Posted by yxibow on October 22, 2008, at 22:34:45
In reply to quite vitamin D deficient, strange results, posted by iforgotmypassword on October 19, 2008, at 0:42:15
> it looks like i am very vitamin d deficient. i am wondering if this could be what is causing my neuropsych and extrapyramidal and parkinsonian-like problems, and why my response to medication is incomplete, unpredictable, untolerable and seem to be risky in my case (since i have permanent extrapyrmidal symptoms.)
EPS symptoms aren't normally permanent that I know of -- Tardive ones are and should be examined by a neurologist to evaluate them.> currently my most effective medication is lorazepam, which i have to use to function and move properly. this has worried me as it is gaba-ergic, and gaba is one of the neurochemicals which seems to plummet with parkinson's. but it is both a inexplicable hesitance and an inexplicable tension with screwy sensations with akathisia and rage that is very unpredictable. i have had screwy mouth movements, and problems talking in an organized conclusive way (and especially trouble with inhibiting talking,) that have been diagnosed both as psychosis and i have been asked if i abuse psychostimulants at the E.R. and i have seen "psychostimulant abuse" on my file, which kindof wierds me out. i have in the past tried to self-medicate out of desperation with higher doses of dexedrine leftover from trials that went nowhere, but responded very badly and certainly in no way i would consider recreational. i think the only time i went to the E.R. over overreaction to psychostimulants was when my doctor tried to add concerta to my desipramine.
>
> in any case i will share the numbers my psychiatrist gave me over the phone, he said for 25 D i had a "10", and that the reference ranges for 25 D are:
>
> <25 is "deficiency"
> 26-75 is "insufficiency"
> 76-250 is normal
> >250 is "toxicity"
>
> but here is what is wierd, while my vitamin D stores (what 25 D is) seem to be quite low according to this, he said the 1,25 D (the active hormone converted from the stores (which are converted from the vitamin)) test was apparently normal, i didn't ask for the number, since i was trying to remember enough already.
>
> there seem to be a certain other physical problems that may cause paradoxical results like this, but i haven't read enough. from what i read, apparently: sarcoidosis and hyperparathyroid disease, but it seems hypoparathyroid as well. i found it interesting and worth remembering that when i was reading about one of the parathyroid diseases, they mentioned parkinson's disease occuring as a consequence of the illness.
>
> not sure what to make of all of this...
>
> then there is the debate over D2 and D3, that i cannot make sense out of. it seems that D2 effectively contributes to 25 D stores, so that then it should also contribute to reliable availability of these stores for conversion to 1,25 D (again the process seems to be in this order: D2/D3 -> 25 D -> 1,25 D) it seems that there are bot studies saying that D3 is better, and studies saying that D3 and D2 are the same. it still does not explain why i am not hearing the same miraculous getting better stories from other "chronic lyme" patients taking D2, that i am hearing from those taking D3. and possible immediate explaination may be is that certain popular sentiments that D3 is better (that seem to get stronger in the alternative realm) may indicate that too few people are buying and trying D2, and that's why i'm not hearing anything. but also, it is interesting, it appears that vitamin D3 may be its own hormone with its own effects? is this plausible. there seem to have been favourable studies on vitamin d supplementation for mood, but i don't remember if they used D3 or D2. i should look into that.
>
> i am also a vegetarian. so i do not want to take D3 unless there is solid reasoning it could be better, the larger sheep industry is absolutely vile.
I appreciate your tenacity to a vegetarian diet -- I'm a vegan, but at some point I knew that not 100% of everything could be so.
Also when I go out to eat, I know that something is going to have eggs or milk in it, its just the way it is -- yes, I ask about fish sauce and stuff like that but there is a limit to things at some point -- social cooperation and going out to eat with people. A personal view.
When I first took Prozac, I took it liquid because I didn't want the gelatin capsules. But I've abandoned that, because things aren't typically available that way and there's no way to completely avoid it.To me, health comes first. And I would say the same thing about D3 -- I hadn't realized it was part of the lanolin industry (mostly, there is a algae form apparently), but again, a lot of soaps that you're going to encounter in public washrooms have lanolin. I'm not going to endanger myself and not wash my hands.
In fact if you analyze every possible chemical in the shampoo and soap industry, you're going to find chemicals that you don't really know what source they're from.
I also don't wear leather, but lately I've had to wear whatever I can find in shoes, one because its too expensive now to import non-leather shoes, England being where they're mostly from, where Vegan activity started anyhow, and two, I have some form of arthritis after having many bouts of weight loss and gain and I can't afford the choice to both have non-leather and not destroy my feet.
I also take my vegetarianism as a personal choice... but anyhow that's getting about me, not about you.
I'm just saying if it comes down to needing supplements and your GP says so, I think whatever belief system you may have should let you have the health you need. Just a personal statement anyhow.
I take what is probably almost completely vegetarian multivitamins, except I guess D3 is probably the only one that isn't, who knows, I use vegetable sources of omegas, etc.
> i had to get these tests through my psychiatrist since a requisition from my naturopath (who initially had the idea to do the test) would not be covered. it was apparently cc'd to both my naturopath, and my GP. but this seems to be taking forever. and my GPs office is so busy, i hesitate to ask for appointments anymore. the staff can be very moody and they can be booked for quite long periods, i was hoping that they would call me. my psychiatrist called and told me about the results because they indicated that my 25 D result was clearly not normal, but he had no further knowledge of the meaning of the results.
>
> sorry this is another exceptionally long, and possibly quite incoherent post.No, its not incoherent, but no matter how annoying your GPs office can be and I know about how bureaucratic things can get -- your psychiatrist, while being an MD, is not the best place to get a blood panel, except for the occasional diabetes test, say, for monitoring medications.
I'm sure he's been through residency and probably remembers a panoply of conditions but what his specialty is currently is psychiatry and that is what he/she gets their CMEs in, etc.
A GP, a family physician is more used to reading results from tests and has probably gone over hundreds if not in to the thousands of them, and knows what the meanings are, rather than searching the net and a) scaring yourself about some condition and b) not getting the best treatment if there is something to be done.
A D.O. still has to go through medical training and is actually in at least this state as good as an M.D. for most common purposes. Its just the schools are cheaper for them.
If you have these results, and you have a signature relationship between your psychiatrist and your GP to release information between them (often a good choice but up to you), I think they should communicate.
-- best wishes
Jay
poster:yxibow
thread:858207
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20081016/msgs/858887.html