Posted by jay on February 15, 2002, at 23:41:33
In reply to Trashing Benzos, posted by Mr. Scott on February 15, 2002, at 19:38:39
Scott, thanks, and I thought I would add in some of my other thoughts also, and in particular to your situation. I don't really like giving a lot of med advice, but I can honestly say, and will put money on this, that benzos, for me in particular, have been *the only* lifesaver especially in difficult times.Here in Canada, there is anti-benzo sentiment, but I don't think it is as harsh as some places in the U.S. (In particular, with the DEA and their Big Brother scare tactics.) I also think it is sad that folks don't get a chance to try a maintenance dose of not one, but a couple benzo's. I have a friend in Europe who is on a good dose of Clonazepam, and takes a small dose of Xanax with that for "breakthrough" anxiety. Interesting but he is also on a small dose of a tricyclic, which are far more popular in Europe than here in North America. I don't honestly think the problem with tricyclics has been their side-effects, I think it is their 'cost-effects'. I have only ever found the closest to complete remission of my depression on the tricyclic nortriptyline with a benzo, and given all the designer drugs I have been on, nothing comes close to touching my depression and anxiety like those two do.
All of these stories we see on here, and especially the horrid pain of side-effects and concern about meds in everything from Lithium to antipsychotics, and how doctors are pushing these as "maintenance" treatment, is just downright pathetic. If a person's anxiety and depression can be well treated with a low eminence dose of both a benzo and a tricyclic, what the heck are they doing on a combo of expensive meds like Remeron or Effexor often with very, very heavy medication like an antipsychotic? Antipsychotics are not indicated for generalized anxiety, and I think cause more problems and put people in danger when they don't have to be. The same goes for the anti-convulsants, as some folks seem to think they act the same way benzo's do, which is not true. Anti-convulsants are powerful medications that *still* haven't made the grade the way benzos do. They tried it with Buspar, and even my old pdoc claimed it was "garbage".
If you can/and/or/do have a benzo to take, don't be afraid to fall back on it, and if it is the only thing that helps you, assertively tell your pdoc. I went through a couple of years of hell thinking I could combine anti-convulsants, with powerful new a.d's and antipsychotics. All's that ended up happening was that I felt very drugged, tired, anxious, and of course just as 'depressed'. As of a few days ago, I am off my Effexor, chucked the antipsychotics down the toilet, and my pdoc got me back on eminence benzo doses. I have 9 or so years experience with the benzos, and they still work just as amazing and great AND quick, and I can start/stop as needed. Last time I was on benzos alone, I found an amazing girlfriend and got into a relationship, got working again, felt much lighter. Then my pdoc put me on Effexor without benzos, and that is when my major problems began. Anyhow...just my story/ IMHO. I hope this can help somehow.
This is a great thread...I hope we can keep it up. Take good care...
Jay
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> Certain elements about benzos scare me because I like to be in control, but someone who sees the whole picture would surely see that Effexor and Paxil are just as bad if not worse in all respects. You can't go on a trip and forget to take your Effexor just like you can't forget to take your Klonopin. Someone please correct me, but what is the difference? Just because Monkeys and Rats don't self administor Effexor when locked in a cage? Maybe it's because the Rats and Monkeys are smarter than we are. Because the label calls them "discontinuation symptoms" instead of "withdrawal Symptoms".
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> However, The reason newer drugs aren't being trashed (except by us, the people who take them) is because they are "on Label" while benzos are "off Label". Off label=generic=no marketing dollars. On label=branded=14 years to get richer=FAT marketing budget to drive sales. I'm still a capitalist all they way, but patients need to know what is going on behind the scenes, and I would hope doctors would realize that reps have no real interest in the docs other than to persuade them to SELL THEIR DRUGS.
> Drug Companies with their FAT marketing budgets and tentacles of dissemination try to bad mouth generic competitors even if WE don't hear about it, you can bet Wyeth and GSK reps trash benzos every chance they get so they will prescribe their drugs instead. Handing out studies funded through "Unrestricted Educational Grants" that highlight the merits of shitty SSRI's and knocking benzo's down. Unrestricted Educational Grants are a myth in case you want to know. Even the most reputable journals "will work with their clients" especially now when the advertising dollars are down.
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> I know factually that BMS reps leveraged MASSIVE campaigns against benzos to doc's when Buspar turned out to be a disapointment in clinical practice.
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> So stick that in yer pipe and smoke it!
>
> Scott
poster:jay
thread:94336
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20020215/msgs/94358.html