![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 46. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by babbler20 on February 8, 2016, at 15:15:36
Hi, i've been on SSRI's for 23 years. 7 years ago, I developed severe chronic insomnia for the first time ever and my anxiety and depression became much worse. Is it possible that all these years of being on meds fried my receptors and that a break from medication will help me recover from this insomnia? Has anyone had experience with this? I didn't make any changes 7 years ago so the insomnia wasnt and isn't a side effect it is just a problem that first appeared back then
Posted by Lou Pilder on February 8, 2016, at 16:32:56
In reply to Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible, posted by babbler20 on February 8, 2016, at 15:15:36
> Hi, i've been on SSRI's for 23 years. 7 years ago, I developed severe chronic insomnia for the first time ever and my anxiety and depression became much worse. Is it possible that all these years of being on meds fried my receptors and that a break from medication will help me recover from this insomnia? Has anyone had experience with this? I didn't make any changes 7 years ago so the insomnia wasnt and isn't a side effect it is just a problem that first appeared back then
babbler20,
You wrote,[...severe chronic insomnia...anxiety and depression became much worse...Is it possible...that a break from (drugs)will help me recover?...].
You have be been on a Road that has brought you to the sorrows of despair in the mire and dirt tossed about like being in a raging sea. But there is another Road that is like a Sea of Glass, calm, where there is no insomnia or depression or death. And it has been revealed to me that you can be delivered out of the raging sea and be led out with gladness to have a new Road to follow with new garments and a new mind and a new heart a nd a new spirit.
It is not too late to turn around. For it has been revealed to me that if you continue on the road with drugs, you could go further to the end where there is a Great Gulf that you could be standing over that you could fall into a Lake of Fire. And it has been revealed to me that I was there and you looked at me, and I could see that you were way beyond repair. But now you could have a chance with another, when I saw you standing there. Today you could turn around and forsake what you know is causing you these sorrows. For you are correct in that these drugs can cause a worsening of depression and anxiety and induce insomnia.
I have come here to lead people out of the darkness induced into them by the psychiatrist's drugs. This deliverance will break the shackles of addiction and insomnia and depression so that you will be led out with joy and be led forth with peace; the mountains and the hills shall break forth before you into singing; and all the trees of the field will clap their hands.
Lou
Posted by SLS on February 8, 2016, at 17:27:38
In reply to Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible, posted by babbler20 on February 8, 2016, at 15:15:36
> Hi, i've been on SSRI's for 23 years. 7 years ago, I developed severe chronic insomnia for the first time ever and my anxiety and depression became much worse. Is it possible that all these years of being on meds fried my receptors and that a break from medication will help me recover from this insomnia? Has anyone had experience with this? I didn't make any changes 7 years ago so the insomnia wasnt and isn't a side effect it is just a problem that first appeared back then
My position on this is that ADs can produce changes that persist. One example of this is the ability of an AD to produce a remission that lasts beyond drug discontinuation. Of course, this is the best of scenarios. Some people feel that SSRIs can produce amotivation and sexual side effects that last well after the drug is discontinued. I, myself, have experienced changes in various bodily functions as a result of exposure to TCAs. Another manifestation of long-term changes in psychobiological function produced by ADs, especially SSRIs, is the phenomenon of drug-induced drug refractoriness. If one attains full remission on an AD which lasts a decade, and then decides to discontinue it, it may not work if it has to be restarted upon relapse two months later. Long-term exposure to a drug can induce changes that are not easily reversed.
My advice to you is to:
1. Raise the dosage.
2. Discontinue the drug that you are on now and replace it with a yet untried treatment (includes combinations).
You might find that the insomnia and anxiety actually improve with the discontinuation of your current AD. The depression might get worse, though.
I'm sorry that you have to deal with this situation. You might have to feel worse before you feel better.
- Scott
Posted by babbler20 on February 8, 2016, at 17:35:01
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » babbler20, posted by SLS on February 8, 2016, at 17:27:38
Thanks so much for the thoughtful response Scott. I've tapered down rom 50 mg of Luvox to 3.5 over 8 weeks and I'm going to stop taking it in a couple of days. I guess I'll have to wait it out and see. How bad do you think my withdrawal symptoms will be , considering I was on a really low dose and I tapered down over 8 weeks?
Posted by SLS on February 8, 2016, at 19:45:04
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible, posted by babbler20 on February 8, 2016, at 17:35:01
> Thanks so much for the thoughtful response Scott. I've tapered down rom 50 mg of Luvox to 3.5 over 8 weeks and I'm going to stop taking it in a couple of days. I guess I'll have to wait it out and see. How bad do you think my withdrawal symptoms will be , considering I was on a really low dose and I tapered down over 8 weeks?
I really don't know, but you did a good job of tapering. Perhaps the worst thing that can happen is that you experience some mild to moderate brain zaps that last for a day or two. I don't really think this will be a problem, though. Otherwise, you might get a headache, feelings of malaise or flu-like symptoms, or even a temporary increase in anxiety. If any of these things occur, I would not restart the Luvox. You can try taking some Benadryl (diphenhydramine) to treat the withdrawal symptoms.
I wish I had a more definitive answer for you.
Have you tried Paxil or Effexor? Was the Luvox chosen to treat OCD?
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on February 8, 2016, at 21:47:10
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » babbler20, posted by SLS on February 8, 2016, at 19:45:04
I too would love to discontinue the luvox now for about 8 years 25mg. I also have the lexapro only take 2.5 mg of it. And you know the benzos and doses. My fear is low doses of benzos are due to the luvox? Thoughts? Thanks Phillipa
Posted by SLS on February 9, 2016, at 1:10:45
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » SLS, posted by Phillipa on February 8, 2016, at 21:47:10
> I too would love to discontinue the luvox now for about 8 years 25mg. I also have the lexapro only take 2.5 mg of it. And you know the benzos and doses. My fear is low doses of benzos are due to the luvox? Thoughts? Thanks Phillipa
I'm confused as to what you are asking.
You seem like a Paxil (paroxetine) person. Have you ever tried it? What were the results?
Was Luvox (fluvoxamine) chosen because your doctors thought you have some type of OCD, or were they just looking for something sedating? Ruminations are not the same as OCD. What happens when you take 100 mg/day?
We both have been around the blocks a few times. Which tricyclic antidepressants (TCA) have you tried, and what were the results? I was thinking about Sinequan (doxepin) for you.
If you have not tried any neuroleptic antipsychotics (AP), I don't know what you are waiting for. Your case would not demand the higher dosages used by most people. For anxiety, you could, for example take Seroquel (quetiapine) 50 mg at night and then take two 25 mg doses during the day. At 75 mg/day, extrapyramidal symptoms (EPS) are often non-existent and the risk of tardive dyskinesia (TD) is minimal. You can discuss the specifics with your doctor. A rather unusual choice for anxiety is promethazine (Phenergan). I saw this drug work well as a substitute for Zyprexa (olanzapine) when weight-gain became an issue.
I get the feeling that your case is not so straight-forward. Cognitive-behavioral therapy (CBT), a type of psychotherapy, can be very helpful to deal with depression and anxiety. It really isn't that hard or intense, but just takes some practice outside the therapist's office. In fact, some people practice using a workbook. CBT treatment doesn't last forever like some other forms of psychotherapy seem to. A course of CBT can be relatively brief. It is very much like taking a school course to learn how to change how you think about things and thus changes how your feel. CBT is not a drilling down to the inner workings of your psyche. You aren't forced to reveal your most secret thoughts or feelings.
As to your original question, perhaps you can rephrase it?
- Scott
Posted by Lou Pilder on February 9, 2016, at 8:49:35
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » babbler20, posted by SLS on February 8, 2016, at 19:45:04
> > Thanks so much for the thoughtful response Scott. I've tapered down rom 50 mg of Luvox to 3.5 over 8 weeks and I'm going to stop taking it in a couple of days. I guess I'll have to wait it out and see. How bad do you think my withdrawal symptoms will be , considering I was on a really low dose and I tapered down over 8 weeks?
>
> I really don't know, but you did a good job of tapering. Perhaps the worst thing that can happen is that you experience some mild to moderate brain zaps that last for a day or two. I don't really think this will be a problem, though. Otherwise, you might get a headache, feelings of malaise or flu-like symptoms, or even a temporary increase in anxiety. If any of these things occur, I would not restart the Luvox. You can try taking some Benadryl (diphenhydramine) to treat the withdrawal symptoms.
>
> I wish I had a more definitive answer for you.
>
> Have you tried Paxil or Effexor? Was the Luvox chosen to treat OCD?
>
>
> - ScottFriends,
Scott wrote here,[...Perhaps the worst thing that could happen is that you experience some mild to moderate brain zaps that last for a day or two. I don't think this will be a problem though....].
Be not deceived. This statement by Scott is allowed to be seen here by Mr. Hsiung as being supportive. But what Scott has posted could constitute the fallacy of overgeneralization. This fallacy could cost you your life if it is allowed to stand because it could influence readers to think that withdrawing is easier than it really is and the withdrawaler could kill themselves as being in a state much worse than Scott says here, as he says, "Perhaps the worst thing that could happen is that you experience some mild to moderate brain zaps that last for a day or two."
This statement standing could seriously mislead you into taking a chance with death. For what could happen to anyone withdrawing from these drugs is the commission of suicide or mass-murder that is left out by Scott. This leaving out the whole truth is a fallacy not permitted by the FDA in their rules for advancing or promoting a drug. Here, Scott also promotes Benadryl as some type of thing to take to help with withdrawal. Readers could be misled that Benadryl is a cure for withdrawal symptoms which is promoting the drug in violation of FDA rules, but Mr. Hsiung could be exempt from the FDA rules here and I do not know why.
Be not deceived. Scott cites no reputable research to support his claim and readers could be misled to their deaths by accepting the fallacy of overgeneralization indicated by what Scott has posted here, as Scott posts a conclusion without drawing from a representative sample and citing such in research. Scott states that he doesn't really think this will really be a problem. How does he substantiate such a claim? This is what overgeneralization entails because it is allowed by Mr. Hsiung to stand as being supportive.
But what is the proper conclusion? The research shows that thousands of people are killed each month by these drugs and that people in withdrawal could kill themselves and/or others and and even commit mass-murder and kill their own parents. That could be "the worst thing" which Scott has left out. This brings up what s known as the fallacy of slothful induction that I will integrate here as I show you how this site could mislead you seriously enough to cause your death or the death of your child being drugged in collaboration with a psychiatrist.
Lou
Posted by Lou Pilder on February 9, 2016, at 9:06:02
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » Phillipa, posted by SLS on February 9, 2016, at 1:10:45
> > I too would love to discontinue the luvox now for about 8 years 25mg. I also have the lexapro only take 2.5 mg of it. And you know the benzos and doses. My fear is low doses of benzos are due to the luvox? Thoughts? Thanks Phillipa
>
> I'm confused as to what you are asking.
>
> You seem like a Paxil (paroxetine) person. Have you ever tried it? What were the results?
>
> Was Luvox (fluvoxamine) chosen because your doctors thought you have some type of OCD, or were they just looking for something sedating? Ruminations are not the same as OCD. What happens when you take 100 mg/day?
>
> We both have been around the blocks a few times. Which tricyclic antidepressants (TCA) have you tried, and what were the results? I was thinking about Sinequan (doxepin) for you.
>
> If you have not tried any neuroleptic antipsychotics (AP), I don't know what you are waiting for. Your case would not demand the higher dosages used by most people. For anxiety, you could, for example take Seroquel (quetiapine) 50 mg at night and then take two 25 mg doses during the day. At 75 mg/day, extrapyramidal symptoms (EPS) are often non-existent and the risk of tardive dyskinesia (TD) is minimal. You can discuss the specifics with your doctor. A rather unusual choice for anxiety is promethazine (Phenergan). I saw this drug work well as a substitute for Zyprexa (olanzapine) when weight-gain became an issue.
>
> I get the feeling that your case is not so straight-forward. Cognitive-behavioral therapy (CBT), a type of psychotherapy, can be very helpful to deal with depression and anxiety. It really isn't that hard or intense, but just takes some practice outside the therapist's office. In fact, some people practice using a workbook. CBT treatment doesn't last forever like some other forms of psychotherapy seem to. A course of CBT can be relatively brief. It is very much like taking a school course to learn how to change how you think about things and thus changes how your feel. CBT is not a drilling down to the inner workings of your psyche. You aren't forced to reveal your most secret thoughts or feelings.
>
> As to your original question, perhaps you can rephrase it?
>
>
> - Scott
>
Friends
Look what Scott has said above. Be not deceived. Because Mr. Hsiung is allowing it, you could be seriously misled to act on what Scott is promulgating here in toto because Mr. Hsiung states that being supportive takes precedence. But it is much worse than that which could lead you to a life-time of misery and kill yourself and/or others along with you.
I now want to present what is know as the fallacy of moving the goalposts which is related to slothful induction. You see, Mr. Hsiung has changed his standards that were originally used here. But how could him changing his standards make his community improved in his thinking? The answer will shock you.
Lou
Posted by Lou Pilder on February 9, 2016, at 9:23:35
In reply to Lou's urgent warning-moving the goalposts » SLS, posted by Lou Pilder on February 9, 2016, at 9:06:02
> > > I too would love to discontinue the luvox now for about 8 years 25mg. I also have the lexapro only take 2.5 mg of it. And you know the benzos and doses. My fear is low doses of benzos are due to the luvox? Thoughts? Thanks Phillipa
> >
> > I'm confused as to what you are asking.
> >
> > You seem like a Paxil (paroxetine) person. Have you ever tried it? What were the results?
> >
> > Was Luvox (fluvoxamine) chosen because your doctors thought you have some type of OCD, or were they just looking for something sedating? Ruminations are not the same as OCD. What happens when you take 100 mg/day?
> >
> > We both have been around the blocks a few times. Which tricyclic antidepressants (TCA) have you tried, and what were the results? I was thinking about Sinequan (doxepin) for you.
> >
> > If you have not tried any neuroleptic antipsychotics (AP), I don't know what you are waiting for. Your case would not demand the higher dosages used by most people. For anxiety, you could, for example take Seroquel (quetiapine) 50 mg at night and then take two 25 mg doses during the day. At 75 mg/day, extrapyramidal symptoms (EPS) are often non-existent and the risk of tardive dyskinesia (TD) is minimal. You can discuss the specifics with your doctor. A rather unusual choice for anxiety is promethazine (Phenergan). I saw this drug work well as a substitute for Zyprexa (olanzapine) when weight-gain became an issue.
> >
> > I get the feeling that your case is not so straight-forward. Cognitive-behavioral therapy (CBT), a type of psychotherapy, can be very helpful to deal with depression and anxiety. It really isn't that hard or intense, but just takes some practice outside the therapist's office. In fact, some people practice using a workbook. CBT treatment doesn't last forever like some other forms of psychotherapy seem to. A course of CBT can be relatively brief. It is very much like taking a school course to learn how to change how you think about things and thus changes how your feel. CBT is not a drilling down to the inner workings of your psyche. You aren't forced to reveal your most secret thoughts or feelings.
> >
> > As to your original question, perhaps you can rephrase it?
> >
> >
> > - Scott
> >
> Friends
> Look what Scott has said above. Be not deceived. Because Mr. Hsiung is allowing it, you could be seriously misled to act on what Scott is promulgating here in toto because Mr. Hsiung states that being supportive takes precedence. But it is much worse than that which could lead you to a life-time of misery and kill yourself and/or others along with you.
> I now want to present what is know as the fallacy of moving the goalposts which is related to slothful induction. You see, Mr. Hsiung has changed his standards that were originally used here. But how could him changing his standards make his community improved in his thinking? The answer will shock you.
> LouFriends,
Not everyone will be shocked by what I am going to tell you. For there could be a subset of readers that already know what I am going to say here. Those could be the members in concert with Mr. Hsiung and some deputies of record that collaborated with Mr. Hsiung to do his wishes as a deputy does. I know of only one singular reason why the deputies that were of record allowed my notifications to remain outstanding.
But let us look at one standard that Mr. Hsiung has changed in moderating his site. The original standard is that one match could start a forest fire. His new standard that he changed is that many matches are needed to start a forest fire. But how could you accept that the fact that one match could start a forest fire is not a fact when it is. Is this not tantamount for Mr. Hsiung to say that the Earth is flat? Science shows and proves that the Earth is flat and who can change that proof? Science shows that one match could start a forest fire and who has the authority to change that proof? If he moves the goalposts there, what does that show? The answer "could" shock you, but some already know.
Lou
Posted by Lou Pilder on February 9, 2016, at 10:13:26
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible, posted by babbler20 on February 8, 2016, at 17:35:01
> Thanks so much for the thoughtful response Scott. I've tapered down rom 50 mg of Luvox to 3.5 over 8 weeks and I'm going to stop taking it in a couple of days. I guess I'll have to wait it out and see. How bad do you think my withdrawal symptoms will be , considering I was on a really low dose and I tapered down over 8 weeks?
>
>
babbler22,
You wrote to Scott,[...how bad do you think that my withdrawal symptoms will be?...].
I am unsure as to what you are going to do with his advise to you. If you could post answers to the following, then I could respond accordingly.
True or false:
I take Scott's advise, Lou, because;
A. Scott has been delivered from depression by drugs
B. Scott knows more than all the research that shows that psychiatric drugs could worsen depression and anxiety
C. Scott is immune from Mr. Hsiung's enforcement policy to defame you here, Lou, so that means to me that it is supportive and then Scott's advice is correct because a psychiatrist could not cause my death if I act on his advice allows it.
D. People here that have been killed by the drugs that Scott promotes with impunity here, means that any advice from Scott is condoned by The American Psychiatric Association.
E. As long as Mr. Hsiung allows Scott to be exempt from his enforcement policy,I will follow Scott's advice, Lou. F. I will escape death because he is still alive.
If he dies, Lou, then I will re evaluate his advice
Lou
Posted by Lamdage22 on February 9, 2016, at 12:06:01
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » Phillipa, posted by SLS on February 9, 2016, at 1:10:45
You seem like a Paxil person. Haha! GOod one Scott.
Posted by Phillipa on February 9, 2016, at 12:08:34
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » Phillipa, posted by SLS on February 9, 2016, at 1:10:45
Scott first AD ever took was Paxil l0mg with lopressor 25 mg cause at the time found out hasimotos hypothroidism. Same time found out about the lymes disease. And was going through menopause which didn't know at the time. After about six months just stopped the lopressor as was still exercising and didn't raise my pulse. I continued with the l0mg of paxil and xanax .25 4 times a day. Then I weaned off the paxil continued with the xanax. But also had 4 beers after work each night. Long story short the pdoc at the time tricked me as another pdoc worked with confronted mine and I was in the office when the one I worked with called mine and wanted to know if he let me drink beer on benzos. Next thing I knew he hospitalized me my pdoc put me on chloral hydrate said couldn't drink on it and began the luvox and now ativan. And he put me on Disability cause he didn't want me to work with the pdocs that knew how he practiced. It's a very long story but yes he said OCD. The idiot one I have here now just writes refills. Figured that if I got off the luvox and then stuck with just the lexapro that might be better and I could once again be normal. I do think that I basically am almost med free as been on these so long how could they possibly do a thing. If you still have my email. I could answer directly. Phillipa
Posted by SLS on February 9, 2016, at 13:44:13
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » SLS, posted by Phillipa on February 9, 2016, at 12:08:34
Hi Phillipa.
Even though you obsess, I doubt that you have true OCD, and should not be treated as if you do. I would guess that you have some type of anxiety disorder. Right now, you are taking too little of any one drug to produce a substantial therapeutic effect.
Paxil 20-40 mg/day
Luvox 100-300 mg/day
Lexapro 10-30 mg/day
Xanax 2.0-4.0 mg/dayRight now, it probably makes sense to increase the dosage of Lexapro if you can tolerate it. You are already on it. Lexapro can help with GAD, OCD, and depression. If you genuinely have OCD, you would need the higher dosages of the SSRIs for longer periods of time.
There is so much that you have not tried. Are you afraid of these drugs?
- Scott
Posted by babbler20 on February 9, 2016, at 15:11:45
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » babbler20, posted by SLS on February 8, 2016, at 19:45:04
> > Thanks so much for the thoughtful response Scott. I've tapered down rom 50 mg of Luvox to 3.5 over 8 weeks and I'm going to stop taking it in a couple of days. I guess I'll have to wait it out and see. How bad do you think my withdrawal symptoms will be , considering I was on a really low dose and I tapered down over 8 weeks?
>
> I really don't know, but you did a good job of tapering. Perhaps the worst thing that can happen is that you experience some mild to moderate brain zaps that last for a day or two. I don't really think this will be a problem, though. Otherwise, you might get a headache, feelings of malaise or flu-like symptoms, or even a temporary increase in anxiety. If any of these things occur, I would not restart the Luvox. You can try taking some Benadryl (diphenhydramine) to treat the withdrawal symptoms.
>
> I wish I had a more definitive answer for you.
>
> Have you tried Paxil or Effexor? Was the Luvox chosen to treat OCD?
>
>
> - ScottBendadryl is a really good idea. Do you know if benadryl has down stream effects? I'm wondering if I'm just prolonging things if the effect on my histamine receptors from the benadryl has a downstream effect on serotonin.
I've tried Paxil and Effexor. Luvox was given to me because I had tried everyting else. This will be my last time on antidepressants. I really have nowhere to go, but up from the way I see it. Thanks again!!
Posted by babbler20 on February 9, 2016, at 15:14:12
In reply to Lou's wonderment- » babbler20, posted by Lou Pilder on February 9, 2016, at 10:13:26
Lol
Posted by Lou Pilder on February 9, 2016, at 15:34:30
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » Phillipa, posted by SLS on February 9, 2016, at 13:44:13
> Hi Phillipa.
>
> Even though you obsess, I doubt that you have true OCD, and should not be treated as if you do. I would guess that you have some type of anxiety disorder. Right now, you are taking too little of any one drug to produce a substantial therapeutic effect.
>
> Paxil 20-40 mg/day
> Luvox 100-300 mg/day
> Lexapro 10-30 mg/day
> Xanax 2.0-4.0 mg/day
>
> Right now, it probably makes sense to increase the dosage of Lexapro if you can tolerate it. You are already on it. Lexapro can help with GAD, OCD, and depression. If you genuinely have OCD, you would need the higher dosages of the SSRIs for longer periods of time.
>
> There is so much that you have not tried. Are you afraid of these drugs?
>
>
> - ScottFriends,
Scott writes here that Phillipa should not be treated as if she has OCD. This is allowed by Mr. Hsiung as being seen as being supportive. But I say to you, that when someone making any type of diagnosis in a mental health forum chaired by a psychiatrist, readers could act on the diagnosis and could cost those persons their lives by being misdiagnosed by someone that the psychiatrist here is allowing what Scott is doing to stand without interceding which could influence vulnerable readers to accept Scott's diagnosis when he is not a doctor or psychiatrist. And worse, Scott claims that Phillipa is not taking enough of the drug(s) which could cause Phillipa to increase her dosage of the drug(s) and suffer a horrible death by them.
Here Scott is allowed to break the rules of the FDA by advocating increasing the dosage of Lexapro because it can help, according to Scott, with GAD, OCD and depression. That is quite a promotion for the drug, Lexapro and the manufacturers get free advertising here by Scott. But Scott doesn't tell the rest of what could happen to Phillipa or anyone else taking Lexapro, which could be addiction, life-ruining conditions and death by their own hand.
And you mothers, trying to make a more-informed decision as to drug your child in collaboration with a psychiatrist, look at the admin board at my discussion with Mr. Hsiung. And look at those trying to still my voice here. And see the anti-Semitic propaganda being allowed to be seen here as being supportive which Mr. Hsiung says that in his thinking his community will be good for the whole. That is the same argument used historically to justify slavery and infanticide and segregation and genocide. Do you want to swallow the poison of European Fascism that resulted in a hundred million deaths that history has condemned decades ago?
Lou
Posted by Horse on February 9, 2016, at 15:41:06
In reply to Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible, posted by babbler20 on February 8, 2016, at 15:15:36
Hey, I'm sorry to hear you're in such a bad place right now. Sending good thoughts your way. Have you tried rTMS? I'm wondering if it could provide a kick start once you've withdrawn from meds.
I had intractable, severe insomnia for a number of years. I thought it would kill me.
In retrospect, mine was triggered by menopause and benzodiazapines. I'm much better now.
Best wishes there.
Posted by Lou Pilder on February 9, 2016, at 16:50:44
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » Phillipa, posted by SLS on February 9, 2016, at 13:44:13
> Hi Phillipa.
>
> Even though you obsess, I doubt that you have true OCD, and should not be treated as if you do. I would guess that you have some type of anxiety disorder. Right now, you are taking too little of any one drug to produce a substantial therapeutic effect.
>
> Paxil 20-40 mg/day
> Luvox 100-300 mg/day
> Lexapro 10-30 mg/day
> Xanax 2.0-4.0 mg/day
>
> Right now, it probably makes sense to increase the dosage of Lexapro if you can tolerate it. You are already on it. Lexapro can help with GAD, OCD, and depression. If you genuinely have OCD, you would need the higher dosages of the SSRIs for longer periods of time.
>
> There is so much that you have not tried. Are you afraid of these drugs?
>
>
> - ScottFriends,
Phillipa has a list of the drugs that she takes here posted by Scott. I have finished a preliminary exploration using my Death-O-Meter in regards to Phillipa taking the 4 drugs listed.
Notice that Scott advocates the increase of one of the drugs. This could cause death.
You see, the 3 drugs absent the Xanax together could cause death by serotonin syndrome. But it is even worse as that heart failure could result also. And worse, judgment could be severely impaired that could result in accidental death. And worse, the drugs could increase suicidal thinking.
My first Death-O-Meter reading indicates that Phillipa's life-span could be shortened drastically, so I do not advocate anyone's mother drugging their child this way or for any human being to be drugged in this combination of drugs for the effects are increased exponentially when they are combined. Here, this combination could be seen as being supportive, and worse, Scott advocates to increase dosages of already a life-threatening combination of drugs.
Lou
Posted by babbler20 on February 9, 2016, at 18:37:50
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » babbler20, posted by Horse on February 9, 2016, at 15:41:06
> Hey, I'm sorry to hear you're in such a bad place right now. Sending good thoughts your way. Have you tried rTMS? I'm wondering if it could provide a kick start once you've withdrawn from meds.
>
> I had intractable, severe insomnia for a number of years. I thought it would kill me.
>
> In retrospect, mine was triggered by menopause and benzodiazapines. I'm much better now.
>
> Best wishes there.
Hi, I did try TMS. It didn't do aything, unfortunately
Posted by Phillipa on February 9, 2016, at 22:02:20
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » Phillipa, posted by SLS on February 9, 2016, at 13:44:13
Yes Especially due to age. But you like lexapro. I can do that but did go to 5mg last night and kept the same amount of luvox? No difference. Phillipa
Posted by SLS on February 10, 2016, at 5:16:22
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » SLS, posted by Phillipa on February 9, 2016, at 22:02:20
> Yes Especially due to age. But you like lexapro. I can do that but did go to 5mg last night and kept the same amount of luvox? No difference. Phillipa
As a nurse, you surely know better than to evaluate the worth of an antidepressant drug after only one day.
1. 5 mg/day of Lexapro is still only half of the lowest recommended dose (10-20 mg/day). Some people go up to 40 mg/day, especially for OCD. I would say that the most common dosage used is 20 mg/day.
2. Even if 5 mg/day were the perfect dosage of the perfect drug for you, it would still take a minimum of 3-6 weeks before symptoms improve and you begin to feel better. You must commit to a drug trial before beginning it. This would include tolerating side effects. It would be a good idea to confer with your doctor if you reach the point of discontinuing the drug prematurely.
3. You could cross-titrate the Luvox and Lexapro, or even simply drop the Luvox altogether once you begin increasing the Lexapro dosage.
I sometimes get the feeling that you are your own worst enemy when it comes to selecting and committing to treatments. The faster you get your depression and anxiety under control, the younger you will stay. Chronic stress beats the hell out of the whole body, particularly the brain.
- Scott
Posted by Lou Pilder on February 10, 2016, at 8:46:57
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible, posted by SLS on February 10, 2016, at 5:16:22
> > Yes Especially due to age. But you like lexapro. I can do that but did go to 5mg last night and kept the same amount of luvox? No difference. Phillipa
>
> As a nurse, you surely know better than to evaluate the worth of an antidepressant drug after only one day.
>
> 1. 5 mg/day of Lexapro is still only half of the lowest recommended dose (10-20 mg/day). Some people go up to 40 mg/day, especially for OCD. I would say that the most common dosage used is 20 mg/day.
>
> 2. Even if 5 mg/day were the perfect dosage of the perfect drug for you, it would still take a minimum of 3-6 weeks before symptoms improve and you begin to feel better. You must commit to a drug trial before beginning it. This would include tolerating side effects. It would be a good idea to confer with your doctor if you reach the point of discontinuing the drug prematurely.
>
> 3. You could cross-titrate the Luvox and Lexapro, or even simply drop the Luvox altogether once you begin increasing the Lexapro dosage.
>
> I sometimes get the feeling that you are your own worst enemy when it comes to selecting and committing to treatments. The faster you get your depression and anxiety under control, the younger you will stay. Chronic stress beats the hell out of the whole body, particularly the brain.
>
>
> - ScottFriends,
Be not deceived. What Scott has posted could draw you into a life-time of misery and lead to your death by suicide or the drug s could kill you. Let us look at how psychiatry hooks even children into a life-time of dependence on mind-altering drugs that could induce a life-ruining condition, addiction and death.
Here Scott writes that in order for the drugs to be determined to improve depression/anxiety ect, they have to be taken a minimum of 3-6 weeks.
Can you see it? Tell me can you see it?
If you can't see it, the hook is that the drugs can cause addiction in that time-frame so that when the drug is stopped, withdrawal could set in and then the sufferer could return to the psychiatrist to get another drug and repeat even more addiction and the chances can increase of suicide or murder or life-ruining conditions that could cause death induced from the drugs.
And has Scott posted that he is free from depression/ anxiety from his drugging over the years? I see posts by him saying that all of his drugs have not done so.
The human tragedy here is that readers could be misled to believe that what Scott is posting here is supportive, but Scott does not tell the whole truth because he leaves out the other side of the coin which could seriously mislead you to think that what Scott is advocating is safer than it really is. And worse, children reading here could think that taking Scott's advice could not cause any harmful effects at all. That could start them on a lifetime of sorrows that could cause them to kill themselves from the drugs or even murder their own parents as the drugs kill thousands of people each month, but Scott leaves that fact out.
Parents, beware of Scott's advice here, for what he has posted here could mislead you to believe that you have to take drugs for stress as he does not list any alternative. But there is an alternative to taking mind-altering drugs that could maim you for life for your stress and even shorten your life span by killing you or causing you to kill yourself. For it has been revealed to me that those that take these drugs become slaves to the drugs and the psychiatrists and others that traffic in them. Do you want to be shackled to the psychiatrist and the drugs headed for the dance at the pharmacy?
Friends, there is a way out. And the way out is to be drawn to The Light of Life. That Light will shine to expose the lies of drugs and the deception carried out by those looking for a new fool. Be not deceived. There is a continual body of scientific knowledge showing that these drugs do not work and are addictive even worse so than heroine. And even more so, look out kids, your going to be hit, by losers and cheaters hanging 'round the druggies, sucking you down a whirlpool into the sewers of humanity. Friends, the deceived mind is the devil's playground.
Lou
Posted by SLS on February 10, 2016, at 23:24:39
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible » Phillipa, posted by SLS on February 9, 2016, at 13:44:13
> Hi Phillipa.
>
> Even though you obsess, I doubt that you have true OCD, and should not be treated as if you do. I would guess that you have some type of anxiety disorder. Right now, you are taking too little of any one drug to produce a substantial therapeutic effect.
>
> Paxil 20-40 mg/day
> Luvox 100-300 mg/day
> Lexapro 10-30 mg/day
> Xanax 2.0-4.0 mg/day
>
> Right now, it probably makes sense to increase the dosage of Lexapro if you can tolerate it. You are already on it. Lexapro can help with GAD, OCD, and depression. If you genuinely have OCD, you would need the higher dosages of the SSRIs for longer periods of time.
>
> There is so much that you have not tried. Are you afraid of these drugs?In order to remedy any possible misunderstandings, I wish to state that the drugs I listed above are those that Phillipa takes or has taken in the past. I did not mean to recommend that they be taken together.
- Scott
Posted by Lou Pilder on February 11, 2016, at 9:59:21
In reply to Re: Can AD's Cause Long-Term Damage that is Reversible, posted by SLS on February 10, 2016, at 23:24:39
> > Hi Phillipa.
> >
> > Even though you obsess, I doubt that you have true OCD, and should not be treated as if you do. I would guess that you have some type of anxiety disorder. Right now, you are taking too little of any one drug to produce a substantial therapeutic effect.
> >
> > Paxil 20-40 mg/day
> > Luvox 100-300 mg/day
> > Lexapro 10-30 mg/day
> > Xanax 2.0-4.0 mg/day
> >
> > Right now, it probably makes sense to increase the dosage of Lexapro if you can tolerate it. You are already on it. Lexapro can help with GAD, OCD, and depression. If you genuinely have OCD, you would need the higher dosages of the SSRIs for longer periods of time.
> >
> > There is so much that you have not tried. Are you afraid of these drugs?
>
> In order to remedy any possible misunderstandings, I wish to state that the drugs I listed above are those that Phillipa takes or has taken in the past. I did not mean to recommend that they be taken together.
>
>
> - ScottScott,
But you have recommended taking combinations of drugs here. Combinations that could cause addiction and life-ruining conditions and death.
Let there be no misunderstanding. Readers could be seriously misled by you when you promote a drug, advocate changing dosages and such which could lead to their deaths or even murder others or get addiction and life-ruining conditions. The FDA rules require when a drug is promoted to give a balanced view including the most important adverse consequences. These rules are not being followed here and I do not know why you and Mr. Hsiung are exempt from the FDA rules. So what I want you to do from here on is to:
A. not advocate to anyone to change the dosage of these mind-altering drugs because changing the dosage could cause great adverse effects including death. An alternative would be to say to the poster to return to their provider and ask for a dosage adjustment. I do not think that advocating any type of diagnosis or advising changes in dosage of these drugs to be supportive at all, since you are not a psychiatrist or even a licensed psychopharmacologist or a degreed pharmacist. In fact, what you are doing here could cause the death of children because without Mr. Hsiung interceding here with you, there could be readers thinking that what you post is actual fact when it is not because the site is chaired by a psychiatrist and they could think that what is posted here is validated by him since he allows you free reign in posting what could kill others.
B. I want you to go back and post corrections in all the posts where you have promoted these drugs to include the whole truth so that readers are not deceived to think that the drugs promoted by you are safer than they really are including warning about death.
C. I want you to go to write a letter to Mr. Hsiung asking for him to not allow you to promote these drugs in defiance of the FDA rules so that if you do, he could post a disclaimer that your promotion of the drugs could mislead readers to think that the drugs are safer than they really are.
D. I want you to resign immediately from this forum if you are going to refuse to stop promoting drugs here without also listing the adverse effects including death that could befall the reader that takes your advise
Lou
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