Posted by kiddo on February 11, 2002, at 22:41:55
In reply to Re: Real Depression, posted by OldSchool on February 11, 2002, at 10:11:49
Yes, I have been in a mental hospital and on the ‘locked’ ward…I’m not now nor have I ever said dysthymia, cyclothymia, major depression, manic depression or any other form of depression was more or less severe than another. What I’m saying is that you seem to be downplaying, minimizing, and/or trivializing others’ experiences if they aren’t suffering from major depression.
Major depression, as all of the mood disorders ARE mental illnesses, with physical symptoms…from my understanding, they are classified as a psychiatric disorder. Severe mental illness may cause a change in the brain, but not all of them originate that way…for example, severe childhood trauma (physical, sexual, emotional, etc..) can cause those changes…hence ‘mental illness’ not physical.
Sorry, but I learned long ago about trusting, and don’t trust anyone that says “Trust me”…no offense, just how I am. I think all of us ‘mentally ill’ people would be taken more seriously if our society was educated on the truth, there are too many stereotypes/stigmas attached because people are uneducated.
Thank you for admitting they are ALL real depression, that’s what I’ve been trying to say all along…it is you not me that used ‘real’ depression vs. ‘dysthmia’, etc…(not quoting that mind you)
Again-side effects seem rather trivial too you…
I don’t know what you are talking about when you say “LOL-Again it’s obvious you never had real depression before”. Although I’m not sure, I can’t recall you saying it before, and if you had, I chose to ‘not see’ it there…I take offense at your claiming to know what I have or haven’t been Dx’d with, what I have or haven’t been through in my life, and if I’m suffering more or less than you; especially if you are claiming it’s this ‘obvious’ from reading the very few posts I’ve made to PB….
The truth of the matter is you don’t know me at all, so please don’t pretend that you do. I may have been through a lot more than you or anyone else on this board, and then again maybe not, but I don’t claim that I have, don’t think my suffering is any greater than anyone else’s here, because I honestly don’t know. Something that I’ve dealt with may not have bothered someone else, or may have sent them to the psych ward…I don’t downplay or trivialize another’s experience for that very reason…you really don’t know unless you’ve walked a mile in their mocassins. True?
For the record, I have been ‘nailed by the big one’. Again, you are basing your knowledge on the fact that I’m not agreeing with you, so I must not have had the ‘real’ thing, or at least that’s how it is in my opinion. I’m glad you find it funny, because I never have and wouldn’t, especially if I had been there and supposedly knew that someone else hadn’t.
You didn’t give me a definition of ‘real mental illness’, you gave me mental disorders. I know those, but thanks for answering.
My meds have helped me, and I’m still here; no, I’m not cured either, but improving, and care about the people I’ve met and become ‘friends’ with. I was only asking about your meds, and how you were doing. I feel like I’m being treated as if I crawled from under a rock, I haven’t.
I’m sorry, but I don’t remember you ever saying that meds weren’t successful for you-I apologize if you have.
Kiddo
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> > I disagree. Real depression IS the sadness/hopelessness/suicidal thoughts “stuff” you are talking about. People respond to depression in different ways…because you have insomnia doesn’t mean that if someone sleeps 22 out of 24 hours doesn’t mean they aren’t clinically depressed. Severe depression can also make you GAIN thirty pound without trying and not increasing your appetite. Real depression affects different people in different ways…as for the dry ejaculation, I can’t comment, as I’m a woman. However, I don’t understand if REAL depression is not being able to get it up, how could you even have a dry ejaculation…but again, I’m “only” a woman…depression regardless of how ‘severe’ is still REAL DEPRESSION!!!!! Suicidal thoughts with or without other symptoms of clinical depression are a very serious matter, and someone that’s suffering from fake depression doesn’t have suicidal thoughts.
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> Look, I am just trying to make you aware that there are varying degrees of severity of mental illness. Have you ever been to a mental hospital and been to the "lockup" ward? Where the psychotic people are? Where the doctors just keep you drugged up for days. Are you going to honestly tell me that "dythymia" is as severe or as serious as that?
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> There are varying degrees of severity when it comes to mood disorders. For example, classic manic depression (bipolar disorder) is WAY more serious than dysthymia. And the melancholia subtype of major depression (severe sleeping, eating, sex drive and cognition probs) is way more severe than dysthymia.
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> A person with dysthymia can usually still generally function in the world, still work some type of job, etc. It is irritating to read about people who stop modern class antidepressants for trivial reasons (sexual dysfunction, weight gain, dry mouth) when your depressed as dirt, cant sleep good and losing weight like crazy and cant work cause you cant think clearly.
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> > > Real depression is a physical disease. Its not mental illness. All "mental illnesses" should be formally reclassified as Neurological diseases. I get irritated as hell when I read sleep problems in depression being described as "somatic" complaints. Fuck psychiatry. Its way more than a "somatic complaint." If you cant sleep good, your "mental health" as well as your physical health is going to deteriorate.
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> > Depression is depression and I’m not going to argue the matter of physical vs. mental illness. Why should it be formally reclassified as a Neurological disease?
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> Because all severe forms of mental illness are brain based illnesses. Severe mental illness causes changes in the brain. Things would be much better for all of us if society just started thinking of these problems as neuro diseases and not as "emotional" problems. Trust me on this, all of us "mentally ill" people would be taken much more seriously if our society perceived our problems as physically based, neuro diseases of the brain.
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> All behavior, both normal and abnormal, is mediated thru neuronal function ie, the brain.
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> > What if you sleep ‘too good’? Is your physical health going to deteriorate as well? Your symptoms are not the only symptoms of depression. There isn’t only “one” way to be depressed….Different people process things differently, the same disorder/disease can have different effects on different people. If that weren’t the case then we’d only need one med for each disorder, right?
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> > > Im sorry to put things so graphically for you, but Im just trying to point out some major differences between REAL depression and mild depression. There ARE differences.
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> > Thanks for the apology, you are graphic…I realize you are trying to point out the differences between the different FORMS of depression, and I agree there are differences…BUT they are all REAL DEPRESSION!
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> Sure its all real depression, but there are degrees of severity. Some cause disability more than others. Dysthymia or situational depression rarely causes longterm disability.
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> > > A person with the severe kind of depression is just grateful for any relief they get thru meds. They are grateful for just a good night of sleep...hell, just being able to sleep at all for some is a feeling of wonderment and joy. Drug side effects seem rather trivial compared to this severe kind of depression.
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> > I disagree again…ppl become REALLY depressed (vs. unreal) by weight gain, lack of sexual desire/performance, and other side effects of medication.
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> LOL...again its obvious you never had real depression before.
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> >True, being able to sleep is a relief, as well as WAKING UP can be. To you drug effects seem trivial, however, that isn’t the situation with everyone.
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> Sure its not the situation with everyone. For people who have milder forms of depression, these folks havent yet experienced the severe breakdown in basic physiological bodily functions that severe depression causes. What psychiatry classifies as "somatic" complaints. For someone who hasnt yet experienced the real thing, SSRI side effects are bothersome.
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> All I have to say about that is wait til you get nailed by the big one. Real melancholic SEVERE major depression. Or psychotic depression. Or manic depression. LOL hehehe Trust me, you wont care about "SSRI side effects" anymore. You will thank God just for the fact you have these drugs so you can sleep and not end up going crazy.
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> > > Im sorry to put it this way, but its just the way it really is. Too many dysthymic depressives and people with "life stress" are taking SSRIs in my opinion and obviously they get turned off by these side effects. But guess what? Many of them dont really have real depression to begin with. A lot of these kind of people just need to do the talk therapy thing and stop partying so much, cut out the booze and increase the aerobic exercise.
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> > I’m sorry you put it that way too. It’s really sad because you know; people with “life stress” kill themselves everyday. Why do you think these people party so much, and drink too much alcohol? Why do you think they aren’t really depressed in the first place?
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> A person with true depression...clinical depression wouldnt even be partying to begin with. Plenty of people with dysthymia or mild depression self medicate with booze and recreational drugs however.
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> I found after I became clinically depressed my response to booze totally changed. I found out that I didnt get a beer buzz anymore and booze didnt make me feel loose and happy anymore. Booze just made me sadder, more depressed, cry more and made my insomnia MUCH worse.
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> Many cases of "mild depression" and dysthymia are caused by or exacerbated by alcohol. And too often the person doesnt even realize its the booze causing their dysthymia. Cut out booze totally and see how your mood lifts if you have dysthymia.
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> > > Thats why I wish psychiatry was just formally merged into Neurology. Let the people who have real mental illness go to Neurologists. And let the people who just have mild depression or "Woody Allen depression" go to some talk therapy asshole. I dont have the patience for all this psychology/psychobabble crap after what Ive been thru. It gets on my nerves and its an insult to me after what Ive been thru. I have a REAL PHYSICAL disease and I am not going to stop taking my meds cause of "sexual dysfunction" or "dry mouth."
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> > Your attitude regarding Psychiatry really concerns me. I’m amazed at your hatred toward the mental health field. What exactly do you consider ‘real mental illness’?
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> Here is my personal definition of "real mental illness."
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> 1) schizophrenia and all psychotic disorders
> 2) classic manic depression AKA bipolar type 1
> 3) major depression, especially the melancholia or psychotic depression subtypes
> 4) all of the anxiety disorders
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> >I don’t know what a psychiatrist did to you to warrant such venom toward all psychiatrists, but it sure seems that way. I don’t have much patience either, and I’ve been through more than my share of bad things in life.
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> > Have your meds cured you? Are you now functioning, sleeping, eating normally, and being a normal person in society?
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> Hell no. Im hanging out on psychobabble arent I? What do you think people who hang out here are like? Many of them are treatment resistant.
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> >I’m not trying to be facetious, sarcastic and/or whatnot, I’m honestly curious as to how your meds have helped.
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> As Ive already told you several times, meds dont work for me very good. Somewhat, enough to keep me afloat and alive but thats all. Im hardly in remission which is what Id like. Like I said, Id gladly trade some "SSRI side effects" for a drug that sent me into remission and kept me there. Antidepressant side effects are rather trivial to me.
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> Old School
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> > Kiddo
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> > > Old School
poster:kiddo
thread:91928
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20020208/msgs/93835.html