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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Larry Hoover on January 26, 2007, at 14:55:25
For the first time, a dopamine D1/D2 receptor dimer has been identified as what might be the primary site for the psychological disturbances arising in schizophrenia. I've only seen the press release, not the article:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/01/070123092637.htm
Lar
Posted by SLS on January 26, 2007, at 18:22:27
In reply to Dopaminergic/schizophrenia link discovered?, posted by Larry Hoover on January 26, 2007, at 14:55:25
> For the first time, a dopamine D1/D2 receptor dimer has been identified as what might be the primary site for the psychological disturbances arising in schizophrenia. I've only seen the press release, not the article:
>
> http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/01/070123092637.htm
>
> Lar
It would be nice to be able to squelch the calcium signals without having to block the DA receptors.
- Scott
Posted by linkadge on January 26, 2007, at 19:57:53
In reply to Re: Dopaminergic/schizophrenia link discovered?, posted by SLS on January 26, 2007, at 18:22:27
What about just calcium channel blockers?
Interesting, that vitamin D downregulats certain calcium channels.
This also might explain the utility of drugs like valproate in schizophrenia/mood disorders.
Doesn't PKC also modulate cellular excitability via calcium channels?
Linkadge
Posted by Livehappy on January 26, 2007, at 23:51:07
In reply to Re: Dopaminergic/schizophrenia link discovered?, posted by linkadge on January 26, 2007, at 19:57:53
I know this has nothing to do with the topic, but can someone make themselves paranoid? by fear, and then it to a point in their own state of mind that they are in danger even thought its a delusion such maybe as child thinks their is a monster in the closet, then you just add years to where, i have had some frineds think they are being staked. Now if you where in a fewd with a loan shark, mafia or somehting thats a diffrent situation, you would get shot.
But does this make a point, can, does it start as a child, well. I used to belive i was crazy, and was paranoid about going to a psyche ward. I had irrational thoughts of going insane, im wondering what was happening during that time.....
Im on xanax right now a very high dosage, plus Zprexa, and im fine...But like i said can you think yourself crazy?
Posted by Phillipa on January 27, 2007, at 12:35:55
In reply to Re: Dopaminergic/schizophrenia link discovered?, posted by Livehappy on January 26, 2007, at 23:51:07
I think if anxiety is bad enought it can lead to paranoia. Love Phillipa
Posted by mindevolution on January 30, 2007, at 6:44:40
In reply to Re: Dopaminergic/schizophrenia link discovered? » Livehappy, posted by Phillipa on January 27, 2007, at 12:35:55
how long has schizophrenia been around? at least 100 years, are we any closer to knowing its cause or physiology? they should really keep quiet unless they acutally discover something, lol.
they even refer to it as a disease!!!! it is no such thing. it is a mental illness with no known medial cause and no known physiology. it does not cause any degeneration and is vastly overrated as a condition. the medical treatments for the illness on the other hand, now then you are talking suicide rate * 20, life expectancy -20yrs, vegetative mental state, degeneration to every organ and system in the body.
me
Posted by linkadge on January 30, 2007, at 16:16:04
In reply to Re: Dopaminergic/schizophrenia link discovered?, posted by mindevolution on January 30, 2007, at 6:44:40
Its all just circular logic too.
The first APs were discovered by accident. Sombody noted that such drugs had a calming action in their patients.
They later threw together the hypothesis that effective drugs were the ones that blocked d2 receptors.
So now everybody is on the bandwagon to look for disturbances in the d2 receptors.
Just like when SSRI's came out, everybody was looking for disturbances in the serotonin transporter.
A hell of a lot of money and time were used to come up with basically no association at all.
Doctors want one magic bullit, so that they can say, here, take this pill it will correct such and such problems.
Linkadge
Posted by mindevolution on January 30, 2007, at 18:05:35
In reply to Re: Dopaminergic/schizophrenia link discovered?, posted by linkadge on January 30, 2007, at 16:16:04
> Its all just circular logic too.
>
> The first APs were discovered by accident. Sombody noted that such drugs had a calming action in their patients.
>
> They later threw together the hypothesis that effective drugs were the ones that blocked d2 receptors.
>
> So now everybody is on the bandwagon to look for disturbances in the d2 receptors.
>yes, the drugs seemed to reduce the symtpoms of mental illness, but so to did frontal lobotomies; do you think it would be too outrageous to suggest a "too many brain cells theory could be repromoted as the cause of schizophrenia"?
http://www.cphpost.dk/get/99968.html
> Just like when SSRI's came out, everybody was looking for disturbances in the serotonin transporter.
>
> A hell of a lot of money and time were used to come up with basically no association at all.
>problem is they stick to a suedo scientific explanation, for decades after, even though there is no evidence for it.
what would a truthful doctor say to a patient:
"we have absolutely no idea what causes your illness, but trust me these pills that work on serotonin are safe for you to take indefinitely because the company that makes them says so on the basis of 12 week trials that they conduct rather than being independently carried out! oh, and despit the prefix "anti" they can't cure the illness nor prevent it from occurring, and there are millions of lawsuits regarding the serious side effects of the medications including suicide" lol
> Doctors want one magic bullit, so that they can say, here, take this pill it will correct such and such problems.
and to just "trust them" about it.
me
Posted by linkadge on January 30, 2007, at 21:23:29
In reply to Re: Dopaminergic/schizophrenia link discovered?, posted by mindevolution on January 30, 2007, at 18:05:35
"we have absolutely no idea what causes your illness, but trust me these pills that work on serotonin are safe for you to take indefinitely
because the company that makes them says so on the basis of 12 week trials that they conduct rather than being independently carried out! oh, and despit the prefix "anti" they can't cure the illness nor prevent it from occurring, and there are millions of lawsuits regarding the serious side effects of the medications including suicide"Well said!
And what kinds of tests are they doing on the drugs? They are likely just doing the most rudimentary tests. Oh sure, a little cancer screening, make sure the drug doesn't cause spontanious death.
And combinations, my goodness. I remember reading that when sertraline and some anticonvulsant were combined they caused some massive increase in lipid peroxidation, oxidative stress, mitochondrial dsyfunction etc.
No wonder bipolars don't get better. Take a disease where mitochondial and glial function is already out of whack, and then throw 10 drugs together and hope it all just magically works out. Its all just symptomatic treatment, what happens under the seems could be very ugly.
What bothers me too is how psychiatry just kind of makes these seemless transitions from one concept to the next. Its done ever so slowly and carefully that to the untrained eye it all seems to make sense.
They are always trying to link things and connect things to make it seem like they were right all along.
If a problem ever comes down to either the patient or the drug, it is the patient.
Linkadge
Posted by mindevolution on January 30, 2007, at 22:30:27
In reply to Re: Dopaminergic/schizophrenia link discovered?, posted by linkadge on January 30, 2007, at 21:23:29
> And what kinds of tests are they doing on the drugs? They are likely just doing the most rudimentary tests. Oh sure, a little cancer screening, make sure the drug doesn't cause spontanious death.even if they find that it does, the company just misplaces the study and never publishes it, and then puts pressure on the next academics to come up with the "correct results" otherwise the university's funding could be cut, and the universities quite often make "difficult" academics resign: http://www.slate.com/id/2133061/
> And combinations, my goodness. I remember reading that when sertraline and some anticonvulsant were combined they caused some massive increase in lipid peroxidation, oxidative stress, mitochondrial dsyfunction etc.
I completely forgot about that!
> No wonder bipolars don't get better. Take a disease where mitochondial and glial function is already out of whack, and then throw 10 drugs together and hope it all just magically works out. Its all just symptomatic treatment, what happens under the seems could be very ugly.
>
> What bothers me too is how psychiatry just kind of makes these seemless transitions from one concept to the next. Its done ever so slowly and carefully that to the untrained eye it all seems to make sense.couldn't have said it better myself, it's david copperfield at his best!
> They are always trying to link things and connect things to make it seem like they were right all along.
> If a problem ever comes down to either the patient or the drug, it is the patient.
like delusion, equals illness, equals genetic links + structural brain abnormalities + problems with brain chemistry, equals premature mental degeneration, equals danger to society, equals really severe disease, equals better treat the patient against their will for extended periods of time with drugs that do cause brain degeneration, movement disorders, diabetes, sudden death, reduction in life expectancy. so therefore delusions = persons with premature degenerative dementia and strange facial and body ticks with a high risk of violence, sudden death or suicide. see, nothing up this sleeve, and nothing up that sleeve. and it is what the general public believe about the supposedly most dangerous and destructive mental illness there is!
the patient says: "I only thought the aliens were going to pick me up after smoking some pot, but the drugs you forced me to take caused my facial ticks and strange walk and muscle spasms, my brain to melt, and gave me diabetes and made me hallucinate, depressed, suicidal and violent". the doctors replies: "that was your disease, now take your medicine!"
me
This is the end of the thread.
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