I went up to 30mg before and it helped with sleep but that was it. Ah well.
Posted by Gracie2 on November 1, 2001, at 8:35:33
In reply to Re: what do I do now?, posted by pathetic_n_useless on October 30, 2001, at 5:24:12
Have you tried calling your insurance company and explaining the problem? Sometimes they can be human.
-Gracie
Posted by pathetic_n_useless on November 1, 2001, at 10:34:46
In reply to Well bloody hell, posted by Gracie2 on November 1, 2001, at 8:35:33
>
> Have you tried calling your insurance company and explaining the problem? Sometimes they can be human.
> -Gracie
Erm I live in the UK, no insurance involved!
Posted by Gracie2 on November 3, 2001, at 17:49:09
In reply to Re: Well bloody hell, posted by pathetic_n_useless on November 1, 2001, at 10:34:46
What you mean you have socialized medicine like they do in Canada?Couldn't stay awake in class-
Gracie
Posted by pathetic_n_useless on November 3, 2001, at 18:40:51
In reply to Insurance, posted by Gracie2 on November 3, 2001, at 17:49:09
we have the National Health Service. Everything is free to everyone (well we pay for drugs but £6.10 per drug prescribed no matter what the drug costs but 60% of people here are exempt from paying that too.) Downside is lots of understaffing and not enough resources, long waiting lists (up to 18 months for cbt, one of my friends recently received an 'urgent' appointment with the pain clinic for 2 and a half yrs time!Average time in my local hospital between referral from your GP and seeing a specialist is 3 months but usually longer), u have to get referred by your GP for pretty much everything thats not urgent and I often have to wait 2 weeks to get a GP appt)
Posted by Gracie2 on November 5, 2001, at 20:33:15
In reply to Re: Insurance, posted by pathetic_n_useless on November 3, 2001, at 18:40:51
Posted by pathetic_n_useless on November 10, 2001, at 15:40:59
In reply to Re: what do I do now?, posted by PaulB on October 24, 2001, at 12:31:13
what I wrote before I've left below. I've been on mirtazapine (remeron in Us, zispin in UK) for almost 2 weeks. I was feeling v suicidal on thursday last week so I tried to get an urgent GP appt. First available one was tuesday 13th but I said I couldnt wait that long so had a 5min one on friday. I had So I went Fri morning and I had to wait an hr and a half. It was the same
GP I last. She said an immediate access clinic 5min appt wasn't the appropriate place to talk n when I tried to explain why I was told to go there she said she wasn't having a go at me about it.We kept getting interrupted every minute or so by various people like the nurse wanting advice. She said not much she can do even if I
am feeling suicidal n thinking of doing something (and I was specific about what I had planned. and told her how bad I felt) She said it was my choice n couldn't stop me as I wasn't sectionable so she couldnt make me go to hospital but that she couldn't see anything positive about it- mentioned if didn't work and stuff like that.I
said the only thing that I can see that is positive is if it works! Told me
to try toget away for a few days ( I cant cos of my pets ) or just a day to take the
focus off me and be with other people but there's not really anyone I can go to. and if anyone talks to me at all right now I just burst into tears. I mean I have trouble going out the front door cos of anxiety so suggesting going out for a walk isn't gonna work! She said we'd talk again on Tuesday but I mean what's the point?! She wont have any new suggestions and its only for 10 mins then. There's no way I'm seeing the same psychatrist before n there isnt another one. I'm just so fed up n crying all the time n I
cant stop I hate it.I just don'tknow what to do.
> > Hi. I'm 24 yrs old. I've been depressed and suffered with PTSD and panic attacks for about 5 yrs. i saw a psychiatrist a few times but he decided I wasn't depressed at all but had a personality disorder (borderline I think). He says no medication will help me. I havent seen him for a year because he was judgmental and got angry with me for taking too long for an appointment (45 mins instead of the usual 10!) and wrote this in a letter to my GP and psychologist.We just didnt geton. Unfortunately in the UK there is a shortage of psychiatrists and there is no other one that I can see. My GP has tried 3 drugs (mirtazapine up to 45mg, paroxetine up to 60 and efexor up to 150) he now says he doesnt hink medication will help. I've been having CBT for 2 years but still feel just as suicidal and self harm a lot.My psychologist thinksI am depressed and have PTSD but not borderline personality disorder. I tried to hang myself and i told my GP. He just said go back to see him in a month and when I did he said there was no point in doing so if I wasnt on medication. I feel so alone and depressed and spend most of my time in bed because I just dont see the point or how things will get any better. I don't know what to do anymore.
>
Posted by Jane D on November 10, 2001, at 17:32:27
In reply to Re: what do I do now?- update, posted by pathetic_n_useless on November 10, 2001, at 15:40:59
> what I wrote before I've left below. I've been on mirtazapine (remeron in Us, zispin in UK) for almost 2 weeks. I was feeling v suicidal on thursday last week so I tried to get an urgent GP appt. First available one was tuesday 13th but I said I couldnt wait that long so had a 5min one on friday. I had So I went Fri morning and I had to wait an hr and a half. It was the same
> GP I last. She said an immediate access clinic 5min appt wasn't the appropriate place to talk n when I tried to explain why I was told to go there she said she wasn't having a go at me about it.We kept getting interrupted every minute or so by various people like the nurse wanting advice. She said not much she can do even if I
> am feeling suicidal n thinking of doing something (and I was specific about what I had planned. and told her how bad I felt) She said it was my choice n couldn't stop me as I wasn't sectionable so she couldnt make me go to hospital but that she couldn't see anything positive about it- mentioned if didn't work and stuff like that.I
> said the only thing that I can see that is positive is if it works! Told me
> to try toget away for a few days ( I cant cos of my pets ) or just a day to take the
> focus off me and be with other people but there's not really anyone I can go to. and if anyone talks to me at all right now I just burst into tears. I mean I have trouble going out the front door cos of anxiety so suggesting going out for a walk isn't gonna work! She said we'd talk again on Tuesday but I mean what's the point?! She wont have any new suggestions and its only for 10 mins then. There's no way I'm seeing the same psychatrist before n there isnt another one. I'm just so fed up n crying all the time n I
> cant stop I hate it.I just don'tknow what to do.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > > Hi. I'm 24 yrs old. I've been depressed and suffered with PTSD and panic attacks for about 5 yrs. i saw a psychiatrist a few times but he decided I wasn't depressed at all but had a personality disorder (borderline I think). He says no medication will help me. I havent seen him for a year because he was judgmental and got angry with me for taking too long for an appointment (45 mins instead of the usual 10!) and wrote this in a letter to my GP and psychologist.We just didnt geton. Unfortunately in the UK there is a shortage of psychiatrists and there is no other one that I can see. My GP has tried 3 drugs (mirtazapine up to 45mg, paroxetine up to 60 and efexor up to 150) he now says he doesnt hink medication will help. I've been having CBT for 2 years but still feel just as suicidal and self harm a lot.My psychologist thinksI am depressed and have PTSD but not borderline personality disorder. I tried to hang myself and i told my GP. He just said go back to see him in a month and when I did he said there was no point in doing so if I wasnt on medication. I feel so alone and depressed and spend most of my time in bed because I just dont see the point or how things will get any better. I don't know what to do anymore.
> >Dear Pat
First the disclaimers. I'm not in the UK and therefore don't know the ins and outs of the NHS. For that you need to imput of the other UK posters. Pauls advice above sounded good to me. I think some things are the same in both countries though. The problems with the NHS sound similar to the ones we have with our HMOs. Some things that jumped out at me.
A borderline personality diagnosis often just means that you and the psychiatrist "didn't get on". I wouldn't take it to seriously. But, if it is borderline (whatever that may be), medication can work. That he was absolutely wrong about. There was a thread here a couple of week ago about this. Check the archive for October 15th.
Just because 3 drugs didn't work doesn't mean that none will. Not everyone responds to the same drugs or the same doses.
If all you have access to is a GP I think you can still get what you need. She doesn't sound like the easiest person to deal with but keep the appointment on Tuesday. She may in fact have thought of something new to say and you can use the time between now and Tuesday to figure out what you want from her. If another referral to a Psychiatrist is out of the question this can still work. Assume that she wants to help you but doesn't have a lot of experience with people like you or a lot of time to look things up. Her abruptness with you is probably because she is frustrated by the situation that the NHS has put her in, not because she doesn't like you. She may be willing to listen to any suggestions you make that will give her a way to help you without taking time that she doesn't have. And the great thing about medication is that once you find one that works it doesn't matter whether the doctor has any clue about why it works or what was wrong with you in the first place.
The hard part is going to be deciding what it is that you want to do. Your Psychologist may have some unofficial opinions on medication and others on this board definately will. I know this sounds unfair - you've said that you don't see the point anymore and you DONT know what to do. That's the bind I think most of us have been in. You have to decide what to do even though you're not able to. One thing that might work is to pretend you are making these choices for someone else. And just pretend that you believe me and the rest of the posters when we say that things will get better. Act as though you believe it until you really can.
JanePS What kind of pets do you have?
Posted by pathetic_n_useless on November 10, 2001, at 19:46:15
In reply to NHS imput needed » pathetic_n_useless, posted by Jane D on November 10, 2001, at 17:32:27
>
> PS What kind of pets do you have?I have 8 rats, all males.
Posted by Jane D on November 11, 2001, at 19:43:43
In reply to Re: NHS imput needed, posted by pathetic_n_useless on November 10, 2001, at 19:46:15
>
> >
> > PS What kind of pets do you have?
>
> I have 8 rats, all males.White rats? Do you need to keep them separated?
Just curious. I've had just about everything else but never rats. - Jane
Posted by pathetic_n_useless on November 11, 2001, at 20:48:04
In reply to Re: NHS imput needed, posted by Jane D on November 11, 2001, at 19:43:43
Not white ones- all sorts of colours. 5 live in one cage, 3 in another. they r v friendly n sociable n intelligent, mine come when called by their name.
> > >
> > > PS What kind of pets do you have?
> >
> > I have 8 rats, all males.
>
> White rats? Do you need to keep them separated?
> Just curious. I've had just about everything else but never rats. - Jane
Posted by Jane D on November 11, 2001, at 23:05:24
In reply to Re: NHS imput needed, posted by pathetic_n_useless on November 11, 2001, at 20:48:04
Pat,
Have you thought further yet about what you want to ask the doctor for on Tuesday?
Jane
(There must be a story to how you ended up with eight. Did you get them all as pups?)
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.