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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by spower_ette on March 1, 2004, at 13:27:06
I've looked for information about Buspar and Klonopin being used for depression with anxiety components but can't find anything solid.
From what I've read here it appears that Klonopin MAY increase depression long term?
Is Buspar a strong enough antidepressant effect?
I'm beginning to think my doctor doesn't know what he is doing.
Help!
power
Posted by zeugma on March 1, 2004, at 16:43:12
In reply to Buspar and Klonopin for depression w/ anxiety?, posted by spower_ette on March 1, 2004, at 13:27:06
> I've looked for information about Buspar and Klonopin being used for depression with anxiety components but can't find anything solid.
>
> From what I've read here it appears that Klonopin MAY increase depression long term?
>
> Is Buspar a strong enough antidepressant effect?
>
> I'm beginning to think my doctor doesn't know what he is doing.
>
> Help!
>
> poweris your dr. using buspar as an antidepressant? now i've heard everything. it is very common to hear buspar used instead of klonopin, because dr.'s hate writing scripts for scheduled drugs and the "Clinical Manual of Psychopharmacology" claims buspar is an 'anxiolytic.' this is a deplorable tendency, but very common.
If anything, buspar is a better antidepressant than anxiolytic. That is not saying much. And klonopin can indeed cause or worsen depression.i am on two AD's AND buspar, and the tiny amt. of klonopin i take seems like all I can stand, partly because it does induce depression.
What doses buspar and klonopin are you on?
Posted by spower_ette on March 8, 2004, at 14:15:36
In reply to Re: Buspar and Klonopin for depression w/ anxiety? » spower_ette, posted by zeugma on March 1, 2004, at 16:43:12
zeguma,
Thank you so much for answering! I don't have a computer at home so I'm sorry for the delay. It took me a while to find what happened to this post.
I guess that my doctor is using the Buspar as an antidepressant. In reading about it more it seems like it is used mainly for anxiety and secondarily as an antidepressant. I am on 45 mg a day of Buspar.
The Klonopin was just added. I take a half milligram in the morning and a half milligram in the evening for a total of one mg a day.
I'm feeling lower now than I have and after reading about people's experiences with Klonopin and residual depressive effects from that medication I'm having strong doubts.
I know I need something for anxiety but it appears that my depression is being undertreated.
What now? I feel like some sort of freakish pill popper taking two drugs.
Thanks again Zeguma for your help. I wasn't ignorning you but don't get to use the computer as much as I'd like to.
power
Posted by zeugma on March 8, 2004, at 16:14:17
In reply to Re: Buspar and Klonopin for depression w/ anxiety? » zeugma, posted by spower_ette on March 8, 2004, at 14:15:36
It's odd that you feel that you have anxiety and depression and the depression is being undertreated, for the longest time I felt I had both, too, but the anxiety was undertreated. I suppose it has a lot to do with who is treating you, and what they are comfortable with prescribing.
Klonopin, without a doubt, can contribute to depression. I was about to give it up over the Christmas break, when the lethargy it was inducing was truly horrific, when i discovered that without it my social anxiety came back... things like standing in line at the supermarket became ordeals again. So I stuck with it, and while I feel it has dampened my AD's efficacy somewhat, it is helping me enough to justify itself in other respects. (Life isn't perfect.)
It sounds like you need an antidepressant that is stronger than Buspar. You can stop the buspar easily if you decide to (no withdrawal syndrome), but if it's helping you can keep it on board and try an SSRI.... the Buspar may mitigate the side effects of SSRI's, especially at the dose you're at. (I was never able to tolerate more than 30 mg.)
z
Posted by shadows721 on March 9, 2004, at 20:15:26
In reply to Buspar and Klonopin for depression w/ anxiety?, posted by spower_ette on March 1, 2004, at 13:27:06
If I were you, I would give it a try and see if it works for you. I have found that Buspar acts as a very mild antidepressant and did nothing for anxiety. So, if your depression is not severe, it may be worth it to give it a try. Also, buspar increases sexual enjoyment and doesn't cause withdrawal or weight gain. You may find you feel dizzy about 20 mins after taking it. That is normal. You may also get the munches right after it kicks in, but that will pass too. The nice thing about Buspar is there is no withdrawal if it doesn't work for you. But, even if it doesn't take care of the depression, you can add an ssri to it. The two usually work really well together.
Klonopin works wonders for anxiety. So, give it a try. If it doesn't work for, you can just an antidepressant to the mix. Good luck to you.
Posted by micro on March 9, 2004, at 22:45:16
In reply to Buspar and Klonopin for depression w/ anxiety?, posted by spower_ette on March 1, 2004, at 13:27:06
> I've looked for information about Buspar and Klonopin being used for depression with anxiety components but can't find anything solid.
>
> From what I've read here it appears that Klonopin MAY increase depression long term?
>
> Is Buspar a strong enough antidepressant effect?
>
> I'm beginning to think my doctor doesn't know what he is doing.
>
> Help!
>
> powerDear Power,
The question I have for you is regarding your diagnosis. Do you have a pure anxiety disorder or an anxious depression? Chronic anxiety left untreated can lead to depression or depressive symtoms. Also, depression in and of its self will manifest as anxiety or anxiety symtoms. This is where it really gets grey...Is anxiety a manifestation of depression, a seperate entity or or the two interelated. I think it would be logical to believe that a pure anxiety disorder exists if an antianxiety med alone eliminates the depressive symtoms. If it does not, there is likely an underlying depression which requires treatment. There is also a waste basket term used frequently as "mixed anxiety depression"
The real answer lies in the question; is or is not anxiety a prominent feature of depression. If it is truly mixed, and anxiety is a just a different manifestation of depression then it would appear to be more logical to treat anxiety with an antidepressant and the anxiety would abate. The current difficulty is : which came first or are they the same disease?
Buspar from all accounts appears to be a wash as a stand alone antidepressant and is frequently ineffective for the control of moderate to severe anxiety, but it has been used as an adjunctive med with some success. Klonopin causes depressive symtoms in those who are not depressed, hence the need for adjunctive antidepressive meds. While it may not be true to all cases, Klonopin causes depressive symtoms period for many people. I think you may be better off reconsidering this combination if you are continuing to be symtomatic. Some of the more sedating antidepressants titrated slowly may control the anxiety symtoms unless of course you have comorbid conditions.As I have stated repeatedly [and don't mind doing so appropriate treatment] lies in proper diagnosis which can't be done in a twenty minute session in most cases. This is exactly why many bipolars that you read about are not diagnosed early while there is an abundance of literature that requires consideration of this diagnosis particularrly if depressive features were present early in life.
I teach this every day in my practice... History ,History, History--- Diagnosis etc, etc... A history taken well will led to a proper diagnosis which leads to proper therapy. A great diagnosis is in in great history. Treatments are in a receipe book which anyone can look up.
Does this help?
Let me know! regards, Micro
Posted by micro on March 9, 2004, at 22:49:20
In reply to Buspar and Klonopin for depression w/ anxiety?, posted by spower_ette on March 1, 2004, at 13:27:06
> I've looked for information about Buspar and Klonopin being used for depression with anxiety components but can't find anything solid.
>
> From what I've read here it appears that Klonopin MAY increase depression long term?
>
> Is Buspar a strong enough antidepressant effect?
>
> I'm beginning to think my doctor doesn't know what he is doing.
>
> Help!
>
> powerDear Power,
The question I have for you is regarding your diagnosis. Do you have a pure anxiety disorder or an anxious depression? Chronic anxiety left untreated can lead to depression or depressive symtoms. Also, depression in and of its self will manifest as anxiety or anxiety symtoms. This is where it really gets grey...Is anxiety a manifestation of depression, a seperate entity or or the two interelated. I think it would be logical to believe that a pure anxiety disorder exists if an antianxiety med alone eliminates the depressive symtoms. If it does not, there is likely an underlying depression which requires treatment. There is also a waste basket term used frequently as "mixed anxiety depression"
The real answer lies in the question; is or is not anxiety a prominent feature of depression. If it is truly mixed, and anxiety is a just a different manifestation of depression then it would appear to be more logical to treat anxiety with an antidepressant and the anxiety would abate. The current difficulty is : which came first or are they the same disease?
Buspar from all accounts appears to be a wash as a stand alone antidepressant and is frequently ineffective for the control of moderate to severe anxiety, but it has been used as an adjunctive med with some success. Klonopin causes depressive symtoms in those who are not depressed, hence the need for adjunctive antidepressive meds. While it may not be true to all cases, Klonopin causes depressive symtoms period for many people. I think you may be better off reconsidering this combination if you are continuing to be symtomatic. Some of the more sedating antidepressants titrated slowly may control the anxiety symtoms unless of course you have comorbid conditions.As I have stated repeatedly [and don't mind doing so] appropriate treatment lies in proper diagnosis which can't be done in a twenty minute session in most cases. This is exactly why many bipolars that you read about are not diagnosed early while there is an abundance of literature that requires consideration of this diagnosis particularrly if depressive features were present early in life. While I am not a pdoc,
I teach this every day in my practice... History ,History, History--- Diagnosis etc, etc... A history taken well will led to a proper diagnosis which leads to proper therapy. A great diagnosis is in great history. Treatments are in a receipe book which anyone can look up.
Does this help?
Let me know! regards, Micro
P.S. Sorry for the sloppy posting before editing for error.
Posted by spower_ette on March 12, 2004, at 12:20:27
In reply to Re: Buspar and Klonopin for depression w/ anxiety? » spower_ette, posted by zeugma on March 8, 2004, at 16:14:17
> It's odd that you feel that you have anxiety and depression and the depression is being undertreated, for the longest time I felt I had both, too, but the anxiety was undertreated. I suppose it has a lot to do with who is treating you, and what they are comfortable with prescribing.
>I think the more I read here the more confused I get as to what I'm being treated for and waht I'm actually dealing with.
> Klonopin, without a doubt, can contribute to depression. I was about to give it up over the Christmas break, when the lethargy it was inducing was truly horrific, when i discovered that without it my social anxiety came back... things like standing in line at the supermarket became ordeals again. So I stuck with it, and while I feel it has dampened my AD's efficacy somewhat, it is helping me enough to justify itself in other respects. (Life isn't perfect.)
>
> It sounds like you need an antidepressant that is stronger than Buspar. You can stop the buspar easily if you decide to (no withdrawal syndrome), but if it's helping you can keep it on board and try an SSRI.... the Buspar may mitigate the side effects of SSRI's, especially at the dose you're at. (I was never able to tolerate more than 30 mg.)
>
> z
>
>thank you for your response once again. I have a lot to think about and talk about with my doctor.
power
Posted by spower_ette on March 12, 2004, at 12:24:08
In reply to Re: Buspar and Klonopin for depression w/ anxiety?, posted by shadows721 on March 9, 2004, at 20:15:26
> If I were you, I would give it a try and see if it works for you. I have found that Buspar acts as a very mild antidepressant and did nothing for anxiety. So, if your depression is not severe, it may be worth it to give it a try. Also, buspar increases sexual enjoyment and doesn't cause withdrawal or weight gain. You may find you feel dizzy about 20 mins after taking it. That is normal. You may also get the munches right after it kicks in, but that will pass too. The nice thing about Buspar is there is no withdrawal if it doesn't work for you. But, even if it doesn't take care of the depression, you can add an ssri to it. The two usually work really well together.
>
> Klonopin works wonders for anxiety. So, give it a try. If it doesn't work for, you can just an antidepressant to the mix. Good luck to you.Thank you shadows721 for this information. I thought I was the only one who felt that weird dizzy pass out feeling twenty minutes after taking buspar in the morning. It doesn't affect me like that in the evening.
I don't know which is more severe right now. I have a lot of things to go over with my doctor.
thank you again.
power
Posted by spower_ette on March 12, 2004, at 12:26:13
In reply to Re: Buspar and Klonopin for depression w/ anxiety?, posted by micro on March 9, 2004, at 22:45:16
> > I've looked for information about Buspar and Klonopin being used for depression with anxiety components but can't find anything solid.
> >
> > From what I've read here it appears that Klonopin MAY increase depression long term?
> >
> > Is Buspar a strong enough antidepressant effect?
> >
> > I'm beginning to think my doctor doesn't know what he is doing.
> >
> > Help!
> >
> > power
>
> Dear Power,
> The question I have for you is regarding your diagnosis. Do you have a pure anxiety disorder or an anxious depression? Chronic anxiety left untreated can lead to depression or depressive symtoms. Also, depression in and of its self will manifest as anxiety or anxiety symtoms. This is where it really gets grey...Is anxiety a manifestation of depression, a seperate entity or or the two interelated. I think it would be logical to believe that a pure anxiety disorder exists if an antianxiety med alone eliminates the depressive symtoms. If it does not, there is likely an underlying depression which requires treatment. There is also a waste basket term used frequently as "mixed anxiety depression"
> The real answer lies in the question; is or is not anxiety a prominent feature of depression. If it is truly mixed, and anxiety is a just a different manifestation of depression then it would appear to be more logical to treat anxiety with an antidepressant and the anxiety would abate. The current difficulty is : which came first or are they the same disease?
> Buspar from all accounts appears to be a wash as a stand alone antidepressant and is frequently ineffective for the control of moderate to severe anxiety, but it has been used as an adjunctive med with some success. Klonopin causes depressive symtoms in those who are not depressed, hence the need for adjunctive antidepressive meds. While it may not be true to all cases, Klonopin causes depressive symtoms period for many people. I think you may be better off reconsidering this combination if you are continuing to be symtomatic. Some of the more sedating antidepressants titrated slowly may control the anxiety symtoms unless of course you have comorbid conditions.
>
> As I have stated repeatedly [and don't mind doing so appropriate treatment] lies in proper diagnosis which can't be done in a twenty minute session in most cases. This is exactly why many bipolars that you read about are not diagnosed early while there is an abundance of literature that requires consideration of this diagnosis particularrly if depressive features were present early in life.
> I teach this every day in my practice... History ,History, History--- Diagnosis etc, etc... A history taken well will led to a proper diagnosis which leads to proper therapy. A great diagnosis is in in great history. Treatments are in a receipe book which anyone can look up.
> Does this help?
> Let me know! regards, Micro
>This does help!! thank you Micro. I think that I haven't had a proper history taken and that might be the first step in making things work again.
power
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