![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 20 of 20. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Peter S. on February 18, 2003, at 13:32:04
I'm contorted, constricted into a ball. My brain hurts. I have very little outward energy it's all compressed. Attempts to smile come out as a grimace. Confidence is low.And yet I need a job. How to interview in this condition? How do I convince an employer (and myself) that I'm capable of doing anything besides flipping burgers? Although this is always an option- but I think I would feel even worse doing this kind of work.
I wish I could act like someone who had his s*** together! Anybody know of any techniques of appearing competent and confident in the midst of darkness and hurt?
I must say that I appreciate this board very much- reading people's posts really help me feel less crazy.
Posted by justyourlaugh on February 18, 2003, at 14:16:05
In reply to Interview Hell, posted by Peter S. on February 18, 2003, at 13:32:04
hi peter,
thats a fun one,
i would get "rip roaring" drunk
and open a few top buttons showing my black lacey bra...
how you doing?..(like joey tribuonni)
jyl
Posted by Peter S. on February 18, 2003, at 14:21:16
In reply to Re: Interview Hell, posted by justyourlaugh on February 18, 2003, at 14:16:05
hey jyl,
Do you have a bra I could borrow?
> hi peter,
> thats a fun one,
> i would get "rip roaring" drunk
> and open a few top buttons showing my black lacey bra...
> how you doing?..(like joey tribuonni)
> jyl
Posted by justyourlaugh on February 18, 2003, at 14:27:18
In reply to Re: Interview Hell, posted by Peter S. on February 18, 2003, at 14:21:16
i could also,accidently drop my pencil
between them.....
wanna come over peter?
just kidding,
think i am spinning out of control
j
Posted by shar on February 18, 2003, at 18:09:56
In reply to Interview Hell, posted by Peter S. on February 18, 2003, at 13:32:04
I understand exactly what you're talking about. I send out applications, and then think how would I ever get enough energy to go thru an interview. The ones I've had have not been successful (obviously...since I'm still unemployed), and I do not have the key.
I do know that a lack of self-confidence and self-esteem is not one's best friend when trying to impress potential bosses.
And, nobody wants to look down my shirt anymore, so I don't rely on that either. (Even when they did, I wasn't too comfortable with that technique, and wouldn't recommend it.) But, as always, I could be totally wrong about that!
If you find the answer, please share.
Good luck--Shar
Posted by JohnV on February 18, 2003, at 21:14:27
In reply to Interview Hell, posted by Peter S. on February 18, 2003, at 13:32:04
Ahh yes...the same dilema I am facing. The last six interviews I went to I felt I "failed"...and yes I didn't get the job of course. But a number of things have helped to overcome the fear.
1) Try to get a benzo from your doctor, but not too strong a dose or you may seem "out of it". Maybe a beta-blocker might help with the symptoms..like sweating..fast heartbeat...nervous twitches...etc.
2)If you can, get yourself very comfortable but proper clothes to wear to the interview.
3)Practise it with someone if you can.
4)Take a painkiller and muscle relaxent which I find help eases tension.
5)Get good and plenty rest, and prepare yourself in every way.
6)Before you go, take a nice long relaxing shower and get yourself feeling fresh and even use some body wash or something for the nice smell which is relaxing.
I'd personally say go with all of the above...as I don't think any single one would do much. If you can act relaxed in the interview, just pace yourself, and don't answer too quickly, but don't take a long time with questions. Giving your best is "the" best you can do, and you can't force them to hire you. So just remember if they happen to not hire you, don't let it be a measure of your self worth. If they can't see the good qualities in you giving your best, then maybe they weren't an employer you would want to work with. IMHO. John (the "V" one:-)
Posted by bozeman on February 18, 2003, at 21:59:50
In reply to Re: Interview Hell » Peter S., posted by JohnV on February 18, 2003, at 21:14:27
John -- good suggestions and well thought out.
Some small tricks I used coming out of grad school (interview hell to be sure -- lots of interviews but no jobs to be had for most of my classmates.) These are certainly no guarantees, but they made me *look* more comfortable to interviewers, so people responded to me better, and the situation didn't become awkward so I didn't flip out and start babbling gibberish (you know what I mean.)
First and most important -- Practice smiling in front of a mirror until you can do it without looking forced. Practice several different smiles to see what's the best for you. The most effective one I found is the "eyes-only" smile, where you tighten the muscles on your temples (kind of the same muscles you would tighten to wiggle your ears - but don't wiggle, just tighten and hold.) This very subtly lifts your cheeks and eyebrows, people won't know you're doing it, but they will like you without knowing why. It's only an "edge" but sometimes every little bit helps. The whole time the interviewer is talking, I lock eyes with them and use this smile. It gives the appearance that you are hanging on their every word, and most people love that. It also makes you look open and approachable, and most employers feel safer with that.
This one may sound crazy, and not everyone can do this for *many* reasons, but a non-credit drama class at a community college helped me tremendously. I was depressed at the time, but not anxious, so strangers didn't bother me (I really didn't care one way or the other, ha ha) and it was non credit so there was nothing to lose. Very low pressure and would have been fun if I hadn't been so depressed. What I was looking for was help in figuring out how to not *look* depressed (body language, etc.) and it must have worked, as I have been able to successfully hide depression from current employer of over 5 years.
Neither of these things will directly make you *feel* any less anxious, but they can keep you from *looking* anxious, so the situation stays calmer and you can retain the control you do have.
Hope this helps. Best of luck to you both.
bozeman
Posted by Peter S. on February 19, 2003, at 19:08:35
In reply to Re: Interview Hell -- John V and Peter S, posted by bozeman on February 18, 2003, at 21:59:50
Great suggestion Bozeman!
I love the eye techique- I'm definitely going to practice it! When I'm depressed (which is a lot of the time), people pick up on it. I've considered going to an acting coach so that I can learn to hide it. Sometimes it feels like such a huge effort and energy drain just to look at people and maintain eye contact. I have no problem with this when I'm not depressed. My depressed "personna" is extremely introverted and quiet. This has never seemed quiet natural to my true self which appears when I'm feeling good.
Again I much appreciate the Input
PeterOne issue that I've had in my life is that > Some small tricks I used coming out of grad school (interview hell to be sure -- lots of interviews but no jobs to be had for most of my classmates.) These are certainly no guarantees, but they made me *look* more comfortable to interviewers, so people responded to me better, and the situation didn't become awkward so I didn't flip out and start babbling gibberish (you know what I mean.)
>
> First and most important -- Practice smiling in front of a mirror until you can do it without looking forced. Practice several different smiles to see what's the best for you. The most effective one I found is the "eyes-only" smile, where you tighten the muscles on your temples (kind of the same muscles you would tighten to wiggle your ears - but don't wiggle, just tighten and hold.) This very subtly lifts your cheeks and eyebrows, people won't know you're doing it, but they will like you without knowing why. It's only an "edge" but sometimes every little bit helps. The whole time the interviewer is talking, I lock eyes with them and use this smile. It gives the appearance that you are hanging on their every word, and most people love that. It also makes you look open and approachable, and most employers feel safer with that.
>
> This one may sound crazy, and not everyone can do this for *many* reasons, but a non-credit drama class at a community college helped me tremendously. I was depressed at the time, but not anxious, so strangers didn't bother me (I really didn't care one way or the other, ha ha) and it was non credit so there was nothing to lose. Very low pressure and would have been fun if I hadn't been so depressed. What I was looking for was help in figuring out how to not *look* depressed (body language, etc.) and it must have worked, as I have been able to successfully hide depression from current employer of over 5 years.
>
> Neither of these things will directly make you *feel* any less anxious, but they can keep you from *looking* anxious, so the situation stays calmer and you can retain the control you do have.
>
> Hope this helps. Best of luck to you both.
>
> bozeman
Posted by Gracie2 on February 19, 2003, at 21:33:17
In reply to Interview Hell, posted by Peter S. on February 18, 2003, at 13:32:04
If your next interview doesn't go any better, you might want to consider taking a job that is beneath your abilities, just as a temporary measure of course. You won't be nearly as nervous when interviewing for a menial job because you won't really care too much if you're not hired.
Consequently, you'll be more relaxed and you'll probably have no problem getting hired.There are a couple of good reasons for doing this. First, if you're just too uncomfortable to take a big step like interviewing for an important job, it's much better to take baby steps than to just stand still. Inertia is devestating to the body and soul; the longer you freeze up, the harder it is to get moving again. Action brings relief.
Second, interviewing for a menial job or two will be good practice for you. The interview and the job itself will help loosen you up, get you more used to interacting with strangers. Also, boredom can be motivating. After working for a time at a job beneath your abilities, you'll be ready for something more challanging.
I know this works because I've had to do it myself. There are other things besides flipping burgers. For awhile I worked for an apartment manager, my only job was to file her paperwork and answer the phone, set up appointments for her to show apartments. It was low-pay, low-stress, and dull as hell. After a couple of months I was more than ready for a real job.
Good luck to you, dear.
-Gracie
Posted by bozeman on February 19, 2003, at 23:24:41
In reply to Re: Interview Hell -- Bozemen, posted by Peter S. on February 19, 2003, at 19:08:35
Anytime. ;-)
Good luck, and let us know when you bag one (job) !!!
bozeman
Posted by noa on February 21, 2003, at 8:29:08
In reply to Re: Interview Hell » Peter S., posted by JohnV on February 18, 2003, at 21:14:27
Going through similar issues....
Even though I've been pretty darn functional at work recently, I am terrified of applying for jobs, which I may have to do if we have RIFS this year. The idea of convincing someone else of my value seems daunting, because I don't believe it myself. Objectively, when someone (like my therapist) walks me through some reality testing about my skills, one by one, I can see them, but it is my overall ability to handle something that makes me anxious. I'm mostly afraid of my emotional readiness. both for a new job and for the interview process. I mean, in interviews, people want to see optimism and confidence--can I portray these? Feels doubtful to me.
Posted by noa on February 21, 2003, at 8:31:46
In reply to Re: Interview Hell -- John V and Peter S, posted by bozeman on February 18, 2003, at 21:59:50
Hmm...have to try the eye-smile thing. I can't wiggle my ears, though, so I'm not familiar with the righ muscles.
Posted by bozeman on February 22, 2003, at 12:33:34
In reply to Re: Interview Hell -- John V and Peter S » bozeman, posted by noa on February 21, 2003, at 8:31:46
> Hmm...have to try the eye-smile thing. I can't wiggle my ears, though, so I'm not familiar with the righ muscles.
noa -- That was the best way I could think of to describe it, but it's not tough to find. Look in the mirror and just try different muscle sets to see what it does to your "visual affect." Clench your teeth, then raise your eyebrows, etc. The most effective thing in finding the right muscles is something I learned in massage therapy -- "intent" -- formulate the "intent" to tighten a certain set of muscles, but don't actually tighten anything. Your "intent" will cause a preparatory "micro tightness" in the affected muscle set. You can demonstrate this to yourself by looking at your hands on the keyboard while typing. Stop typing in mid-sentence, look at your hands, "think the intention" of striking the "number eight" key, but don't actually do anything. Do you feel the "activation" or "tension" or "anticipation" in that middle finger, right hand, waiting for the command to be actually executed? That's the kind of tension I'm talking about. It's subtle but effective. You form the "intent" to have friendly, smiling eyes. It takes a little practice (it took me about an hour or so to really figure this out. I was tired of people thinking I was mad when I wasn't , per our conversation about what to say to rude people "Smile!", over on Psychological Babble, wasn't it?)
Anyway, give it a try and see what you think. It's all about those "micro-facial expressions" they talk about in books like "Emotional Intelligence", "Primal Leadership -- Realizing the Power of Emotional Intelligence", etc, and in work about the new lie-detector technology which is based on the same thing.
bozeman
Posted by noa on February 22, 2003, at 16:52:23
In reply to Re: Interview Hell » noa, posted by bozeman on February 22, 2003, at 12:33:34
OK--I'll be spending some mirror time later to practice my open-face look.
I'd heard of this kind of thing, I guess--I dunno, read somewhere about how some kids have social difficulties partly due to what their "resting face" facial expression is. Makes me wonder what mine looks like to people.
Tangent--was visiting with nephews last night and they had out thier parents' wedding album and omg, I hadn't seen those pics in such a long time. 23 years ago, and I was looking so much better, but back then I thought I was hideousness personified. I wouldn't mind looking 19 again!
Posted by PuraVida on February 23, 2003, at 23:20:32
In reply to Re: Interview Hell, posted by Gracie2 on February 19, 2003, at 21:33:17
Gracie - good suggestion. I'm thinking of doing the same thing. Like Shar, I sit and wonder how I'm going to find the energy to interview IF they call. I know being out and about, and having somewhere to be each day will help get my career confidence back up, so I'm loking for an easy, enjoyable part-time job to try to help me rise out of my funk back into a "real" job. Now if I can just get myself out the door tomorrow morning to apply for that easy job...!
PVG
Posted by Gracie2 on February 24, 2003, at 14:24:07
In reply to Re: Interview Hell » Gracie2, posted by PuraVida on February 23, 2003, at 23:20:32
Posted by bozeman on February 24, 2003, at 21:47:55
In reply to Re: Interview Hell, posted by noa on February 22, 2003, at 16:52:23
I know . . . I had the same experience. I look at pictures of my twenty-five-year-old self and think, "Dang, girl, you looked good! Shame on you for letting that man (husband, don't ask) tell you that you were fat!"
I was blinded by insecurity. So glad that maturity brings perspective, at least on some things. :-)
bozeman
Posted by tackleme on February 28, 2003, at 17:15:32
In reply to Re: Interview Hell . . . Reunion hell? » noa, posted by bozeman on February 24, 2003, at 21:47:55
Well, maybe this is a conversation that I can add something to instead of just draw support. I have hired hundreds of people and have interviewed for many jobs with great success...none of which have ever detected my lack of mental health. So here is what you do.
1. Buy or select clothing that is sharp, fits perfectly and that makes you feel like you look great in it. Slightly overdress for the interview. Have your hair freshly cut and washed, manicure, facial, pedicure etc. anything that will help you feel good about the way you look ... even for a while. I personally feel invincible for about 2 hours after I take a hot followed by a cold shower... Then I go right to the interview!
2. Learn to make small talk. I moved 10 times before I went to high school and always had to be the one that initiates conversation and keeps it going. Make an excuse to go door to door in your neighborhood... like making or updating a phone directory. Force yourself to knock on every door and talk to every neighbor. Fill out your little page of names and numbers to kill dead spots in the conversation. After 20-40 neighbors you will start to get the idea about how to be friendly and cordial and helpful and talkative in a relaxed and authentic way plus most of the neighbors will love what you are doing. It took me 75 neighbors over a period of several weeks but I started to feel like I was a good guy and was doing something good. People actually think I am "such an outgoing person" when in reality I am forcing myself to endure my own personal survival therapy.
3. Learn to ask questions. During your neighborhood walk or at a party or everywhere, force yourself to ask about everything you notice. This is the most powerful tool in interviewing to be sure. If you can be interestED instead of interestING you are going to be way ahead of most applicants. Gradually you will learn to transition from your question into something about you or the job or, preferably, both.
4. Do not smoke, drink or take anything before the interview that will make you feel anything other than normal. I personally think taking any special short term meds will backfire since most interviews are part of a series of interviews and a saavy interview team will notice the inconsistencies in your style or behavior.
5. Do a little research and a little reading about the company, industry or the area so that you have something to draw on for your questions. If you are applying at retail, shop the place a few times before the interview. Call their help-line, "look under the carpet" a bit. You will be amazed at how this will ease your nerves and improve the image that you deliver.
6. Tell the truth about everything... except your mental health issues. Most people who don't know depression personally will never benefit from you telling them about yours. Additionally, the unknown is scary to most people and they will have wild, negative, fantasies about you and your future behavior.
7. Follow-up, Follow-up, Follow-up, Follow-up.
Call in a couple of days to see if any additional information is needed. Call again with another question that you didn't get answered. Email a request as to some sources they might recommend for further information. Ask to talk to the person who had the job previously or who currently has the job. Ask to speak with others who will work with the selected candidate to gather more information about what will be success factors in the job. etc. etc. etc. If you can't force yourself to do this then get a friend to hold you accountable to do it. Have them chech to make sure you are doing the steps.Some of this stuff is mechanical you might say but I guarantee that these things will help either you feel better and more confident or they will help the interviewers like and take notice of you more or both. Interviewers hire candidates that they like and feel comfortable with. The above tips will help this occur.
Good Luck!
Posted by shar on February 28, 2003, at 23:22:46
In reply to Interview tips from a depressed success, posted by tackleme on February 28, 2003, at 17:15:32
Posted by noa on March 1, 2003, at 14:59:42
In reply to Great tips--Thank you! (nm) » tackleme, posted by shar on February 28, 2003, at 23:22:46
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Social | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.