Posted by Dave001 on September 5, 2004, at 15:04:27
In reply to Re: Ecstasy safely converted and prescribed? » Dave001, posted by Larry Hoover on September 5, 2004, at 7:06:40
> > > A few key points. Moderate dose (as defined with respect to RDA, which is by definition insufficent to avoid all symptoms of deficiency), the subjects did not change their poor diets (which may have wholly consumed the antioxidants ingested, on a day-to-day basis), the trial was only for 90 days, and there were limited assays of antioxidant effect (the body definitely prioritizes nutrient allocation).
> > >
> > > Concluding anything from such a study is not something I'm inclined to do.
> > >
> >
> > No, but you're missing the key sentence in the abstract, which was as follows: "In healthy young men, the endogenous antioxidant defense system and a modest intake of dietary antioxidants are adequate to minimize levels of in vivo oxidant damage..." Ya might want to subscribe to the sci.life-extension news group, as there is frequently some interesting scientific discussion of these issues. There are some valuable contributers such as Aubrey De Grey, Steve Harris, Peter Proctor, and others.
> >
> > Dave
>
> I may do so, thanks. But I didn't miss anything. I don't believe that those biomarkers are necessarily sufficient to assess oxidative stress parameters, nor do all effects of the nutrients arise from sacrificial events. I believe the protocol was flawed.
>It may likely be that we're 'measuring' the effects of antioxidants in different ways, because I do believe antioxidants are beneficial in many circumstances. The reason I posted the abstract I did was because I felt it underscored the point I was making about the influence of age on oxidative stress. It is well established in animal studies that certain antioxidants such as the spin-trap PBN can mitigate the acute toxicity of MDMA, for instance.
I don't know why, but I entered this antioxidant discussion partly with the mentality of one debating their effectiveness against the aging process. Probably because that's what I'm used to. On that note, here is an example of a much better discussion on that topic:
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=g:thl4131328336d&dq=&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=a6h84i%24i63%241%40slb4.atl.mindspring.net&rnum=1Dave
poster:Dave001
thread:383476
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20040904/msgs/386749.html