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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 5 to 29 of 29. Go back in thread:
Posted by McPac on April 29, 2003, at 22:55:25
In reply to Re: Zoloft, posted by linkadge on April 29, 2003, at 11:42:50
Questions for you, please:
1) Prozac made me VERY Angry/Irritable, Zoloft does too....WHY? What is it about those 2 ssri's that could cause that? (If it helps, Lamictal also made me that way) Geez, I really need to figure this out!
(Also, if it helps, Remeron, at 45 mg. sped me up too much (very jittery) but did NOT make me angry....is there any way to deduce why the ssri's cause anger/temper problems? Thanks!!!
Posted by Snoozy on April 29, 2003, at 23:12:16
In reply to Zoloft, posted by canwetalk on April 29, 2003, at 8:25:41
Lots of good suggestions here. I would add thinking about your mom seeing a geriatric psychiatrist. If she is taking any other medications, those may be having an interaction with the Zoloft. And if she does withdraw from Zoloft, be very careful of the dizziness.
Good luck!
> My 87 years old mom was placed on Zoloft a year ago due to depression. She is on 50mg of Zoloft. Mom says she does not understand why she is still on it because she feels she is no longer depressed.
>
> Have read on Zoloft and I am concerned about it's side effects etc. I do know that mom does not remember things as she once did and this all started after being on Zoloft. She seems not to have the energy she once had. She was driving still and everything. Now it is like she is an entirely different person.
>
> I do think that mom is not always taking her medication because she sometimes acts strangely. Could anyone give me some suggestions in dealing with her. I am very concerned this is my mom.
>
> Does Zoloft react differently in someone her age? I believe it does because she has changed entirely after being on this. I mean this is suppose to be for depression but now there are so many other things that are there that was not there since taking the Zoloft.
Posted by linkadge on April 30, 2003, at 17:17:42
In reply to Linkadge, Re: Zoloft, posted by McPac on April 29, 2003, at 22:55:25
I'm not exactly sure but I do know that
the Serotonin aspect of the drugs *shouldn't*
cause anger/irritability symptoms.The secondary binding sites of these drugs
may have caused the problems. Prozac
does have affinity for the Norepinephrine
sites, and Zoloft has affinity for Dopamine
receptor sites. These two chemicals can
provoke anger in certain individuals.You could try a cleaner SSRI like Celexa,
or Lexapro. Also, these symptoms could be
signs of the depression (which can sometimes
worsen before getting better).Also, certain people with underying bipolar disorder can react with anger/rage if pushed
by a drug into a manic state.
But this is not normal, for most people SSRI's
surpress anger.
Good Luck
Linkadge
Posted by Katia on May 3, 2003, at 3:28:26
In reply to Linkadge, Re: Zoloft, posted by McPac on April 29, 2003, at 22:55:25
Ihaveto say that I didn't do well onZoloft. My keyboard is a testimony for that. When I was onit, I wasazombie. Nowthat i"vebeen off it for thepast three weeks; it's been a bleary nightmare. First mind shivers/electrical jolts,thenMOODSWINGS. It's been awful..My (maybe fifth pdoc?) put me onZoloft after effexor and told me torelax. It'd be ok b/c Zoloft was EASY to come off of. It'sbeenworse than Effexor.
I've had theworst rages in the past week over NOTHING. i'VE Been doing homeimprovement type of things that led me to absolute destitute tears....ofrage rage rage so much i punched thispoor keyboard. now what to do?
it's my experience since you were asking.
katia
> Questions for you, please:
>
> 1) Prozac made me VERY Angry/Irritable, Zoloft does too....WHY? What is it about those 2 ssri's that could cause that? (If it helps, Lamictal also made me that way) Geez, I really need to figure this out!
> (Also, if it helps, Remeron, at 45 mg. sped me up too much (very jittery) but did NOT make me angry....is there any way to deduce why the ssri's cause anger/temper problems? Thanks!!!
Posted by Katia on May 3, 2003, at 3:41:44
In reply to Re: Zoloft » canwetalk, posted by Snoozy on April 29, 2003, at 23:12:16
Hi,
Since coming off of Zoloft, Ive been experiencing some wierd thingsinmy mind. I have been in more than one rage of terror. so muchI've called friends in the night to save me (I never do these midnight "drama" calls):-).Mind you, I'm a pretty competent woman (except for this keyboard) but lately, I've felt as though my boundaries are floating away from me and i REALLY don't know where reality ends and my fantasy begins. I'vethought about doing crazy things,like becomea prostitute for a living. And I'm meaningthis in a sincere way. And I'mso far fromthat! HAsanyone else felt this way? Where they felt their boundaries dissolving and some wierd creative and primal urge surface?
any replys of honesty would begreatly appreciated!
katia
Posted by zeugma on May 3, 2003, at 14:29:23
In reply to W/Zoloft w/drawal lose reality?, posted by Katia on May 3, 2003, at 3:41:44
> Hi,
> Since coming off of Zoloft, Ive been experiencing some wierd thingsinmy mind. I have been in more than one rage of terror. so muchI've called friends in the night to save me (I never do these midnight "drama" calls):-).
>
> Mind you, I'm a pretty competent woman (except for this keyboard) but lately, I've felt as though my boundaries are floating away from me and i REALLY don't know where reality ends and my fantasy begins. I'vethought about doing crazy things,like becomea prostitute for a living. And I'm meaningthis in a sincere way. And I'mso far fromthat! HAsanyone else felt this way? Where they felt their boundaries dissolving and some wierd creative and primal urge surface?
> any replys of honesty would begreatly appreciated!
> katia
I would guess that since SSRI's cause apathy and general indifference to one's surroundings, coming off it might create a hypersensitivity and hyperemotionality that is not itself bad, but may be exaggerated because of the previous numbing.I know quite a few people who have taken SSRI's, and the ONLY ones I know who did well on them did not have severe or chronic depression. I don't know if your dx is chronic or severe but it sounds like it may have triggered a hypomanic episode.
Posted by Katia on May 3, 2003, at 19:21:16
In reply to Re: W/Zoloft w/drawal lose reality? » Katia, posted by zeugma on May 3, 2003, at 14:29:23
Hi,
I'm not sure that it's a hypomanic ep. I have suffered from depression my whole life interspersed w/ major ones lasting years. dx-depression. not bi-polar.Ifeel far too crazy at times; like something just clicks and i becometotally and unreasonably rageful or tearful or amconfused at a very deep level what thepoint is inall thislife drama.
anyway,prob. just w/drawals from Zoloft. can't wait for it toimprove!
thanks.
Posted by bookgurl99 on May 3, 2003, at 22:04:42
In reply to Re: W/Zoloft w/drawal lose reality? » zeugma, posted by Katia on May 3, 2003, at 19:21:16
Katia,
This sounds like a reaction to all the stress that you're going under. I remember when I was wd'ing, that sometimes I felt really overwhelmed and emotional. Part of it was that I was not used to feeling certain fears that I used to.
Physiologically, withdrawal usually makes me feel either really tired or anxious/hyper/panicky. The very least I can say is that it will go away. Even if you have to ride it out for a few weeks to a month, eventually the symptoms will dissipate.
Are you looking for something else to go on? Maybe you can get on something else in a couple weeks to minimize the withdrawal symptoms.
books
Posted by Katia on May 4, 2003, at 0:57:04
In reply to Re: W/Zoloft w/drawal lose reality?, posted by bookgurl99 on May 3, 2003, at 22:04:42
> Katia,
>
> This sounds like a reaction to all the stress that you're going under. I remember when I was wd'ing, that sometimes I felt really overwhelmed and emotional. Part of it was that I was not used to feeling certain fears that I used to.
>
> Physiologically, withdrawal usually makes me feel either really tired or anxious/hyper/panicky. The very least I can say is that it will go away. Even if you have to ride it out for a few weeks to a month, eventually the symptoms will dissipate.
>
> Are you looking for something else to go on? Maybe you can get on something else in a couple weeks to minimize the withdrawal symptoms.
>
> books
>
>Hi books,
yes, fivedays ago I began Serzone. we'll see....
thanks for your concern.
Posted by bookgurl99 on May 4, 2003, at 8:50:58
In reply to Re: W/Zoloft w/drawal lose reality? » bookgurl99, posted by Katia on May 4, 2003, at 0:57:04
Hey katia, I'm going from zoloft to serzone too. we'll have to compare notes.
though, i have been on serzone before, and developed a bad reaction to it -- it gave me panic attacks every time i took it after a while, but my p.doc figured out what was going on; i'm not supposed to have it with coffee!
this is going to be my first no-zoloft day, btw.
books
Posted by Katia on May 4, 2003, at 13:39:21
In reply to Re: W/Zoloft w/drawal lose reality? » Katia, posted by bookgurl99 on May 4, 2003, at 8:50:58
> Hey katia, I'm going from zoloft to serzone too. we'll have to compare notes.
>
> though, i have been on serzone before, and developed a bad reaction to it -- it gave me panic attacks every time i took it after a while, but my p.doc figured out what was going on; i'm not supposed to have it with coffee!
>
> this is going to be my first no-zoloft day, btw.
>
> books
>
Hi Books,
I was under the impression that it was ok to stop Zoloft rather suddenly from my pdoc! So, still not heeding her advice, I took myself off of it kinda gradually; from 200 to 100 the next week to 50 and then off. And that obviously wasn't slow enough. That pdoc is long gone and I've hadanother one lately who is overworked and not withme inthis process at all. I had also started Wellbutrin two weeks at the end and the side effects I was experiencing from the Zoloft w/drawal I figured it was the wellbutrin;so stoppedthat. (b/c of what mydoc said). (I wasn'tabout to take anything againthat gave me those electrical shock things). Now I realize it was zoloft w/drawal worse than effexor w/drawal. (and probably wasn't the WB) I think it's easing up a bit now; the electrical things and nauseousness; but then I got themood swings. I was off allmeds for about two weeks reluctant to take anything as i am/was not getting good help. But last week, in therapy it was quite obvious I was eitherinthe moodswings w/drawal from zoloft orfalling into another depression. So I beganthestarter pack of Serzone fourdays ago. we'll see. Sometimes, I think i'm improving but then I'll have a "moment" of complete irrationality and hysteria and realize that I'm not ok.
we'll see. ifyou want we can e-mail each other regarding this tracking since we're experiencing similar situations.
good luck.
Katia
Posted by bookgurl99 on May 7, 2003, at 19:16:18
In reply to Re: W/Zoloft w/drawal lose reality? » bookgurl99, posted by Katia on May 4, 2003, at 13:39:21
Hey Katia,
how is starting on the serzone going?
i just took my first 75 mg. pill. the p.doc said i could start once i didn't feel ill from zoloft. i took zoloft down to 25 mgs for 5 days, then took nothing for 3 days, and am now on this low dose of serzone. (i know it's a little fast, but. . .)
the exciting thing for me is that i'm not getting the reaction -- heart pounding, full on panic attack -- that i used to get from it after awhile. yay!
i feel mildly nauseated, but i'm not sure if that's the serzone or zoloft withdrawal. i remember feeling a little nauseated when i started on it, so we'll see.
are you feeling any better? are those flashes of panic going away?
Posted by Katia on May 7, 2003, at 19:53:28
In reply to to serzone from zoloft » Katia, posted by bookgurl99 on May 7, 2003, at 19:16:18
> Hey Katia,
>
> how is starting on the serzone going?
>
> i just took my first 75 mg. pill. the p.doc said i could start once i didn't feel ill from zoloft. i took zoloft down to 25 mgs for 5 days, then took nothing for 3 days, and am now on this low dose of serzone. (i know it's a little fast, but. . .)
>
> the exciting thing for me is that i'm not getting the reaction -- heart pounding, full on panic attack -- that i used to get from it after awhile. yay!
>
> i feel mildly nauseated, but i'm not sure if that's the serzone or zoloft withdrawal. i remember feeling a little nauseated when i started on it, so we'll see.
>
> are you feeling any better? are those flashes of panic going away?
>Hi,
Why did your doc want you to wait for the w/drawal to pass before you started on the Serzone?
I'm still experiencing w/drawal from Zoloft. It's horrendous. still the electrical zaps and the bouts of rage. and some nauseousness - serzone or zoloft?? It's been over three weeks, when will this end? is it permanent?????
I'm really tired and sick of this!
Not sure if the serz. working....it's hard to tell. I started at100mg for five days and now I'm on my fourth day of 200mg. How high do people normally go?
thanks.
katia
Posted by bookgurl99 on May 7, 2003, at 20:42:12
In reply to Re: to serzone from zoloft » bookgurl99, posted by Katia on May 7, 2003, at 19:53:28
Hey Katia,
> Why did your doc want you to wait for the w/drawal to pass before you started on the Serzone?I think to make it easier on me physically, as it can be more uncomfortable to go on one thing and come off another at the same time. Also, it helps to sort out which med. is causing which symptoms.
> I'm still experiencing w/drawal from Zoloft. >It's horrendous. still the electrical zaps and >the bouts of rage.
I had this on another ad, not zoloft. it lasted about a month and a half. sorry. : (
> and some nauseousness - serzone or zoloft??serzone can cause you to feel nauseous when you start, along with dry mouth or drowsiness. i feel a little nauseous from starting it.
>is it permanent?????
i bet that your withdrawal side effects -- zaps, etc. will go away with time.
> I'm really tired and sick of this!
i understand. i really hope you're feeling better soon. here's to healing for us both. :D
> Not sure if the serz. working....it's hard to tell. I started at100mg for five days and now I'm on my fourth day of 200mg. How high do people normally go?
uh -- i first took it at 200, then got bumped to 300.
right now i'm on 75's until the nausea goes away.
see ya,
books
Posted by Katia on May 8, 2003, at 2:53:47
In reply to Re: to serzone from zoloft » Katia, posted by bookgurl99 on May 7, 2003, at 20:42:12
> Hey Katia,
>
>
> > Why did your doc want you to wait for the w/drawal to pass before you started on the Serzone?
>
> I think to make it easier on me physically, as it can be more uncomfortable to go on one thing and come off another at the same time. Also, it helps to sort out which med. is causing which symptoms.
>
> > I'm still experiencing w/drawal from Zoloft. >It's horrendous. still the electrical zaps and >the bouts of rage.
>
> I had this on another ad, not zoloft. it lasted about a month and a half. sorry. : (
>
>
> > and some nauseousness - serzone or zoloft??
>
> serzone can cause you to feel nauseous when you start, along with dry mouth or drowsiness. i feel a little nauseous from starting it.
>
> >is it permanent?????
>
> i bet that your withdrawal side effects -- zaps, etc. will go away with time.
>
> > I'm really tired and sick of this!
>
> i understand. i really hope you're feeling better soon. here's to healing for us both. :D
>
>
>
> > Not sure if the serz. working....it's hard to tell. I started at100mg for five days and now I'm on my fourth day of 200mg. How high do people normally go?
>
> uh -- i first took it at 200, then got bumped to 300.
>
> right now i'm on 75's until the nausea goes away.
>
> see ya,
>
> books
Thanks so much for your feedback.
My starter pack is : 100mg for 5days, then 200mg for awk. then 300mg foranother week. and then 400 for two days? then Iguess Ihave toget more? 400 seems abit high? I take two doses a day a.m. andp.m.
hope it works for you. feel free towrite anytime.
katia
Posted by bookgurl99 on May 8, 2003, at 8:31:59
In reply to Re: to serzone from zoloft » bookgurl99, posted by Katia on May 8, 2003, at 2:53:47
i feel totally sick today. think i should wait longer for zoloft withdrawal (i waited less than a week.) I have an enormous headache and feel like puking. i'm gonna miss work.
books
Posted by bookgurl99 on May 15, 2003, at 14:46:09
In reply to Re: to serzone from zoloft » bookgurl99, posted by Katia on May 8, 2003, at 2:53:47
hey katia,
i restarted serzone, and i feel
a) really sick, headachey, tired all day
b) insomniac with trouble sleepingdid you have any symptoms like this, and if so, how long did they take to go away?
thanks,
books
Posted by katia on May 15, 2003, at 17:14:12
In reply to Re: to serzone from zoloft, posted by bookgurl99 on May 15, 2003, at 14:46:09
> hey katia,
>
> i restarted serzone, and i feel
>
> a) really sick, headachey, tired all day
> b) insomniac with trouble sleeping
>
> did you have any symptoms like this, and if so, how long did they take to go away?
>
> thanks,
>
> booksBooks,
As you've probably read from my other posts (help I think I may be manic) you've probably gotten some of it. But here goes:
I think I experienced some hypomania - whether it has to do with just getting on Serzone or not I"m not sure. I didn't/don't have too much trouble sleeping other than some early morning waking and trouble getting back to sleep; but once I did i usually slept late (11ish) to make up for the lost time in the early morning. so much fun eh?
I know i experienced lots of energy for house projects,etc. and have periodically experienced irrational bouts of highly energized irritability and rage. Suddenly I feel I'm crashing again and it's an effort to even watch TV - not that I even like that too much, it's just even the mindless things take effort for me; it's painful. time is painful and my breathing is shallow. It's just before my period so I'm wondering if that has anything to do with this (or rather is the sole reason) or is it depression still? I'm so sick of this.
So that's been my experience in the past 17 days I've been on Serzone.
katia
Posted by bookgurl99 on May 15, 2003, at 23:47:45
In reply to Re: to serzone from zoloft » bookgurl99, posted by katia on May 15, 2003, at 17:14:12
> I think I experienced some hypomania - whether it has to do with just getting on Serzone or not I"m not sure.
Hmm, I _did_ have some hypomania on Serzone once shortly after trying to switch to it from another SSRI. The effect did wear off after awhile.
> I know i experienced lots of energy for house projects,etc. and have periodically experienced irrational bouts of highly energized irritability and rage.hm. . i have _not_ had any experiences like this. is it almost like the med picks you up and then gives you a crash once it wears out of your system?
i wouldn't assume that you're bp yet, but perhaps are having bp symptoms triggered by serzone -- OR have a medical condition (i.e., thyroid disorder) that is mimicking these symptoms. good luck getting it worked out, it's really hell just trying to get to 'normal' sometimes.
Posted by katia on May 16, 2003, at 0:41:48
In reply to Re: to serzone from zoloft » katia, posted by bookgurl99 on May 15, 2003, at 23:47:45
> > I think I experienced some hypomania - whether it has to do with just getting on Serzone or not I"m not sure.
>
> Hmm, I _did_ have some hypomania on Serzone once shortly after trying to switch to it from another SSRI. The effect did wear off after awhile.
>
>
> > I know i experienced lots of energy for house projects,etc. and have periodically experienced irrational bouts of highly energized irritability and rage.
>
> hm. . i have _not_ had any experiences like this. is it almost like the med picks you up and then gives you a crash once it wears out of your system?
>
> i wouldn't assume that you're bp yet, but perhaps are having bp symptoms triggered by serzone -- OR have a medical condition (i.e., thyroid disorder) that is mimicking these symptoms. good luck getting it worked out, it's really hell just trying to get to 'normal' sometimes.
>
yes, I agree it's "hell". What I am finding "hell" is just getting the right dx. It's a lot about just keeping track of our own emotions - being aware and able to identity feelings and so forth instead of unconsciously becoming oblivious to feelings and emotions as a way of coping. (what I've done for so long).I think this splurge of energy with "projects" like painting my room and gardening and putting together book shelves tables, etc. has to with the fact that I'm afraid to stop and feel.....
keep me posted on your experience of serz.
katia
Posted by bookgurl99 on May 16, 2003, at 1:16:56
In reply to Re: to serzone from zoloft » bookgurl99, posted by katia on May 16, 2003, at 0:41:48
Katia,
hey, I think it's great that you're getting in touch with your emotions.
i'm actually considering pitching antidepressants for a while, to see how I do without. i've been on meds for 3 years. i'm hoping that with adequate treatment for my thyroid, a careful diet,exercise, and maybe a supplement such as fish oil, I will be able to come off for good.
however, i'm almost definitely not bp. I've had symptoms of severe anxiety and ocd, which may require pharmaceutical treatment in the future, we'll see.
books
p.s. but lately my biggest symptom is waffling on drugs!
Posted by katia on May 16, 2003, at 1:25:54
In reply to Re: to serzone from zoloft, posted by bookgurl99 on May 16, 2003, at 1:16:56
> Katia,
>
> hey, I think it's great that you're getting in touch with your emotions.
>
> i'm actually considering pitching antidepressants for a while, to see how I do without. i've been on meds for 3 years. i'm hoping that with adequate treatment for my thyroid, a careful diet,exercise, and maybe a supplement such as fish oil, I will be able to come off for good.
>
> however, i'm almost definitely not bp. I've had symptoms of severe anxiety and ocd, which may require pharmaceutical treatment in the future, we'll see.
>
> books
>
> p.s. but lately my biggest symptom is waffling on drugs!Hi books, "p.s. but lately my biggest symptom is waffling on drugs!"
yes I got that! good to notice!
Yes emotions and identifying them. good stuff, but sometimes toooo much!
Oh, by the way, my thyroid is fine. and i've tried fish oil and personally doesn't do a thing for my depression as far as I could see doesn't mean it doesn't help others. I've just started this med journey so I can't throw in the towel yet. what would the alternative be? there is none in my eyes.
k.
Posted by 2sense on May 18, 2003, at 14:07:30
In reply to Re: to serzone from zoloft » bookgurl99, posted by katia on May 16, 2003, at 1:25:54
> > Katia,
> >
> > hey, I think it's great that you're getting in touch with your emotions.
> >
> > i'm actually considering pitching antidepressants for a while, to see how I do without. i've been on meds for 3 years. i'm hoping that with adequate treatment for my thyroid, a careful diet,exercise, and maybe a supplement such as fish oil, I will be able to come off for good.
> >
> > however, i'm almost definitely not bp. I've had symptoms of severe anxiety and ocd, which may require pharmaceutical treatment in the future, we'll see.
> >
> > booksWhat kind of thyroid problems do you have, if I may ask. I have hypo from Hashimoto's and am crawling ... right now. Thank you kindly.
2Sense
> >
> > p.s. but lately my biggest symptom is waffling on drugs!
>
> Hi books, "p.s. but lately my biggest symptom is waffling on drugs!"
>
> yes I got that! good to notice!
> Yes emotions and identifying them. good stuff, but sometimes toooo much!
> Oh, by the way, my thyroid is fine. and i've tried fish oil and personally doesn't do a thing for my depression as far as I could see doesn't mean it doesn't help others. I've just started this med journey so I can't throw in the towel yet. what would the alternative be? there is none in my eyes.
> k.
>
Posted by katia on May 18, 2003, at 15:13:35
In reply to Re: to serzone from zoloft -- bookgurl99 Katia » katia, posted by 2sense on May 18, 2003, at 14:07:30
You may want to re-send this to bookgurl. I do not have a thyrod problem.
katia> > > Katia,
> > >
> > > hey, I think it's great that you're getting in touch with your emotions.
> > >
> > > i'm actually considering pitching antidepressants for a while, to see how I do without. i've been on meds for 3 years. i'm hoping that with adequate treatment for my thyroid, a careful diet,exercise, and maybe a supplement such as fish oil, I will be able to come off for good.
> > >
> > > however, i'm almost definitely not bp. I've had symptoms of severe anxiety and ocd, which may require pharmaceutical treatment in the future, we'll see.
> > >
> > > books
>
> What kind of thyroid problems do you have, if I may ask. I have hypo from Hashimoto's and am crawling ... right now. Thank you kindly.
>
> 2Sense
> > >
> > > p.s. but lately my biggest symptom is waffling on drugs!
> >
> > Hi books, "p.s. but lately my biggest symptom is waffling on drugs!"
> >
> > yes I got that! good to notice!
> > Yes emotions and identifying them. good stuff, but sometimes toooo much!
> > Oh, by the way, my thyroid is fine. and i've tried fish oil and personally doesn't do a thing for my depression as far as I could see doesn't mean it doesn't help others. I've just started this med journey so I can't throw in the towel yet. what would the alternative be? there is none in my eyes.
> > k.
> >
>
>
Posted by bookgurl99 on May 18, 2003, at 20:39:40
In reply to Re: to serzone from zoloft -- bookgurl99 Katia » katia, posted by 2sense on May 18, 2003, at 14:07:30
>
> What kind of thyroid problems do you have, if I may ask. I have hypo from Hashimoto's and am crawling ... right now. Thank you kindly.
I have Hashimoto's, and am hypothyroid. I feel like an effin' menopausal woman at times, with memory problems and attention-span problems that never existed before becoming hypo. I'm so angry that docs want to give us SSRI's instead of treating the real problem, our thyroids and brains, which LONG for T3.
This is the end of the thread.
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