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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 43 to 67 of 169. Go back in thread:
Posted by Sigismund on August 1, 2010, at 21:43:28
In reply to Back on Toipc: Why Is Babble Not Babbling?, posted by ron1953 on August 1, 2010, at 20:33:38
> "Modernization" appears to be a recurring suggestion, and a good one.
I don't know about modernisation.
It suggests there might be progress.
I suggest a return to traditional values of hypocrisy and leaving well alone.How about some wu wei?
Posted by Sigismund on August 1, 2010, at 21:47:45
In reply to Re: being blocked again, posted by BayLeaf on August 1, 2010, at 21:22:35
> Bob appears to rachet up the blocks
There have been scores of them whom this has happened to.
But the formula is scientific and value free.
Thank God for technology and social science, and the US penal system.
It's been a great success.
Posted by Sigismund on August 1, 2010, at 21:55:49
In reply to Re: being blocked again, posted by Sigismund on August 1, 2010, at 21:47:45
I've got to stop this.
It reminds me of when my father came back with a number of battery cages for the chooks. No more messy unhygeinic walking around the yard. Our chooks would be clean and their eggs would roll down and collect in a neat line.
And then you could feed the chook sh*t to some other animal.
It's like feeding ground up cows to cows.......sensible, rational, scientific, progressive.
I think Bob should be congratulated for keeping traditional values alive.
Posted by ron1953 on August 1, 2010, at 22:52:48
In reply to Re: being blocked again, posted by Sigismund on August 1, 2010, at 21:55:49
As much as I'm tempted, I'm trying to avoid sarcasm, not because it's uncivil, but because it simply doesn't convey well in an online environment.
Posted by Dr. Bob on August 2, 2010, at 0:57:01
In reply to Re: The Question Remains: Why Is Babble Not Babbling?, posted by ron1953 on July 31, 2010, at 10:51:01
> the kiddie pool
Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel put down.
But please don't take this personally, either, this doesn't mean I don't like you or think you're a bad person, and I'm sorry if this hurts you.
I do hope that you choose to remain a member of this community and that members of this community help you, if needed, to avoid future blocks.
More information about posting policies and tips on alternative ways to express yourself, including a link to a nice post by Dinah on I-statements, are in the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#enforceFollow-ups regarding these issues should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration. They, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
Thanks,
Bob
PS: According to the formula:
duration of previous block: 1 weeks
period of time since previous block: 0 weeks
severity: 2 (default) + 1 (uncivil toward particular group) = 3
block length = 2.98 rounded = 3 weeks
Posted by Dr. Bob on August 2, 2010, at 0:57:35
In reply to Re: Why Is Babble Not Babbling? » Dr. Bob, posted by PartlyCloudy on August 1, 2010, at 7:37:38
> You don't tell Ron what you find problematic about what he said. This would be direct. Instead you address the rest of the community. That is indirect.
>
> It seems that you are saying that if posters care about Ron and want to help him avoid a blocking then they need to attempt to justify why it is that you think Ron owes you a rephrase or an apology and do what they can to coax him into meeting your demands.
>
> I think that you need to take responsibility for your own actions Dr Bob. You decide whether you will block a poster and you decide how long you will block them for. You decide what they need to do to avoid a blocking (e.g., you decide that apology or grovelling is an acceptable out whereas explaining oneself is not and so on).
>
> alexandra_kYes, if posters didn't want Ron to be blocked, they could've acted. Whether or not they thought the block would've been justified.
Other posters didn't try to help him avoid a block, and I blocked him. I take responsibility for blocking him, and I see other posters as responsible for not trying to help him avoid the block.
Maybe Babble isn't babbling because people see posters not trying to help each other avoid blocks.
> I don't feel I can be very positive about the site
>
> pcAnd, as Dinah suggested, maybe that's another reason.
Bob
Posted by fayeroe on August 2, 2010, at 1:09:38
In reply to Re: blocked for 3 weeks » ron1953, posted by Dr. Bob on August 2, 2010, at 0:57:01
Posted by Dinah on August 2, 2010, at 1:12:38
In reply to Re: Why Is Babble Not Babbling?, posted by Dr. Bob on August 2, 2010, at 0:57:35
> Maybe Babble isn't babbling because people see posters not trying to help each other avoid blocks.
Honestly, Dr. Bob, I think the public requests are more likely to turn people off than the lack of posters urging another poster to repent. I understand your intent, I think. To have posters recognize that they are not powerless in the presence of Bob. But I wish you would listen to the feedback about the wording. I'm all for personal responsibility, and I'm not exactly an anarchist, but even I recognize that there are ways and ways to say something, and the way you're using isn't likely to get the result you want.
I understand what you're saying. I'm just asking you to understand what people are *hearing*.
Posted by fayeroe on August 2, 2010, at 1:30:47
In reply to Re: Why Is Babble Not Babbling?, posted by Dr. Bob on August 2, 2010, at 0:57:35
posters who agreed to help other posters avoid blocks.
As much as I enjoy Ron's posts, he doesn't need my help to avoid a block.I'm sorry, bob, but I didn't sign on or agree to help anyone else avoid a block. I explained this quite clearly to you last week.
I feel absolutely zero responsibility for anything that administration does.
I don't allow anyone else to put their responsibilities upon my shoulders.
And I feel that the statement is manipulative, stomach roiling, disgusting, childish, childish, childish and I feel offended every time I read it.
I want to leave the door open in case I've not made myself clear. If there are questions, please ask them.
"and I see other posters as responsible for not trying to help him avoid the block."
Bob
Posted by fayeroe on August 2, 2010, at 1:33:05
In reply to Re: Why Is Babble Not Babbling? » Dr. Bob, posted by Dinah on August 2, 2010, at 1:12:38
> > Maybe Babble isn't babbling because people see posters not trying to help each other avoid blocks.
>
> Honestly, Dr. Bob, I think the public requests are more likely to turn people off than the lack of posters urging another poster to repent. I understand your intent, I think. To have posters recognize that they are not powerless in the presence of Bob. But I wish you would listen to the feedback about the wording. I'm all for personal responsibility, and I'm not exactly an anarchist, but even I recognize that there are ways and ways to say something, and the way you're using isn't likely to get the result you want.Dinah, I feel that bob may be getting the result he wants.
>
> I understand what you're saying. I'm just asking you to understand what people are *hearing*.Thank you for your post.
P
Posted by fayeroe on August 2, 2010, at 1:35:06
In reply to Re: Why Is Babble Not Babbling?, posted by Dr. Bob on August 2, 2010, at 0:57:35
Posted by sigismund on August 2, 2010, at 2:14:04
In reply to Re: being blocked again, posted by Sigismund on August 1, 2010, at 21:55:49
I have to hand it to Ron. He tried to keep a civil conversation alive.
Sarcasm is not permitted here. Some of what I posted was ironical....
>> Bob appears to rachet up the blocks
>There have been scores for whom this has happened.
>But the formula is scientific and value free.
>Thank God for technology and social science, and the US penal system.
>It's been a great success.
(But it has, the stock on hand, the profit, more than anything the political influence, even here.....John Howard himself used 'stock' in conversation.)
Whereas this was not.....>It's like feeding ground-up cows to cows. Sensible, rational, scientific, progressive .
(apologies to John Ralston Saul and John Gray)
Posted by sigismund on August 2, 2010, at 2:17:02
In reply to ......., posted by ron1953 on August 1, 2010, at 22:52:48
>As much as I'm tempted, I'm trying to avoid sarcasm, not because it's uncivil, but because it simply doesn't convey well in an online environment.
Of course most of what I said has been much more offensive than what you said (kiddie pool?) but that's not the point.
What is the point?
Posted by violette on August 2, 2010, at 4:03:06
In reply to Re: blocked for 3 weeks » ron1953, posted by Dr. Bob on August 2, 2010, at 0:57:01
There are many forums which don't use operant conditioning/behavioral conditioning (Skinner; Pavlov)..It takes a while to get used to a new community, but once you start to get to know people within that community, it grows on you...And you could always invite your babble friends who you'd miss.
Some are more moderated than others...I haven't used all of these, but the ones I have used have reasonable moderation and various features such as safety and privacy. Also, several I know of are moderated by mental health professionals who join or add to, the mental health discussions of its members:
There's a list of 60 on just this one page:
http://psychcentral.com/resources/Mental_Health/Support_Groups/more2.html
Here are some others:
http://forums.psychcentral.com/
http://www.mindandmuscle.net/forum/
http://community.mentalhelp.net/
http://www.psychforums.com/forum.html
http://www.psychological.com/forums/forum.php
http://www.mentalhealth-world.org.uk/forums/
http://www.imminst.org/forum/index.php?s=c6f70f74a97963a4b517a8f3693daf6f&act=idx
http://www.depressionforums.org/
http://www.revolutionhealth.com/forums/mental-behavioral-health
http://www.ivillage.com/emotional-fitness/4-w-117806
http://www.ptsdforum.org/content/1-home
http://www.way2hope.org/family-forums/index.php?showforum=12
http://www.thepsychologyforum.com/
http://www.dailystrength.org/c/Depression/support-group
http://www.carolina-disability.com/discus/messages/743/743.html
http://www.medhelp.org/forums/Abuse-Support/show/147
http://www.depressiontribe.com/
http://www.findthelight.net/support_group_def.htm
http://www.mentalhealthforum.net/
http://selfhelpmagazine.com/forum/index.php#1
http://www.adders.org/cgi-bin/2bb/2bb.cgi
http://www.google.com/Top/Health/Support_Groups/Mental_Health/
Posted by SLS on August 2, 2010, at 5:01:16
In reply to Re: blocked for 3 weeks..who felt put down? (nm) » Dr. Bob, posted by fayeroe on August 2, 2010, at 1:09:38
I did.
- Scott
Posted by 10derHeart on August 2, 2010, at 5:55:13
In reply to Re: blocked for 3 weeks..who felt put down? » fayeroe, posted by SLS on August 2, 2010, at 5:01:16
Posted by alexandra_k on August 2, 2010, at 7:43:33
In reply to Re: Why Is Babble Not Babbling?, posted by Dr. Bob on August 2, 2010, at 0:57:35
> Yes, if posters didn't want Ron to be blocked, they could've acted.
Some did. Some acted by attempting to tell you to stoppit. I realize that we didn't act in the way that YOU wanted, but act, we did.
> Whether or not they thought the block would've been justified.
The above course of action (trying to get you to stoppit) seems most fitting for someone who doesn't believe that your action of blocking him is justified - don't you think?
> Other posters didn't try to help him avoid a block
Please don't jump to conclusions. Can't you see how these conversations with you are posters attempting to help posters not be blocked? Can't you take some responsibility for the efficacy (or inefficacy) of that strategy?
> and I blocked him. I take responsibility for blocking him
Indeed. Then you jump to conclusions about our behavior here:
> and I see other posters as responsible for not trying to help him avoid the block.
> Maybe Babble isn't babbling because people see posters not trying to help each other avoid blocks.
And you wonder why babblers aren't babbling... Do you really not see???
PBC... INdeed.
Posted by fayeroe on August 2, 2010, at 9:47:04
In reply to Re: blocked for 3 weeks..who felt put down? » fayeroe, posted by SLS on August 2, 2010, at 5:01:16
Posted by fayeroe on August 2, 2010, at 9:51:19
In reply to I did as well. (nm), posted by 10derHeart on August 2, 2010, at 5:55:13
Posted by Dinah on August 2, 2010, at 10:22:53
In reply to Re: blocked for 3 weeks..who felt put down? (nm) » Dr. Bob, posted by fayeroe on August 2, 2010, at 1:09:38
I would prefer that posters who have a problem with Bob kept their remarks confined to Bob. I leave open the possibility that I misinterpreted and this was a remark about Bob, but I'd have needed a bit of clarification on the point. I think that part of a rephrase can be clarification on things like that.
I just see a difference between saying something about Bob and saying something about the rest of Babble.
Not that I don't have problems with all the negativity towards Bob either. I know I show plenty myself, but I try to be balanced and recognize his better qualities as well. What does it gain the board or ourselves to be really negative towards him?
Posted by Dinah on August 2, 2010, at 10:33:09
In reply to Re: blocked for 3 weeks..who felt put down? (nm) » Dr. Bob, posted by fayeroe on August 2, 2010, at 1:09:38
Again, I use the example...
Is this something I would say publicly in real life at a party about the party? Those in attendance? Even if I was in a dispute with the host?
Would it make any difference if it were a party I'm leaving forever - with no intent of interacting with any of the participants ever again? If it were a party I intend to return to?
I think there are some things I might say privately to like minded individuals that I might not say publicly in front of those who are enjoying the party. And there are other things I'd likely only tell my therapist and my civility buddy.
Posted by Dinah on August 2, 2010, at 10:42:51
In reply to Re: blocked for 3 weeks..who felt put down? » fayeroe, posted by Dinah on August 2, 2010, at 10:33:09
I'm trying to phrase my responses in generalities. I generally am uncomfortable answering questions like this unless my answer is an unqualified "no".
I don't wish to show any incivility to Ron. I appreciate his attempts later in the thread to keep the conversation constructive, and those attempts definitely made me feel better about the thread.
Posted by fayeroe on August 2, 2010, at 11:02:54
In reply to Re: blocked for 3 weeks..who felt put down? » fayeroe, posted by Dinah on August 2, 2010, at 10:22:53
"I would prefer that posters who have a problem with Bob kept their remarks confined to Bob. I leave open the possibility that I misinterpreted and this was a remark about Bob, but I'd have needed a bit of clarification on the point. I think that part of a rephrase can be clarification on things like that".
I am assuming that you are talking to me, Dinah, even though you didn't use my name in your post.
Dinah, I was asking if anyone was offended by the words "kiddie pool". Kiddie pool was what got Ron blocked, right? And did Bob not say his usual "don't post anything......................................"?
I guess if posters don't read a post and only go by the subject line, misunderstandings can occur.
I ask you, now, how could I have possibly been referring to Bob? I didn't ask if anyone was offended by Bob, did I?
I can't speak to negativity about Bob because I don't feel I need to.
I apologize in advance if you weren't directing your post to me.
Posted by Dinah on August 2, 2010, at 11:30:10
In reply to Re: blocked for 3 weeks..' kiddie pool' » Dinah, posted by fayeroe on August 2, 2010, at 11:02:54
I was answering your question about being offended, not responding to your post in any other way.
And as I said, I prefer not to go into this on board. I wouldn't wish to make anyone feel uncomfortable by critiquing their posts. So I answered very generally rather than specifically.
Posted by SLS on August 2, 2010, at 11:31:43
In reply to Re: blkd for 3 weeks..who felt put down? how? (nm) » SLS, posted by fayeroe on August 2, 2010, at 9:47:04
How?
I don't know how. I just do.
Do you really need an explanation?
I don't understand the goal of your question. Do you wish for me to point out and detail what I consider to be the incivilities of others?
- Scott
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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