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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 27 to 51 of 60. Go back in thread:
Posted by Poet on September 1, 2006, at 23:50:20
In reply to Re: Hired Someone Else- Interview Cancelled, posted by Phillipa on September 1, 2006, at 20:12:54
Hi Phillipa,
No one else was there to be interviewed. I did send a thank you letter and included a brochure I'd created for another job because the lawyer said she'd like someone who could do things like that. Maybe she hated it. Though she got the letter and brochure before I got the second interview.
I don't think salary was the issue as the job paid more than I currently make and I told her what my salary is.
Not being able to find out what the person they hired had and I don't is what really hurts. A friend actually called and inquired about the job to try to find out, but was only told it was filled.
Keep those ideas coming. I need all the help I can get.
Poet
Posted by Poet on September 1, 2006, at 23:54:19
In reply to Re: I agree, posted by finelinebob on September 1, 2006, at 20:21:08
Her majesty does not carry monetary funds on her person. She is afraid you will have to go forth and be successful. She regrets she cannot join you in this endeavor, but her loyalty to her subjects prevents it.
Q of EL
Posted by Poet on September 2, 2006, at 0:01:43
In reply to Re: Second Job Interview » Poet, posted by Dinah on September 1, 2006, at 22:29:09
Hi Dinah,
I get many first interviews, but the only time I've gotten a second one is when I'm going to be offered the job. That's what is so devastating about this job. I really let myself think I had it. Of course, positive thinking leads to negative results, I should know that by now. There's good reason I'm a pessimist.
Deep down I know that success in life is different than success in employment. It's just crazy me can't get that deep down knowledge to surface. Think therapy would help? My poor T, she's on vacation. I left her a message on Monday when I got the interview and another one on Thursday when it was cancelled. She called me today.
Thanks for the encouragement. I need it as I am really ready to throw in that soggy towel.
Poet
Posted by finelinebob on September 2, 2006, at 0:25:25
In reply to Re: I agree » finelinebob, posted by Poet on September 1, 2006, at 23:54:19
> Her majesty does not carry monetary funds on her person. She is afraid you will have to go forth and be successful. She regrets she cannot join you in this endeavor, but her loyalty to her subjects prevents it.
>
> Q of ELSee? SEE?! I falied AGAIN! What self-respecting overload would put up with that sort of behavior from his vassals?
I win! ;^)
Posted by Racer on September 2, 2006, at 2:10:10
In reply to Re: Hired Someone Else- Interview Cancelled » Racer, posted by Dinah on September 1, 2006, at 21:48:16
> Uh oh. That would mean you don't think too highly of me. :(
OMG! Say it ain't so!
Dinah, I think that's one of those things I just don't want to know about you, if you're suggesting what I think you're suggesting... I like you too much to want to know that about you, you know?
Never mind. I'm tired, depressed, etc. Going to BED!
Posted by Dinah on September 2, 2006, at 8:37:54
In reply to Say it ain't so! » Dinah, posted by Racer on September 2, 2006, at 2:10:10
Admittedly, I was never paid for my endeavors.
I had a heck of a good time, though.
Posted by Dinah on September 2, 2006, at 8:48:40
In reply to Say it ain't so! » Dinah, posted by Racer on September 2, 2006, at 2:10:10
I think maybe my self esteem might be suffering.
Good thing for my pride.
Posted by Dinah on September 2, 2006, at 9:27:50
In reply to Re: Second Job Interview » Dinah, posted by Poet on September 2, 2006, at 0:01:43
> Deep down I know that success in life is different than success in employment. It's just crazy me can't get that deep down knowledge to surface.
Well, overall I think I'm glad you have a deep down knowledge that can't get to the surface instead of a superficial knowledge that won't seep deep down. :)
Perhaps you could have a list of people you know or know of on hand. People who are very successful in a career sense, but who you would not consider particularly successful in areas where you most definitely are, and that you value in yourself. It could be sort of a mantra.
Posted by Poet on September 2, 2006, at 16:10:12
In reply to Re: Second Job Interview » Poet, posted by Dinah on September 2, 2006, at 9:27:50
Hi Dinah,
I can try. Not this weekend. I need to lick my wounds. My T is on vacation, I don't see her until Sept. 14, so I may end up at Camp Comfort. She did call me yesterday. It's not like she can get me a job, but she understands why I'm so down. Poor thing, a nice vacation ruined by a depressed Poet.
Poet
Posted by Racer on September 2, 2006, at 16:54:22
In reply to Re: Second Job Interview, posted by Poet on September 2, 2006, at 16:10:12
That's pretty good advice, what Dinah suggested. Despite her sordid past, she's a smart one...
I'd also suggest the inverse of it: make a list of people you admire or respect or like who have NOT suceeded in the employment world. You can use people like Ogden Nash, who really didn't do all that well writing advertising copy; or you can use people you know, like FineLineBob, who's got so much going for him, but claims to be the ultimate employment loser. Ask yourself which list contains people with the attributes you value most.
Another option is just plain to write down everything that you think career success would bring you. What does it really mean to you?
For what it's worth, despite things like not being able to support myself, etc, teaching horseback riding made me feel much more successful than being assistant accounting manager at a huge, international law firm. ;-)
Posted by Deneb on September 2, 2006, at 20:32:17
In reply to Hired Someone Else- Interview Cancelled, posted by Poet on August 31, 2006, at 15:32:58
Hi Poet,
I think you can recognize that saying you are a loser is a distortion in thought.
Would you think all the other applicants are losers? I don't think you would. What makes you different?
It takes a lot of guts to go through job interviews and you obviously did well at that first interview.
I have a lot of trouble with thinking I'm a loser too. I should have graduated already, but I haven't and so I think I'm a loser.
My self esteem and self worth shouldn't be contingent on my achievements. I am of value even if I flunk out of university.
Deneb*
Posted by Jost on September 2, 2006, at 20:51:43
In reply to Re: Second Job Interview » Poet, posted by Racer on September 2, 2006, at 16:54:22
Can you imagine Van Gogh on a job interview?
Interviewer: "Uh, Sir, could you explain the seeming absence of part of one of your ears? It was not in any way the cause of your losing your last job, I hope?"
VG: I haven't had time for a job; for the past years I've devoted myself singlemindedly to the pursuit of my art, to the love of all that is spiritual, and to the passionate attempt to learn how to draw. Also paint. I have also spent some time in a fine institution on the other side of town. I was forced to cut off part of my ear due to the pain I experienced upn being abandoned by my master and co-worker, a fellow seeker named Paul Gaugin, who.....
I: I see!?
VG: Yes! That ingrate, whom I loved as a brother and compatriot, sojourned here to the countryside to be my collaborator in the development of a new....
I: Har-umph! Sir! Sir!.."
.VG: .."a new and remarkable school of painting and the...
I: My Good Sir! Thank you for your time, Sir..... Guards.....!!!"
VG: But!... I must explain!: my love for Gaugin and his terrible abandonment....
I: (loudly) Next?"
Jost
Posted by Poet on September 4, 2006, at 0:00:42
In reply to Re: Hired Someone Else- Interview Cancelled » Poet, posted by Deneb on September 2, 2006, at 20:32:17
Hi Deneb,
You are right that self esteem and self worth shouldn't be contingent on achievements. I just can't seem to find what will give me either of them.
You're also right that my saying that I am a loser is distortion in thought. I started therapy because I wanted help accepting failure. As I wrote that I immediately thought, I'm a loser in therapy, too.
Why can't I just think like a normal person on career? I'll be in therapy forever. Sigh.
Poet
Posted by Poet on September 4, 2006, at 0:04:30
In reply to Re: Second Job Interview » Poet, posted by Racer on September 2, 2006, at 16:54:22
Hi Racer,
Dinah is pretty darn smart. So are you.
I can try writing what career success would bring me, but it won't be easy. Because I know it would bring me happiness and nothing else will. Go ahead, hit me.
Poet
Posted by Poet on September 4, 2006, at 0:07:14
In reply to Re: Second Job Interview, posted by Jost on September 2, 2006, at 20:51:43
Hi Jost,
Thank you for making me laugh at my own negative thinking.
At least I have both my ears, so that's not why I got turned down...
Poet
Posted by Racer on September 4, 2006, at 0:32:17
In reply to Good advice » Racer, posted by Poet on September 4, 2006, at 0:04:30
> Hi Racer,
>
> Dinah is pretty darn smart. So are you.
>
> I can try writing what career success would bring me, but it won't be easy. Because I know it would bring me happiness and nothing else will. Go ahead, hit me.
>
> PoetS'OK, when I read your first sentence, my first thought was, "fat lot of good *that* does me..." Guess we flock together, huh?
Listen, here's a deal for you:
You're funny as [torrid climate], and I've been saying for ages that my nightmare would be exorcised if I could make it into a novel. Why don't we egg each other on and write those dang things? You can write a screenplay, or a fully volume of poetry, or a novel, or a 250 page grocery list, for that matter! I'll write what happened to me, and call my heroine something we'd both like -- we could work that out.
It might not improve anything for either of us, and I still might wake up at 4AM shaking and crying, and you still might work for a company with "F" in its name -- but it would give us some focus, and a reason for weekly updates, right?
Besides, we might become rich and famous -- and have to retire our crowns, step down from our rightful places in the pantheon of losers...
Posted by Jost on September 4, 2006, at 1:07:19
In reply to {Pow!} Let's Make A Deal » Poet, posted by Racer on September 4, 2006, at 0:32:17
Posted by Poet on September 4, 2006, at 17:57:11
In reply to {Pow!} Let's Make A Deal » Poet, posted by Racer on September 4, 2006, at 0:32:17
Hi Racer,
I'm game. First we need a title. Then a lead character. Then some support characters...
Poet
Posted by llrrrpp on September 6, 2006, at 23:07:12
In reply to Re: {Pow!} Let's Make A Deal » Racer, posted by Poet on September 4, 2006, at 17:57:11
I think it's going to be awesome.
Will there be a recipe for crab cakes?
With there be an opportunity for me to write in my name?
"THIS BOOK BELONGS TO ______llrrrpp_______"
?
fondly, to my favorite poet, and my favorite essayist/(narrator? well, you know what I mean- paragraphs/stories/tall tales/epics
I will even buy a new bookmark to mark my place.
can I do some calligraphy for one of the illustrations?yours fondly, in happy anticipation and vivid imagination,
-ll
Posted by Jost on September 6, 2006, at 23:33:12
In reply to Re: {Pow!} Let's Make A Deal » Racer, posted by Poet on September 4, 2006, at 17:57:11
Okay:
Two people who live near one another, although they don't know it, become friends on a psychology message board.Here are two plot ideas:
One: they correspond on the Message board , revealing increasingly intimate details of their lives, etc, and interacting with some other characters on the message boards. Meanwhile their lives go through career disappointments and re-structuring, and the vicissitudes of living with husbands, cats, a meeting with a difficult, but inspiring math teacher who initially is skeptical of the student's aspirations, but who, as a deep thinker and spirit, takes the student under her wing, on trips to Europe (or Canada, or wherever) and adopting her as a spiritual "goddaughter."
There is some sort of sexual tension, but neither teacher or student pursues it, except the student, after doing brilliant work, and moving through struggles about ambition and risk, finally leaves to pursue a graduate education in Math.
Meanwhile our other heroine, initially, dejected by her career failures, and the discouragements of various headhunters, realizes that her true life vocation is as a healer ,and poet. She writes a book of poetry about her infatuation with her online friend, whom she calls her "Light Woman." It is a difficult book of lyric invention, but startles the poetry world, with its inventive wordplay and golden-tongued odic structure.
Suddenly, the two meet, on the plane where one is travelling to her new graduate future, and the other is on a book tour to read a the 92nd st. Y in New York.....
(or you could go for a darker plot/ending, but maybe not...)
There's another plot, but it's a bit more exotic.
Jost
Posted by Poet on September 7, 2006, at 9:00:34
In reply to Re: {Pow!} Let's Make A Deal » Poet, posted by llrrrpp on September 6, 2006, at 23:07:12
Hi llrrrpp,
Right now I can guarantee you that there 's a place for you to write you name, because all we have is blank pages. ;)
Chef Racer will have to come up with the crab cakes recipe. I have problems not burning toast. Hey, maybe it could be mystery: the Crab Cake Conspiracy? If we have illustrations I'm sure we could use some crab cake calligraphy.
I am getting way ahead of myself. We don't even have characters. Am I obsessed with the letter C today or what?
Poet
Posted by Poet on September 7, 2006, at 9:04:48
In reply to Re: {Pow!} Let's Make A Deal » Poet, posted by Jost on September 6, 2006, at 23:33:12
Hi Jost,
I can't even come up with beginnings that aren't dark.
I like your story, maybe if you just add a few chapters and sign my name to the contract...
Just out of curiosity how exotic is the other story?
Poet
Posted by Jost on September 7, 2006, at 14:03:59
In reply to Re: {Pow!} Let's Make A Deal » Jost, posted by Poet on September 7, 2006, at 9:04:48
Although fiction doesn't have to be autobiographical.
But it could be dark, too.
Give me a few minutes and I'll re-work it. (Are we going for a popular, commercially-successful type of novel, or a more serious, "critically-successful" type?)
If I recall (dimly), I was thinking, the two posters on the message board would each be posting, using names of the other gender-- so the woman would be posting with a male name and and the man would be posting with a female name-- or we (or should I say, you) could do two women posting with men's names--but I thought maybe that wasn't so appealing, although it could have a cult (or more specialized) audience.
The question is how to interweave that with the RLives, so that they were posting about their actual lives, but somehow transposing the details--also what it's like to think of yourself as of a nother gender and how to present that-- but I mean not in a politically correct or stereotypical way-- which I wouldn't like and would be horribly formulaic-- but if you just went with it-
And I guess somehow they would meet and recognize something about one another-- could be gimmicky-- but if you didn't go with the gimmick, but just used it more seriously, it might (or might not) go somewhere.
I'm not sure.
I can come up with other ideas. Ihe dark thing is probably the most interesting-- but I didn't want to suggest that because it could be depressing, which would be counter-productive-- I think-- or could be. Not too dark, but darkish-- but I won't sign on to a super-dark ending, or a vague, ambiguous, who knows ending-- maybe a more Henry Jamesian ending (whatever that is...)
Jost
Posted by llrrrpp on September 7, 2006, at 14:12:56
In reply to Re: {Pow!} Let's Make A Deal » Poet, posted by Jost on September 7, 2006, at 14:03:59
Successful, schmuchcessful.
I don't care about critics, or nothing. I just wanna book that has some interesting things in it, and some personality. I just wanna read or look at something that makes me think and want to think.
It shouldn't be too hard, knowing Racer and Poet. They are awfully good at communicating using words. But they might freak out if they have to fill up 300 blank pages to satisfy some publisher!
I like the format Jost proposes: a series of posts to each other. anonymous on the WWW, revealing, yet concealing. And then, some day, the mental picture we have of a post-er coincides with the reality of the person we meet in real life. And there is a frightening, exhilharating nexxus where art and life stop imitating each other.
-ll
Posted by Jost on September 7, 2006, at 16:36:44
In reply to Re: {Pow!} Let's Make A Deal » Jost, posted by llrrrpp on September 7, 2006, at 14:12:56
Thanks, Ll!
I liked the idea of posts, because some of the early novels were in the form of letters-- and there's the added element of how one creates oneself-- or imagines oneself, esp in narrating oneself to oneself and to other people-- and the internet makes it more possible-- because in the epistolary novel, the people were supposedly already individual, formed selves, writing to someone who knew them-- also, it make me wonder how the way one images oneself is subject to conscious (or partly conscious) modification, and also whether the modifications can produce real change (maybe-- or maybe not? but it's a subject, anyway)
There were these early epistolary novels-- and they're really great--
It's a way that I think a contemporary novelist could get so much more into the inner lives of characters-- without having to be omnipotent, or use an artifiical, third person-- or an uncomfortable first person--
I think it could work--
Probably my favorite novel is Clarissa--- which is one of those-- but it's also probably the longest novel in the English language-- (there is an abridged version, which is pretty long, but it's such an amazing book--or I thought so a while back)
But of course you (Poet and Racer) would need your own subject-- so I'm interested-- what subject(s), characters, or situations, would each of you be interested in???
Jost
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