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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 59. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by gardenergirl on January 6, 2005, at 0:07:15
Ugh ugh ugh
I didn't go to my session today. I am not really sure why. Practically speaking, I had a terrible night last night. I was up til about five a.m. doing mindless things instead of going to bed. I suppose I was avoiding thinking about or feeling *something*, but I am not sure what. So, about the time I needed to get up to get ready to leave was prime sleeping time for me.
But then again, I've been able to get up and go to work and other appointments without a problem. Here's the thing: when I am at my worst with depression, I tend to sleep a ton. I can't get out of bed in the morning, I am chronically late or even just don't go to class or wherever.
I did a few no-shows early on in the therapy process. I have also cancelled once or twice due to illness. But I've been pretty good over the last several months about being relatively on time and such.
At work, I am not usually late. Okay, not late in that I am not late for a scheduled appointment, but I don't always get there at 8:30 if I don't have a client that early. Usually I am there by nine. At any rate, I have no difficulty getting out of bed to go to work.
But I've been late to my therapy sessions every week now for the last several, dating back to just before the holidays, I think. And late cause I just lie in bed and can't make myself get out. So today, I just didn't. Worse, I didn't call. I rationalized it to myself that I am the first appointment, and the phones don't open up til just before I come in, anyway. You can't leave a message. That really doesn't make sense, but that's why I said I didn't bother to call.
Okay, enough blathering. I feel like a turd. Now I have to email him (or I suppose I could call) and apologize and ask if he has anymore time this week. Ugh. I really do want to process this with him. I actually tried to process me being late more and more with him a couple of sessions ago, and I wondered aloud if I might be resisting something. But he didn't go there. He never talks about my being late, perhaps cause he's a late person, too. And he admits it. So maybe he feels odd dealing with this in me cause he does it too.
You know, this might have started not long after that session when I relived that body memory and just had racking sobs and loads of pre-verbal pain. At times I feel like, gee, that was very therapeutic...I need to get back to that and do more of that (crazy, I know, cause who wants to feel that?) And perhaps part of me doesn't want to go there. Heck, I don't know. When I try to talk about being stuck and afraid in/of the process, he thinks it's a smokescreen for whatever the process might bring out.
Is any of this making any sense at all?
gg
Posted by daisym on January 6, 2005, at 1:07:36
In reply to I think I'm resisting in therapy, posted by gardenergirl on January 6, 2005, at 0:07:15
YES --YES --- YES!!!!
...only, I'm not late. That would be against the rules. But as far as resistance goes, absolutely! It is hard not to blame therapy for your pain, even if intellectually you know that therapy just gives you the space to feel and deal with, your pain. And talking about the process, the resistance, etc. is "easier" than talking about the underlying issue.
Obviously you have already made an association to the time frame of all of this. And, I remember reading a post of yours about how your new pdoc had an interpretation that put your mind at ease about a worry that had developed. I don't want to unease your mind but somehow these things seem connected to me...are you somehow worried about what might come out in therapy, because it will rekindle this worry? (Of course I could be all wet.)
Don't be too hard on yourself. Call, try to reschedule and don't forget to think about hormones, meds, post-holiday let down, exhaustion and SAD. At least here, it has been gray and cold. ick.
(((GG)))
Posted by gardenergirl on January 6, 2005, at 8:54:56
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy, posted by daisym on January 6, 2005, at 1:07:36
Daisy,
Thanks for the validation and practical advice. I think I am experiencing more depression, which may or may not be related to resistance, but is getting in the way of things. I may up my meds. It also IS horribly gray and gloomy, weather-wise here. My lawn is under water. So I'm trying to get in more light therapy time, but it's not easy.And you are right in the time frame stuff. I actually had a triggering dream along the same lines while I was away in Detroit. I was actually kicking my husband while asleep. I never do that. It left me feeling very sad. And yet I hesitate to bring it up in therapy, because I feel like I'm being silly. Stupid, I know.
He emailed me back and I have an appt. today at 2:00.
Thanks
gg
Posted by annierose on January 6, 2005, at 9:06:16
In reply to I think I'm resisting in therapy, posted by gardenergirl on January 6, 2005, at 0:07:15
Glad he had time to see you today. This is such a complicated process and sometimes, I feel, I over-think some issues. I just it would be easier to speak without editing. Good Luck!
Posted by TofuEmmy on January 6, 2005, at 11:50:05
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » daisym, posted by gardenergirl on January 6, 2005, at 8:54:56
And he disagreed with the pdoc's intrepretation - the one which had put you at ease? So perhaps you are avoiding him for that reason? He may hold alternative perspectives, right or wrong. Or he may just disagree with all collateral viewpoints just cuz he doesn't like other folks poking around in your prescious head. :-)
Hugs and kisses, tbutt
Posted by fallsfall on January 6, 2005, at 12:42:20
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » daisym, posted by gardenergirl on January 6, 2005, at 8:54:56
Good. Go at 2.
I hope you can just be bluntly open about all of this with him. It is painful to do so, but I have found it really valuable.
Good luck! and let us know how it goes!
Posted by Shortelise on January 6, 2005, at 13:11:12
In reply to I think I'm resisting in therapy, posted by gardenergirl on January 6, 2005, at 0:07:15
Aren't you doing just what you need to do?
You are avoiding therapy a little, giving yourself some time off. You are thinking things over. Asking yourself questions. Letting yourself venture into late night thinking.
If it feels unhealthy, you could worry.
But I think there are times when we need to give ourselves a break, and trust that we are doing what we need to do.
So, gg, is what you're doing the Wrong Thing? Or is the ther Right Thing for you at the moment?
Do you see what I mean? I feel I am being a little cloudy, but then again, I think I tend to over explain.
ShortE
Posted by mair on January 6, 2005, at 20:17:19
In reply to I think I'm resisting in therapy, posted by gardenergirl on January 6, 2005, at 0:07:15
I'm impressed - I've never just actually not showed up although I've wanted to lots of time. I think my overarching super ego tells me that it's just too rude to do that. So I'll debate with myself for hours about whether I should call and cancel and I never seem to resolve it until it's too late to cancel.
As someone else said, you have probably been doing what you need to. In my opinion, better maybe not too go than to go and suffer through a non productive session because you're so resistant. I'm not suggesting that you'd carry that resistance into your session, but I know I have.
Last weekend I almost never left my house and when i did I mostly regretted it. I was feeling very guilty about everything that I wasn't getting done and the friend who I kept putting off about taking a walk. I thought my hibernation might be depression induced withdrawal. My T suggested that maybe it's just what I needed to do to recover from the holidays and a bunch of houseguests. Somehow her explanation never really occurred to me.
How'd your appointment go?
Mair
Posted by fires on January 6, 2005, at 20:56:34
In reply to I think I'm resisting in therapy, posted by gardenergirl on January 6, 2005, at 0:07:15
You asked so I shall answer: No not a bit.
Posted by TofuEmmy on January 6, 2005, at 22:14:52
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » gardenergirl, posted by fires on January 6, 2005, at 20:56:34
>You asked so I shall answer: No not a bit.
Despite GG's request, please consider this - Sometimes it is better to not reply to a post if it is not possible for you to offer something supportive.
Or as my mother always said, "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all"
PS: Some guidelines for posting are in the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Posted by fires on January 6, 2005, at 22:51:03
In reply to Please be Supportive » fires, posted by TofuEmmy on January 6, 2005, at 22:14:52
> >You asked so I shall answer: No not a bit.
>
> Despite GG's request, please consider this - Sometimes it is better to not reply to a post if it is not possible for you to offer something supportive.
>
> Or as my mother always said, "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all"
>
> PS: Some guidelines for posting are in the FAQ:
>
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
>
>What? When someone asks me if something makes sense, I answer truthfully. I'm not sure what you are suggesting? Are you implying that I lied?
The only other thing I can even think of is: that the question was strictly rhetorical. Yet after reading the post 3 times, it still doesn't sound rhetorical to **me**.
Sorry, if I offended anyone. I didn't mean to. I sincerely found that her post didn't make sense to me. Also, if I may ask, are you telling me that a comment directed to someone else, is "not supportive"? Please explain.
Thank you
Posted by gardenergirl on January 6, 2005, at 23:41:51
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » gardenergirl, posted by fires on January 6, 2005, at 20:56:34
Fires,
I suppose I did think of it as a rhetorical question, cause if it made sense, I wouldn't be so confused. And frankly, when I read your first post, I thought you were saying that I was not resisting a bit. Which surprised me.But anyway, snookems. I'm so pleased you joined this thread. I am just tickled to tell you that one hypothesis about what is going on is that I am feeling as if I might be on the verge of a recovered memory.
"EEEKKK! BREAK OUT THE ARTICLES! THE WEBSITES! THE PITHY COMMENTS"
"GET ME SOME IODINE, I'VE GOT DOG GERMS!" (with apologies to Snoopy)
RUN AWAY RUN AWAY RUN AWAY!
;)
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:08:59
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy, posted by annierose on January 6, 2005, at 9:06:16
Posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:12:57
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy, posted by TofuEmmy on January 6, 2005, at 11:50:05
awww, thanks. If only he knew how many babblers were poking around in my head.
It could be that dynamic. He does tend to disagree with her a lot, and he seemed disappointed when I decided not to keep weaning off Nardil, although he never said so.
But then he's the great blank slate, so I could be doing a ton of projection, too.
Thanks,
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:28:41
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » gardenergirl, posted by fallsfall on January 6, 2005, at 12:42:20
Well, I went. He was very gracious and concerned about me missing yesterday.
He wondered, when I said my behavior was so rude, and that's why I felt like a turd (he laughed at that), why I might want to be rude to him. I really didn't have any answers to that.
Instead, I told him about the odd dream I had while in Detroit. It was kind of a triggering dream. I was kicking my hubby while it was going on. What felt odd to me was that my emotion after this dream felt very detached and kind of numb. Usually I am much more in the moment of the emotion when I wake up, and sometimes thru at least part of the day.
He's very good about listening without priming or leading. It lead to me doing some serious crying and sobbing for a bit again. The session itself was a bit disjointed. I hopped around, and he didn't always bring me back to the dream. We did talk about a trauma when I was about 21, and family issues stuff. Heck we even talked about the tsunami for a minute or two. (I've been avoiding looking at images or reading too much about it...just take my donation and I'll close my eyes.)
I did mention that I was glad I didn't have to go back to work, which surprised him. He wondered why that would be a problem. (Duh!). But I mentioned that I always go to Starbucks after sessions, as my little treat for myself. And that sometimes I feel like I need to crawl into bed and sleep for a bit. Or do something else self-care related. Now, silly me, I thought this was healthy. But he seems concerned that maybe therapy is too intense if I can't put myself back together enough to be able to go back to work.
At the end, he said he wasn't able to put everything together into a meaningful whole like he usually can. Instead, he said he would lay out the pieces on the table, so to speak, for us to just look at. Maybe next session we can put some of them together. That's odd for him, to feel just as confused as I am.
So, intense, and meaningful session, I suppose. But draining. Very draining. But I can tell he is concerned about me, and in a weird way, that is nice. Cause I can't remember a time in my life when I wasn't depressed except maybe when I was very young. And yet it was my brother my mother had hospitalized when he was 16 for depression. Now I didn't act out, but didn't anybody notice me?
Thanks for your encouragement, falls
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:31:58
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » gardenergirl, posted by Shortelise on January 6, 2005, at 13:11:12
Hmmm, I didn't look at it that way. I suppose that could be, except I feel as if I am more depresesd. Lordy, sometimes I think it's just the weather. I would kill to see the sun right now. ;)
And I suppose if it were a conscious effort to step back and take time off, I might have at least called to cancel? I was just so appalled at my not showing up and not calling. But maybe I did not go in order to have a break.
Right now I feel like I could use one. I had been wanting to know more about the body memory event I had, and what it means. And then this dream...I am not sure I want to know what it all means. At least not right now. Maybe after my dissertation...?
Thanks, shortE. Your posts always make me think...
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:34:47
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » gardenergirl, posted by mair on January 6, 2005, at 20:17:19
You know, post-holiday recovery makes a lot of sense. I was depressed right after the holidays last year, too.
And my super-ego was telling me I was a horrible person, and very very rude and disrespectful. I felt like I had to slink in today in shame. But he didn't treat me like that and was very interested in what was going on with me.
I posted more about the session above.
Thanks for you input.
gg
Posted by daisym on January 7, 2005, at 1:08:19
In reply to today's session » fallsfall, posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:28:41
<<<Now I didn't act out, but didn't anybody notice me?
>>>>Oh, (((GG))) -- so much pain in a single statement. Being with family really brings up so much old cr*p.
So much of what you described sounds like how I feel when I'm either recovering a memory that I don't really want...or when I'm faced with mom stuff. We've talked about this, mom stuff just rips you up. You've been dreaming about your brother and your mom too...hmmm. It all sounds so hard.
I'm glad you could at least lay it out on the table today. At least you don't have to hold it all by yourself. When is your next appointment?
Posted by mair on January 7, 2005, at 5:07:38
In reply to today's session » fallsfall, posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:28:41
I think it's right and good that he be concerned for you, but I, too, can't imagine why he would be surprised that you don't always want to jump back into work after sessions. I frequently have that urge to go home and get in bed and it doesn't just go away. I pretty much always dutifully return to my office for what is sometimes a very unproductive afternoon; but I probably crawl into bed tons earlier on nights when i've had therapy.
Do these people not understand how exhausting and draining it can be?
I'm glad your T didn't treat this as an act of rudeness, even if you thought of it that way. When I've felt suicidal the contract my T likes striking with me is to get me to promise that I'll show up at the next session, not necessarily to ask me to promise to call her if I think I'm in danger (which is implied I'm sure). I think it's the "promise you'll show" statement that gives me pause when I think about just not showing. I'm just afraid she'd jump to the wrong conclusions.
Mair
Posted by annierose on January 7, 2005, at 7:27:48
In reply to Re: today's session » gardenergirl, posted by mair on January 7, 2005, at 5:07:38
GG- I relate to your feeling invisible. That is what we are talking about in therapy right now too. And I'm from a family of 5 children and I don't think they ever noticed me. It's nice how your T tries to wrap up each session for you. And how honest he was that he wasn't able to do that for you yesterday. You're probably so close to something big right now. Just try to stay in the moment and it will come out (if you let it).
Annierose
Posted by fires on January 7, 2005, at 12:20:59
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » fires, posted by gardenergirl on January 6, 2005, at 23:41:51
> But anyway, snookems. I'm so pleased you joined this thread. I am just tickled to tell you that one hypothesis about what is going on is that I am feeling as if I might be on the verge of a recovered memory.<<
A fellow skeptic and MD, concurs with me: Isn't it curious that ALL recovered memories are negative ones?
>
> "EEEKKK! BREAK OUT THE ARTICLES! THE WEBSITES! THE PITHY COMMENTS"
>
> "GET ME SOME IODINE, I'VE GOT DOG GERMS!" (with apologies to Snoopy)
>
> RUN AWAY RUN AWAY RUN AWAY!Doesn't Dr. Bob have anything in his civility rules about it being rude to post in all caps?
Why are you yelling at me?
> ;)
Posted by fallsfall on January 7, 2005, at 12:29:07
In reply to today's session » fallsfall, posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:28:41
>But he seems concerned that maybe therapy is too intense if I can't put myself back together enough to be able to go back to work.
I think that they often really don't have a clue how much therapy effects us. My therapist changed how he was dealing with me a lot right after we had a discussion about how it wasn't "healthy" for me to be so destroyed by therapy. And the changes really have helped with that.
I'm glad you were open and honest with him. Sometimes I think the disjointed sessions are really important. I find that if I can accept the disjointedness that I am more honest - the rest of the time, I might be editing thing so that what I say all supports the point I'm trying to make. But it is true that when the sessions are really disjointed, it might take a little while (sessions) to figure out what the issues really are.
I hope that whatever you are heading towards is helpful in the long run.
Posted by Annierose on January 7, 2005, at 12:31:14
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » gardenergirl, posted by fires on January 7, 2005, at 12:20:59
Not sure I want to get involved in this conversation, but just as a fyi, I have recovered wonderful memories of my grandmother! And I love it when I discover another time we shared together!!
Posted by antigua on January 7, 2005, at 12:32:28
In reply to Re: today's session, posted by annierose on January 7, 2005, at 7:27:48
GG, I'm so very glad you went today. One thing I am picking up on is that maybe you're really opening up more to your T--I don't know how to say this, really, but if he was somewhat surprised at how you felt and wasn't able to put it neatly together, then that could be a really good thing. A new level of trust, maybe? I've also been told that these kinds of feelings/behavior often precede a breakthrough and I certainly hope that is what is happening to you.
Also, about being late. When I first started, I was always exactly on time (my father had a thing about tardiness. The last two years, maybe, I've been very conscious of being late. It doesn't matter how much time I give myself, I'm always late now. We talk about it. It's significant.
One silly story for you.
My T moved over the summer, as I know I've mentioned. I didn't (and maybe still haven't) adjusted well to her move. One day the traffic was terrible (I have a 9 am appt)and I decided to go the back way, or so I thought. I ended up getting lost and the more anxious I became, the more lost I became. The clock was ticking and my prescious T minutes were awasting! I ended up overshooting her new place and had to pass by her old place to get to the new place (still following me?). I don't regularly go by her old place; it's out of the way.By the time I reached my T, I was more than 30 minutes late. I was so flustered. She sweetly told me it was fine and said that I wasn't late for therapy, I had just started it somewhere else (her old house). It was a very productive session.
good luck,
antigua
Posted by Shortelise on January 7, 2005, at 12:44:39
In reply to today's session » fallsfall, posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:28:41
gg,
You really are in the middle of it, aren't you?
You are so aware, coming at yourself from a place of knowledge of the psyche, and the tender ignorance of self of the analysand. That must be the hardest of all, and I think of this every time I read posts from those of us here who have that knowledge. I second guess myself all the time, with very little of that knowledge. I can imagine what it's like for you.
I love it when my T is "concerned" about me. I feel cared about, and there is safety in that. It means that someone is looking out for me, someone is hearing me, and in that concern I am somehow safe. And when I am in that precarious place of opening cans of worms, I need *some* sense of safety.
Are you the middle child? You make me think of my sister. I was hospitalized when I was 16, and she kept it together.
ShortE
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