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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 25 to 49 of 49. Go back in thread:
Posted by AuntieMel on September 3, 2004, at 23:11:11
In reply to Re: Being Compassionate » JenStar, posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2004, at 21:52:40
Posted by alesta on September 3, 2004, at 23:25:19
In reply to Re: Being Compassionate, posted by JenStar on September 2, 2004, at 13:27:32
<I'm not poking fun or insults at anyone who suggested a petition; please don't read that into my notes.
well, i don't think anyone was reading that into your notes..but it sure looks like you are poking fun and insulting now...i don't appreciate your "cleverly disguised" insult...*i'm* the one who started the petition. if you're aiming to hit a nerve, well you have succeeded.
amy
Posted by alesta on September 3, 2004, at 23:26:54
In reply to Re: Being Compassionate, posted by alesta on September 3, 2004, at 23:25:19
Posted by AuntieMel on September 3, 2004, at 23:55:32
In reply to Re: Being Compassionate, posted by alesta on September 3, 2004, at 23:25:19
I'm sorry, but I didn't read it that way at all. I hate putting words in someone else's mouth, but I'm going to do it anyway(smile)
What Jen seems to me to be saying is that exceptions can make enforcement a lot trickier. The paragraph above it was using a petition, plus a lot of other things as an example of how complicated it can get.
And I think that Jen, who is a very sensitive person, added the bit about not poking fun because she was genuinely worried about it. I've never known her to be mean, and it's hard for me to think she is being mean in this case.
It's been a long day and a long struggle. I think we all need some rest.
Peace?
Posted by Dr. Bob on September 4, 2004, at 1:38:19
In reply to This wears on me, too » Atticus, posted by AuntieMel on September 3, 2004, at 17:31:56
> I also think that when people cluster to see an issues as "Dr. Bob vs XX poster" it can be a rebellion against the authority of Dr. Bob as the overseer, a desire to draw him out into deeper conversation or to have him show personal feeling/thoughts (which makes him into a peer), or to express frustration with the fact that although he runs this board and he's a doctor, he's unavailable for personal assistance.
>
> JenStarThose are interesting theories, thanks for sharing your reflections on this...
--
> I guess I was hoping Dr. Bob would answer my questions.
Sorry, let me try to go back...
> What *was* chemist's block for.
See:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20040717/msgs/384795.html
> It's the subjective ones I have real problems with.
>
> conviction should be based on 'beyond a reasonable doubt.'
>
> AuntieMelWouldn't reasonable be subjective, too?
Bob
Posted by AuntieMel on September 4, 2004, at 9:26:14
In reply to Re: This wears on me, too, posted by Dr. Bob on September 4, 2004, at 1:38:19
Maybe that's where the jury system comes in:)
Posted by alesta on September 4, 2004, at 10:22:18
In reply to Re: This wears on me, too, posted by Dr. Bob on September 4, 2004, at 1:38:19
dr. bob,
i think that if you would have just been specific from the beginning and let us know what the exact reason *was*, it would have saved us all a lot of heartache..i don't know why we are even discussing this with you if we aren't going to get anywhere. you argued with me over some points, finally agreed that my points were good ones, and that's it? so i got through to you, but now nothing's happening...what was the point of all this "discussion" then?
amy
Posted by Dinah on September 4, 2004, at 10:26:53
In reply to Re: This wears on me, too, posted by Dr. Bob on September 4, 2004, at 1:38:19
This may sound odd, but thank you for admitting that. I think it's something we sometimes infer from your posts, but is easy to overlook.
It certainly helps me to understand a bit better if I keep that in mind.
Posted by alesta on September 4, 2004, at 10:32:36
In reply to Re: Being Compassionate » alesta, posted by AuntieMel on September 3, 2004, at 23:55:32
yes, i do want peace, too, but i know a backhanded insult when i see one. i am not feeling very *peaceful* after reading her disguised insult. she may have fooled some people here, but she hasn't fooled me. i respectfully disagree.
Posted by Dinah on September 4, 2004, at 10:36:49
In reply to dr. bob, posted by alesta on September 4, 2004, at 10:22:18
I don't think it's intentional on Dr. Bob's part. I think he doesn't always understand what we want from him, especially in longer posts. I find I get the most coherent explanations if I state my question as briefly as possible, wait for an answer and determine what page Dr. Bob is on, then reframe my question (again briefly) to thank him but to explain that it didn't quite answer my question, which was more xxxx. At some point our understandings often (though not always) meet, and I understand what he's thinking even if I don't agree and vice versa. Not always though, I must admit. Once I understand what he's thinking, I sometimes try to convert him to my point of view. That doesn't work nearly as often. :)
Dr. Bob is generally a patient man, and if I am equally patient, I can often (though by no means always) get answers. Maybe not the answers I want, but ones I can understand. But I really don't think it's purposeful on his part. It might be a function of how busy he is. Or it might be that he doesn't hear the way I write.
Posted by alesta on September 4, 2004, at 11:10:26
In reply to Re: dr. bob, posted by Dinah on September 4, 2004, at 10:36:49
> I don't think it's intentional on Dr. Bob's part. I think he doesn't always understand what we want from him, especially in longer posts.
I’m not saying it was intentional..i’m not attacking dr. bob..i’m just trying to keep us on track and remind him of what the purpose was for these discussions in the first place..I’m not doing all of this for my health :)a couple of days ago, everyone here was attacking dr. bob and upset with him. this upset me. i posted a few nice comments about dr. bob, basically saying that he was not a bad guy, but that we simply had an issue that we were discussing. (i wanted all the dr. bob "hate" to stop.) this completely turned the tide around here. and so now everyone is siding with him on this issue and turning on me..i guess that's what i get for caring so much about everyone...i don't dislike dr. bob, i'm not attacking him, but there is an issue that still needs closure here.
all of this discussion has taken a serious toll on me...i am considering leaving this forum for good, b/c i am not receiving the same kind of empathy that i try to give others...
amy
Posted by Dinah on September 4, 2004, at 11:18:30
In reply to Re: Being Compassionate » alesta, posted by AuntieMel on September 3, 2004, at 23:55:32
I have this desire to share something I learned about myself on Babble, but it feels horribly presumptuous of me to do it, so please feel free to ignore the entire post. And please realize that my intentions are good.
When I first came to Babble and for a reasonably long time later, I felt the need to play peacemaker, especially if I cared about all the people involved or if I felt that there was a simple misunderstanding at the core. There were a lot of reasons behind my need, not least of which was that it was my job in my family of origin to do exactly this. And my family of origin let me be very effective in this role.
But I was continually frustrated on Babble. Not only did all the posters not immediately thank me and see the wisdom of what I had to say, but it often (to my intense dismay) led to exchanges in which worse things were said than were said initially.
I'm not saying it never worked. It did sometimes. And I've seen it work when other people did it too. And I've been the recipient where I reacted overly quickly to a post from a poster who, had I reflected, would have been unlikely to say what I thought I read and another poster was able to help me see that I was probably in error.
I have also frequently been in the position where something I said was taken in a way different from how I intended it (I must express myself poorly at times), and I know that a supportive post from another poster really helped me feel better about it. I think I've resolved my internal conflict about that by waiting to see how things play out. Sometimes the posters are able to work it out themselves (unlike my parents). Other times someone is hurt, and I extend support to the hurt poster. That's the response that I figured out was best for me, and I'm certainly not suggesting that the response that is best for you would be similar.
So I'm certainly not condemning the peacemaker role. I just wanted to extend a hand from someone who has been hurt by the role at times. (And probably do a whole lot of projecting onto you, for which I apologize. There's no reason to think you would react the same way I did.) To say please try not to take it personally if it doesn't work and try not to invest too much of yourself into whether or not other people get along. Because it can hurt!
And again, I apologize if I'm being presumptuous.
Posted by Dinah on September 4, 2004, at 11:21:52
In reply to Re: dr. bob » Dinah, posted by alesta on September 4, 2004, at 11:10:26
Here is a prime example of what I was explaining in my post to Mel. :)
I wasn't siding with Dr. Bob against you. I'm sorry if it came across that way. I was agreeing that trying to converse with Dr. Bob can be frustrating at times, and relating the techniques that have helped me do it less frustratingly.
In other words, I was attempting to respond with empathy to you. I'm sorry if that didn't come through in my post.
Posted by Dinah on September 4, 2004, at 11:22:41
In reply to Re: dr. bob, posted by Dinah on September 4, 2004, at 11:21:52
Tho Dr. Bob is of course welcome to read it. :)
Posted by alesta on September 4, 2004, at 11:30:59
In reply to Re: dr. bob, posted by Dinah on September 4, 2004, at 11:21:52
ok, dinah.thanks..:). i am crying at my terminal as we speak..this has all just become way too stressful..i just feel *really* depressed...can anybody help? and please, let's not discuss the block...i need emotional help..
Posted by alesta on September 4, 2004, at 11:45:04
In reply to Re: dr. bob » Dinah, posted by alesta on September 4, 2004, at 11:30:59
hi, again,
i've decided to post on psychobabble for help...thanks :),
amy
Posted by gardenergirl on September 4, 2004, at 13:08:37
In reply to Re: dr. bob, posted by alesta on September 4, 2004, at 11:45:04
Alesta,
I just sent you a babblemail rather than posting.Take care,
gg
Posted by Jai Narayan on September 4, 2004, at 14:50:27
In reply to I'll take a pink elephant - or chocolate (nm), posted by AuntieMel on September 3, 2004, at 23:11:11
I'd like one too.
Hey AuntieMel are you making fun of me again?
xoxox
Jai Narayan
Posted by AuntieMel on September 4, 2004, at 19:41:08
In reply to Re: I'll take a pink elephant - or chocolate, posted by Jai Narayan on September 4, 2004, at 14:50:27
making fun? only in the kindest, gently teasing way:)
Posted by Jai Narayan on September 4, 2004, at 19:53:58
In reply to Re: I'll take a pink elephant - or chocolate » Jai Narayan, posted by AuntieMel on September 4, 2004, at 19:41:08
Posted by AuntieMel on September 4, 2004, at 23:11:34
In reply to Auntie Mel?, posted by Dinah on September 4, 2004, at 11:18:30
Dinah - I know your intentions (as always) are good, and I always like getting advice from you about the mysterious ways of babble. So, please don't ever think of it as presumptious. Though saying that *does* make it sound friend to friend:)
I fully expect to end up in some of the situations that you're speaking of (and already have to some extent) but it usually doesn't bother me, and if it does it doesn't last long.
It's just that I can usually see people getting upset at something that is probably a misunderstanding and could be diffused. And I usually approach it with my logical brain, not the emotional one. I do have a stubborn streak at times - as if you hadn't noticed - and want to follow things through. I also really hate unfinished business, and I get a bit irked when I keep asking a question and don't feel like I get an answer..
I really do appreciate what you are saying and I'll try to detach a bit. But if you see me carrying on way, way longer and see it being a waste of time, could you pipe in with a 'Nice try Mel - you gave it your best shot' and wake me up to the fact that the horse is long dead (grin)
Mel
Posted by Dinah on September 4, 2004, at 23:18:24
In reply to Re: Auntie Mel? » Dinah, posted by AuntieMel on September 4, 2004, at 23:11:34
Posted by AuntieMel on September 4, 2004, at 23:19:28
In reply to Re: This wears on me, too, posted by Dr. Bob on September 4, 2004, at 1:38:19
>>>>>3. I didn't mean to imply he wasn't doing his best. I'm glad he's getting a lot of support, and I'm sorry I wasn't around.
<< He is getting support because he has given support, much, much more than he's getting.
>>>>>4. What happened was unfortunate, but if possible, I'd like to try to focus on getting back on track and moving forward again.
<< Good plan. Where should we start? I believe you have received email? What's next?
Posted by Dr. Bob on September 5, 2004, at 1:51:51
In reply to Re: dr. bob » Dinah, posted by alesta on September 4, 2004, at 11:10:26
> there is an issue that still needs closure here.
What issue is that?
> i know a backhanded insult when i see one... she may have fooled some people here, but she hasn't fooled me.
Sorry, I know this is stressful, but I need to remind you, please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing oneself, please see the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow-ups regarding these issues should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration. They, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by alesta on September 5, 2004, at 2:45:48
In reply to Re: please be civil » alesta, posted by Dr. Bob on September 5, 2004, at 1:51:51
dr. bob,
for my mental health right now, i just wanted to notify you that i will no longer be discussing this issue with you, in case you haven't already read that.
amy
This is the end of the thread.
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