Posted by billy pilgrim on April 3, 2009, at 22:49:00
In reply to Re: Nardil Question » billy pilgrim, posted by myco on April 1, 2009, at 10:05:49
> ***to fast here man. Would have suggested more time at 60 but thats ok. Slow it down a lil though. Hang at 75 and watch. You may have passed your ideal dose (perhaps 60 - many like 60)...I would have said 4-6 weeks at 60 personally. But I tend to move slower and pay close attention to how I feel, very close attention.Thanks for the advice man! I wish i had have stayed at 60 for a while, i just wanted it to kick in asap, i realise now the only thing thats going to be kicking in asap is additional side effects. I know what u mean about moving slow and paying attention to mood i did that with my first few ad's, after that i started getting sooo impatient!
> ***My opinion here, as this is different for everyone, is your answer is in how benzo's make you feel in general anyway. Benzo's depress me the next day in general ok...so do they prevent nardil from working correctly?....for a depression patient yes...depressive symptoms are common next day with benzo use for sleep so....if nardil is for depression you are technically (albeit prob not to much) inhibiting some of the AD effect. Also, yes Ive noticed my energy level on nardil is way higher, if I sleep without temazepam (benzo) use, the next day. Benzo's work on GABA and nardil does to some extent...but from the studies Ive read they do this in a different way (can give u those studies if you like)...I had the theory once that benzo's would create GABA tolerance with nardil...this was suggested to be false from what ive read and my experiences...temazepam hits me just as hard as it always did if (heres the trick) I dont use it too often...this minimizes any risk also of "dampening" mood on nardil. Add another type of hypnotic and use benzo's a few times a week...if you can. Nardil insomnia is actually, I know sounds weird but, enjoyable to some extent...created need for lil sleep and pumped me way full of energy...of course lack of sleep will catch up with you later...took about 2 months to see issues in my body from lack of sleep on nardil. get a good suite of sleep meds for it.Wow thank you for such great information, your conclusion seems totally logical and the best part most of it's based on experience. I will try to find an alternate benzo/z drug to use with mirtazapine for when the insomnia get's really nasty.
I've certainly noticed i need a lower dose of benzo's now as the Nardil and Mirtazapine seem to enhance them somewhat.
Id love those study's. Reading anything about meds and their effects always intrigues me.
I know what u mean about enjoying maoi insomnia! I used to love going out on parnate, staying out till on the clubs shut and repeating the process again on saturday night.> ***again I dont think its "stopped working"...you are simply (my guess) hindering its AD effects...benzo's can be depressive the next day - this is actually quite commone...dr's are well aware of this and valium is notorious for this. Not as much xanax. Klon is also another one implicated in bad depressive issues the compound over time after prolonged use and may mask effects of your AD.
Yeah that really makes me wonder how many people could be possibly feeling much better if they wernet taking their "xannys" and their "k-pins" everyday with ad's.
I know what you mean about valium, whenever i took that for sleep on parnate id actually burst into tears the next day.>Dizzy with dilated pupils....has to do with the stimulant properties (the energy levels) the parnate may give you...again benzos will slow you down in this regard...chill you out..I..cut anxiety (related to NE or stimulation)...this is how they work really...calm the nerves. NE is another issues in anxiety apart from GABA. Parnate effects NE pretty good I believe. I dont take it though...nardil is my first maoi.
So to much NE and not enough GABA regulation = Do they think im an idiot? Does she think im stupid? what if they notice my hands shaking? ohh my palms are so sweaty...
Interesting i've always wondered whether the dilated pupils were somewhat due to SA DA or NE.I really liked parnate but, it was so unbalanced. It was almost like id get this big stimulant hit when i dosed, 4 hrs later its gone and im feeling depressed, then another high on the next dose and bang im down again. It just wasn't a consant ad effect. Oh and the insomnia...
I really hope Nardil works out, cause from what ive read so far, it sounds balanced!
Id take a constant ad effect over a short amphetamine type high anyday...as much as the dopamine craving part of me is protesting.
Thank you for the info man.
***Benzos will slow heartbeat a lil I believe...this is another way they address anxiety - chilling you out...reduce heart rate or bp I think is also lowered. These are chill out meds...heart rate, bp, sweats etc...are all issues with anxiety that benzos are basically geared towards relaxing. So if u have a med like a maoi that increases stimulation (may play on heart rate, energy, bp - to get you going) then taking a benzo is somewhat counterproductive if you need that stimulation from nardil/parnate to feel good. Again I suggest a sleep med alteration...combination benzo and something else.Yeah that stimulation im sure is Nardil saying "hey im here and im battering your receptors until they goddam respond" I really dont want something stopping or slowing that battering so i'll certainly alter my sleep meds to find something thats not so intent on stopping that battering.
***no my friend...this is common - but its that its "not working as well"----have no fear it wont kill nardil for you in the long run. ditch the benzo and you will return to the stimulation u once had - those feeling you liked from it. The benzo just dampens your mood - anti-AD effect like I said above.
Cheers that makes me feel better :)
> So....combo sleep meds - benzo/AP or something mabye...something else....trazodone, seroquel, a tca....something plus a benzo for those times of hardcore anxiety/insomnia....just dont overuse the benzo and you will feel nardil working "better" for u - more energy and less mood dampening. This is all familiar to me...but we are all different so just use this as an "investigational" point ok...you may react different but I think its safe to say this is the issue.
>
> mycoThanks for all ur help man. I'll take all this in while im pondering sleep meds and a benzo for occasional use.
Hopefully i'll knock this major depression/social anxiety out of the ball park!
Greatly appreciated :)
poster:billy pilgrim
thread:887994
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20090330/msgs/888585.html