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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by mrgeek on February 18, 2004, at 10:12:36
So I'm just curious about this. As many know Klonopin is great as a sleep aid for those of us with insomnia problems. I am currently taking it for treatment of Social Anxiety and find the sleep benefits very helpful. What I'm wondering however, is are there other reasons people take it at night? Do the effects of a nightly dose carry over to the next day as far as anti-anxiety effects go? I know the duration of it's effects are something like 10-12 hours and this would make sense. Does anyone have a more technical, in-depth explanation/justification for this? Thanks!
/mrgeek
Posted by KellyD on February 18, 2004, at 14:58:11
In reply to Taking Klonopin before bed - effects next day?, posted by mrgeek on February 18, 2004, at 10:12:36
Reports state the halflife can be up to 30 hours. Which means some of the active metabolites can still be in your system at that point. While it has helped me with sleep, I have found after using it a while, the sleepiness feeling dimishes and I'm left with only the antianxiety effects. Stands to reason that if those symptoms (anxiety based) are the cause of insomnia, a benzo can still be of use to aid sleep. There are some conflicting reports of benzo's interferring with stage 4 sleep in some sleep studies. But, personally, once my anxiety is controlled, I no longer have sleep issues.
I have found for my garden variety anxiety "disorder" which includes: social, generalized, agoraphobic tendencies, and (now) rare panic attacks, a once dosing at night does not cover me for 24 hours - even with the halflife findings. My daytime dose is actually MORE important than my nighttime dose and I can actually skip the nighttime dose altogether at times.... in the beginning of my use I always dosed twice a day.
Other probably have different findings, but those are the ones I find for me.
I hope you don't mind my input to your actual question. You know my standing, but I do want to see you succeed in getting a handle on this cr*ppy illness.
How are you doing, btw?
Posted by Viridis on February 18, 2004, at 23:55:57
In reply to Taking Klonopin before bed - effects next day?, posted by mrgeek on February 18, 2004, at 10:12:36
Initially, I tried taking my dose (1 mg/day) before bed, but I found that the anti-anxiety effects started to wear off by about noon the next day. I do much better taking it in the morning. For the first while I tried divided doses throughout the day (to minimize sleepiness). The drowsiness (which was minor to begin with) disappeared quickly, and now I just take it all at once when I wake up.
Posted by mrgeek on February 19, 2004, at 8:21:58
In reply to Re: Taking Klonopin before bed - effects next day?, posted by KellyD on February 18, 2004, at 14:58:11
KellyD,
Thanks again for your input! :) I'm actually doing great! I have also read about the 30 hour halflife, but have also read from many sources that the actual duration of action is somewhere in the range of 8-12 hours (depending on the individual), which would pretty much match up with what Viridis said in the previous post.
I am also in agreement with you about the sleep aid aspect. It's really very logical. The way I see it, taking the Clozenepam has absolutely nothing directly to do with making you sleepy. Rather, it removes the blockade one may have (i.e., anxiety) and allows one to go to bed as normal. I have noticed this for myself as I can take my nightly dosage and not pass out instantly if I still want to be up doing things for a few hours. I love it! I used to pace back and forth around the house or watch the television for hours before I could actually go to bed. My mind would just refuse to relax and shut down!
I definitely agree that the daytime (morning/afternoon) dose is very important, to me at least. I have also a few times over the past 9 days considered not taking my nightly dose just because I have been feeling so relaxed, but then again I really dont know what effect that would have.
Does skipping your before-bedtime dose have any adverse affects for you? Taking a once-daily dosage in the morning would be great if possible.
Hope all is well.
/mrgeek
Posted by KellyD on February 19, 2004, at 8:37:26
In reply to Re: Taking Klonopin before bed - effects next day?, posted by mrgeek on February 19, 2004, at 8:21:58
I am really glad to hear you are doing well.
I didn't start skipping my PM dose until I had been on K for about a year or so. For the first year, I dosed AM and PM. Now, I really don't notice any ill effects from skipping. I have gone (rarely) a day or so without dosing at all.... simply because I forgot.... and that is the best feeling, actually... to be doing well enough that you don't even think about your med. I try not to forget it though... and abrupt stoppage is never a good idea, so I try to keep "on track".
I will probably be a "lifer", but that's fine with me. It has made dramatic changes (for the absolute good) in my life.
Keep doing well. It may take a bit of time to work out a good schedule for you.
Kelly
Posted by KellyD on February 19, 2004, at 9:51:34
In reply to Re: Taking Klonopin before bed - effects next day?, posted by KellyD on February 19, 2004, at 8:37:26
There is evidence that alcohol combined with Klonopin can increase seizure potential. This was probably discovered as Klonopin is also used to control seizures. Could have also been found in those who abruptly stopped taking the med and had alcohol use as a factor, too. (this is only my speculation). Whether this seizure potential bears out in individuals who have no history of seizures, I'm really not sure, but that is the general warning with combining. I'm also unaware of what dose plus how much alcohol.
There is also some pretty good evidence that the combo can depress the resp. center to the point of apnea. The Karen Ann Quinlan situation was due to the use of alcohol and Valium. Being the same drug class could give the impression that it could occur with any benzo. I think we are talking large amounts of both.
Some have reported that benzo's tend to potentiate the effects of alcohol... meaning you get ____faced faster and the hangover factor can also be intensified.
Caution should be used.
I'm not posting for scare.... just for information. I use alcohol very rarely, but I have drank without problems, but I excercise a healthy dose of caution.
There have been posts where people have consumed fairly good doses of both and have no difficulties but I personally don't recommend it, but that's just me.
Just be careful.
Posted by mrgeek on February 19, 2004, at 9:56:47
In reply to Regarding alcohol and Klonopin, posted by KellyD on February 19, 2004, at 9:51:34
Posted by KXo on February 19, 2004, at 13:10:11
In reply to Regarding alcohol and Klonopin, posted by KellyD on February 19, 2004, at 9:51:34
What would be the amount of Klonopin taken with alcohol to cause problems?
I usually don't drink much alcohol and I have no problems with the combination. But what if someday I drink heavily?
Posted by KellyD on February 19, 2004, at 13:58:43
In reply to Re: Regarding alcohol and Klonopin, posted by KXo on February 19, 2004, at 13:10:11
I really don't know the answer to that, I'm sorry. I'm assuming it may have to do with body mass and the like... but I really don't know.
My opinion, and that's what it is, MY opinion... if consumption of alcohol routinely is an important issue for anyone (not necessarily a PROBLEM, but important) then a benzo may not be the best choice for treatment in terms of the safety concerns. Plus, that's asking a liver to do alot of work....
This is the end of the thread.
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