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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by lars1 on February 6, 2005, at 3:04:40
In reply to OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION?, posted by medhed on February 5, 2005, at 10:08:08
Hi medhed,
Opium may be effective in the short term, but tolerance is likely to develop and addiction is a real risk. If it were me, I wouldn't go that route unless I had exhausted all other alternatives -- meaning that I had tried antidepressants from several different classes, for a sufficient length of time and at an adequate dose, as well as combination therapies, cognitive-behavioral therapy, etc. If you tell us what your symptoms are and what you have tried, maybe we could suggest something that would work for you and be more effective long-term?
Lars
> currently i use poppy tea each weekend...
> what do you think?
>
> i also smoke raw opium- but it seems too recreational compared to tea.
Posted by SadDoggie on February 6, 2005, at 4:03:27
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION? » medhed, posted by lars1 on February 6, 2005, at 3:04:40
Yes if he hasn't tried all the antidepressants then I think he should go on trying others. But it would not be unreasonable to try an opiate if you have tried everything already. And add nmda antagonist memantine or amantadine to keep tolerance from setting in. I don't know if this really works and I'd like to see some people test it before I try it, lol. But if it doesn't help your depression then I don't see how you would get addicted. If it does help but you can't keep tolerance from setting in then just stop it and don't take it no more, and don't go to high doses.
SadDoggie
> Hi medhed,
>
> Opium may be effective in the short term, but tolerance is likely to develop and addiction is a real risk. If it were me, I wouldn't go that route unless I had exhausted all other alternatives -- meaning that I had tried antidepressants from several different classes, for a sufficient length of time and at an adequate dose, as well as combination therapies, cognitive-behavioral therapy, etc. If you tell us what your symptoms are and what you have tried, maybe we could suggest something that would work for you and be more effective long-term?
>
> Lars
>
> > currently i use poppy tea each weekend...
> > what do you think?
> >
> > i also smoke raw opium- but it seems too recreational compared to tea.
>
>
Posted by lars1 on February 6, 2005, at 5:27:54
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION?, posted by SadDoggie on February 6, 2005, at 4:03:27
> Yes if he hasn't tried all the antidepressants then I think he should go on trying others. But it would not be unreasonable to try an opiate if you have tried everything already. And add nmda antagonist memantine or amantadine to keep tolerance from setting in. I don't know if this really works and I'd like to see some people test it before I try it, lol. But if it doesn't help your depression then I don't see how you would get addicted. If it does help but you can't keep tolerance from setting in then just stop it and don't take it no more, and don't go to high doses.
Hi SadDoggie!
You raise some good points. Depression is highly disabling and often fatal, so it is certainly serious enough to merit use of a schedule II drug, if one was effective and no safer alternative was available. Mostly I just wanted to make the point that this should really be a last resort, and not a rationalization for recreational drug use (and I'm not saying the OP is doing that, BTW). I was particularly concerned that he seems to be self-medicating. If he hasn't sought medical advice, how does he know there isn't a correctible organic cause for his depression, and how does he know that there isn't a better alternative treatment?
Best regards,
Lars
Posted by medhed on February 6, 2005, at 5:34:08
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION? » medhed, posted by lars1 on February 6, 2005, at 3:04:40
I am diagnosed:
Major Depressive-cycling/treatment resistant
OCD (currently under control)
Post Traumatic Stress Disorder
ADD/Adult
Dual Diagnosis-- History of substance abuse (30yrs.)
Drugs that were prescribed for me:
(in the last 30yrs.)
Desoxyn, Dexedrine, Ritalin, Concerta,
Elavil, Nortryptoline, Imapramine,
Temazapam, Valium, Ativan, Klonapin,
Cloral Hydrate, Librium, Xanax,
Prozac, Zoloft, Paxil, Luvox,
(in the last 18mos.)
Welbutrin, Adderall, Abilify, Gabitril, Neurontin, Seroquel, Geodon, Strattera,
Effexor.I'm currently taking Welbutrin 300XR (for 6yrs.)and Effexor down from 300mgXR to 150mgXR. I like Welbutrin but I can't tell exactly what it's doing for me except that I don't experience side effects and that I would probally miss it if I discontinued it. Effexor brought me out of suicidal depression back in May 04 but I don't like the side effects. I'm numb in my extremities, profuse sweating (day and night), apathetic and tired, sexual... I tryed to quit cold turkey last month and had withdrawl symptoms. I'm not sure when I will try again, I am between pdocs now.
My 'substance abuse', what I call self medicating, at this time is periodical and controlled. There are substances that I now abstain from, alcohol, cocaine, street heroin, tobacco (I still use nicotine as a nicotrol nasal spray), research chemicals, and disassociatives.
I don't believe in total abstinence of ALL drugs due to my own experiences involving substance abuse treatment and 12 step groups. Drugs don't kill you, it's trying to find drugs- that's what kills you!Drugs I've used in the past 18mos. without a prescription or Dr.'s consent:
codiene, hydrocodone, oxycodone, morphine, hydromorphone, valium, ativan, xanax, soma.Illegal substances in the past 18mos:
LSD, mescaline, MMDA, LSA, marijuana/hashish, poppies- opium/tea, crystal meth.I know this is starting to look like it should be posted in substance use so let me get to the point. I want meds that I can rely on to make my life bearable on a daily basis AND I want to be able to augment these meds with the occasional vacation from life that opiates and benzos give me. Or the elation that I get from psycedelics. And the contentment of mind and body I get from cannabis. These are some of the things that make my life bearable, things I look foward to.
I've drank 2 cups of tea and I feel great! Too bad its so fleeting. I have enough experience to not get physically addicted but I do find myself looking foward to my little sessions on the weekend...
Posted by lars1 on February 6, 2005, at 6:23:56
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION? » lars1, posted by medhed on February 6, 2005, at 5:34:08
Hi again!
I am in no way qualified to recommend anything for you, but I am hoping others will have some ideas. I did notice that you don't list any of the MAO inhibitors, which lots of people seem to have good results from after everything else has failed. If you had a partial response to any of the anti-depressants you tried, then another option might be to go back to that and augment it with the Wellbutrin.
Best wishes,
Lars> I am diagnosed:
> Major Depressive-cycling/treatment resistant
> OCD (currently under control)
> Post Traumatic Stress Disorder
> ADD/Adult
> Dual Diagnosis-- History of substance abuse (30yrs.)
>
>
> Drugs that were prescribed for me:
> (in the last 30yrs.)
> Desoxyn, Dexedrine, Ritalin, Concerta,
> Elavil, Nortryptoline, Imapramine,
> Temazapam, Valium, Ativan, Klonapin,
> Cloral Hydrate, Librium, Xanax,
> Prozac, Zoloft, Paxil, Luvox,
> (in the last 18mos.)
> Welbutrin, Adderall, Abilify, Gabitril, Neurontin, Seroquel, Geodon, Strattera,
> Effexor.
>
> I'm currently taking Welbutrin 300XR (for 6yrs.)and Effexor down from 300mgXR to 150mgXR. I like Welbutrin but I can't tell exactly what it's doing for me except that I don't experience side effects and that I would probally miss it if I discontinued it. Effexor brought me out of suicidal depression back in May 04 but I don't like the side effects. I'm numb in my extremities, profuse sweating (day and night), apathetic and tired, sexual... I tryed to quit cold turkey last month and had withdrawl symptoms. I'm not sure when I will try again, I am between pdocs now.
>
>
> My 'substance abuse', what I call self medicating, at this time is periodical and controlled. There are substances that I now abstain from, alcohol, cocaine, street heroin, tobacco (I still use nicotine as a nicotrol nasal spray), research chemicals, and disassociatives.
> I don't believe in total abstinence of ALL drugs due to my own experiences involving substance abuse treatment and 12 step groups. Drugs don't kill you, it's trying to find drugs- that's what kills you!
>
> Drugs I've used in the past 18mos. without a prescription or Dr.'s consent:
> codiene, hydrocodone, oxycodone, morphine, hydromorphone, valium, ativan, xanax, soma.
>
> Illegal substances in the past 18mos:
> LSD, mescaline, MMDA, LSA, marijuana/hashish, poppies- opium/tea, crystal meth.
>
> I know this is starting to look like it should be posted in substance use so let me get to the point. I want meds that I can rely on to make my life bearable on a daily basis AND I want to be able to augment these meds with the occasional vacation from life that opiates and benzos give me. Or the elation that I get from psycedelics. And the contentment of mind and body I get from cannabis. These are some of the things that make my life bearable, things I look foward to.
>
> I've drank 2 cups of tea and I feel great! Too bad its so fleeting. I have enough experience to not get physically addicted but I do find myself looking foward to my little sessions on the weekend...
>
Posted by tygereyes on February 6, 2005, at 8:44:07
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION? » lars1, posted by medhed on February 6, 2005, at 5:34:08
If you're using the drugs you mentioned, any antidepressant medication will NOT work.
I am a recovering drug addict and when I was using, I was CONVINCED that medication didn't work for me and that I "had" to self-medicate to relieve my depression.
It was only after I quit doing drugs COMPLETELY that psychiatric medication began to work for me.
Until you're willing to give up drugs, you are not going to find a med that will work. Period.
As far as drugs not killing you, that is b*llshit. That's something you tell yourself so it is still okay, in your mind, to use drugs.
I have a friend who died from a meth overdose. I have a friend who died on Ecstasy. I nearly died from an OxyContin overdose two years ago.
THAT is the reality of drugs.
> I am diagnosed:
> Major Depressive-cycling/treatment resistant
> OCD (currently under control)
> Post Traumatic Stress Disorder
> ADD/Adult
> Dual Diagnosis-- History of substance abuse (30yrs.)
>
>
> Drugs that were prescribed for me:
> (in the last 30yrs.)
> Desoxyn, Dexedrine, Ritalin, Concerta,
> Elavil, Nortryptoline, Imapramine,
> Temazapam, Valium, Ativan, Klonapin,
> Cloral Hydrate, Librium, Xanax,
> Prozac, Zoloft, Paxil, Luvox,
> (in the last 18mos.)
> Welbutrin, Adderall, Abilify, Gabitril, Neurontin, Seroquel, Geodon, Strattera,
> Effexor.
>
> I'm currently taking Welbutrin 300XR (for 6yrs.)and Effexor down from 300mgXR to 150mgXR. I like Welbutrin but I can't tell exactly what it's doing for me except that I don't experience side effects and that I would probally miss it if I discontinued it. Effexor brought me out of suicidal depression back in May 04 but I don't like the side effects. I'm numb in my extremities, profuse sweating (day and night), apathetic and tired, sexual... I tryed to quit cold turkey last month and had withdrawl symptoms. I'm not sure when I will try again, I am between pdocs now.
>
>
> My 'substance abuse', what I call self medicating, at this time is periodical and controlled. There are substances that I now abstain from, alcohol, cocaine, street heroin, tobacco (I still use nicotine as a nicotrol nasal spray), research chemicals, and disassociatives.
> I don't believe in total abstinence of ALL drugs due to my own experiences involving substance abuse treatment and 12 step groups. Drugs don't kill you, it's trying to find drugs- that's what kills you!
>
> Drugs I've used in the past 18mos. without a prescription or Dr.'s consent:
> codiene, hydrocodone, oxycodone, morphine, hydromorphone, valium, ativan, xanax, soma.
>
> Illegal substances in the past 18mos:
> LSD, mescaline, MMDA, LSA, marijuana/hashish, poppies- opium/tea, crystal meth.
>
> I know this is starting to look like it should be posted in substance use so let me get to the point. I want meds that I can rely on to make my life bearable on a daily basis AND I want to be able to augment these meds with the occasional vacation from life that opiates and benzos give me. Or the elation that I get from psycedelics. And the contentment of mind and body I get from cannabis. These are some of the things that make my life bearable, things I look foward to.
>
> I've drank 2 cups of tea and I feel great! Too bad its so fleeting. I have enough experience to not get physically addicted but I do find myself looking foward to my little sessions on the weekend...
>
Posted by Impermanence on February 6, 2005, at 11:17:03
In reply to OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION?, posted by medhed on February 5, 2005, at 10:08:08
Opiates are great for depression but the problem is it's only while you're on them. I'd love to spend all day smoking heroin but thats just giving up, it's very hard to live a productive life while skaged out of your head all day on costly illegal substances.
I, like you am a very unhappy bunny when I don't have something to protect me from the harsh reality that is life. After years of drug and alcohol abuse I now just stick with weed and benzos which works fine and for a treat a few times a month I take codeine, dihydrocodeine or a cheeky line or ten on the foil (not very often these days). The tolerance and addiction associated with opiates has brought the strongest of men to the depths of despair and suffering so really it's not a great option unless you have an endless suppily and can afford it.
Do you grow your own opium? I'm thinking of bringing a few poppies into the world as the seeds seem to be easily available over here. I already grow cannabis indoors so I'm not a complete horticultural novice but I am in need of tips for opium.
Posted by medhed on February 6, 2005, at 13:07:54
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION? » medhed, posted by Impermanence on February 6, 2005, at 11:17:03
poppiesinternational.com is a place you can start.
I do not cultivate, nor would I admit if I did, illegal plants. Dried poppies are legal and sold in bulk for about $1.00US. The seeds are also legal. books on cultivation are legal.
Posted by medhed on February 6, 2005, at 13:36:02
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION?, posted by tygereyes on February 6, 2005, at 8:44:07
If you decide to use drugs again I hope you will do some research first and try to control yourself. To OD on Oxycontin you either had no idea what you were doing or were in a self destruct abuse mode. I consider abuse or addiction to be a moral or behavioral choice of the abuser. NOT A DISEASE. Dealt with cognitively, it can be controlled by choice, therefore total abstainence is not necessary.
Thank you for your opinion.
Posted by medhed on February 6, 2005, at 14:06:13
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION? » medhed, posted by Impermanence on February 6, 2005, at 11:17:03
poppies.org is also informative.
Posted by paulbwell on February 6, 2005, at 16:11:26
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION?, posted by medhed on February 6, 2005, at 14:06:13
> poppies.org is also informative.
Hi ya,
You mentioned you having taken
-Desoxyn
-Dexedrine
-RitalinI take Rit for ADHD,
what differences did you find with these meds in say?
-duration action
-cerebral stimulation vs somatic stimulation
-different areas of effectiveness?much appreciated,
Paul
Posted by medhed on February 7, 2005, at 6:27:25
In reply to MEDHED-Question, posted by paulbwell on February 6, 2005, at 16:11:26
> > poppies.org is also informative.
>
> Hi ya,
>
> You mentioned you having taken
> -Desoxyn
> -Dexedrine
> -Ritalin
>
> I take Rit for ADHD,
>
> what differences did you find with these meds in say?
>
> -duration action
> -cerebral stimulation vs somatic stimulation
> -different areas of effectiveness?
>
> much appreciated,
>
> PaulDesoxyn was the strongest, lasted about 8-12 hrs., and tended to be less beneficial for focus.
It was more body than brain. I never had any experience that compares to the meth addicts I read about as far as psycosis, behavior and inpulse problems. Not my first choice as an ADD med.Ritalin/Concerta made me sleepy, spaced, and appathetic. For the first hour I would feel increased motor and brain activity, within 2hrs. I would feel nauseus, dizzy, irritable, kind of like I was always withdrawling. Roller Coaster.
Dexedrine worked best for me for many years. Good focus, lasted well till the next dose, tolerance did not seem to be a problem. Dexedrine spanules were obviously better for length of duration.
Adderal was the best one for me. I feel this mix of amphetamine is the mildest, best for focus, easier to tolerate in the longterm. And XR lasts me all day at the lowest doses, higher doses tend to last too long and interfere with my sleep. They didn't make this certain combo of drugs when I was younger, I took Dextrostat for a long time.
Now I take adderal with frequent drug vacations. I don't feel amphetamine works well in the long term without cognitive therapy. It's best to be used during tough times in therapy, work, and other life experieces that do require focus.
I will be trying Provigil.
Posted by CareBear04 on February 7, 2005, at 10:19:41
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION?, posted by SadDoggie on February 6, 2005, at 4:03:27
hi, no disrespect at all intended. just wondering-- do most of you experience a "high" from opiates? i've heard of this happening with some people, but i've never had a high or a good feeling; more like a numb feeling of being pushed down.
Posted by CareBear04 on February 7, 2005, at 10:27:02
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION?, posted by tygereyes on February 6, 2005, at 8:44:07
please listen to this last poster! i'd blocked it out, but i too lost a close friend from a combination of these drugs. my close friend was under the care f a psychiatrist. i never figured out whether he was recovering from heroin (i didn't know about this possibility but it could be) or prescription painkillers (which he was pretty open about.) he died suddenly at the age of 22 from a mixture of methadone and xanax. i won't go into the sadness of it all, but he was talented and spirited, and when i remember what happened, i really want off my percocet and all my benzos and downers. i don't think he meant to die that night, but i think he was messing with high doses and flirting with danger, and he never woke up. please be safe.
Posted by medhed on February 7, 2005, at 11:27:16
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION? » tygereyes, posted by CareBear04 on February 7, 2005, at 10:27:02
Yes, you should never mix narcotics with benzos unless under a Docs close supervision. Benzos increase the strength of opiates and opiates increase the strength of benzos, making a powerful cocktail.
I notice that it is most people's belief that if you are taking narcotics you cannot control yourself or be responsible for your own health. I've found that you hear way more negative stories about uses of drugs compared to the people with positive experiences because of the social stigmas attached, nobody enjoying narcotics is going to advertise it in the mainstream. But if you look at the numbers, how many people are buying drugs? And how many are repeat customers? Somebody must be enjoying themselves...In the news, in the paper, in the neighborhood, society loves tragedy. Some people can't drive 55, they just have to push the limit. So you hear about the guy who ODed because he did not reasearch what he was taking or just didn't care, and while he was at it he invites a freind, now you have page 2 in the newspaper. All his freinds and family say 'drugs are bad', and for some reason the government loves it. (a whole nuther story)
What about this...
Headline, Daily News.
DETAILS ON PAGE 2.
"PHIL JACKSON GETS A SERIOUS BUZZ!!!, PHIL WAS HEARD SAYING, 'THAT WAS SOME GOOD SH*T.'"I don't think so.
Maybe in 'HIGH TIMES'
Posted by ed_uk on February 7, 2005, at 11:33:09
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION? » lars1, posted by medhed on February 6, 2005, at 5:34:08
Hi medhed!
Do you have a 'favourite' recreational drug? MDMA? LSD? Meth?
Which is your favourite opioid? Hydromorphone? Oxycodone?
Ed.
Posted by medhed on February 7, 2005, at 11:59:15
In reply to Recreational Drugs » medhed, posted by ed_uk on February 7, 2005, at 11:33:09
> Hi medhed!
>
> Do you have a 'favourite' recreational drug? MDMA? LSD? Meth?
>
> Which is your favourite opioid? Hydromorphone? Oxycodone?
>
> Ed.Hi Ed, I've read some interesting posts of yours.
Recreational, I would put marijuana but it's also a med for me. I really enjoy barbituates like seconal, nembutal, but they are hard to get, I substitute soma and fiorinal. In the old days it was Tuinal, Quaalude, Doriden, Placydil.
MMDA but I don't do it vey often.My favorite opiate is hydromorphone or fentanyl when I can get it. I like them because they can be introduced into the system a variety of ways easily and because of the strengtht.
I always try to know and respect the drugs I take, even recreationally.
Except for pcsyc meds-I'm always trying to trust the doc and he keeps screwing me. I'm finally trying to be proactive in my treatment and they don't like it... go figure, sometimes I feel like I work for them!
Posted by ed_uk on February 7, 2005, at 12:08:18
In reply to OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION??? » ed_uk, posted by medhed on February 7, 2005, at 11:59:15
Hi!
>I've read some interesting posts of yours.
Hey Thanks :-)
> I really enjoy barbituates like seconal, nembutal, but they are hard to get, I substitute soma and fiorinal. In the old days it was Tuinal, Quaalude, Doriden, Placydil.
Don't you find barbiturates a bit 'boring'?! If never taken one btw.
What effect does Quaalude have on you? Is it your favourite sedative to use recreationally?
Ed.
Posted by medhed on February 7, 2005, at 13:22:18
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION??? » medhed, posted by ed_uk on February 7, 2005, at 12:08:18
They don't make (LEMMON< RORER) Quaaludes anymore in the USA and there is no substitute. I think the equivalent in the UK is Mandrax but I'm not sure, Quaalude was very popular in the 70s and 80s. It was a very strong 'hyonotic' that had prosexual side effects. The generic name was something like Methaquaalone (not sure of spelling) They were affectionately nicknamed ludes on the street.
I am actually energized by barbituates. Kind of like some good scotch or some GHB. I don't like blackouts though, occasionally I'll blackout or fall. They are highly addictive and serious withdrawl can cause death, but if you watch your intake I don't see any problem except you might embarass yourself like a drunk! I think alot of people just knock out on this med, snore their *ss off. We used to call them Gorilla Bisquits in NYC.What is btw?
Posted by paulbwell on February 7, 2005, at 15:09:49
In reply to OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION? » paulbwell, posted by medhed on February 7, 2005, at 6:27:25
> > > poppies.org is also informative.
> >
> > Hi ya,
> >
> > You mentioned you having taken
> > -Desoxyn
> > -Dexedrine
> > -Ritalin
> >
> > I take Rit for ADHD,
> >
> > what differences did you find with these meds in say?
> >
> > -duration action
> > -cerebral stimulation vs somatic stimulation
> > -different areas of effectiveness?
> >
> > much appreciated,
> >
> > Paul
>
> Desoxyn was the strongest, lasted about 8-12 hrs., and tended to be less beneficial for focus.
> It was more body than brain. I never had any experience that compares to the meth addicts I read about as far as psycosis, behavior and inpulse problems. Not my first choice as an ADD med.
>
> Ritalin/Concerta made me sleepy, spaced, and appathetic. For the first hour I would feel increased motor and brain activity, within 2hrs. I would feel nauseus, dizzy, irritable, kind of like I was always withdrawling. Roller Coaster.
>
> Dexedrine worked best for me for many years. Good focus, lasted well till the next dose, tolerance did not seem to be a problem. Dexedrine spanules were obviously better for length of duration.
>
> Adderal was the best one for me. I feel this mix of amphetamine is the mildest, best for focus, easier to tolerate in the longterm. And XR lasts me all day at the lowest doses, higher doses tend to last too long and interfere with my sleep. They didn't make this certain combo of drugs when I was younger, I took Dextrostat for a long time.
>
> Now I take adderal with frequent drug vacations. I don't feel amphetamine works well in the long term without cognitive therapy. It's best to be used during tough times in therapy, work, and other life experieces that do require focus.
>
> I will be trying Provigil.--------------------------------------------------
Thanks for you reply,
You sound like you have been around a while, some of the meds you have mentioned have been discontinued for many years,
I'm assuming you took Desoxyn-(Guaduamets)(SR)5mg? 10mg? 15mg?
discontinued 5 years ago-Abbott Labs., strange you said that you found it to be more somatic vs cerebral, in action-most say the opposite.The only Desoxyn available now are 5mg IR tabs, which my friend takes for sever Narcolepsy (45+ years!)
- 4x5mg IR tabs Q.I.D 80mgs!!Ritalin often makes me larthergic too.
I wonder if Dex is smoother-less up/down, most say so.
Thanks again.
Cheers
Posted by Impermanence on February 7, 2005, at 15:16:52
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION??? » ed_uk, posted by medhed on February 7, 2005, at 13:22:18
Btw = By the way.
Thanks for the links, I've found many other sites also, theres a wealth of information on the subject out there.
I diden't realize just how simple it was to extract morphine from opium and turn morphine into heroin, if the duller masses only knew!!!
Theres fascinating history on opium at opioids.com, it's a great site.
Well it looks like I'll be in for a nice "itchy" few years, by that I mean I'm going to start sleeping on fiber glass because I'd never grow opium really, that would be illegal. Society says I'm not aloud to self medicate and enjoy Gods natural medicines, and society must be right, after all theres hardly any problems in the world!!
"I'll die young, but it's like kissing God"
Lenny Bruce
Posted by CareBear04 on February 7, 2005, at 16:41:24
In reply to MEDHED?, posted by paulbwell on February 7, 2005, at 15:09:49
what is a standard dose of desoxyn? if i take 50-60mg a day of adderall, what is the equivalence in desoxyn? i'd like to try it, but i think my pdoc probably hasn't heard of it or is probably scared of it. also, she wouldn't want to give me a humongous dose of it. i hear desoxyn comes only in 5mg pills now?
Posted by medhed on February 7, 2005, at 16:55:57
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION??? » medhed, posted by Impermanence on February 7, 2005, at 15:16:52
A great book full of info is "Opium for the Masses" by Jim Hogshire. A great how to, who, and why book, you will not need any more reading on the subject. Jim, who wrote the book got into tons of trouble in the US for writing this book and is now in hiding.
Posted by medhed on February 7, 2005, at 17:15:28
In reply to Re: MEDHED? » paulbwell, posted by CareBear04 on February 7, 2005, at 16:41:24
I haven't been prescribed Desoxyn for a long time. A previous poster says they've changed some so I would be irresponsible to comment on dosages. I found after many years of stimulant use for ADD that Dexidrine works well, but the mix in Adderall was the smoothest and most helpful to me. Desoxyn was not very good for MY ADD but everybody's different, and I seem to be very different when it comes to ups and downs... stims mellow me and the downers activate me.
Good luck getting your doc to prescribe Desoxyn, which is Methamphetamine, all the irresponsible abuse has once again drawn negative attention to a good drug. The Drug enforcers are afraid we might get high... now we wouldn't want that.
Posted by tygereyes on February 7, 2005, at 17:26:17
In reply to Re: OPIATES FOR DEPRESSION? » tygereyes, posted by medhed on February 6, 2005, at 13:36:02
I don't think that drug addiction is a disease, either. And I believe that some people can use in moderation; I just know from experience that I can't.
All I was saying was that if you are using these recreational drugs, psychiatric medication WILL NOT work and you might as well stop wasting your money.
And by the way, the OxyContin overdose occurred because I was using it intravenously. I was shooting it.
Thanks for berating me, though. Really.
> If you decide to use drugs again I hope you will do some research first and try to control yourself. To OD on Oxycontin you either had no idea what you were doing or were in a self destruct abuse mode. I consider abuse or addiction to be a moral or behavioral choice of the abuser. NOT A DISEASE. Dealt with cognitively, it can be controlled by choice, therefore total abstainence is not necessary.
> Thank you for your opinion.
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