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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by fires on September 4, 2005, at 18:33:58
I'm having severe insomia. Jerking/ muscle twitches/shocks just when about to fall asleep. I'm as tired as I can get, but part of my mind won't shutdown so I can sleep.
Lunesta isn't helping much -- 3 mg. I'm starting to have all kinds of other symptoms -- toes pulling up on left foot at times, depression geting worse, altered beathing at times,...
Last time I felt this way it was Effexor induced, and my doc gave me Klonopin wafers -- helped a lot. I'm afraid to take 1 mg of Klon. because:
I'm tapering off Klon. and am down to .5 mg from 3 mg. I'm also taking 300 mg Wellbutrin and 100 Lamictal for BP NOS. I'm convinced it's either Klon. discontinuation or Lamictal which is causing problem.
Due to weekend I can't get my pdoc until Tues.. I'm thinking of going to ER, but don't know what they can do -- maybe give me ativan? I seem stuck in a circle and I can't get out.
I know not to use med advise from web, but I need to do something.I will try to read responses, but may not reply today.
(Typing this helped me be more alert, but I'll drop down again when I stop.)
Thanks
Posted by Phillipa on September 4, 2005, at 19:20:11
In reply to Need help now: Klonopin?, posted by fires on September 4, 2005, at 18:33:58
How fast are you cutting down on your klonopin? Slow tapers are best. Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by gardenergirl on September 4, 2005, at 20:43:03
In reply to Re: Need help now: Klonopin? » fires, posted by Phillipa on September 4, 2005, at 19:20:11
Lamictal seems to give me some akisthesia at higher (for me) doses. I'm fine until I try to lie down to sleep, and then I just can't lie still and can't sleep. There seemed to be a bit of a delay in this hitting me from when I started at 75 mg and when the akisthesia hit. I also get myoclonic jerks when I lower my Nardil. I'm not sure what the mechanism for this is, but it's fairly common.
I don't know what to tell you about Klonopin. I've never taken it and know little about it.
What did help for me was doing yoga and drinking some herbal tea (Tension Tamer by Celestial Seasonaings).
I think the yoga was the most helpful, since it allowed my body to move, but also helped me to relax a bit by focusing inward on my breathing and my mind.
I wish I could help more. But allow yourself to get up and move if it helps. Not being able to sleep is not good, but it's better than lying awake in bed twitching, IMO.
gg
Posted by fires on September 4, 2005, at 21:46:14
In reply to Re: Need help now: Klonopin? » fires, posted by Phillipa on September 4, 2005, at 19:20:11
Thanks for replying. I've been reducing the Klon. by .5 mg every 2 weeks. I should be going from .5 to .25 mg tommorrow, but I may go up some.
I went to the ER because I've never before experiended what I experienced today. I was quite depressed for a couple of hours, then I very suddenly "lit up" like a lightbulb aout 5 pm. My mood never went past normal to exuberant, but I had many of the other hyper type symptoms of hypomania. I more clearly understand why the 4 docs involved in my treatment split 2 - 2 over whether I was BP or had dep. with anxiety. Today seemed like a mix of the two.
The ER wasn't much help -- like I expected. I was told that I could increase my Klonopin slightly, but that 3 mg of Lunesta should not be exceeded.
This is all new to me so -- I'm better for the time being -- but don't know what to expect in the future. I'm of the opinion that I won't cross the line into full blown mania. For now I just want to get more sleep!!
Posted by fires on September 4, 2005, at 22:09:16
In reply to Re: Need help now: Klonopin? » Phillipa, posted by gardenergirl on September 4, 2005, at 20:43:03
> Lamictal seems to give me some akisthesia at higher (for me) doses. I'm fine until I try to lie down to sleep, and then I just can't lie still and can't sleep.<snip>
The jerky - shock stuff doesn't start until I lie down, also. The benign fasciculations can occur at anytime.
<snip>> I wish I could help more. But allow yourself to get up and move if it helps. Not being able to sleep is not good, but it's better than lying awake in bed twitching, IMO.
>
> ggThat's *exactly* what the ER nurse told me. I don't know why it didn't dawn on me!! (to not lie there for 3 hours +). Maybe because I felt that sleep could come at any time.
Years ago when I had insomnia due to depression, Halcion worked absolutely great for me. I'd be asleep within 10 - 15 minutes, and sleep staight through until morning. I tried it a few months ago and it was worthless.
Thanks
Posted by wildcard on September 5, 2005, at 10:23:37
In reply to Re: Need help now: Klonopin? » gardenergirl, posted by fires on September 4, 2005, at 22:09:16
I can only tell u that both effexor and wellbutrin cause the same effects w/ me and i have to take klonopin to take the edge off, mainly at night. Nothing else has helped. I too had went down on the klonopin but taking effexor i take 1 to 1.5 mg early evening and sometimes need tylenol pm if i still cannot sleep by 1am. I hope things work out. Take care.
Posted by fires on September 5, 2005, at 11:20:23
In reply to Re: Need help now: Klonopin?, posted by wildcard on September 5, 2005, at 10:23:37
> I can only tell u that both effexor and wellbutrin cause the same effects w/ me and i have to take klonopin to take the edge off, mainly at night. Nothing else has helped. I too had went down on the klonopin but taking effexor i take 1 to 1.5 mg early evening and sometimes need tylenol pm if i still cannot sleep by 1am. I hope things work out. Take care.<
I slept much better last night. Thought I'd be too "hyper" to sleep, but I took .5 mg of Klonopin and 3 mg of Lunesta. I fell asleep within 60 - 75 mins. instead of 3 hours.
I have had problems with insomnia when trying Wellbutrin in the past -- it caused me to stop it after only days (on it). The pdoc I consulted suggested tapering off of Klon. while I come up on Lamictal, because I thought that Lamictal was causing sedation. Now it seems that it's not causing much sedation. Maybe I need some Klon. in addition to the Well. and Lam..
I'm curious about tylenol pm --- I'm going to read up on it.
Thanks!
Posted by gardenergirl on September 5, 2005, at 19:43:22
In reply to Re: Need help now: Klonopin? » wildcard, posted by fires on September 5, 2005, at 11:20:23
I hope things continue to smooth out.
gg
Posted by fires on September 5, 2005, at 20:07:04
In reply to Glad you got some sleep » fires, posted by gardenergirl on September 5, 2005, at 19:43:22
> I hope things continue to smooth out.
>
> ggThanks, better so far today, but not near where I want to be.
Posted by wildcard on September 5, 2005, at 21:30:15
In reply to Re: Glad you got some sleep, posted by fires on September 5, 2005, at 20:07:04
i dont know if tylenol pm would be the way to go for long term help. when i couldnt sleep, my doc added trazadone and i slept better and weined off the trazadone after 6 months or so. good luck!! i hope u sleep tonight.
Posted by gardenergirl on September 6, 2005, at 2:14:19
In reply to Re: Glad you got some sleep, posted by wildcard on September 5, 2005, at 21:30:15
Tylenol PM is tylenol with benadryl.
It makes me restless. Anything with benadryl does. :(
gg
Posted by Mr.Scott on September 8, 2005, at 13:31:33
In reply to Need help now: Klonopin?, posted by fires on September 4, 2005, at 18:33:58
Sounds like clonazepam withdrawal...Possibly heightened by the Wellbutrin. Can you taper a bit slower?
Scott
Posted by fires on September 8, 2005, at 14:21:38
In reply to Re: Need help now: Klonopin? » fires, posted by Mr.Scott on September 8, 2005, at 13:31:33
> Sounds like clonazepam withdrawal...Possibly heightened by the Wellbutrin. Can you taper a bit slower?
>
> ScottI'm doing better since my neuro. told me to increase my .25 mg of clon., up to .5 -.75 mg, and to not worry about tapering off for now. Said I may need to stay on clon.. (my neuro. returned my call within a few hours, my pdoc's nurse took about 27 hours).
I had no idea that Wellbutrin could make clon. withdrawal worse. I am wondering if clon. withdrawal can come on so relatively late in my tapering? I started at 3 mg and got down to .25 before I noticed anything.
Thanks
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