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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 20 of 20. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by tensor on March 1, 2013, at 1:32:48
I'm soon going to taper clonazepam slowly. I wonder if there's some med that you can take "as needed" for anxiety that is not a benzo. My pdoc hates Lyrica. I don't know if Zyprexa is a viable option either. What works for you?
/tensor
Posted by SLS on March 1, 2013, at 4:57:54
In reply to Meds for anxiety prn, posted by tensor on March 1, 2013, at 1:32:48
> I'm soon going to taper clonazepam slowly. I wonder if there's some med that you can take "as needed" for anxiety that is not a benzo. My pdoc hates Lyrica. I don't know if Zyprexa is a viable option either. What works for you?
>
> /tensorI once suggested to someone that they try taking Trileptal at a constant dosage during the clonazepam withdrawal period. He reported that it worked very well. I later found that my idea was not unique.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18821451
You could try taking a low dosage of Trileptal first; perhaps 200 - 400 mg/day. However, you may need 600 mg/day or more. You might want to begin Trileptal treatment before tapering the clonazepam. Clonazepam seems to be a particularly difficult BZD to discontinue. I'm not sure why. It may have something to do with its unique serotonergic properties. There is, of course, the strategy of crossing-over to Valium and tapering the dosage from there. I would be curious to see how Neurontin works.
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on March 1, 2013, at 9:48:47
In reply to Re: Meds for anxiety prn » tensor, posted by SLS on March 1, 2013, at 4:57:54
Prn? Inderol? Gabapentin or neurotonin but it probably has a longer half life. Do you want something that lasts for a while or just a few hours? Phillipa
Posted by Phil on March 1, 2013, at 11:44:44
In reply to Meds for anxiety prn, posted by tensor on March 1, 2013, at 1:32:48
Just curious tensor, why stop Clonazepam to start another drug that is going to have more side effects?
I know that no one wants to be on a benzo for whatever reason but I'm just curious.
Posted by tensor on March 1, 2013, at 12:05:00
In reply to Re: Meds for anxiety prn » tensor, posted by Phil on March 1, 2013, at 11:44:44
> Just curious tensor, why stop Clonazepam to start another drug that is going to have more side effects?
> I know that no one wants to be on a benzo for whatever reason but I'm just curious.I have tried most things to stop my recurring depressions that are becoming more frequent. I have not been benzo free for twelve years, so it could play a role. A rapid discontinuation doesn't work, the anxiety and the depression are too much to handle.
Going the Ashton way, which I plan todo, will take over six months. If, under that period, there was a stressful event I can't resort to benzos as usual, that would be throwing away months of tapering.
I do not want something to take regularly just for this, amitrip is doing a pretty good job. I'm just thinking ahead, maybe I think too much, I don't know./tensor
Posted by Phil on March 1, 2013, at 12:53:47
In reply to Re: Meds for anxiety prn » Phil, posted by tensor on March 1, 2013, at 12:05:00
Oh heck, we never think too much. :) Good luck..
Posted by tensor on March 1, 2013, at 13:29:41
In reply to Re: Meds for anxiety prn » tensor, posted by SLS on March 1, 2013, at 4:57:54
> I once suggested to someone that they try taking Trileptal at a constant dosage during the clonazepam withdrawal period. He reported that it worked very well. I later found that my idea was not unique.
>
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18821451
>
> You could try taking a low dosage of Trileptal first; perhaps 200 - 400 mg/day. However, you may need 600 mg/day or more. You might want to begin Trileptal treatment before tapering the clonazepam. Clonazepam seems to be a particularly difficult BZD to discontinue. I'm not sure why. It may have something to do with its unique serotonergic properties. There is, of course, the strategy of crossing-over to Valium and tapering the dosage from there. I would be curious to see how Neurontin works.
>
>
> - ScottI used Lyrica once during a fast taper, worked well. Unfortunately the anxiolytic properties of Lyrica disappeared after two weeks. So it was back to clonazepam. That's the drawback with a fast taper, the brain doesn't have time to adjust and is in a super-tense state. At least that's what it feels like.
/tensor
Posted by tensor on March 1, 2013, at 13:32:27
In reply to Re: Meds for anxiety prn, posted by Phillipa on March 1, 2013, at 9:48:47
> Prn? Inderol? Gabapentin or neurotonin but it probably has a longer half life. Do you want something that lasts for a while or just a few hours? Phillipa
I use beta blockers and they work pretty well. Never used gabapentin, but why not. Who knows, maybe I won't need anything if I just give the brain enough time to heal.
/tensor
Posted by joe schmoe on March 1, 2013, at 16:52:23
In reply to Meds for anxiety prn, posted by tensor on March 1, 2013, at 1:32:48
> I'm soon going to taper clonazepam slowly. I wonder if there's some med that you can take "as needed" for anxiety that is not a benzo. My pdoc hates Lyrica. I don't know if Zyprexa is a viable option either. What works for you?
>
> /tensorI am tapering clonazepam right now. I am down to 1/8 mg per day, from 2 mg per day.
I am wondering if Valerian root might be a good supplement to take, or whether it would interfere with the taper.
I got some melatonin to try helping me sleep tonight.
I have some Inderal lying around, but so far have preferred to use booze to relax.
Posted by jono_in_adelaide on March 1, 2013, at 21:19:39
In reply to Meds for anxiety prn, posted by tensor on March 1, 2013, at 1:32:48
Hydroxyzine (Atarax, Vistaril, dose 25mg-100mg three times a day prn) is non habit forming and usefull.
Posted by tensor on March 2, 2013, at 6:07:31
In reply to Re: Meds for anxiety prn » tensor, posted by SLS on March 1, 2013, at 4:57:54
> I once suggested to someone that they try taking Trileptal at a constant dosage during the clonazepam withdrawal period. He reported that it worked very well. I later found that my idea was not unique.
>
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18821451
>
> You could try taking a low dosage of Trileptal first; perhaps 200 - 400 mg/day. However, you may need 600 mg/day or more. You might want to begin Trileptal treatment before tapering the clonazepam. Clonazepam seems to be a particularly difficult BZD to discontinue. I'm not sure why. It may have something to do with its unique serotonergic properties. There is, of course, the strategy of crossing-over to Valium and tapering the dosage from there. I would be curious to see how Neurontin works.
>
>
> - ScottDoes oxcarbazepine work on anxiety too? You don't happen to have the full article?
/tensor
Posted by phidippus on March 2, 2013, at 14:43:05
In reply to Meds for anxiety prn, posted by tensor on March 1, 2013, at 1:32:48
Keppra works wonders for me. Seroquel can be useful. Scopalomine works.
But, really the best treatment for anxiety is the right AD.
Eric
Posted by tensor on March 3, 2013, at 3:57:22
In reply to Re: Meds for anxiety prn » tensor, posted by phidippus on March 2, 2013, at 14:43:05
> But, really the best treatment for anxiety is the right AD.
I agree, depression and anxiety go hand in hand./tensor
Posted by Emme_V2 on March 3, 2013, at 7:08:41
In reply to Re: Meds for anxiety prn » Phil, posted by tensor on March 1, 2013, at 12:05:00
> > Just curious tensor, why stop Clonazepam to start another drug that is going to have more side effects?
> > I know that no one wants to be on a benzo for whatever reason but I'm just curious.
>
> I have tried most things to stop my recurring depressions that are becoming more frequent. I have not been benzo free for twelve years, so it could play a role. A rapid discontinuation doesn't work, the anxiety and the depression are too much to handle.
> Going the Ashton way, which I plan todo, will take over six months. If, under that period, there was a stressful event I can't resort to benzos as usual, that would be throwing away months of tapering.
> I do not want something to take regularly just for this, amitrip is doing a pretty good job. I'm just thinking ahead, maybe I think too much, I don't know.
>
> /tensor
I think all benzos are not created equal. When I suspected that clonazepam might be making me more depressed, I cross-tapered over to xanax, which I use PRN to this day. It's pretty much an ideal drug for me. I know how my body handles it, no side effects, no tolerance, no rebound anxiety or withdrawal when it wears off.I personally wouldn't be so quick to dis benzos. They've been around a long time, they are well understood, and a lot of people do well with them long term. You might want to consider crossing to another one and see if it makes a difference in how you feel.
Other than benzos, Paxil helped my anxiety and my depression, but it pooped out for the depression. A tiny dose of Seroquel has worked well for me PRN when my anxiety hits the stratosphere or if I simply can't sleep.
Good luck.
Posted by SLS on March 3, 2013, at 8:52:01
In reply to Re: Meds for anxiety prn » phidippus, posted by tensor on March 3, 2013, at 3:57:22
> I think all benzos are not created equal. When I suspected that clonazepam might be making me more depressed, I cross-tapered over to xanax, which I use PRN to this day. It's pretty much an ideal drug for me. I know how my body handles it, no side effects, no tolerance, no rebound anxiety or withdrawal when it wears off.
>
> I personally wouldn't be so quick to dis benzos. They've been around a long time, they are well understood, and a lot of people do well with them long term. You might want to consider crossing to another one and see if it makes a difference in how you feel.
>
> Other than benzos, Paxil helped my anxiety and my depression, but it pooped out for the depression. A tiny dose of Seroquel has worked well for me PRN when my anxiety hits the stratosphere or if I simply can't sleep.
>
> Good luck.
I agree with all of this - especially the wishing you good luck part.:-)
- Scott
Posted by tensor on March 3, 2013, at 10:57:11
In reply to Re: Meds for anxiety prn » tensor, posted by Emme_V2 on March 3, 2013, at 7:08:41
> > > Just curious tensor, why stop Clonazepam to start another drug that is going to have more side effects?
> > > I know that no one wants to be on a benzo for whatever reason but I'm just curious.
> >
> > I have tried most things to stop my recurring depressions that are becoming more frequent. I have not been benzo free for twelve years, so it could play a role. A rapid discontinuation doesn't work, the anxiety and the depression are too much to handle.
> > Going the Ashton way, which I plan todo, will take over six months. If, under that period, there was a stressful event I can't resort to benzos as usual, that would be throwing away months of tapering.
> > I do not want something to take regularly just for this, amitrip is doing a pretty good job. I'm just thinking ahead, maybe I think too much, I don't know.
> >
> > /tensor
>
>
> I think all benzos are not created equal. When I suspected that clonazepam might be making me more depressed, I cross-tapered over to xanax, which I use PRN to this day. It's pretty much an ideal drug for me. I know how my body handles it, no side effects, no tolerance, no rebound anxiety or withdrawal when it wears off.
>
> I personally wouldn't be so quick to dis benzos. They've been around a long time, they are well understood, and a lot of people do well with them long term. You might want to consider crossing to another one and see if it makes a difference in how you feel.
>
> Other than benzos, Paxil helped my anxiety and my depression, but it pooped out for the depression. A tiny dose of Seroquel has worked well for me PRN when my anxiety hits the stratosphere or if I simply can't sleep.
>
> Good luck.
>
>I must say, these posts have made me reconsider. I also had more than usual anxiety today and took an extra pill of clonazepam (2mg), which made me realize how much I need it. And as you say, if I discontinued it, it would need to be compensated/replaced with something else with more side effects and maybe not as effective. I tried alprazolam but didn't like it. Clonazepam is a keeper.
Thanks guys.
Posted by bleauberry on March 3, 2013, at 12:11:43
In reply to Meds for anxiety prn, posted by tensor on March 1, 2013, at 1:32:48
Zyprexa is a great med....well, as meds go anyway....but for anxiety I think that's a bit heavy duty. That's a serious med. But maybe worth a look. For me it knocked down horrible anxiety within about 2 hours of dosing, but it somehow over time made the whole anxiety thing more pronounced in its natural patterns.
I've used these herbs when withdrawing from benzos, sleeping pills, and antipyschotics. They were helpful, sometimes miracles.
Lemon Balm tincture.
Passion flower tincture.
Skullcap any version.Any experience with magnesium? It helps a lot of people. For me it can indeed squash an anxiety issue but makes me more depressed. For others it can actually be a depression cure. Mileage varies a lot. But it is generally a calming mineral and it is generally deficient in most americans.
As with all approaches, getting the right dose is what matters, and that is a matter of personal experimentation. For example, a half dropper of Lemon Balm for me makes maybe a hint of sedation but that's it. If I increase it to a full drooper, it is no longer sedating but instead kind of wakes up my brain, and yet at the same time I can feel the anxiety washing out of me within about 30 minutes. All of it, gone. Especially if I let some of it soak in the mouth a bit before swallowing.
Ongoing anxiety that is hard to treat tells me one thing....toxins are in the system. Those toxins are messing up a lot of works in the neurotransmitter departments, total chaos, no way to point a finger at just one thing or another. And thus the difficulty in managing it with a med that is too focused on just one thing.
Posted by Sheilac on March 4, 2013, at 8:10:13
In reply to Re: Meds for anxiety prn, posted by bleauberry on March 3, 2013, at 12:11:43
Trileptal is great for anxiety. Since taking 600mg a day I rarely need Klonopin. That said, Trileptal has a tendency to make me depressed.
But, it does work great for me for mood stabilization and anxiety.
Maybe a low dose like 150mg once or twice a day would cure that anxiety.
Something to discuss with your doc.
Posted by tensor on March 4, 2013, at 12:21:42
In reply to Re: Meds for anxiety prn, posted by Sheilac on March 4, 2013, at 8:10:13
> Trileptal is great for anxiety. Since taking 600mg a day I rarely need Klonopin. That said, Trileptal has a tendency to make me depressed.
>
> But, it does work great for me for mood stabilization and anxiety.
>
> Maybe a low dose like 150mg once or twice a day would cure that anxiety.
>
> Something to discuss with your doc.Interesting. But I wouldn't trade clonazepam for Trileptal. If I needed mood stabilization it would be a different story. Reading on the net it seems it also can cause anxiety.
Thanks anyway.
/tensor
Posted by Phillipa on March 4, 2013, at 21:07:37
In reply to Re: Meds for anxiety prn » Sheilac, posted by tensor on March 4, 2013, at 12:21:42
Tensor took 150mg for a few months but still on benzos. No reduction in anxiety. Actually nothing at all and was expensive so got off it. No withdrawal either. Phillipa
This is the end of the thread.
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