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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by vic80 on April 17, 2010, at 12:58:52
My Pdoc feels I need to change from my 20mg Lexapro to effexor. So I am tapering Lex: from 20mg to 10mg; this was supposed to be done while I start on 37.5 mg Effexor. I had a strange reaction - was completely mind-frozen after my first Effexor dose, so the doc asked me to not take any effexor for now and taper down lex. Doc says I sould not notice any withdrawal effects.
Past 4 days I have been taking 10mg Lex. I have noticed
* my fatigue has lessened.* I am feeling very indifferent. Not even feeling irritable or angry like when I was on lex. This is scaring me - makes me wonder if I have become MORE depressed or its just some side -effect.
* Feeling somewhat blue, not sad... just a feeling of deep loss.
* No anxiety (used to be rather wired on Lex 20mg)
* Feeling out of it, a bit like I am in a dream ... disconnected from the world. (felt dreamy/unconnected even before when I was on 20mg, but now its a different dream-like feeling! - distressing nevertheless)
* Unable to know how I am feeling
* Not much change in sleep
* not reacting to anything - a feeling of resignation
* Appetite is better
* unexplained feeling of dread
My understanding is that any increase or decrease in dose takes a while to affect the peak concentration levels of the med to reach a stable level for the renewed effects to be felt.
What should I expect..... am I undergroing withdrawal... or is the worse yet tome come???
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 17, 2010, at 14:08:00
In reply to Tapering down Lexapro 20mg, posted by vic80 on April 17, 2010, at 12:58:52
> My Pdoc feels I need to change from my 20mg Lexapro to effexor. So I am tapering Lex: from 20mg to 10mg; this was supposed to be done while I start on 37.5 mg Effexor. I had a strange reaction - was completely mind-frozen after my first Effexor dose, so the doc asked me to not take any effexor for now and taper down lex. Doc says I sould not notice any withdrawal effects.
>
> Past 4 days I have been taking 10mg Lex. I have noticed
> * my fatigue has lessened.
>
> * I am feeling very indifferent. Not even feeling irritable or angry like when I was on lex. This is scaring me - makes me wonder if I have become MORE depressed or its just some side -effect.
>
> * Feeling somewhat blue, not sad... just a feeling of deep loss.
>
> * No anxiety (used to be rather wired on Lex 20mg)
>
> * Feeling out of it, a bit like I am in a dream ... disconnected from the world. (felt dreamy/unconnected even before when I was on 20mg, but now its a different dream-like feeling! - distressing nevertheless)
>
> * Unable to know how I am feeling
>
> * Not much change in sleep
>
> * not reacting to anything - a feeling of resignation
>
> * Appetite is better
>
> * unexplained feeling of dread
>
> My understanding is that any increase or decrease in dose takes a while to affect the peak concentration levels of the med to reach a stable level for the renewed effects to be felt.
>
> What should I expect..... am I undergroing withdrawal... or is the worse yet tome come???
>Vic80,
You wrote,[...completly mind-frozen...indifferent..MORE depressed...deep loss..out of it...in a dream...disconnected...unable to know...not reacting...resignation...dread...is the worse yet to come???...].
What you are describibg here have been described that could be the classic effects from mind-altering drugs.
You asked as to what is yet to come. I can not see thw future but when the sky is red at night, the next day is supposed to be a great day. Now when the sky is red in the morning, that is supposed to be a warning that the day will be stormy.
Now when you list all of the things here that are happening to you, I think that the whole picture shows me that there could be a calber of disaster that you may not be aware of. I'm speaking about, death thoughts, gun purchasing, overdosing on multiple pills, and trying to find a way out of a dream-like state.
Well, I should say, how can anyone stop the thoughts that you have? Here what I can do. If you find one, two, three, four , five, six symptoms in your thoughts, symptoms that could be the difference between suicide and your life, email me and we could talk and I could be your partner in tribulation.
Lou
lpilder_1188@fuse.net
there is an underscore between my name and the 1188
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 17, 2010, at 14:23:21
In reply to Lou's offer-dehkliph » vic80, posted by Lou Pilder on April 17, 2010, at 14:08:00
> > My Pdoc feels I need to change from my 20mg Lexapro to effexor. So I am tapering Lex: from 20mg to 10mg; this was supposed to be done while I start on 37.5 mg Effexor. I had a strange reaction - was completely mind-frozen after my first Effexor dose, so the doc asked me to not take any effexor for now and taper down lex. Doc says I sould not notice any withdrawal effects.
> >
> > Past 4 days I have been taking 10mg Lex. I have noticed
> > * my fatigue has lessened.
> >
> > * I am feeling very indifferent. Not even feeling irritable or angry like when I was on lex. This is scaring me - makes me wonder if I have become MORE depressed or its just some side -effect.
> >
> > * Feeling somewhat blue, not sad... just a feeling of deep loss.
> >
> > * No anxiety (used to be rather wired on Lex 20mg)
> >
> > * Feeling out of it, a bit like I am in a dream ... disconnected from the world. (felt dreamy/unconnected even before when I was on 20mg, but now its a different dream-like feeling! - distressing nevertheless)
> >
> > * Unable to know how I am feeling
> >
> > * Not much change in sleep
> >
> > * not reacting to anything - a feeling of resignation
> >
> > * Appetite is better
> >
> > * unexplained feeling of dread
> >
> > My understanding is that any increase or decrease in dose takes a while to affect the peak concentration levels of the med to reach a stable level for the renewed effects to be felt.
> >
> > What should I expect..... am I undergroing withdrawal... or is the worse yet tome come???
> >
>
> Vic80,
> You wrote,[...completly mind-frozen...indifferent..MORE depressed...deep loss..out of it...in a dream...disconnected...unable to know...not reacting...resignation...dread...is the worse yet to come???...].
> What you are describibg here have been described that could be the classic effects from mind-altering drugs.
> You asked as to what is yet to come. I can not see thw future but when the sky is red at night, the next day is supposed to be a great day. Now when the sky is red in the morning, that is supposed to be a warning that the day will be stormy.
> Now when you list all of the things here that are happening to you, I think that the whole picture shows me that there could be a calber of disaster that you may not be aware of. I'm speaking about, death thoughts, gun purchasing, overdosing on multiple pills, and trying to find a way out of a dream-like state.
> Well, I should say, how can anyone stop the thoughts that you have? Here what I can do. If you find one, two, three, four , five, six symptoms in your thoughts, symptoms that could be the difference between suicide and your life, email me and we could talk and I could be your partner in tribulation.
> Lou
> lpilder_1188@fuse.net
> there is an underscore between my name and the 1188vic,
I have reviewd in more depth your post here and I think that it could be more serious than I first thought so I am withdrawing my offer. This is because I now think that you could be better helped by having somone close to you understand the thoughts that you are having and that there is the potential for one to think of suicide in the condition that you decribe here that you are in. So emailing me is not in y opinion the best thing for you.
I think that a person close to you could watch you and when you and be able to take you to maybe an ER if you show that you are comtemplating suicide.
Lou
Posted by Phillipa on April 17, 2010, at 19:26:03
In reply to Tapering down Lexapro 20mg, posted by vic80 on April 17, 2010, at 12:58:52
Vic could be some withdrawal. Why not give your pdoc a call so he can reassure you. Phillipa
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 18, 2010, at 11:05:03
In reply to Re: Tapering down Lexapro 20mg » vic80, posted by Phillipa on April 17, 2010, at 19:26:03
> Vic could be some withdrawal. Why not give your pdoc a call so he can reassure you. Phillipa
Friends,
It is written here,[...give your .doc a call..]. That is good advice IMO.
If you are considering posting in this thread or parallel threads, I am requestiing that you read the material in a link that you can find by doing a search by keying in what is titled,{Anti-Depressant Connection to suicide and murder-suicide}.
After reaading some of the articles in that, one could have IMO a better understanding of the situations presented here by members and you could IMO be better able to offer support to them.
Lou
Posted by vic80 on April 18, 2010, at 11:11:43
In reply to Lou's request to discussants-pserchgoogmosr, posted by Lou Pilder on April 18, 2010, at 11:05:03
Lou,
I dont get what you are trying to do... Are you trying to help, or caution AD users or are you trying to scare them?
Your intent fails my logic.
would you care to explain?
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 18, 2010, at 11:39:58
In reply to Re: Lou's request to discussants-pserchgoogmosr, posted by vic80 on April 18, 2010, at 11:11:43
> Lou,
>
> I dont get what you are trying to do... Are you trying to help, or caution AD users or are you trying to scare them?
>
> Your intent fails my logic.
>
> would you care to explain?vic,
You wrote,[...trying to help, or caution..or scare...explain?....].
The forum here is for support and education. It is my intent to help people here from completing a suicide. I also want to offer educational material to the members as per the mission of the site here.
Now in your post here, there are in my understanding the tell-tale signs of factors that could lead me at least to think that you could go into a mind-altered state and kill yourself.
I think that it is good that you posted here because I saw your post and I want to help you. You see, there is research to show a lot concerning this here and I think that by members here reading that research, one could be better able to offer support and education. Could you elaborate more about what you are wanting to mean in relation that you have posted to me something about scaring? If you could, then I could have the opportunity to respond accordingly.
Lou
Posted by bleauberry on April 18, 2010, at 13:24:16
In reply to Tapering down Lexapro 20mg, posted by vic80 on April 17, 2010, at 12:58:52
From what I have seen in others over the years and experienced myself, the taper schedules given us by doctors are often extremely aggressive. Those schedules almost guarantee some very rough times. 20mg to 10mg in such a short time is huge.
These meds are extremely potent at what they do.
I would suggest getting some practice at cutting pills, or crushing them into powder so you can make custome sized piles for doses, and lower your doses by about 1mg every 3 days or so. Bringing the dose down in very tiny steps over a gradual time period is the best way to avoid severe unpleasantness. There is no way to avoid it completely. But it can be greatly minimized.
What you are experiencing right now does not need to be that way. It is your nervous system in total confusion from a 50% decrease in dose. An informal general rule of thumb is to reduce dose no faster than 10% per week.
While benzos, stimulants, and other addictive substances are known for their withdrawal symptoms, I have experienced some of the worst withdrawals on common things like paxil, lexapro, zoloft, effexor, zyprexa. These drugs in my opinion are greatly underestimated in their power to create severe withdrawals.
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 18, 2010, at 17:51:42
In reply to Re: Tapering down Lexapro 20mg, posted by bleauberry on April 18, 2010, at 13:24:16
> From what I have seen in others over the years and experienced myself, the taper schedules given us by doctors are often extremely aggressive. Those schedules almost guarantee some very rough times. 20mg to 10mg in such a short time is huge.
>
> These meds are extremely potent at what they do.
>
> I would suggest getting some practice at cutting pills, or crushing them into powder so you can make custome sized piles for doses, and lower your doses by about 1mg every 3 days or so. Bringing the dose down in very tiny steps over a gradual time period is the best way to avoid severe unpleasantness. There is no way to avoid it completely. But it can be greatly minimized.
>
> What you are experiencing right now does not need to be that way. It is your nervous system in total confusion from a 50% decrease in dose. An informal general rule of thumb is to reduce dose no faster than 10% per week.
>
> While benzos, stimulants, and other addictive substances are known for their withdrawal symptoms, I have experienced some of the worst withdrawals on common things like paxil, lexapro, zoloft, effexor, zyprexa. These drugs in my opinion are greatly underestimated in their power to create severe withdrawals.
>
> Bleau,
You have a great message here. I invite all here to look at the following video. You find it by
A. bring up google
B. key in as you see it here: Youtube, Xanax (anxiolytic addiction and withdrawal)
C. If more than one come up, see Gwen Olsen
Lou
Posted by Bob on April 18, 2010, at 18:03:55
In reply to Re: Tapering down Lexapro 20mg, posted by bleauberry on April 18, 2010, at 13:24:16
>
> While benzos, stimulants, and other addictive substances are known for their withdrawal symptoms, I have experienced some of the worst withdrawals on common things like paxil, lexapro, zoloft, effexor, zyprexa. These drugs in my opinion are greatly underestimated in their power to create severe withdrawals.
>
>The word "underestimated" might not be strong enough. I would say in some cases the possibility of severe withdrawl is all but ignored.
Posted by Sigismund on April 18, 2010, at 23:44:54
In reply to Re: Tapering down Lexapro 20mg » bleauberry, posted by Bob on April 18, 2010, at 18:03:55
> I would say in some cases the possibility of severe withdrawl is all but ignored.
Yes, but they're not much fun so we are kept safe from the possibility of euphoria.
This is the end of the thread.
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