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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by bleauberry on June 11, 2010, at 17:51:08
In reply to Turmeric, posted by Lao Tzu on June 11, 2010, at 9:47:53
> Anybody experience a difference in mood from using turmeric? I don't know if it would help. Any experiences? So far, I've heard that cinnamon and garlic have a positive impact on mood, but wondering if turmeric has any positive benefits.
Turmeric is supposedly helpful in that it is an MAO inhibitor. It is also anti-inflammation. I've never actually heard of anyone claiming it did that in any kind of amazing fashion, but it is widely touted on the net.
I discovered that it made me feel absolutely horrible. It felt to me like Moclobemide did. I do really bad on anything that is just MAOI-A and that's what it felt like to me. Not only that, but inflammation I had under some kind of managibility just flared up big time on turmeric. So you can't always believe what you read. Mileage varies.
That said, it is worth a try for everyone as I see it.
Posted by janejane on June 12, 2010, at 19:58:16
In reply to Turmeric, posted by Lao Tzu on June 11, 2010, at 9:47:53
Hey guess what. I just started seeing a TCM (traditional Chinese medicine) doc for my depression and it turns out one of the herbs she gave me is turmeric (yu jin). How's that for a coincidence? I don't think I'll get headaches since I'm no longer taking rhodiola (which also increases serotonin) or any meds right now.
Posted by sigismund on June 12, 2010, at 23:30:53
In reply to Re: Turmeric » Lao Tzu, posted by janejane on June 12, 2010, at 19:58:16
The sources of insomnia are ubiquitous and mysterious but I had a theory going that curcumin aggravated it for me. Good stuff though.
Posted by Phillipa on June 13, 2010, at 12:39:38
In reply to Re: Turmeric » Lao Tzu, posted by janejane on June 12, 2010, at 19:58:16
No more rhodalia at all? Phillipa
Posted by morganator on June 13, 2010, at 14:48:52
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by sigismund on June 12, 2010, at 23:30:53
Curcumin is known to boost serotonin and promote neurogensis.
This is an interesting thread on M and M.
Posted by Phillipa on June 13, 2010, at 19:48:32
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by morganator on June 13, 2010, at 14:48:52
Is sounds like not much it doesn't do. Thanks for the link. Phillipa
Posted by janejane on June 14, 2010, at 10:39:42
In reply to Re: Turmeric » janejane, posted by Phillipa on June 13, 2010, at 12:39:38
No, want to give the Chinese herbs a chance. Need to know any improvement is not due to rhodiola.
Posted by morganator on June 14, 2010, at 17:53:47
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by janejane on June 14, 2010, at 10:39:42
> No, want to give the Chinese herbs a chance. Need to know any improvement is not due to rhodiola.
What chinese herbs are you trying?
Posted by janejane on June 15, 2010, at 4:48:59
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by morganator on June 14, 2010, at 17:53:47
> What chinese herbs are you trying?
>bai shao
shan yao
fu ling
bai zhu
wu wei zi
mai dong
dang gui
yu jin
yuan zhiIt's a customized blend of raw herbs that the doc made for me. Yu jin is the turmeric. I'm also doing acupuncture. It's been less than a week so not much to report yet, but if TCM works for me, I'll definitely post about it.
Posted by Hombre on June 15, 2010, at 4:57:20
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by morganator on June 14, 2010, at 17:53:47
Curcuma
yujin
regulates flow of qi, dissolves qi stagnation, disperses stagnant blood
Although curcuma is best known for its ability to vitalize circulation of qi and blood, it enters into several formulas for brain disorders because it is also considered useful in treating phlegm accumulation disorders, especially when there is a heat syndrome.
---
A relatively complex look at the herbs and formulas used in TCM for mind and brain disorders:
Posted by Hombre on June 15, 2010, at 6:25:19
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by Hombre on June 15, 2010, at 4:57:20
Apparently yu jin/curcuma is not the same as turmeric/jiang huang ("yellow ginger"). There is some confusion in the use of the common names of these two similar but not identical herbs in Chinese medicine.
http://www.itmonline.org/arts/turmeri3.htm
"Turmeric is reported to be especially useful for treating pain syndrome (8), including pain in the chest and hypochondriac region, amenorrhea with abdominal pain, injury pain, and bi syndrome, especially in the shoulders. This last indication is the reason for its inclusion in Juanbi Tang, which is indicated for pain, especially in the neck, shoulder, and upper back."
"Curcuma, aside from vitalizing blood circulation, is used to regulate qi, cool the blood and clear heat, and facilitate gallbladder function. Because of its ability to regulate qialong with its cool energy and its activating effect on the gallbladdercurcuma is sometimes used as a substitute for bupleurum*. Some doctors suggest that bupleurum can have an action that is too harsh, while curcuma has a similar but gentler action. Like turmeric, it is used for pain in the chest, hypochondriac region, and abdomen, and dysmenorrhea. Unlike turmeric, it is not indicated for bi syndrome. Unlike both turmeric and zedoaria, it is indicated for ***accumulation of turbidity that causes mental disorders***[emphasis added], for jaundice, and for spontaneous bleeding (due to blood heat)."
*bupleurum is used to remove liver stagnation, the #1 cause of depression according to TCM
"Yujin: To promote flow of qi, to eliminate blood stasis, ***to calm the nerves and ease the mind, and increase the flow of bile***. Indications: amenorrhea, dysmenorrhea, distending or pricking pain in chest and abdomen; impairment of consciousness in febrile diseases; epilepsy; mania; jaundice with dark urine."
* the gall bladder and liver have to do with being able to make plans and having the "gall", or the guts, to carry them out. dysfunction of these systems could manifest as the inability to form long term plans, or to make lots of plans and not be able to carry them out...sound familiar?
"As can be seen from the formula applications, in most cases the herbs are used in accordance with their reported unique properties; hence, curcuma tends to be used for heat syndromes, and ***especially those with neurological effects and/or phlegm accumulation;***"
* phlegm -> depression, brain fog
"The common name turmeric, if it is to be used at all, should always apply to jianghuang, which should be derived from Curcuma longa. According to the original naming system developed by OHAI, curcuma should be the common name for yujin and it should be derived from Curcuma aromatica, while zedoaria should be the common name for ezhu which is derived from either Curcuma zedoaria or Curcuma kwangsinensis. Using the pinyin will help avoid some confusion, but students and practitioners of Chinese herbal medicine should also recognize the somewhat fluid nature of herb selection for making prescriptions and the use of substitute materials in different regions of China."
Salud,
Hombre
Posted by morganator on June 15, 2010, at 9:43:31
In reply to Re: Turmeric » morganator, posted by janejane on June 15, 2010, at 4:48:59
Cool thanks. Good luck!!!
I just want to report that I more than doubled my fish oil intake and I am sure it has helped me feel so much better already. I'm taking Carlson's Salmon Oil. I bet your already taking fish oil.
Posted by janejane on June 15, 2010, at 11:04:41
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by Hombre on June 15, 2010, at 6:25:19
Thanks for the clarification, H. I need to check out that site. By the way, yes those symptoms sound familiar. ;-)
P.S. I really appreciate the fresh perspective you bring to this board. Your contributions have been invaluable.
Posted by janejane on June 15, 2010, at 11:08:14
In reply to Re: Turmeric » janejane, posted by morganator on June 15, 2010, at 9:43:31
> Cool thanks. Good luck!!!
>
> I just want to report that I more than doubled my fish oil intake and I am sure it has helped me feel so much better already. I'm taking Carlson's Salmon Oil. I bet your already taking fish oil.Can't take it daily because it makes me anxious (I think) and causes oily skin. Have you tried krill oil? It's supposed to pack a bigger punch, plus it includes PS. You might want to read up on it. (Unfortunately, it had similar side effects to fish oil for me. I've mean meaning to take it just intermittently, but I keep forgetting!)
Posted by morganator on June 15, 2010, at 11:23:58
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by janejane on June 15, 2010, at 11:08:14
> > Cool thanks. Good luck!!!
> >
> > I just want to report that I more than doubled my fish oil intake and I am sure it has helped me feel so much better already. I'm taking Carlson's Salmon Oil. I bet your already taking fish oil.
>
> Can't take it daily because it makes me anxious (I think) and causes oily skin. Have you tried krill oil? It's supposed to pack a bigger punch, plus it includes PS. You might want to read up on it. (Unfortunately, it had similar side effects to fish oil for me. I've mean meaning to take it just intermittently, but I keep forgettingMaybe try products with high EPA to DHA ratios and then try products with high DHA to EPA rations to see if there is a difference. What is the PS in krill oil? Phosphatydil Serine? I want to take krill on top of fish oil but it just seems too expensive and I am skeptical as to whether it really is that much better. Thanks for the suggestion though!
Posted by bobman on June 19, 2010, at 22:40:10
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by morganator on June 14, 2010, at 17:53:47
I've been taking turmeric for close to a year, and I notice as much of an improvement from it as I ever have from aed's & ad's. Better, because it isn't so much that I have some sort of relief from depression, and with it all the mood flattening and feeling like the drug is causing my mood, I simply feel healthier, and looking back, I realize I've been remarkably mentally strong, and experienced no depression, despite having quit cymbalta + lamictal in that period.
I've been taking gotu kola as well, so it has difficult to separate the effect, but I can now notice an effect when I take turmeric. Both affect the mind in very positive ways.
FYI, I wouldn't take curcumin extracts. They are <5% bio-available, unless taken with black pepper, but for maximal absorption they really need fats. Turmeric provides what logically seems the perfect carrier for bio-available curcumin, and this is supported by studies on absorption. Furthermore, the "ideal" curcumin dose is very low. In the only study on curcumin neurogenesis, 1mg/kg is the only dose which promoted neural progenitor proliferation (.5mg/kg and 10mg/kg were innefective). Furthermore, higher doses of curcumin, like 10mg/kg, are apoptotic to stem cells, so I would definitely avoid high doses.
You can pick up Frontier Coop's high quality turmeric with 5% minimum curcumin content, and take what a normal Indian would, about 1 teaspoon a day. That gives you roughly the right amount of curcumin for neurogenesis, a notion supported by at least 1 cadaever study on long term effects of Indian diet (of which turmeric is one of the few regular neuroprotective/regenerative substances).
Posted by desolationrower on June 22, 2010, at 12:28:28
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by bobman on June 19, 2010, at 22:40:10
2 tsp tumeric
1 tsp fish sauce
1/2 tsp cardmom
1/2 tsp nutmeg
a few grates of ginger
1/3 cup besan
enough water to make about crepe batter thickness (maybe 2/3)let sit, it will thicken. may need to mix in a bit more water.
pour onto hot pan, then reduce temp. time depends on how thick it is, i like it like a thin pancake.
sometimes make it with herbs, more like a socca.
-d/r
Posted by Lao Tzu on June 22, 2010, at 12:43:28
In reply to Turmeric, posted by Lao Tzu on June 11, 2010, at 9:47:53
Ordered it last week. Haven't gotten it yet, but I will post my experience with it soon.
Posted by morganator on June 22, 2010, at 14:11:32
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by Lao Tzu on June 22, 2010, at 12:43:28
I am torn over what the best form of turmeric/curcumin supplementation is. Some believe that the highly concentrated curcurmin extracts are not as good as a full spectrum turmeric extract. Because of this I am trying New Chapter's Turmeric Force. I was more inclined to try high potency extracts like BCM-95, but now I'm wondering if there is too much bioavailable curcumin in products like this. I'm hoping that a super critical full spectrum turmeric extract properly delivers just enough curcumin to make a difference. Then there is the possibility that there are other things in the turmeric that have beneficial properties.
Posted by Lao Tzu on June 27, 2010, at 20:25:33
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by Lao Tzu on June 22, 2010, at 12:43:28
Tried the Turmeric two days ago. Didn't think it did anything special for me. Was verging on a headache. Maybe I need to give it a longer trial, but don't think it will help. Oh, well! On to Holy Basil!
Posted by former poster on July 18, 2010, at 23:03:46
In reply to Turmeric, posted by Lao Tzu on June 11, 2010, at 9:47:53
I added Curcumin to my cocktail 2 weeks ago. I noticed after about a week my rage is under control. I don't get deep sadness, suicidal thoughts, sleep has improved. I am also on Bupropion, Vyvanse, Clonazepam.
Posted by janejane on July 19, 2010, at 18:03:37
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by bobman on June 19, 2010, at 22:40:10
How do you take the tumeric? Do you put it into capsules? I understand the powder causes staining. And how do you take the gotu kola? Thanks!
Posted by janejane on July 19, 2010, at 21:32:29
In reply to Re: Turmeric » bobman, posted by janejane on July 19, 2010, at 18:03:37
Interesting note at the end about taking it with vitamin D.
Posted by janejane on July 20, 2010, at 10:12:14
In reply to Re: Turmeric + Altheimers, posted by janejane on July 19, 2010, at 21:32:29
Sorry, I wanted to correct that typo. I came across that article last night, remembered the tumeric thread and sort of posted it in haste as hubby was calling me away from the computer. Now I wish I hadn't posted it at all because I looked at it again and discovered that the study they referred to was from 2001! So this is old info. A much better summary of the benefits of curcumin was given in the M&M link given by Morgan. (Thanks for that, by the way. It was very informative.)
Posted by Chris O on January 17, 2014, at 17:19:12
In reply to Re: Turmeric, posted by bobman on June 19, 2010, at 22:40:10
Bobman:
You still getting noticeable anti-depressant effects from turmeric?
Chris
This is the end of the thread.
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