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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Dr. Rod on November 22, 2003, at 11:22:37
Affective Disorders need not be thought of as a life sentence in the jail of your mind... The symptoms are ambiguous on a good day, so expectations are not met and frustration sets in...
All recovery is a process, never an event... Passing through a threshold of recovery leaves you feeling that you had a recovery event... You feel all giddy with success, until another demon arrives at the door... What you may forget to honor in yourself is that the last success gave you practice and strategies for the next demon, no matter how vile and hidious...
I like to say, "While you are healing, we are watching, lovingly"... The "Outcome Thinking" project did have a beginning, a middle, and an end... Luckily the end came before my mentor David Peck passed away, the research and the results are complete... Carefully administered, the techniques and strategies we developed and perfected, can continue to produce the "got it" success for 7 out of 8 people...
That was a 6 month live-in program... Would a 30 day at-large program producing 1 success out of 8 people be enough??? How about 5 out of 8???
Posted by krazybirdlady on November 22, 2003, at 22:05:13
In reply to Not a Life Sentence, posted by Dr. Rod on November 22, 2003, at 11:22:37
that depends...what precisely did they "get"...
Posted by Dr. Rod on November 23, 2003, at 0:42:58
In reply to Re: Not a Life Sentence, posted by krazybirdlady on November 22, 2003, at 22:05:13
"It" is different for each person, so precision is not a goal... Goal orientation and option thinking replacing expectations and obligatory thinking are some goals of "outcome thinking"...
Can you see yourself not caring whether you take the medications or not??? Can you see yourself recognizing that you are having an episode and you are OK with it??? "Got it" is like not being affected anymore... You systematically choreograph your life to minimize affectations that blackmail your emotions...
Again, this strategy appears different for each person... However, when a person successfully trades in their childhood fear of danger, which causes them to freeze in their tracks, for respect for the very same danger, which gives them options not available to the unfinished mind of a child, they can then choose the timing and the distance for jumping out of the way of danger... Note: if you see an adult freeze in their tracks, they are stuck in the childhood fear of danger no matter how old they are...
The difficulty for most folks is that they confuse obligation for respect... Others have respect intellectually induced in them; they talk respect but their feet still freeze at the site of danger... Also, you can't be good at respect for danger, or respect for others, until you have had healthy self-respect for awhile... Practice makes perfect, they say...
Once you exhibit respect, you take responsibility for who you are separate from what you do, you accept yourself and your limitations, and trade in your childhood "approval" for adult "love", you would be a candidate for testing for "got it"...
To be precise, you are not going to be out of the woods until you harness your impulses and develop effective conflict management skills... The reason I hesitate to start out here is "Affective Disorder" folks turn a deaf ear to any notion that they are acting like children. Incidentally, children are well known to have poor impulse and conflict "management-skills"...
Posted by tabitha on November 23, 2003, at 1:40:11
In reply to Not a Life Sentence, posted by Dr. Rod on November 22, 2003, at 11:22:37
So I'm still trying to understand where you're coming from here. You were working with a guy on a book and a personal growth training program, and he died, and now you're sort of left not knowing where to take it next. Is that right?
The ideas sound a little like est and the Forum. Was it an LGAT type of program? I've never heard of a 6-month live-in training program. How did the participants manage to commit to that much time?
Posted by Dr. Rod on November 23, 2003, at 12:05:22
In reply to Re: Not a Life Sentence » Dr. Rod, posted by tabitha on November 23, 2003, at 1:40:11
Thank you "Tabitha" for listening and responding... David Peck, LCSW/MFCC, was retired from his personal practice and working part time or volunteering at the center for 8 to 15 hours per week... He was 78 when he passed away in May... His techniques he coined as "outcome thinking", took the center like a firestorm, tripling the "success rates" in a couple of years...
No one could shed any light for him as to why his techniques were so significant, so several of his friends and cohorts (62 in all) started meeting 5 to 10 of us at a time weekly, studying the territory, feeding back to him our separate successes and reporting on what we had read and studied in the week...
We amassed an enormous amount of new stuff that seemed connected, and seemed to provide better results, but astoundingly, continuing to increase the success rates... In 1999, he offered the center a careful research study to prove what we had discovered and employed... In 2001, he had cancer surgery which put a big glitch in the graphs... Remarkably, we had statistics that indicated success 7 out of 8 times with no repeaters, and no "cooking the books" (I have direct and immediate knowledge, since I was responsible for the database and the reporting)...
After chemo, David started gleaning his 40 odd trade journal submissions (some published, some not), assembling the beginnings of a book as the definitive study... When David neared the end, he offered his work to a fully credentialled collegue to finish...
This didn't leave me lost or angry... I had already witnessed and discovered so much that I choose to "float my own boat"... I have an overwhelming number of optional paths to venture down... The difference for me is I won't "vibrate with indecision"; and I know why I won't...
I'm out of time so I promise to answer the second half in a little bit...
Again, thank you "Tabitha"...
Posted by Dinah on November 23, 2003, at 12:25:19
In reply to Re: Re: Not a Life Sentence » tabitha, posted by Dr. Rod on November 23, 2003, at 12:05:22
http://decisionhome.com/counsel.html
It's all I could see on the web.
Posted by tabitha on November 23, 2003, at 16:39:13
In reply to Would this be it? » Dr. Rod, posted by Dinah on November 23, 2003, at 12:25:19
must be.. Dr Rod mentioned 'the Aesthetic View' as the name of the book earlier. Excellent googling, Dinah!
Posted by Dinah on November 23, 2003, at 17:16:32
In reply to Re: Would this be it? » Dinah, posted by tabitha on November 23, 2003, at 16:39:13
Posted by Dr. Rod on November 23, 2003, at 18:10:24
In reply to Would this be it? » Dr. Rod, posted by Dinah on November 23, 2003, at 12:25:19
Thank you for doing something I would have never thought to do since I am on the inside... I left the area in July and have been busy, and obviously out of touch...
Notice there is no referrence to the book, just the Peck Protocol and the "Aesthetic view" in tangent... I will follow up from my end...
Thanks again for the heads up...
Posted by Dr. Rod on November 23, 2003, at 18:24:39
In reply to Would this be it? » Dr. Rod, posted by Dinah on November 23, 2003, at 12:25:19
http://decisionhome.com/counsel.html
Shows you a picture of my friend and mentor David F. Peck... We all miss him alot...Thanks again "Dinah" for your diligence...
Posted by Dr. Rod on November 24, 2003, at 1:45:43
In reply to Re: Not a Life Sentence » Dr. Rod, posted by tabitha on November 23, 2003, at 1:40:11
The following scathing attack is sorta how I fell about Landmark, EST, and Scientology... I have a special trapdoor to Hell for Scientology and L. Ron Hubbard... (I can't talk like this... This is grumbling) Check out this WEB site for the scathing attack...
http://www.caic.org.au/psyther/landmark/landmark-testa1.htm ---
You picked up on "get it" from the Landmark forum... David Peck knew very little about the Landmark Education when I talked to him about it... I haven't gone through the Forum weekend process, but have had several friends who have...
I have sat in on open sessions, and quite frankly took away only a smattering of ideas... My favorite is the principle comparing what you know to what you can't even guess and don't even know that you don't even know... Turns out that don't know that you don't know, DK-DK, is virtually everything... Quite humbling actually...
Note: The centers nationwide are palnning to extend their programs to a year in residency to bring their numbers up... I predict it will ruin the sucess percentages because, like you point out; its reasonable that it will be very hard to get rough and tumble union types to commit to a full year with limited family contact...
Posted by tabitha on November 24, 2003, at 2:27:38
In reply to Re: Not a Life Sentence » tabitha, posted by Dr. Rod on November 24, 2003, at 1:45:43
I've read a lot of negative stuff about Forum and Scientology too. Probably I wouldn't mind Forum so much if they didn't pressure people to recruit their friends. I hope you weren't insulted by the reference. Yes, it was the mention of 'getting it' that brought est/Forum to mind. Now I understand your mentor was a therapist and the outlook thinking is used in a residential substance abuse program. Thanks for providing the background-- it helps to have a context for your posts.
Posted by Dr. Rod on November 24, 2003, at 11:44:43
In reply to Re: Not a Life Sentence » Dr. Rod, posted by tabitha on November 24, 2003, at 2:27:38
FYI --- David Peck started looking at Affective Disorder folk more closely After he had his heart attack and decided to retire from his thriving (and stress filled) practice, where he managed a team of six therapist... Can you imagine requirements of doing sessions 4 to 12 hours per day and keeping 6 other therapists on track???
Interesting to me was his portrayal of phobias being so foreign to him when he started his practice, that he didn't know what people were talking about... In his family of seven kids and a minister father, no one seemed to exhibit phobic tendencies... So in the 20 years of his active practice he hadn't gotten a satisfactory answer to the question, "Why phobias"...
You and I can benefit from what he did during the 15 years before his unfortunate passing... He found the underlying connections to most, if not all, mental difficulties... During his life, he was verbally attacked, even by his siblings, yet persevered to an "astonishing results"... I am so sad that he had to go without at least a glimmer of the success he so deserved... I feel so proud and lucky to have been a participant and contributor to the results...
It was logical to me that I might have a positive effect on Affective Disorder folks, since I had been so heavily steeped in that genre'... So that's why I'm hear...
I have discovered a simple motto:
Personal strength is the ability to withstand...
Personal power is the ability to make a difference...I'm here to make a difference...
Posted by shar on November 25, 2003, at 14:22:59
In reply to Not a Life Sentence, posted by Dr. Rod on November 22, 2003, at 11:22:37
'cept when it keeps on happening all your life, I guess.
Shar
> Affective Disorders need not be thought of as a life sentence in the jail of your mind... The symptoms are ambiguous on a good day, so expectations are not met and frustration sets in...
>
> All recovery is a process, never an event... Passing through a threshold of recovery leaves you feeling that you had a recovery event... You feel all giddy with success, until another demon arrives at the door... What you may forget to honor in yourself is that the last success gave you practice and strategies for the next demon, no matter how vile and hidious...
>
> I like to say, "While you are healing, we are watching, lovingly"... The "Outcome Thinking" project did have a beginning, a middle, and an end... Luckily the end came before my mentor David Peck passed away, the research and the results are complete... Carefully administered, the techniques and strategies we developed and perfected, can continue to produce the "got it" success for 7 out of 8 people...
>
> That was a 6 month live-in program... Would a 30 day at-large program producing 1 success out of 8 people be enough??? How about 5 out of 8???
>
>
>
>
Posted by Dr. Rod on November 25, 2003, at 15:35:35
In reply to Re: Not a Life Sentence » Dr. Rod, posted by shar on November 25, 2003, at 14:22:59
...assuming that tomorrow has to be like yesterday...
Posted by shar on November 25, 2003, at 20:41:26
In reply to What kinda life is that... » shar, posted by Dr. Rod on November 25, 2003, at 15:35:35
> ...assuming that tomorrow has to be like yesterday...
Good point, Doc.
At 51, so many tomorrows have been like yesterday, tho' I know there MAY be a different outcome, it seems ever so unlikely.
I 'appreciate' your point, it just seems so very, very unlikely.
Shar
This is the end of the thread.
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