![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Notaliseliz on July 4, 2004, at 5:28:50
Hi all,
I was diagnosed with depression about 10 years ago, but my problems started way before then.
My doctor has recently suggested cyclothymia and he changed me from an SSRI to oxycarba...whatever. I'm doing EXTREMELY BAD. I have no side effects, but it's like the devil is inside me.
I'm talking to my husband about divorce and thinking of running off and offing myself. My "moods" are swinging 180° every 5 minutes. I'm MEAN and NASTY and IRRITABLE over everything. It's so hard to talk to my doctor because I live in a country that's not my own and my vocabulary in this new language isn't good enough to express myself completely.
For me everything is BLACK and NEGATIVE and life just generally sucks. It's affecting my kids and my marriage, and even my social life. I'm not having trouble sleeping (any more than ususal) and my eating habits haven't changed. I'm feeling totally irrational and out of control.
Could this be an anxiety problem? Should I pursue anti-anxiety drugs? I've been on this oxycarb stuff for about 1 month, and off the SSRI for about the same time. I went thru a nasty bout of withdrawl (dizziness, fuzziness) about 2 weeks ago, but that's stopped.
I really need some advice.
Posted by linkadge on July 4, 2004, at 8:21:14
In reply to What's going on with me???? PLEASE RESPOND, posted by Notaliseliz on July 4, 2004, at 5:28:50
oxycarbamazapine should not be perscribed unless you have bipolar disorder. It is not an antidepressant. Some doctors would like to think it is, but it is not. It is a drug used for epilepesy that may work for bipolar disorder.
Go to a doctor who can perscribe you something different.
Linkadge
Posted by Racer on July 4, 2004, at 14:48:30
In reply to What's going on with me???? PLEASE RESPOND, posted by Notaliseliz on July 4, 2004, at 5:28:50
Wow! See, I've got a problem talking to my doctor about medication options, but that's only because he doesn't listen to me all that well -- I can't imagine how awful it would be if we were also speaking different languages! Don't you go doing anything permanent -- we need you here for inspiration! If you can muddle through with the deck so stacked against you, we should surely be able to soldier on, too.
Aside from that, what you're describing sounds a LOT like something that I experienced with a trial of Remeron -- which only lasted eight days, but nearly landed me on an involutary psychiatric hold even in that short a period. I was so irritable, so agitated, so actively suicidal and hostile, and the end came when my husband came up to try to comfort me and I told him to stay waaaayyyy back from arm's reach, because I couldn't promise I wouldn't lash out at him physically. I guess also told him I was afraid of hurting him or one of the cats, because I felt so out of control. ("Out of control" was the dominant quality of my experience on Remeron, by the way. OOC eating, hostility, anger, RAGE, etc. Thank goodness I still had the good sense to call the doctor's office to ask if this would pass -- true to form, there was no answer to that question, just a flat, "If you don't like it, stop taking it" with the implication that *I* was at fault for the failure of one more medication. But we do speak the same language. That's gonna be my new motto.) When I saw him at my next visit, he said he'd heard other patients say the same thing about Remeron -- somehow he didn't mention that part when he was reading me the list of side effects on the Informed Consent sheet, guess only the Official Side Effects (which he claimed he'd never heard about from his own patients) really count.
As for you, may I ask what language you're trying to communicate with the doctor in? Maybe someone here will know it well enough to offer some suggestions to help you communicate better. Another idea is to try to find another doctor who does speak -- well, I'm guessing you speak English -- your language, or at least provide a *good* interpreter? Or can you bring someone you trust to act as an interpreter for you? (Yeah, I know -- the idea of having anyone listen in on my little visits with Dr EyeCandy is pretty abhorrent to me, but if language is a barrier to effective treatment for you, it might be worth the discomfort of having someone else hear about your distress to break through it.)
I truly hope you find some relief, which this drug doesn't seem to be providing to you. Considering what you've written here, I'd say "stop the drug -- and then make a new appointment ASAP" That's not medical advice, only common sense -- if this sort of overwhelming distress started when you started this drug, and it's getting worse, and it's getting to the point that you feel you may become a danger to yourself and/or others -- well, that's about the point my husband finally pressured me to stop the Remeron and I wish now that I'd listened to him earlier.
And listen -- no matter how alone you feel in your distress, no matter how much you feel as if no one can empathize with you because your situation is so uniquely difficult, there are people here who have similarly and uniquely difficult situations. Many of us have tried multiple drugs over the years, and many of us have experienced doctors who are difficult to deal with. Even if we can't help you directly, this is a good place to come for support and just to be in a community that can understand better than a lot of the rest of the world. This med board isn't the only place on this site: check out the Social board, if you haven't already, because it's a great place to go and say, "WWWAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!! Why do I even keep trying?" and get a dozen answers back telling you what has kept others trying despite similarly awful experiences. There may not be a solution here for you, but there is caring and understanding and support. I hope you'll come back and visit here again.
Best luck.
Posted by Notaliseliz on July 4, 2004, at 15:14:33
In reply to Re: What's going on with me???? » Notaliseliz, posted by Racer on July 4, 2004, at 14:48:30
Thanks for your support, I appreciate it.Today was a bit better but it was a real effort on my part, but I can't say if tomorrow will be bad or good. I wish I could actually.
I'm calling my doc tomorrow to see if he can get me in this week. I walked out on our last appointment because he pissed me off and I'm not really in the right state of mind to deal with people who piss me off, you know?
I'm leaving here (Italy) on Friday for about two months in the states so I need to get myself in order.
I DEFINITELY CANNOT deal with my dysfunctional extended family like this.
By the way, I too called my doc "eye candy", even to his face sometimes 'cause he didn't understand anyway LOL, but now he just doesn't look too good to me. I guess I'm tired of his face.
He says "oh I understand how you feel" but I tell him, "if you're not on meds and have the same problems I do then you DON'T understand, and if you ARE on meds and DO feel like I do, what the hell are you doing here?" a little humor, tough, but I got it out.
Posted by Harlock on July 7, 2004, at 11:48:58
In reply to What's going on with me???? PLEASE RESPOND, posted by Notaliseliz on July 4, 2004, at 5:28:50
Hmmm, to me, you sound manic as well. I used to be super-irritable, angry, full of rage, etc. I used to snap at my wife, had road rage so bad that you wouldn't believe it if I explained it, etc.
I've never heard of the drugs you are on, but take that with a grain of salt.
It sounds like you need a mood stabilizer (again, not sure if one of those you are on is one).
One thing that really calmed me down was Symbyax. A drug I haven't seen discussed here too much. It does have sexual side effects, but they are light, meaning, I can still have sex, if I ever wanted to (which I don't now).
I take Wellbutrin for energy (keeps me awake) and Symbyax (which I believe is just prozac and zyprexa in one pill), and I just got put onto Lamictal to try to control my mood swings.
Right now, I find little to no enjoyment in life. I have two "good" days (which equates to, it's not a "bad" day), then I have 1-2 bad days. I go up and down like a yo-yo.
Personally, I'd rather have the rage again, and swap it with the depression. At least when I was angry, I could enjoy living. I've also had thoughts of suicide lately, which I never really had before.
I'm not productive at work, and I struggle severely to get out of bed and actually go there. I'm pretty useless when I'm there. Anyhoo, I'm a 35-year old male software engineer, just for a frame of reference.
If a particular drug isn't working for you, definately tell your doctor about it. Hopefully, he/she will explain about tapering off of it. A few of these drugs discussed here cause nasty withdrawal effects if you just stop taking them suddenly.
You may need to try a different cocktail of meds and need to find the right dosages in order to for them to help you. This can take 1 month, to many years depending on the person. I've been changing meds for 5-10 years, much of this happening in the last 2 years, but everyone is different.
Have faith, and hang in there. Try to remember that your brain fighting against you. Life really isn't as bad as your brain makes you think it is.
About 2 months ago, I had a couple weeks where I felt amazing, so I know there's hope. If you think of suicide, remember your husband and children, and other loved ones, and how negatively effected they would be if you hurt yourself, or worse.
I wish you good luck. I'm in the same boat as you, just with some different symptoms, although I share a few of yours.
> Hi all,
> I was diagnosed with depression about 10 years ago, but my problems started way before then.
> My doctor has recently suggested cyclothymia and he changed me from an SSRI to oxycarba...whatever. I'm doing EXTREMELY BAD. I have no side effects, but it's like the devil is inside me.
> I'm talking to my husband about divorce and thinking of running off and offing myself. My "moods" are swinging 180° every 5 minutes. I'm MEAN and NASTY and IRRITABLE over everything. It's so hard to talk to my doctor because I live in a country that's not my own and my vocabulary in this new language isn't good enough to express myself completely.
> For me everything is BLACK and NEGATIVE and life just generally sucks. It's affecting my kids and my marriage, and even my social life. I'm not having trouble sleeping (any more than ususal) and my eating habits haven't changed. I'm feeling totally irrational and out of control.
> Could this be an anxiety problem? Should I pursue anti-anxiety drugs? I've been on this oxycarb stuff for about 1 month, and off the SSRI for about the same time. I went thru a nasty bout of withdrawl (dizziness, fuzziness) about 2 weeks ago, but that's stopped.
> I really need some advice.
Posted by JohnDoenut on July 7, 2004, at 13:22:02
In reply to Re: What's going on with me???? PLEASE RESPOND » Notaliseliz, posted by Harlock on July 7, 2004, at 11:48:58
I would say people have given good advice here. Also get a new pdoc and meds. I would suggest taper down slowly
on what you are currently taking to get off it but not suddenly which could be bad.>I'm not productive at work, and I struggle severely to get out of bed and actually go there. I'm pretty useless when I'm there. Anyhoo, I'm a 35-year old male software engineer, just for a frame of reference
>Holy Cr** that sounds just like me!
Same profession too.
About a year ago I just up and left work
one day cause I couldnt take it anymore
and I knew they needed someone who could do
the work. I talked to my pdoc who supported
me and did the paperwork to get it worked
out with HR so I wasnt burning any bridges
and went on a medical leave of absense.
I said nothing to my bosses except I had a
medical problem that needed to be taken care of.
Attempted to go on disability. so there is that.J
Posted by Harlock on July 7, 2004, at 13:53:14
In reply to Re: What's going on with me???? PLEASE RESPOND, posted by JohnDoenut on July 7, 2004, at 13:22:02
Howdy.. you said attempted.. were you able to recieve disability?
I walked out once almost the same exact way. I sent my boss and email that said:
"...Fine then. Put me on medical leave"He didn't care for that. I got better and I came back to work - I fluctuate rapidly.
The main difference is that my current boss, and my last "boss" for that matter, knows about my condition. My current boss was a friend before he became my boss. One of the main reasons I had a manager change is due to the major problems with the previous boss, and his lack of belief/understanding/etc of mental disorders. Not only did he cut me NO slack, he was on my case about various medical related problems, all the time. We basically hate each-other now. We won't even speak to each other in the same meeting. ;)
I HATE how so many people think we're weak, and say "jeez, just snap out of it". Uh oh, you got me going now... Man, if I could just give them my disorder for a couple of weeks. Ya, I know that's mean...
My current boss has been pretty forgiving with my sudden mood changes. He tolerates it pretty well, which I REALLY appreciate. I still think of going on leave from time to time.
Funny, here's my AOL IM name:
"UselessEmployee"Take care,
-Harlock
Posted by notaliseliz on July 7, 2004, at 15:55:42
In reply to Re: What's going on with me???? PLEASE RESPOND » JohnDoenut, posted by Harlock on July 7, 2004, at 13:53:14
Hi, Thanks for the words of wisdom.
I found out--what I've been taking is Trileptal and for two days have been taking paxil too.
I've been yawning like mad!!!! I look stooopid.
I haven't killed anyone in the near vicinity, but Friday I'm taking a long flight back to Texas with the kids and with my experiences with American Airlines, well, you never know. I'll just say that last time I arrived in Chicago with two tired kids and the staff was completely, well, retarded, and I went into a "controlled" rage.
Thankfully I'm bypassing that airport this time!!!!I explained to my doc that I don't think he realizes how hard it is for me to explain myself in Italian, I hope he understood. He says I'm seeing things in black and white, so I don't see the big picture, but thought it was best for me to take the antidepressant along with the mood stabiliser.
I've had no problems on the trileptal, but I'm taking a low dose, 600 mg a day.
The paxil, on the other hand, is already giving me headaches, but that could also be because I'm yawning so hard my face hurts!!!!
As for changing docs, I have to admit I'm scared about thinking about it.
I'm "comfortable" because at least I know what to expect and he knows me.As for people not realizing how it feels--I went to have my hair done today and everything she did, to me at least, sucked. I explained that she just needed to ignore me because when I'm depressed, nothing is right. Of course I got, "Oh don't be depressed, snap outta it" (in Italian, of course). Whatever.
People can look at you and say, wow, what a great life you have, healthy kids, great husband, a nice home, job, etc...but these things don't matter when our brains decide that they don't matter. And it really bites.Oh yeah, I've had to curb the road rage thing here because my husband (he's Italian) scared me and said I'll probably flip off someone in the mafia, so I'd better not do it. But driving here is a real test of patience.
Well, off to bed for me. Thanks again for taking the time to reply...
Posted by Racer on July 7, 2004, at 16:19:55
In reply to Re: What's going on with me???? PLEASE RESPOND » Harlock, posted by notaliseliz on July 7, 2004, at 15:55:42
Just a quick note for communicating this to your pdoc:
I'm in California, where a huge percentage of the kids in public schools are not native speakers of English. When the standardized tests are given, the scores are skewed badly unless those kids are disaggragated from the results -- which doesn't always happen -- because you can't really tell if the kids couldn't answer the questions or JUST COULDN'T UNDERSTAND THEM IN THE FIRST PLACE! (That's the illustration for you.)
Remind your doctor that there's a difference between being able to SEE the world in shades of grey and being able to EXPRESS what you say in a language which is not your native tongue.
(Second illustration: different cultures and languages have differing numbers of color names. For some time, anthropologists thought maybe people in cultures that had limited numbers of color names could only see those colors. Took a while for them to wake up to the real answer: if they only have names for, say, three colors, it's because they only saw the need to NAME three of the infinite number of colors they could perceive.)
Hope that helps, and best luck.
Posted by Harlock on July 8, 2004, at 11:27:10
In reply to Re: What's going on with me???? PLEASE RESPOND » Harlock, posted by notaliseliz on July 7, 2004, at 15:55:42
Howdy again. Funny, I was on Trileptal for a bit as well. When I first started taking it, it didn't seem to do anything. So, I stopped taking it. My doc told me to try again, but this time, after 1-2 days of taking it, I was angry as hell. I couldn't believe the med would cause this reaction, especially so quickly, so I went two days without it, and wasn't angry at all. I tried to take it again, and boom, instant anger. So, I refused to take it ever since.
Anyway, great comment about people trying the "your life is great, and you shouldn't be upset" angle. I hear you.. they just don't get it. Everyone always asks me what's wrong, or what happened, when I'm miserable. I surprise them by saying "nothing, it's chemical". They don't believe me. One guy at work kept thinking I was mad at him. I don't think he believed me when I said no, it's just the depression.
I left work early yesterday, I was in a real low slump. I went home and went to bed. 4:30 in the afternoon. I also sleep around 11 hours a night.
Just started Lamictal, 2nd day, and from reading the insert that came with it, I'm scared as hell. The insert actually said there were some rare deaths caused by a skin? reaction, caused by this medication. WTF? I don't think my other meds every had issues like this. Scary stuff.
I'm only on my 2nd day taking it. Another person here posted a message about wanting to tear his skin off due to the itching that this med caused him. Wow, that's reassuring.
Oh well, I gotta go pretend I'm working.
Take care,
-H-
Posted by JohnDoenut on July 8, 2004, at 11:33:57
In reply to Re: What's going on with me???? PLEASE RESPOND » JohnDoenut, posted by Harlock on July 7, 2004, at 13:53:14
> Howdy.. you said attempted.. were you able to recieve disability?
>Its a complicated matter depending a lot of factors and mine and yours are unique to ourselves so the best thing to do is seek medical and legal advice on this.
>
> I walked out once almost the same exact way. I sent my boss and email that said:
> "...Fine then. Put me on medical leave"The thing here is its not up to your boss to put you on medical leave. In fact I would suggest you never discuss your medical issues with any boss again. Its none of their business and better if
they dont know if you need a reference. The procedure is to first talk to your doctor and tell him your intentions (he can tell you how to word your request), talk to HR And say you need to take a medical leave of absense and would like them to send you the forms. If you work for a company larger than a few hundred people they will have dealt with this before believe me! They have procedures in place for this. All you have to tell your boss is that you are going on a medical leave of absense and would not like to talk about it further for personal reasons. HR by law is not required to tell your boss anything and in fact by law cannot! Fill out your part of the forms and have your doctor fill out what he is supposed to. If you get short term disability that covers you from about 6 to 13 weeks. Get a copy of the STD and LTD insurance plan from HR and read it as they have exclusions. This advice is applicable to anyone in this situation by the way.If you are for whatever reason not covered by the insurance, you can file a claim for workers comp provided that you can show in the case of mental disability it did not occur at work. But again you have to check the workers comp laws of your state.
J
Posted by Harlock on July 8, 2004, at 11:48:57
In reply to Re: What's going on with me???? PLEASE RESPOND, posted by JohnDoenut on July 8, 2004, at 11:33:57
Thanks for the info on medical leave. I'm hoping that I never have to use it. When I get severely depressed, I thankfully don't stay there long. 1-2 days at the most. Problem is that I get depressed every 1-3 days or so, lately anyway. I don't feel the need to take an extended leave of absence right now, but good info in case it ever comes up.
As far as not telling your boss what's up, I don't think I really had a choice in the matter. I needed something I could blame for my strange behavior, otherwise, I would have definately lost my job. Now that he knows, things are better. I'd still get a good reference from him - he would never tell another employer about my condition. Like I might have said before, we are still friends.
Many people that work here know of my condition, mainly my friends. I don't tell everyone, just people I'm close to. It's worked out pretty good. Same issue, I need something concrete to explain my behavior. Otherwise, people wouldn't cut me any slack at all.. they would just assume I'm just a jerk or something.
But that's me. I'm open about it. I know many people are not.
Back to work.. bleah.
Posted by Angel Girl on July 10, 2004, at 22:12:20
In reply to Re: What's going on with me???? PLEASE RESPOND » notaliseliz, posted by Harlock on July 8, 2004, at 11:27:10
> Howdy again. Funny, I was on Trileptal for a bit as well. When I first started taking it, it didn't seem to do anything. So, I stopped taking it. My doc told me to try again, but this time, after 1-2 days of taking it, I was angry as hell. I couldn't believe the med would cause this reaction, especially so quickly, so I went two days without it, and wasn't angry at all. I tried to take it again, and boom, instant anger. So, I refused to take it ever since.
>
> Anyway, great comment about people trying the "your life is great, and you shouldn't be upset" angle. I hear you.. they just don't get it. Everyone always asks me what's wrong, or what happened, when I'm miserable. I surprise them by saying "nothing, it's chemical". They don't believe me. One guy at work kept thinking I was mad at him. I don't think he believed me when I said no, it's just the depression.
>
> I left work early yesterday, I was in a real low slump. I went home and went to bed. 4:30 in the afternoon. I also sleep around 11 hours a night.
>
> Just started Lamictal, 2nd day, and from reading the insert that came with it, I'm scared as hell. The insert actually said there were some rare deaths caused by a skin? reaction, caused by this medication. WTF? I don't think my other meds every had issues like this. Scary stuff.
>
> I'm only on my 2nd day taking it. Another person here posted a message about wanting to tear his skin off due to the itching that this med caused him. Wow, that's reassuring.
>
> Oh well, I gotta go pretend I'm working.
>
> Take care,
>
> -H-
HarlockI didn't mean to scare you with my experience with Lamictal. Firstly, remember that the insert said *rare* deaths caused by skin rash. Also, just because *I* reacted unfavorably to Lamictal, doesn't necessarily mean that you will. YMMV!!! I knew all about the risks of Lamictal before starting it and it was a risk I was willing to take. Just start at a very low dosage and tirate very slow and be on the lookout for any rashes. BTW, I'm female. :) Also, I'm personally not aware of any other med with the same kind of potential side effect. Speak to your pdoc.
AG
Posted by Harlock on July 12, 2004, at 10:20:45
In reply to Re: What's going on with me???? PLEASE RESPOND » Harlock, posted by Angel Girl on July 10, 2004, at 22:12:20
Hiya.. Oh I know that side effects are different for everyone, possibly absent. I get scared/worried when anyone has side effects, especially bad ones. I tend to see the 'standard' side effects that most meds list on their little insert. Some drugs just turned me into a zombie, specifically Effexor and ... damn, I forgot the name of it. It was so bad that I went to see this coworker's house at lunch, and the next day I couldn't remember parts of the visit. Hell, I could remember much of the prior few days. I got off that one quick. Tapered it and still got nasty "withdrawal" symptoms.
Every time I bend over to pick something up, I felt ill.. nausea, vertigo, etc. That took months to finally clear up.
Anyway, I'm always worried about side effects. I'm on day 6 of Lamictal, and no side effects to speak of (so far anyway).
Take care.
> > Howdy again. Funny, I was on Trileptal for a bit as well. When I first started taking it, it didn't seem to do anything. So, I stopped taking it. My doc told me to try again, but this time, after 1-2 days of taking it, I was angry as hell. I couldn't believe the med would cause this reaction, especially so quickly, so I went two days without it, and wasn't angry at all. I tried to take it again, and boom, instant anger. So, I refused to take it ever since.
> >
> > Anyway, great comment about people trying the "your life is great, and you shouldn't be upset" angle. I hear you.. they just don't get it. Everyone always asks me what's wrong, or what happened, when I'm miserable. I surprise them by saying "nothing, it's chemical". They don't believe me. One guy at work kept thinking I was mad at him. I don't think he believed me when I said no, it's just the depression.
> >
> > I left work early yesterday, I was in a real low slump. I went home and went to bed. 4:30 in the afternoon. I also sleep around 11 hours a night.
> >
> > Just started Lamictal, 2nd day, and from reading the insert that came with it, I'm scared as hell. The insert actually said there were some rare deaths caused by a skin? reaction, caused by this medication. WTF? I don't think my other meds every had issues like this. Scary stuff.
> >
> > I'm only on my 2nd day taking it. Another person here posted a message about wanting to tear his skin off due to the itching that this med caused him. Wow, that's reassuring.
> >
> > Oh well, I gotta go pretend I'm working.
> >
> > Take care,
> >
> > -H-
>
>
> Harlock
>
> I didn't mean to scare you with my experience with Lamictal. Firstly, remember that the insert said *rare* deaths caused by skin rash. Also, just because *I* reacted unfavorably to Lamictal, doesn't necessarily mean that you will. YMMV!!! I knew all about the risks of Lamictal before starting it and it was a risk I was willing to take. Just start at a very low dosage and tirate very slow and be on the lookout for any rashes. BTW, I'm female. :) Also, I'm personally not aware of any other med with the same kind of potential side effect. Speak to your pdoc.
>
> AG
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.