![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by reluctant on January 6, 2004, at 21:47:47
In reply to Re: here it is . . . » reluctant, posted by Journeyman on January 6, 2004, at 15:05:12
Journeyman, are you a lit teacher by any chance? just curious. if not, then all the better that one of the things you do well is to help others enjoy language - when they're not expecting it! thanks for sharing. I'm not entirely sure what "trifle" is (a sort of pudding?) but I'll give it a shot (you can send me the recipe on the social board, unless it includes pulverized prozac or something). I must say, it sounds like your family is lucky to have you. All of those things you listed are excellent qualities indeed, and everyone should have a baker in the house.I have been in Heathrow airport once, en route to Italy. That's about it for my UK connection, though I'm thinking of a trip to Scotland. I used to be very into british comedy when I was younger - maybe it's a holdover. I live in *new* england (ayuh) . . . otherwise, I'm stumped.
As for my "board identity" - well, it took a little while to get used to posting. I also have been feeling better the past few days - and went to meet my (probable) new therapist today. turns out he's spent a long time practicing buddhism, which is great for me as I've been shuffling my feet at the edge of that jump for a while now, and the questions one confronts in practice are questions I struggle with daily. It also says something very fundemental about the approach he takes to working with his patients.
And, this evening the man I've had a crush on for a long while stopped in at my workplace uexpectedly, and while I didn't quite sweep him off his feet with devastating charm, I did have a pleasant, cheerful & not-freaked-out chat with him - no stammers or blushing. OK, I'm done giving myself gold stars - it's just nice to be able to tell someone about things that I regard as accomplishments, which most people I know wouldn't quite get ("Guess what? I talked to a *boy* today! And . . . *he talked back*!")
I haven't read "Speak", but I'll look for it - I have a PT job in a bookstore, so I'll search the shelves.
thank you for all of your support -
-r(eluctant to change my posting name just yet)
Posted by Journeyman on January 6, 2004, at 22:46:06
In reply to Re: here it is . . . » Journeyman, posted by reluctant on January 6, 2004, at 21:47:47
Hi,
I just spent 30 minutes responding and suddenly got (cue dramatic music) 'the bluescreen crash' right before posting. Hope you're still out there.
I'll try to summarize in a few minutes.
Richard
Posted by Journeyman on January 6, 2004, at 23:12:08
In reply to Re: here it is . . . » Journeyman, posted by reluctant on January 6, 2004, at 21:47:47
Yes, I work in the English Dept. of a college near DC. Grew up in central Maine though, so the Ayuh dialect is my first language.
Trifle is about as close to a national dessert as England comes. To get a sense of what it's like, though my own version is quite different, head for the cookbook section and see if there's a copy of Nigella Lawson's 'How to be a Domestic Goddess.' See pages 148-153. Personally, I don't find her recipes all that good flavorful, but the photographs are arresting and her writing is sumptuous.
So what was the humor connection? Monty Python? Benny Hill? Jasper Carrot? The Two Ronnies? The Black Adder? One Foot in the Grave? I've been a bit of an Anglophile for a while now...went to college there for four years.
Glad to hear you're pleased with your potential therapist. I hope that works out for you.
My therapist is Buddhist too. I was surprised lately when I took an online test designed to find compatibility between individually held beliefs and the 10 major religions/denominations in the US. Despite (or perhaps because of) being raised a Christian, it came in dead last on the list. Universal Unitarianism was at the top, followed by neopaganism (for my environmental bent, I guess) and Buddhism. Have been dabbling into some of the Dalai Lama's writings the last year, along with Steven Levine's 'Who Dies?' - He's a Buddhist counselor who works with the terminally ill. It was my Dad's death last year that pushed me in that direction and it's shaped/reflected my shifting beliefs in a very helpful way.
Congratulations are in order for your successful meeting with the crushee this evening. And to think you didn't even try to escape by hiding behind the self-help stack! Anyone who gets to talk to you is lucky -r; you're a rare soul.
I enjoy the chats with you. It took reading all of one of your postings to sense you're a kindred spirit. I'm also glad you tipped me off to this board. I was beginning to have some misgivings about posting on the Lex site while discussing recipe swapping. (That's not to say that food hasn't always been my primary medication)
Richard
Posted by reluctant on January 7, 2004, at 19:46:07
In reply to Re: here it is . . . » reluctant, posted by Journeyman on January 6, 2004, at 23:12:08
Where in central Maine? I moved up & down the coast during my teenage years. I kind of miss it, tho it's a tough place to live. Portland's nice & doing much better these days . . . not so many empty storefronts.I'm very sorry about the loss of your dad. It's brave of you to work with it so consciously. I nearly lost my sister last year and it sort of pushed me over an edge that I was dangling my legs over to begin with - not only depression, but also The Big Questions (or the Big Truths - whichever) that I had been trying to ignore for a long time, and which Buddhism asks you to look square in the eye. I think we see our mortality through our family - though I didn't expect to find it in my sister, who's close to my age. Luckily for me, for all of us, I never had to find out what I would do when I lost her; I can't imagine losing my father. It sounds like a year after the fact you are doing well, considering.
Hmm . . . tomorrow I'll see my crushee at a meeting (gulp). it's sweet of you to say he's lucky to talk to me - sadly I don't do as well in person. writing is nice because it gives me time. I don't feel like I'm disguising myself or fabricating my personality online - but I can't say that I'm as open in person, not usually - or as articulate, unless I'm so fired up about something that I forget about myself for a moment. I actually surprise myself by posting on this board - I never really have, anywhere, before. The social aspect of the web - beyond e-mail - baffles me, the whole idea of an online community. I really enjoy chatting with you, too - don't get me wrong. but talking with others this way does feel like hiding, in a way. Interaction on the web is much safer than in real life, and it's real life interaction that I so badly need to re-learn now. (ok, I know, this *is* real life - but only a small part of it, vastly edited . . . you know what I mean. the computer in between fictionalizes everything a bit - not by lying neccessarily, but by abstracting for sure). Maybe that's why 9 times out of ten, I'll send an e-mail rather than give someone a call . . . much more comfortable.
But enough of that! I've baked an apple; I intend to eat it. oh, but first to answer some of your questions: I was raised on Monty Python (thanks, Dad!) and loved Blackadder (tho not so fond of Mr. Bean) and Fawlty Towers and the Hitchhikers Trilogy (guess who wasn't sitting at the popular table at school). Don't know the others you mention . . .
as for buddhist readings - started with alan watts The Wisdom of Insecurity, did quite a bit of online research, read some S. Suzuki & others - definitely heading in the Soto Zen direction - and spent some time at a monastery in NY this spring. Daydreamed a lot about becoming a monastic - but then I guess I'd have to sit every day, huh. (not doing so well with that)
For a fun read about Zen practice, try Thank You and OK! by David Chadwick (tales of an american zen buddhist in Japan)
that was quite a ramble. my apple's getting cold. Take care -
-r.
Posted by Journeyman on January 7, 2004, at 21:57:08
In reply to land of the dropped R (or, the dropped ah), posted by reluctant on January 7, 2004, at 19:46:07
Born in Dexter, grew up in Sangerville - a very small town right next to it. Had a sister who lived in Freeport for many years and I used to go there a lot when I was a teenager. Also, my family used to go to Popham Beach (Phippsburg, near Bath) every summer. I love the Maine coast. Summer/fall are great too. Then there are the stars, thousands, which are visible at night; lots of water for swimming, canoeing. I guess there's actually a lot I miss.
Losing my Dad was surprisingly difficult. Beyond the filial attachment, there's a very deep cosmic attachment that I was wholly unaware of, in spite of imagining life without him. When you lose a parent, (at least in my experience) it's as though there's suddenly a literal hole in the universe. Something that has been, at least existentially, present since before you were born is gone, in an instant. I struggled somewhat with it for about a year. One the one-year anniversary of his death, at exactly the time when he had taken his last breath, I suddenly felt this incredible field of energy going out of my body in every possible direction. It was really bizarre, though not frightening in any way. I just knew there was some kind of his presence out there somewhere. I miss him, but in a sense, he's very much with me in my thoughts. I've been completely at ease with his death since then. I've also come to realize that although he was very much absent as a nurturing parent, he love me unconditionally - in the sense that he accepted me exactly as I was. I think he's the only one who ever accepted me to that extent. Now he's just sort of a thought companion. I recognize him in certainly movements I have, in my own thought patterns, in my love of the outdoors, and lots of other ways.
I'm glad your sister's okay. Are there any more siblings? I'm the youngest of five (two older sisters, two older brothers).
I know what you mean about the genuineness of online vs. in-person. There's a wonderful one-act play that I always read with my Research and Literature class about how different conversations would go if you could stop, rewind, and revise. (as in Groundhog Day with Bill Murray (sp?). It's by David Ives and it's called Sure Thing. Well worth the read, and I think it's something you'd relate to quite easily.
At the same time, what you ultimately produce when you click on that Submit your post button is also telling. What you allow out is incapable of blanking out what you've kept hidden. It blurs it, no doubt, but your essence is the same. The very fact that you care about the revision is in itself an important part of you - one that a lot of others might benefit by employing more frequently I might add (esp. myself in writing this particular paragraph :-))
Hope things go well for you tomorrow.
May you be filled with comfort at interacting with others...or barring that, be filled with comfort from knowing that if you're not, you're okay anyway.
I didn't know anybody still baked apples. My grandmother used to love them.
Health,
Richard
Posted by Dr. Bob on January 8, 2004, at 1:37:48
In reply to land of the dropped R (or, the dropped ah), posted by reluctant on January 7, 2004, at 19:46:07
> as for buddhist readings - started with alan watts The Wisdom of Insecurity...
I'd just like to plug the double double quotes feature at this site:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#amazon
The first time anyone refers to a book without using this option, I post this to try to make sure he or she at least knows about it. It's just an option, though, and doesn't *have* to be used. If people *choose* not to use it, I'd be interested why not, but I'd like that redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20020918/msgs/7717.html
Thanks!
Bob
Posted by reluctant on January 8, 2004, at 20:35:43
In reply to Re: land of the dropped R (or, the dropped ah) » reluctant, posted by Journeyman on January 7, 2004, at 21:57:08
journeyman, sorry if my last post was a little downbeat, especially since this one will be as well. of course, this *is* a board for folks with mental/emotional issues. I doubt that there are any boards out there for people who just generally feel pretty good about themselves and their place in the world and everyone in it.
Well, so, no blushing or stammering at today's meeting. But meetings are meetings. I was hoping to be able to talk to said guy after the meeting, but we were all heading our seperate ways and I just couldn't bring myself to make the extra step. It has certainly seemed to me, in the past, that he might also be interested in me - but as a result of past experiences, I'm terrified of guessing wrong. (I was kept on the back burner by someone who I had fallen madly for, for several years - it was like he wasn't sure he wanted to come in, but wouldn't get out of the doorway either. It was so painful and went on for so long that the idea of expressing affection for someone else - especially for the first time! - seems far riskier and scarier than it should). I just don't know how to not take these things so damn seriously, and that's the root of the problem. I'm always astounded by people who can "date" casually - it's entirely outside the realm of my experience, I've only ever had long term, serious relationships. Possibly a fling or two would be good for me . . .? maybe not. Anyhow, so tonight I'm feeling a little down & haunted by past experience, and kicking myself a bit. But the impatient side of me is pacing in the back of my head, saying "you'll miss your chance! And *then* how will you feel?"
bleah.
anyway . . . enough of that. I resolve, within the next (almost said two weeks but I think to be fair I'll give myself a little leeway) month, to make some kind of non-vague or easily dismissable action towards solving this dilemma. This means making myself vulnerable again. It would be really swell if I didn't have to be the one to go first, but somebody has to do it. You're the witness - I said it.
(oh, %&@# . . .)
- HERE ENDS THE EXTENDED WHINE -it's good that you came to terms with your father's death in a very positive way. I do think that there's some part of people that stays behind, at least for a while - not ghosts exactly, but some trace. I've heard so many stories about the deceased turning up in dreams, and the particular quality of those dreams, that I think that those dreams often *are* a real meeting - maybe all occuring in the dreamer's head, as dreams do, but influenced by a real presence.
I didn't know baked apples were old fashioned. It's my way of getting to have desert without having to leave the house in search of cookies.
Was freeport as horribly overrun when you were a child as it is now?
Hope it's considerably warmer down there than it is up here,
-r.
Posted by Journeyman on January 8, 2004, at 21:09:49
In reply to not so perky » Journeyman, posted by reluctant on January 8, 2004, at 20:35:43
You never have to apologize for being downbeat. It's just as important a part of our emotional lives as the flipside.
It's also okay that you didn't take the extra step today. Maybe you will, maybe you won't. What's far more important is that you just let yourself be yourself. If someone isn't perceptive enough to see what you are, verbally assertive or not, then they're the one who's missing out.
Casual dating? Don't have a clue. Was never my style either.
Main St. Freeport was a completely different place until about 1982. Then the outlet stores starting moving in and by 87, it was a totally different place. My favorite places in that area now are Harraseeket (sp.) and Wolf's Neck Park. Way back when, my grandmother and great aunt and their brother owned a cottage on Bustin's Island. There was a little boat owned by a guy named Archie (his daughter runs it now)and he takes people out to Bustin's and others places nearby. I have very fond memories of that.
Baked apples have been around forever. It's probably more of a New England thing anyway. I haven't seen anyone do that since I moved away from home (1981) - I'm 40 now.
Are you in Maine now? Where?
It's freezing down here (by DC standards). The high tomorrow is going to be something like 27, which will be our coldest day so far this year. (Nothing like the -40 it was on Christmas Day in 1980 up in Vacationland).
I wish you peace of mind. Heck, for that matter, I wish myself peace of mind too.
Richard
Posted by reluctant on January 8, 2004, at 21:40:11
In reply to not so perky » Journeyman, posted by reluctant on January 8, 2004, at 20:35:43
hey thanks. Peace of mind all around (I'd buy, but I don't get paid til monday).Nope, not in Maine. Think holsteins & Howard Dean. I've shuffled throughout northern New England quite a bit but VT is my chosen home state. I figure I get to choose since I've moved so much - but northern New England is such a viciously regionalistic place, I'm sure you know the phenomenon - if you weren't born there (Maine, Vermont or NH), then you're from "away", even if "away" is the next town over, across the state line. I expect, although a born & bred Mainah, that your time in DC has garnered you "away" status. Me, I don't really count anywhere. Except maybe NH, where I was born, but frankly I don't really want to identify myself with NH. Oh well.
(I was travelling in the Southwest & had NH license plates on my car; a man at a gas station was impressed that I'd come so far and asked if I had anything with me that I could give him as a souvenir from New Hampshire. I didn't - but reflecting on it a while, I couldn't think of a single thing that would be a NH-specific souvenir. Maybe NRA "Charlton Heston is my President" stickers - or Bush/Cheney stickers. sure didn't have any of those.)
Freeport has gotten far worse since I was a teenager in those parts, and I'm 10 years younger than you. Outlet City. Still, I like going to Bean's at 3 AM.
-r.
Posted by Journeyman on January 8, 2004, at 21:57:21
In reply to Re: not so perky » reluctant, posted by reluctant on January 8, 2004, at 21:40:11
Yep, I've done the Beans in the middle of the night thing. It's all right.
If you're okay with the weather, VT's about as good as it gets. We've got some really good friends in Burlington, so we get up there once in a while. Also, I have a brother who works for IBM (but lives in Fairfax).
Ever eat at Stone Soup?
Richard
Posted by reluctant on January 9, 2004, at 17:49:06
In reply to Re: not so perky » reluctant, posted by Journeyman on January 8, 2004, at 21:57:21
hi Richard -
well, normally I can get along with the weather here, so I'd agree that VT is as good as it gets. but it is so *brutally* cold right now! I can't get up the drive to do anything that requires going outside (the only thing that pushes me out the door is my dog's inability to use the indoor plumbing). I just want to get in bed and stay there until it's more reasonable out there - which I hear won't be until next week sometime. 20-30 below tonight, ugh. Last winter I was living in a cabin w/ an outhouse and we had a similar, 2-week sub-sub-zero cold snap. brisk.
Stone Soup? no, I guess not . . . is that in Burlington? I don't get up there much . . .
I'm curious, why did you choose to move to the DC area? are you in the suburbs or further out?Question: how long have you been on lexapro? is it working for you? what was your timetable like? On the other board I'm soliciting people's lexapro "calendars" to try and get an idea of when people had slumps, when they started to really feel better, etc. a lot of people have mentioned a slump; i'm feeling a little slumpy after a good start. thanks . . .
hope all's well with you -
-r.
Posted by Journeyman on January 9, 2004, at 20:35:45
In reply to from the frozen north » Journeyman, posted by reluctant on January 9, 2004, at 17:49:06
Hi -r,
Ugh, sorry to hear it's so cold there. I checked in with the nearest weather station to Sangerville last night, and it was supposed to be -39 last night and -40 tonight. As my grandfather once said, "The place is only fit for eskimos and polar bears." (and they both have the sense not to be there in the winter) Climb in bed and stay there? Sounds pretty smart to me.
You ought to check into getting 'Fluffy' somehow, I don't think your dog would be named that) trained to use the toilet. Better yet, get him/her hooked up to some sort of heat-generating mechanism so that while the pooch is getting some exercise, you can give the mercury in your apt. a bit of a boost.Okay, so after spending a VT winter in a cabin w/an outhouse, I can see how you'd be drawn to the leisure and comforts of the monastic life.
Stone Soup is in Burlington. I'm a lacto-ovo vegetarian and they usually have a good variety of things to choose from. Of course, I'm equally drawn to the Ben & Jerry's and Lake Champlain Chocolate shops on Church Street.
I actually live on Capitol Hill. We moved here when my partner was working on her PhD in American Studies. We've liked it, so we've stayed on. Have been here since 89. Suburban life doesn't appeal to me much. I'd rather be either downtown or in the country.
I started on Lexapro Nov. 21. I think it's working fairly well. In many ways, there are similarities to what other people have mentioned. I started feeling better right away, though I think that part of that may have just been psychological because I had finally taken the step of treating my depression organically - something I have considered for years, but always thought I 'should' just try to deal with through diet, exercise, reading, psychotherapy, etc. I'd felt that medication was kind of cheating or that any healing wouldn't really be authentic. However, after talking to my therapist, who was convinced it was biological, - and unsuccessfully taming the 'blue meanies,' I decided to give it a try. Part of my problem has been that when I've been depressed, I haven't felt like exercising, eating well, etc.
As far as slumps, I had the around week 5 thing too. It seems better now. So far, side effects have been fairly minimal:
- slight bowel discomfort first two or three days;
- often really want to take a nap in the afternoon;
- feel wired from about 4 PM to around midnight;
- sometimes I feel a little lightheaded. Today, for the first time, I decided not to take it because the lightheadedness was bordering on dizzyness. I don't know whether it's just because there's a buildup of it in my system now or what. I'll be making another appt. with the p/doc soon so will discuss it with him.I'm taking 5 mg/day. Just Lexapro.
Most people find that around 8-9 weeks, the side effects are pretty much gone. That's also the time that many mention it's working to its full effect, as long as the dose is appropriate.
I'm sorry to hear you're feeling slumpy - something we're all intimately familiar with. Do you have something light/funny to read at hand? Or a Video/DVD comedy? (rent Stuart Saves His Family if you haven't already seen it.)
Incidentally, what you wrote on the board for that guy yesterday who was feeling down - that was very nice and extremely well written. You have an unusually sensitive heart and capacity for empathy.
I know you're flickering right now, but that's just proof that you're a light.
Peace, joy, and warmth to you.
Richard
Posted by reluctant on January 9, 2004, at 21:49:09
In reply to Re: from the frozen north » reluctant, posted by Journeyman on January 9, 2004, at 20:35:45
" Better yet, get him/her hooked up to some sort of heat-generating mechanism so that while the pooch is getting some exercise, you can give the mercury in your apt. a bit of a boost."
Oh my god, that's BRILLIANT. Solves so many problems at once - 1) the problem of my insane dog really needing to run off some excess energy (he's one yr. old), 2) the problem of me having to actually take him *outside* to do that, and 3) the problem of having just one very sad and ancient gas heater for a heat source. I'll work on it.
I actually really miss my cabin, sub-zero outhouse excursions aside. but it did contribute to my isolation tendencies - now I live in town and actually see other human beings on a daily basis. Plus I don't need to drive anywhere in bad weather (or good weather either - not much anyway) which is a huge bonus in these parts.
Capitol Hill, huh? that must be interesting. is the air saturated with politics, or can you live a semi-normal life there? I haven't been there since I was a kid & barely remember it. I wonder what the difference in perspective on current events is between here & there. I agree about the suburbs. I had never really been in the suburbs of any city until my year of grad school, when I lived in the suburbs of detroit. It was horrible (particularly the disparity between the super-wealthy 'burbs and downtown Detroit). It was one of the contributing factors in my flight from school before finishing my MFA. When I was a kid I had this huge fear that there wouldn't be any land left when I grew up, and trying to escape the metro area that seemed to keep going and going revived that fear . . .
thanks for your lexapro info - I hope the lightheadedness goes away. are you drinking lots of water? sometimes that helps . . . know what you mean about the resistance to using medication. I know a lot of people who are very unhappy but who really look down on antidepressant use; it's hard to not feel that taking pills is a cop-out, around that attitude. However, I really do think that, if taking medication is done as an active step in healing oneself and it's regarded as a tool, it's a very positive thing to do.
also thanks for your kind words. trying to help someone else makes me feel better, too; so maybe it's just self-serving? I've noticed that you do much more consoling than asking for consolation on these boards. So maybe we're just a couple of self-serving jerks?
oh, I'm just kidding.
Don't have a TV. I can watch DVDs on my computer - but to rent a DVD I would need to go *outside*, and you know how I feel about that. Guess it's bed and book.
warm toes to you & yours but especially to me,-r.
Posted by Journeyman on January 10, 2004, at 22:05:48
In reply to Re: from the frozen north, posted by reluctant on January 9, 2004, at 21:49:09
A one-year-old dog...that must be a lot of energy. What kind is he?
I can understand the appeal of a cabin. I remember doing some research for a paper in a 19th-century Brit-Lit class back in college and two memories stick out in my mind. I was reading Thomas Hardy, "Far From the Madding Crowd" maybe, and at one point a guy is looking at some peasants working on the hillside. Their clothes are all earthtones and as he keeps looking at them, it becomes more and more difficult for him to discern the people from the soil, because they are so close to nature. The other one was a poem. As soon as I read it, I actually ran to the Eng. Dept. chair's office and knocked excitedly on the door. The chair of the history dept. was there too (and I was an English/history double major) and I'm blurting out about this poem which speaks of a guy who decides to just live in a little cottage in the woods. They both look at me with an "Okay, Richard...that's nice, but get a grip and go finish your paper." kind of look on their faces. I did, and that was pretty much the end of my cabin-dwelling dreams. It wouldn't have worked for me anyway. I crave and need alone time, but I crave and need to be around people just as much too. Perhaps a dinner-party throwing hermit would have been the right balance.
If you're into it, you can certainly get politics 24 hours a day and be around lots of other people who are enthralled by it too. It's very easy, however, to carve out an existence devoid of that if you want to. For the most part, I love the neighborhood I'm in. It's easy to walk to a lot of stuff (National Galleries of Art, Air & Space, Museums of Natural/American History, etc., etc.
Diverse population, good biking, yadda, yadda.Thanks for the suggestion about drinking more water. I know it's important, but I often forget to drink enough.
What kind of art do you practice? I'd like to hear about it.
There are some things I'd like to say but don't especially want to post for the whole Lexaworld to see. To avoid elec. mail trolling, I'll write somewhat cryptically, but my elec. location is gocelta at (three-letter acronym...starts with first letter of the alphabet, second letter is short for ovation, third letter is the 12th letter of the alphabet).
Hope you're staying warm.
Richard
This is the end of the thread.
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