Posted by Ljoltof on February 20, 2006, at 22:36:50
In reply to Re: best med for GAD? » Greif, posted by corafree on February 20, 2006, at 4:22:13
Corafree - I have been following your posts on this thread and it hits me hard because I can relate to so much of what you are going through. Here I will inject my thoughts below your quotes.
*these are my ideas / opinions and I am not a healthcare professional of any sort*
>Unfortunately, narcotics work too well for anxiety. That, and >having some extra val so can take 1-1/2 or 2, deviating from >my regimen due to unbearable anxiety, is what is getting me >through this paradox.I agree that narcotics work very well for anxiety. From what I have gathered, a large amount of people with constant/chronic anxiety (aka GAD) also have chronic pain symptoms. Physical pain has been linked to depression and vice versa. I will not ever believe that GAD can exist in a person without depression. It took me a while to face the depression as it's own entity, but looking back and adding it all up leads me to insist that I would not have gotten to the levels of depression I have seen without the GAD causing so much difficulty. Now add in some physical injuries (either before or after GAD/dep. onset) and the chronic pain becomes a major obstacle to everyday life as you very well know.
> I've c-spine and t-spine extruded discs. No meds either than >aforementioned, not PT or epidurals, have helped. Surgery for >a person w/ chronic pain (someone who didn't just get flown in >from a car accident) takes the back seat. Trigger point >injections are helpful; doc's hold those back .. maybe 3x a yr.
Exactly, if an injury isn't a huge event of some sort, that injury is treated as minor - put on the back burner - not followed up on until you call the doctor the point where it looks like you're on a rabid drug hunt. I'm sort of outlining my pain situation here which is delivered via at least 3 head injuries. When these injuries are presented to my gen. physician as the major causes for my chronic back, neck and head pain (numbness in the legs etc etc) there is nothing on file to back these incidents up. That is where it's my fault..in my 2 worst injuries (14yrs old head over handlebars on a bmx bike flying down a hill, entire right side of my face was basically ripped apart, and at 18yrs old victim of a drunken 21yr old jock just out of bootcamp - the tough guy ran up from behind on a side walk punched me across the face knocking me out ..) 1st injury I picked my bike back up after regaining consciousness and somehow rode it back home. I did see my pediatrican a few days later and his first remark is something I'll never forget: "Wow. You are extremely luckily to not have suffered a brain injury." 2nd time I jumped up after being knocked out, for what I'm guessing was about 5secs., and ran towards the guy with blood flowing out of my mouth and nose as my brother was beating the sh1t out of him in the middle of the street - 2 cops grab me just before I get in range to put my boot straight down onto his already bashed in face. Cops ask me if I want the ambulance - everyone I'm with is saying lets get out of here and with my GAD in the picture I could not disagree. Filthy 'marine' got arrested while me and my brother walked away. Most important thing is that both of these injuries involve major force trauma to the head and neck simultaneously.
I have received 0 rx pain pills to this point (mid 20's now) but I have had far too many psychiatric drugs thrown my way to start counting as I write this. Is it just me or is something wrong with that picture?
> Pain & Anxiety .. re: Neurontin and Topomax. I've been on >both and had 'irritating side effects (more w/ Topomax I think)' >so prob' couldn't get to high enough dosage; noted no real >relief. Butttttt, was on Prozac or Eff-XR alongside, and so may >not have been in touch w/ myself.No experience with Neurontin or Topomax. Prozac stole my ability to feel anything at all for almost two years - when I quit it myself. Effexor XR just had me feeling irritated and I got the electricity effect....not a good time.
> I'd like to see read more discussion about Neur and Topo tho', >for anxiety (as well as pain), and the new one, 'supposed to be >better!' ... Lyrica.Lyrica looks to be just the latest cash cow to me. My suggestion for the anxiety and the pain is to add in another 10mg of Valium daily and switch from percocet to an equivalent dose of a slightly different narcotic pain killer?
> Is Ljoltof here, or anyone interested in to follow:
>
> Did you ever have have paradoxical effect (or is it affect?)>w/ .Valium? If yes, was it dc'd or increased?I'm here :) ..and I'll say flat out that I have had a paradoxical effect from Klonopin and every other benzo I've ever tried. I'd wager that effect is the appropriate form in the topic at hand because it is indeed a consequence/result of taking the med. It comes down to how long the effect lasts, the frequency, and the turbulance it causes you. I suspect the narcotic (especially percocet with that very short half life) is aiding in making this harder for you.
> Has anyone had a scrip of 10mg 3x a day increased because >anxiety was heightening? Did the increase help, on its own, >standing alone from any other benzo, for at least couple yrs?I could be taking my 10mg tabs 3x, but I have been only taking 2 a day - as I've been fairly comfortable with my anxiety.
> *** I think someone here is on val and klon? I'm wondering if >the klon protects one from a paradoxical reaction to val; like a >safety valve to catch anxiety overflow?! ***I understand what you're getting at and yes I am on both but it is only as a vehicle to say 'goodbye' to klonopin. Having 2 benzo's going simultaneously is not viewed as a permanent option for me.
> I definitely vote benzos best medicinal relief
> for anxiety. For me .. Ativan not strong enough .. Xanax >quickly here and gone .. Klonopin is a snake in the grass, but >became obvious was very effective .. Valium saved my life.In the short term, or for 'as needed' I'd be voting for benzo's right with you. However, I have found normal doses of narcotic pain pills to be the ultimate GAD/Social Anx. destroyer. Some of the finest days of my life were provided by vicodin, which were rx'd due to an infection in my throat.
> Now I'm in 'paradox' and trying to get an idea of a >hypothetical med plan that I can present to a P in a way that >feels as if I just 'reminded them of an idea they'd not yet >brought to the table'. I need to get another P soon, like >Tuesday.
I'm in a similar situation as my chronic pain gets harder to manage almost every day...I mean should someone who has been taking benzo's and amphetamines for *years* with no substance abuse history and no criminal record really be denied at least a small script of pain pills?
> Out of space and time .. sooo exhausted. Hope some of >above helps one, some, or I, isn't written carelessly. Dropping >off ... bw, cfWell there's my attempt at a decent but not too long of post..haha. Sorry if it's hard to read, I usually do proof-read but I'm spent right now!
All of this is so complicated, but just hold on and reach out...myself and plenty of others are right there with you.
Peace and best wishes for all.
-Ljoltof
poster:Ljoltof
thread:610272
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20060219/msgs/611600.html