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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Tepiaca on April 10, 2003, at 23:19:42
Hi Im taking 3mg of klonopin but my anxiety is still there , I want to increase the dose
to the necessary until my FB disapear
Anyone take high doses
is this dangerous?
Posted by utopizen on April 11, 2003, at 0:21:40
In reply to Anyone on high doses of Klonopin (more than 3mg), posted by Tepiaca on April 10, 2003, at 23:19:42
> Hi Im taking 3mg of klonopin but my anxiety is still there , I want to increase the dose
> to the necessary until my FB disapear
> Anyone take high doses
> is this dangerous?
>This isn't related, but I'd like to experience Nembutal and Desoxyn together. I currently just take Desoxyn, but imagine having the old Desbutal combo!!
Posted by matt66 on April 11, 2003, at 6:59:49
In reply to Anyone on high doses of Klonopin (more than 3mg), posted by Tepiaca on April 10, 2003, at 23:19:42
> Hi Im taking 3mg of klonopin but my anxiety is still there , I want to increase the dose
> to the necessary until my FB disapear
> Anyone take high doses
> is this dangerous?
>
I'm a 225 lb male,but Ive been taking 10mg to sleep, no problems. Sometimes your body just gets used to the lower doses and you need to move it higher. Try moving higher one pill at a time.much love,
matt lieb
Posted by ~Alii~ on April 11, 2003, at 14:41:41
In reply to Anyone on high doses of Klonopin (more than 3mg), posted by Tepiaca on April 10, 2003, at 23:19:42
> Hi Im taking 3mg of klonopin but my anxiety is still there , I want to increase the dose
> to the necessary until my FB disapear
> Anyone take high doses
> is this dangerous?
Tepiaca,I can't answer as to the danger question......pose that to your doc or nurse practioner or physician's assistant or whatever healthcare provider you have prescribing Klonopin for you.
I currently take 3 mg/day. Sometimes 4 mg. I'm a chick in the 120-130 lb range. I usually need a higher dose of benzos as my body is just like that. I need more novacaine at dentist. More knockout stuff for dental surgery. Next time I see pdoc I need to discuss whether or not a higher dose of Klonopin is going to help with the panic attacks as opposed to the anxiety which the Klono. has been most effective at.
So talk with health person and ask if other benzos might not be better matched for your dx. Or perhaps a combo depending on the type of anxiety. I'm sorry but I don't know what you mean by "...necessary until my FB disapear..." What does FB stand for?
Everybody is different in their tolerance to benzos so you might need a higher dose or a diff. one. Anxiety sucks and I hope you find a solution soon.
Thanks and good luck.
~Alii
Posted by cubbybear on April 12, 2003, at 4:40:33
In reply to Re: Anyone on high doses of Klonopin (more than 3mg) » Tepiaca, posted by ~Alii~ on April 11, 2003, at 14:41:41
Starting last July, I was taking 4 mg to help me sleep during a period of bad depression. The Zoloft (AD) wasn't helping the sleep problems. Then I went down to about 3.75 mg and stayed on that for a few months until my depression went into remission. I had absolutely no problems with the Klonopin, except for drowsiness when first getting up in the morning.
I'm now in the process of weaning off it and am down to 2.75 mg.
So, although these higher amounts are safe, it will take you weeks or months longer to wean off them than if you were taking a small amount.
Posted by MattD on April 14, 2003, at 19:01:12
In reply to Anyone on high doses of Klonopin (more than 3mg), posted by Tepiaca on April 10, 2003, at 23:19:42
> Hi Im taking 3mg of klonopin but my anxiety is still there , I want to increase the dose
> to the necessary until my FB disapear
> Anyone take high doses
> is this dangerous?
>People take up to 20mg for seizures; 3mg is not a problem. IME I went to 6mg, still didn't find relief, and dropped it back to 2mg and added 2mg Xanax. It worked very well--this was after screwing around with various treatments for the anxiety for 18 months or so.
Good luck.
Matt
Posted by Jack Smith on April 15, 2003, at 16:54:25
In reply to Re: Anyone on high doses of Klonopin (more than 3m, posted by MattD on April 14, 2003, at 19:01:12
>
> People take up to 20mg for seizures; 3mg is not a problem. IME I went to 6mg, still didn't find relief, and dropped it back to 2mg and added 2mg Xanax. It worked very well--this was after screwing around with various treatments for the anxiety for 18 months or so.
>
> Good luck.
>
> MattCould you please elaborate on this, I find it very interesting. What is your anxiety like? Physical symptoms? Is it distinct from Panic? (Mine is). When do you take Klonopin? When do you take xanax? At what doses? What other meds? Thanks, your answers will be helpful.
JACK
Posted by MattD on April 15, 2003, at 20:20:58
In reply to Re: Anyone on high doses of Klonopin (more than 3m » MattD, posted by Jack Smith on April 15, 2003, at 16:54:25
>
> >
> > People take up to 20mg for seizures; 3mg is not a problem. IME I went to 6mg, still didn't find relief, and dropped it back to 2mg and added 2mg Xanax. It worked very well--this was after screwing around with various treatments for the anxiety for 18 months or so.
> >
> > Good luck.
> >
> > Matt
>
> Could you please elaborate on this, I find it very interesting. What is your anxiety like? Physical symptoms? Is it distinct from Panic? (Mine is). When do you take Klonopin? When do you take xanax? At what doses? What other meds? Thanks, your answers will be helpful.
>
> JACK
Jack,I had non-panic, non-generalized anxiety which manifested itself when I went to do my academic work. I take Klonopin 1mg bid, morning and night. I take Xanax .5mg qid--every 4 hours or so.
I'm not quite sure why the two worked so well together for me. But it seemed a natural thing to do, given that I was getting a decent but partial response with the Klonopin, and couldn't go high enough on the Xanax to alleviate the anxiety without getting depressed. I've been at 2mg on each for 3 years now.
Matt
Posted by Denize on April 16, 2003, at 7:13:07
In reply to Re: Anyone on high doses of Klonopin (more than 3mg), posted by matt66 on April 11, 2003, at 6:59:49
my husband is over 260 lbs and takes up to 6 mg (3-2mg tabs) daily if needed.
Posted by bretbe on April 16, 2003, at 23:23:23
In reply to Re: Anyone on high doses of Klonopin (more than 3m » MattD, posted by Jack Smith on April 15, 2003, at 16:54:25
I was curious about Jack's question as I have noticed that the words "anxiety" and "depression" seem to describe a wide range of symptoms and subjective feelings both in medical literature and here at psycho-babble. My symptoms are very atypical which is why I ask. For example, my illness is generally labeled depression yet I don't have a lack of energy, lethargy, low will, etc. as many describe it...it depression only fits because I become despondent about my situation and doom and gloom settle in. But energy levels remain fine and, unfortunately, my body seems to be in otherwise great shape (unfortunate because it means living a long miserable life). My illness is called treatment resistant because no meds have worked to illeviate it, in fact many aggravate it.
But more related to the question of non-panic anxiety, I experience a constant generalized "anxiety" but it doesns't feel like many people describe their symptoms in that I don't feel panicky, social phobias, etc...I don't have short-term "spikes" so to speak, rather it is on ongoing type of mental pain and pressure in my head...it is very painful and I believe, drives my depression from living with such constant pain and dysphoria (misery). Klonopin is the only thing to put a dent in it elavating it from intolerable gotta-kill-myself levels to life-sucks-but-I-might-make-it-another-day levels. The pain does increase on days with normal stressors and a neurotic hang up I have seeming to well up from inside my head out of no where (I don't THINK things are stressful).
Anyway, it's like how some people describe they put all their stress in their neck or some place requiring a massage, whereas I seem to place it all wound up inside my head where no one can massage it and only no medication but addresses it except when on a few rare occassions when I can't take it anymore, I drink enough alcohol to numb the pain...and it takes a lot!
So again, I'm wondering about your question if others have atypical symptoms of anxiety like me, or more typical with panic feelings, etc.? What other anxiety symptoms do people have besides panic and what meds are helpful?
Posted by Ed on April 17, 2003, at 10:12:47
In reply to Non-panic Anxiety...Do others experience too?, posted by bretbe on April 16, 2003, at 23:23:23
Well if you find out what you have, let me know. I've got the same thing. But Nardil worked 100% for me; unfortunately, Nardil made me fat and then fatter and fatter and eventually I had to quite the Nardil because I could barely make it through the front door.
>>> I was curious about Jack's question as I have noticed that the words "anxiety" and "depression" seem to describe a wide range of symptoms and subjective feelings both in medical literature and here at psycho-babble. My symptoms are very atypical which is why I ask. For example, my illness is generally labeled depression yet I don't have a lack of energy, lethargy, low will, etc. as many describe it...it depression only fits because I become despondent about my situation and doom and gloom settle in. But energy levels remain fine and, unfortunately, my body seems to be in otherwise great shape (unfortunate because it means living a long miserable life). My illness is called treatment resistant because no meds have worked to illeviate it, in fact many aggravate it.
>
> But more related to the question of non-panic anxiety, I experience a constant generalized "anxiety" but it doesns't feel like many people describe their symptoms in that I don't feel panicky, social phobias, etc...I don't have short-term "spikes" so to speak, rather it is on ongoing type of mental pain and pressure in my head...it is very painful and I believe, drives my depression from living with such constant pain and dysphoria (misery). Klonopin is the only thing to put a dent in it elavating it from intolerable gotta-kill-myself levels to life-sucks-but-I-might-make-it-another-day levels. The pain does increase on days with normal stressors and a neurotic hang up I have seeming to well up from inside my head out of no where (I don't THINK things are stressful).
>
> Anyway, it's like how some people describe they put all their stress in their neck or some place requiring a massage, whereas I seem to place it all wound up inside my head where no one can massage it and only no medication but addresses it except when on a few rare occassions when I can't take it anymore, I drink enough alcohol to numb the pain...and it takes a lot!
>
> So again, I'm wondering about your question if others have atypical symptoms of anxiety like me, or more typical with panic feelings, etc.? What other anxiety symptoms do people have besides panic and what meds are helpful?
Posted by bretbe on April 17, 2003, at 21:45:31
In reply to Re: Non-panic Anxiety...Do others experience too?, posted by Ed on April 17, 2003, at 10:12:47
Thanks for the heads up on the Nardil. I tried it once for about a month...should I give it a go again? Did my description of my symptoms sound like yours? Out of curiousity, did you have a trigger at some time in your life when it all began...I ask because I did. So what are you taking now and how are you dealing with it?
Anyway, no, I don't have a name for it and I'm not sure a name would do anything unless someone has an answer on how to treat it. I mean, I've had this illness consistantly for 15 years now and well, yes, there have been lots of names and fancy diagnostic labels for it ranging from depression and anxiety to generalized anxiety disorder or now bipolor NOS (the NOS means "not other-wise specified"...it doesn't fit any usual bipolar diagnosis because I don't have mania but my pdoc said that since no meds for unipolar depression have worked, we should try treating it like bipolar).
Posted by sueT on April 17, 2003, at 22:08:41
In reply to Non-panic Anxiety...Do others experience too?, posted by bretbe on April 16, 2003, at 23:23:23
Hi,
You did a great job of describing the type of depression that I suffer from also. I have often wondered why it seems like I am not quite "depressed" and not quite "anxious", yet still suffering so much. I am on Effexor and Topamax, and recently my p-doc added Wellbutrin to the mix. I honestly can not say that anything has helped. Some SSRI's were benefical temporarily but then they seemed to aggravate my symtoms. I have never tried Klonopin. Good luck.
Posted by bretbe on April 17, 2003, at 23:19:45
In reply to Re: Non-panic Anxiety...Do others experience too?, posted by sueT on April 17, 2003, at 22:08:41
Hi Sue,
Okay, we need to stick together here because I don't find many people with same symptoms...maybe I just need to look more. But, besides my illness having driven me nuts, so is how the diagnosis of depression is so generally applied to what I see as quite different illnesses. It's hard to talk with other "sufferers" of depression because the symptoms are so different.
So, please tell me, how would you describe your illness and how long have you had it? I too have tried dozens of ad's, including TCAs, SSRI's, MAOI's, Welbutrin and Buspar...Welbutrin was by far the worst! It racheted up my mental pain so high I thought my head would explode but I didn't want to go to the ER because I had no physical symptoms...it was all subjective but oh, so real and painful. Lamictal was also especially painful. I hypothesize that many of the meds make me worse because they ARE great anti-depressants in the "activation" sense of the word. And I theorize that this activation from ad's makes me worse because it just heightens, or activates my anxiety (again, this is all a subjective feeling in my head/emotion centers...I'm not panicky, etc.) That's why I think what I (we?) have is different because I don't suffer from low energy and kthus don't need to be activated. Rather, I need is to de-activate this pain and misery in my head/emotional center.
Lately, I've been trying the bp meds like tegrital, depakote, and now trileptal. Both tegrital and depakote were nice at first at very low quanities (new approach by my pdoc is to take 1/3 pills and slowly move up to avoid over-activation) but seemed to poop out after a few months. They were GREAT at reducing irritability!
ah, but alas, the effects have worn off and I'm back to the drawing board now hedging my bets for the likes of substance P antagonists.Anyway, as for Klonopin, I would recommend at least you try it, maybe just 1mg at night which will help you sleep initially. If it's going to work, it should world relatively fast (in a few days). The one draw back is if you take every day for about a month, you may be on it for quite some time trying to slowly taper off because of its propensity for dependance (NOT same as addiction) and rebound (temporary worsening of original symptoms if go off too fast). However, if you're like me and desperate to find anything that works, try it...it has a very long safety record and if it helps, think of it like a diabetic takes insulin...your brain just needs it to function the way it's supposed to.
Posted by sueT on April 20, 2003, at 12:57:44
In reply to sueT...in same boat!?, posted by bretbe on April 17, 2003, at 23:19:45
Hi,
My p-doc is not sure what to diagnose me as. I fuction very well at work, and I did in school also (I have a master's degree) My problem is more relational and inner emotional. He seems to think taht I could be Cyclothymic or Mixed bp, but he says I "don't give him enough" for a diagonsis of bp. I told him that I would try to work harder on that!!!
Our symptoms do sound very similar. I never really had low enery until I started taking Effexor and Topamax, but I do like to sleep. Topamax has been somewhat good for calming me down, and making ruminate less on things that upset or irritate me.
There is a good website that speaks of the bp spectrum, including anxoius depression and irritable depressive symtoms. I found it quite helpful. It is www.psycheducation.org. Check it out. Good luck and keep me updated.
Posted by bretbe on April 25, 2003, at 12:02:37
In reply to Re: sueT...in same boat!?, posted by sueT on April 20, 2003, at 12:57:44
Well, I've had similar go-arounds with p-docs...latest is going the Bipolar NOS route but I've been wondering if it is more related to an anxiety disorder of some type. I too have funtioned well until the last year (e.g., grad school, jobs, etc.) but pain has become unbearable after all the years. I kept myself going with "when I graduate I'll feel better," "when I get a job," etc., but I never did. I've heard of Topomax...maybe I'll give it a go if it is calming and do less ruminating which I do. I'm a very guilt-driven/laden person. I tried Lamictal and it was painful...too activating I think. I'm not sure what you mean by emotional/relational but aside from the pain in my head, I feel very numb emotionally as if it is impossible to "feel" love for people I "know" I love, e.g., family...hard on relationships for sure. Also, I feel like there's this cloud, or something in my brain seperating me from experiencing things I used to feel such a connection to, like going to the beach, a pretty sunset, etc...I'm just numb inside to the positive and have...all I can describe it as a type of mental, or pain in my psyche or something that often feel down in my chest to where one would normally have an emotional heart...I feel heartless!
Well, thanks for the info on the web-site...I look it up! Good luck to you as well.
This is the end of the thread.
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