Posted by chemist on January 1, 2005, at 4:14:46
In reply to Re: hello to all... » chemist, posted by dancingstar on December 31, 2004, at 17:01:29
> Hi Chemist,
>
> It's not that i completely disagree with you. In fact, I don't for the most part. I specifically asked the family practice doctor that gave me Effexor three years ago what the side effects were, and he told me that there were some sexual side effects but that they probably wouldn't apply to me. I suppose that he was right, I don't believe they did. I wasn't told of any other side effects and never thought to look for any. The warning on my drug label told me something about not driving if I was drowsy, but since I was prescribed E for fatigue, this made no sense to me...and I ignored it.
>
> Though I stopped drinking all alcohol because I noticed that my tolerance for it had decreased, I never associated that with Effexor, nor my fatigue, low blood pressure, which was taken as a sign of my excellent health in spite of my extreme pain that could not be diagnosed. After a year, I had switched doctors, and monthly to semi-monthly I saw the doctor, even had my blood drawn to no avail. No one broached the concept of Effexor being the cause of all of my problems, though about three months before I stopped taking it on my own, my internist did ask, "How is that Effexor working for you?" in a routine kind of way. I believe that the reason for this is because the side effects data is under-reported by Wyeth and why I have encouraged anyone with side effects to report their problems to the FDA, not directly to Wyeth.
>
> I do remember being weepy when I first saw my new internist two years ago and again another time and asked for an increase from 75mg to 150mg. It didn't help at all and, in fact, I became kind of depressed. Thought it was perimenopause. Besides, I couldn't lose weight. Didn't eat. I was hungry. Tired. In pain. I was getting old, couldn't think.
>
> Finally decided to stop taking E as it couldn't hurt, I tried everything else to at least lose weight. Now, Chemist, let me digress here for a moment. I always do something that brings about a miracle in the month of September, every September. This September was no exception. Three days after I stopped taking it, I became, as you can imagine deathly ill. It was only then that I began to learn about E, only then that I began to do the research. Besides some residual pain in the nerves in my neck and back and colitis-like stomach stuff that seems to be getting better, I feel fantastic for the first time in years! Yep, it's a real, live miracle, the fact that I've figured this out with only the help of God 'cause I couldn't find anyone on earth that could solve my health problems, and now they are miniscule by comparison. All I've lost is three years of my life.
>
> In the meantime, thousands of new prescriptions are being written for that drug, and new people are taking it every day without knowing anything whatsoever about it. I've spoken with some of them quite by accident in my daily journeys, and I know that they are not told anything at all about the problems with the drug. Wyeth's reps don't tell the doctors. The doctors don't tell the patients. I do feel, though, that the drug companies are fighting our ability to sue them in the same way the tobacco companies are even though we received no warnings and they have withheld data that we should have had prior to our ever having taken the drug. I would also like to know if our doctors have received incentives or gifts or money or other stuff in exchange for prescribing Effexor.
>
> Maybe this is a good drug under some circumstances, but in my humble opinion it is being vastly oversold to the wrong people for the wrong reasons...and that is a crime to humanity in its own right.
>
> Best wishes for a Happy New Year!
> Bebehello there bebe, chemist here..i cannot help but note that you were not taking this medication under the supervision of a mental healthcare practitioner. your family doctor and internist are hardly qualified to monitor your progress on a psychoactive substance and provide it to you for more than 30 days.
a you are aware, the ADR forms (3500) filed with the FDA emanate from all parties involved with a medication, from the manufacturer to the distributor to the patient. further, the FDA does evaluate ADR when making revisions/prohibitions to drug use, and serious conditions - death, coma, hospitalization, debilitation - that are not listed in precribing information and results from any pre- and postmarketing trials are considered first and foremost.
the adverse effects that are known and to be published with prescribing information, not to mention given to you by your pharmacist and to be firmly planted in your psychiatrist's head (although there is no indication you were taking this medication under the supervision of one, please do clarify if i am mistaken), are not given much heft: caveat emptor.
on march 30, 2000, wyeth-ayerst added new safety information to the prescribing information for both efffexor and effexor xr. the old information and the new are provided, and were altered to include more comprehansive warnings concerning all of the side effects continually complained about on this thread. don't take my word for it: see www.fda.gov and medwatch.
before march 30, 2000, wyeth-ayerst stated that discontinuation of effexor (taken for 6 weeks or longer) be tapered over ``at least a 2-week period." after this magical date, the discontinuation symptoms, relationship with dose and duration of use, and wording states that patients tapering the medication be monitored; the time of the taper need be adjusted according to length of use and dosage; and ``discontinuation effects are well known to occur with antidepressants.'' symptoms the are reported to emerge upon discontinuation include confusion, coordination impaired, dysphoria, insomnia, sensory disturbances "(including shock-like electrical sensations)," and others.
in may of 2004, the suicide-risk labeling was added and the discontinuation warnings augmented to note that ``while these events are generally self-limiting, there have been reports of serious discontinuation symptoms.'' it is also recommended that the tapering dose be reupped if the side effects of withdrawl are too uncomfortable. and, of course, the monitoring of the patient is reinforced.
your case is actually proof that the very inappropriate and ill-advised abrupt discontinuation of the medication does not result in the emergence of recurring and debilitating symptoms: you report feeling ``fantastic'' less than 4 months after you stopped a 150 mg/day, 2-year regimen of the medication. this makes you an excellent candidate as a witness for the defense, should wyeth be brought to the table.
the drug reps for pharmaceutical companies are not trained in the sciences or medicine: the next time you run into a nicely-groomed young man or woman unloading samples of their wares from their rental car parked outside your doctor's office, chat them up. you will find that the drug rep demographic includes people formally educated in every subject except the ones they should be for this job.
the free ``educational seminars'' in hawaii and san diego came to a halt over 5 years ago, at a minimum. enticements are limited to pens, notepads, and coffee mugs these days. one should not disregard the willingness of the patient to continue taking the medication as indicating that the drug reps are hardly necessary.
it is common knowledge that it is very difficult to quit smoking cigarettes and, for many people, to quit drinking alcohol. the lawsuits which targeted the tobacco industry had to do with health risks that were known and undisclosed at least 50 years ago, and i suppose hepatic failure from excessive alcohol use will be the basis of the lawsuits targeting the manufacturers of alcohol.
venlafaxine was patented in 1985 (u.s.), and was still in clinical trials in 1990: the ADR filing frequency is (as you are aware) quarterly after FDA approved the NDA, then yearly for three years hence. wyeth - like any other company - regards many data as proprietary and ought not release it: this includes drugs under development and results from clinical trials after the IND is filed.
if only to avoid people filing lawsuits because of their own non-compliance, negligence, ignorance, or that of their prescribing doctor, why would any drug company keep any information that could be used against them a secret?
the article in front of me, taken from NEJM in 2001, warns of the new coxib drugs - those that were just pulled - as potentially being a threat in re: thombosis and renal trouble, not to mention questionable efficacy. the enzyme targeted by the cox-2 inhibitors was isolated less than 15 years ago: that the drugs were pipelined via FDA fast-track and were used off-label and in large doses for long times in a population that, in general, is known to be taking other meds (i.e., those for heart, kidney, stomach, or arthritis problems), it is hardly surprising that trouble has ensued.
i wish you a happy new year, and only hope that renewed interest on the part of all patients - myself included - in self-education is on the list of resolutions. all the best, chemist
poster:chemist
thread:434074
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20041228/msgs/436256.html