![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 17 to 41 of 53. Go back in thread:
Posted by hildi on January 23, 2003, at 22:42:14
In reply to Re: Neurontin~~hil, posted by lostsailor on January 22, 2003, at 10:56:24
Posted by judy1 on January 24, 2003, at 11:05:28
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal-off-label marketing., posted by lostsailor on January 23, 2003, at 18:43:56
Tony,
I was up to 3g/day of neurontin for bipolar disorder and it had absolutely no effect, and I know I'm not the only one so I find the pharm co.'s tactics disturbing. Re: lamictal, I'm glad you had such great success. I was part of a study (STEP-BD) where it was used with great success, unfortunately I've gotten hypomanic on 2 trials. take care, judy
Posted by Maximus on January 24, 2003, at 12:32:18
In reply to Lamictal amazing?For anxiety,or just mood? (nm) » lostsailor, posted by hildi on January 23, 2003, at 22:42:14
Posted by Alan on January 24, 2003, at 14:28:05
In reply to The Neurontin Scandal, posted by judy1 on January 23, 2003, at 17:38:54
National Public Radio Reportage on Neurontin:
http://www.npr.org/display_pages/features/feature_920362.html
It turns out there are a number of stories on the illegal mis-marketing of Neurontin at this page, both print and audio.
I think it's important to understand the ramifications of the mis-marketing of Neurontin. Many, many millions were spent to get out the news that it works magically for all these unapproved conditions (for which it doesn't work in reality). But who is going to spend comparable amounts to reverse that message now that it has been show to be illegal and usually false?
These stories also give you some insight into how pharmaceutical research works here in the US, where many of the articles published in medical journals are not written by the doctors whose names appear on them. Instead they're written by professional advertising writers and doctors are paid to put their name at the top.
There's no evidence Neurontin is systematically effective against anxiety. Of course there's always SOMEBODY who'll get a beneficial response from anything, including pickled herring. But the makers of Neurontin have faced FDA sanctions here in the United States, plus massive civil lawsuits, because they pushed Neurontin for ALL kinds of conditions for which there is either no evidence it's effective or for which there IS evidence that it's NOT effective.
Maybe one's doctor is unaware of these developments, or maybe he has had one or two of those patients with an exceptional response. Or maybe one's anxiety or panic is biologically related to seizures. There's good evidence for a connection like that, though it still doesn't prove Neurontin would help the anxiety.
I post this because I was on the receiving end of this kind of thing and as aresult, my anxiety went untreated in the mean time...the "side effects" of that untreated anxiety being much worse than the side effects of those medications that were actually theraputic such as, in my case, benzodiazepines.
Posted by viridis on January 25, 2003, at 1:33:26
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal - NPR, posted by Alan on January 24, 2003, at 14:28:05
The Neurontin marketing story is disturbing, and it does sound like the pharmaceutical company was out of line. However, I'll repeat what I said earlier -- Neurontin was a great anxiolytic for me the first few times I took it, so it must do something. Unfortunately, the effect didn't last (benzos have been much more reliable), but given my initial reaction to Neurontin, I could see it being helpful for those in whom the effect does last. And, my psychiatrist seems convinced that it works (subtly) for a minority of patients, although he isn't a big advocate. He does consider it very safe. I'll probably discontinue it soon, but if I could consistently get the results I did the first few times I took it, I'd recommend it more enthusiastically. Maybe Pregabalin (the "improved" version) will work better, if it makes it to market?
Posted by missliz on January 25, 2003, at 13:26:17
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal - NPR, posted by Alan on January 24, 2003, at 14:28:05
A whole lot of you all missed my point SO TOTALLY!
1- there are numerous double blind placebo controlled studies showing that Neurontin doesn't work for the off label studies the company claimed it was so wonderful for. They were done to try to get the stuff aditional FDA approvals. Neurontin either doesn't work, works for a few weeks/ months then quits, or makes people worse. Google it and see for youselves. The search engine is the patients best freind, learn how to use it.
2- Neurontin is a product that happens to be a drug. Do not kid yourselves, the drug co.'s are loyal to the stockholders and see us as cash cows to be exploited. Psych patients are the most easily kicked around group in our society, and a lot of us have federally funded insurance to milk. Our society is full of dangerous automobiles, crummy food, cigarettes, smog, and you're surprised that a bogus psych drug came along to pick your pocket?
3- This isn't about a New York Times article. There was a trial in Boston where all this came out, a whistle blower from whithin the company produced the same kind of incriminating evidence as the stuff that came out at the big tobacco hearings. Don't you people watch the news? Or Google drugs before you eat them?
As long as you are all good little children and tolerate this kind of horrific treatment we will never get better drugs and better lives because a bunch of crooked businessmen will use us as human sacrifices to the bottom line. I think I deserve better, but the mentally ill are the most crapped on group of people in America because most patients won't take responsibility and say no, that isn't acceptable. A lot of us can't, but the people who can write their congressman about things like this can't be bothered. Spare me the self centered whining.
4- One last peice of reality, kiddoes. Drug company reps are the biggest source of your doctors continuing education. A lot of the drugs pushed for psych do work, but there's just too much money to be made for a Neurontin not to happen. Zyprexa was surrounded by apalling scandal in its testing phase too, but I know half of you won't beleive it. Not until you get type II diabetes and a hundred pound wheight gain and all the other grisly fallout from that particular work of the devil. Read the book, "Mad in America" by Robert Whitaker for starters.
I personally spent two years of personal crisis while on Neurontin wondering what the hell had happened to my mind. Then I refused to take it anymore and am returning to myself again. I'm not the only one. And I'm angry about it, I deserve better.missliz
Posted by Alan on January 25, 2003, at 13:36:54
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal , posted by missliz on January 25, 2003, at 13:26:17
> A whole lot of you all missed my point SO TOTALLY!
> 1- there are numerous double blind placebo controlled studies showing that Neurontin doesn't work for the off label studies the company claimed it was so wonderful for. They were done to try to get the stuff aditional FDA approvals.
> 2- the drug co.'s are loyal to the stockholders and see us as cash cows to be exploited.
> 3- This isn't about a New York Times article. There was a trial in Boston where all this came out, a whistle blower from whithin the company produced the same kind of incriminating evidence as the stuff that came out at the big tobacco hearings.
> 4- Drug company reps are the biggest source of your doctors continuing education. A lot of the drugs pushed for psych do work, but there's just too much money to be made for a Neurontin not to happen. > missliz
>
=================================================Seems like my post addressed these very issues and more with the link to the NPR site.
Alan
Posted by Dr. Bob on January 25, 2003, at 18:28:39
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal , posted by missliz on January 25, 2003, at 13:26:17
> A whole lot of you all missed my point SO TOTALLY!
> Don't you people watch the news?
> As long as you are all good little children ... we will never get better drugs... Spare me the self centered whining.I know you're angry, but please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down, thanks.
Bob
PS: Follow-ups regarding posting policies, and complaints about posts, should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration.
Posted by dreamerz on January 26, 2003, at 23:33:22
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal , posted by missliz on January 25, 2003, at 13:26:17
I must be of the minority..works for me .
Posted by Ritch on January 27, 2003, at 9:27:48
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal , posted by dreamerz on January 26, 2003, at 23:33:22
> I must be of the minority..works for me .
Hi, I have noticed over the years that 100mg of Neurontin at bedtime helps me sleep consistently better, and often with just Depakote at bedtime I can still have broken sleep and/or excessive sleepiness in the mornings when I do awake. N. might not have antimanic properties for most bipolars but it works better in the sleep department as an add-on to Depakote than Klonopin does (for me anyhow). In fact the three-way low-dose combo of Depakote+Neurontin+Klonopin hs has worked the best thus far for sleep quality.
Posted by dreamerz on January 27, 2003, at 11:39:56
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal » dreamerz, posted by Ritch on January 27, 2003, at 9:27:48
Hello Mitch_babe
The combo Depakote/Neurontin/Effexor makes me a nicer person around people...although I still prefer isolation. I'm somewhat spaced out slow , sedated but not the tired yawning kind...although I do sleep a lot . Neurontin also fixes my back/neck pains..I'm kind of trying to deal with the fact that I had should of had anti-convulsants/anti-depressants years ago especially at university..Oh well..
Think I'm the first patient to be prescribed Neurontin in my area of London.
Also you are correct about it not stopping hypo/manic episodes..that's why I got the Depakote added.
Posted by dreamerz on January 27, 2003, at 11:54:30
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal » Ritch, posted by dreamerz on January 27, 2003, at 11:39:56
Ever taken a pill on an empty stomache ?
WOW : )
Posted by Ritch on January 27, 2003, at 12:27:16
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal » Ritch, posted by dreamerz on January 27, 2003, at 11:39:56
> Hello Mitch_babe
>
> The combo Depakote/Neurontin/Effexor makes me a nicer person around people...although I still prefer isolation. I'm somewhat spaced out slow , sedated but not the tired yawning kind...although I do sleep a lot . Neurontin also fixes my back/neck pains..I'm kind of trying to deal with the fact that I had should of had anti-convulsants/anti-depressants years ago especially at university..Oh well..
> Think I'm the first patient to be prescribed Neurontin in my area of London.
> Also you are correct about it not stopping hypo/manic episodes..that's why I got the Depakote added.
>
>This is really weird, but back when I was on lithium instead of AED's, and I was first given Effexor I found it super activating. Now, it just seems to grogg me out major (as does Celexa and the other sedative SSRI's). I wish I could tolerate Zoloft or Prozac. I was a lot more "zippy" on those.
mitchiebabe
Posted by Luka62 on January 27, 2003, at 13:41:13
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal , posted by missliz on January 25, 2003, at 13:26:17
My doc kept me on Neurontin much longer than I wanted to be on it. It did nothing to help my mood swings, and I was put on Lamictal 1 1/2 yrs ago, which works well.
I finally made a decision to go off the Neurontin, against my doc's advice, (I now have a new doc, happily.) I've been off of it since last July, and never in 25 years have I been this stable. I'd swear up and down that Neurontin made me Worse!!
When my teen son's doc took him off Neurontin and switched his med, his mood stability also improved dramatically.
Anyone else out there who had worsening symptoms on Neurontin??
Posted by dreamerz on January 27, 2003, at 18:26:32
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal » dreamerz, posted by Ritch on January 27, 2003, at 12:27:16
> This is really weird, but back when I was on lithium instead of AED's, and I was first given Effexor I found it super activating. Now, it just seems to grogg me out major (as does Celexa and the other sedative SSRI's). I wish I could tolerate Zoloft or Prozac. I was a lot more "zippy" on those.Mitch~babes...
Effexor has never activated me , it's a kind of an anti -agressive sedative , all other ssri's activated bigtime and so I drank heavily on them.
For me it's a very thin line between too much energy and non at all..I'm also starting to put weight on so I'm exercising-sort of.
I still get paranoia/panicky and other stuff but when it happens I don't care so much , I ride it--that's the Neurontin helping mostly.
Posted by hildi on January 27, 2003, at 22:51:31
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal » missliz, posted by Luka62 on January 27, 2003, at 13:41:13
> My doc kept me on Neurontin much longer than I wanted to be on it. It did nothing to help my mood swings, and I was put on Lamictal 1 1/2 yrs ago, which works well.
> I finally made a decision to go off the Neurontin, against my doc's advice, (I now have a new doc, happily.) I've been off of it since last July, and never in 25 years have I been this stable. I'd swear up and down that Neurontin made me Worse!!
> When my teen son's doc took him off Neurontin and switched his med, his mood stability also improved dramatically.
> Anyone else out there who had worsening symptoms on Neurontin??Hi. I Cannot answer you on that one, since I'm still trying to figure out whether to try either one of these meds and am trying to obtain as much information as possible, first.
But can you tell me if you are bipolar? Did you ever try other AD's and if so, how did you do on them? And your son, what is his diagosis? Similar to yours?
I don't mean to be nosey, I'm wondering because of the different variables and the different effects/responses so many have had on these meds, and if I want to chance trying either one of these.
Hildi
Posted by not exactly on January 28, 2003, at 5:27:34
In reply to Re: gabitril neurontin? » hildi, posted by Ame Sans Vie on January 19, 2003, at 13:34:43
Michael,
> Actually, just several days ago I was placed on a regimen of 20mg Valium 2xday, 2mg Xanax 3xday, 4mg Ativan as needed, and 4mg Klonopin 2xday + 30mg twice every other Sunday.
Wow - I've never heard of anyone being prescribed 4 different benzo's concurrently! Is there something about this combo that makes it significanly more effective than a single well-chosen benzo?
- Bob
Posted by not exactly on January 28, 2003, at 6:42:51
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal » missliz, posted by Luka62 on January 27, 2003, at 13:41:13
My pdoc put me on Neurontin a couple of years ago, and I've continued it since then (despite changes in my "primary" meds - AD's & stimulants - on top of it). He originally prescribed it to take some of the "rough edges" off my other meds (anxiety & over-stimulation side effects), as well as addressing my pre-existing low-level anxiety (GAD).
It made me drowsy at first, and I slept a lot. But within a few days, I got used to it, and the drowsiness went away. Didn't notice any other side effects.
It did seem to help with the anxiety. But there were other benefits, which I guess were related to the reduction in anxiety. It helped dramatically with my social phobia, which had previously been a serious problem. I was now able to carry on normal, relaxed conversations. I could even make "small talk" with people I had just met, something that had been nearly impossible before. I think the improvement was that I was no longer afraid that I would say/do something "stupid". I wasn't excessively concerned that others would misjudge me. I became much less self-conscious and more confident.
This improvement would have felt miraculous if I hadn't already experienced it before - it helped in the same way that alcohol had. But using alcohol as a chronic solution seemed like a bad idea and I had successfully avoid that trap.
Neurontin also seemed to simplify my life, and my view of the whole world. Everything was less complex and easier to deal with. No more getting bogged down in minute details. The world even looked more simple (in a pleasing, non-threatening way) - kind of cartoon-like with more saturated colors and less texture.
This improvement would have felt miraculous if I hadn't already experienced it before - it helped in the same way that marijuana had. But using marijuana as a chronic solution seemed like a bad idea and I had successfully avoid that trap.
Eventually, I started noticing some long-term negative effects that I also attribute to the Neurontin (although it may be early senility). Not surprisingly, these negative effects also remind me of the negative effects of alcohol and marijuana. I have become more forgetful. I repeat myself because I can't remember who I've told what. I lose things. I can't keep as many details in my head at once as I used to - for example, mental arithmetic has become almost impossible.
The biggest problem is that I don't care about things that I really should. I lost my job over a year ago, but I've been living off my life savings rather than bothering to find a new job. My aging parents are getting too infirm to care for themselves, but I haven't been motivated to help them. I manage to ignore or procrastinate everyday problems that "normal" folks deal with in their stride, such as bill paying and home maintenance.
Several times, I have tried to discontinue or reduce the dose of Neurontin. When I did, mental clarity and concern for important details returned quickly, but so did the anxiety. Each time, it got so bad that I resumed the Neurontin. I felt like a junky.
You will laugh when I tell you my standard dosage. I saved this detail 'til the end because I figured I would get ZERO sympathy. I take 100 mg T.I.D. Yes, friends, that's not a typo - a mere 300 mg per day! If I take more, I get too sedated, apathetic, and just plain "drunk". If I take less, the anxiety drives me up the wall.
Has anyone experienced or heard of anything like this? Or am I just another deluded placebo victim? I really need some help here...
- Bob
Posted by Ritch on January 28, 2003, at 11:29:45
In reply to Neurontin: solution or problem?, posted by not exactly on January 28, 2003, at 6:42:51
> You will laugh when I tell you my standard dosage. I saved this detail 'til the end because I figured I would get ZERO sympathy. I take 100 mg T.I.D. Yes, friends, that's not a typo - a mere 300 mg per day! If I take more, I get too sedated, apathetic, and just plain "drunk". If I take less, the anxiety drives me up the wall.
>
> Has anyone experienced or heard of anything like this? Or am I just another deluded placebo victim? I really need some help here...
>
> - Bob
>
I'm bipolar and I was on Neurontin at that dosage you mention for over a year (with no other mood stabilizer) with .5mg of Klonopin and a little Celexa (about 1.25-2.5mg), and it had a stabilizing effect for me and I slept better than I do now with Depakote. In my case, anxiety (esp. GAD) seems to fuel the bipolar as much as the reverse. Neurontin didn't help much with temper spells (dysphoric hypomania) that Depakote works well for, however. I want to add back 100mg at bedtime or 100mg bid of Neurontin for improved sleep cycles and the benefits that you mention, but leave in the Depakote for the hypomania. As far as Neurontin dosages go, I think for psych probs. it will work at lower dosages (if it is going to), and as you ramp up the dose the returns diminish rapidly. In my case I didn't notice any added benefits whatsoever above 900mg/day, just more adverse effects.
Posted by Luka62 on January 28, 2003, at 19:16:02
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal » Luka62, posted by hildi on January 27, 2003, at 22:51:31
> > My doc kept me on Neurontin much longer than I wanted to be on it. It did nothing to help my mood swings, and I was put on Lamictal 1 1/2 yrs ago, which works well.
> > I finally made a decision to go off the Neurontin, against my doc's advice, (I now have a new doc, happily.) I've been off of it since last July, and never in 25 years have I been this stable. I'd swear up and down that Neurontin made me Worse!!
> > When my teen son's doc took him off Neurontin and switched his med, his mood stability also improved dramatically.
> > Anyone else out there who had worsening symptoms on Neurontin??
>
> Hi. I Cannot answer you on that one, since I'm still trying to figure out whether to try either one of these meds and am trying to obtain as much information as possible, first.
> But can you tell me if you are bipolar? Did you ever try other AD's and if so, how did you do on them? And your son, what is his diagosis? Similar to yours?
> I don't mean to be nosey, I'm wondering because of the different variables and the different effects/responses so many have had on these meds, and if I want to chance trying either one of these.
> Hildi<<<<<<<<<<Yes, I am bipolar. My son is also bipolar as well as ADHD. Over the years I've tried Prozac, lithium, depakote, Wellbrutin,Elavil Tegretol, Buspar,not to mention the benzo's. I had bad side effects from several,none of which had any therapeutic value for me. I hate that it's trial and error, but it is. What works for one, may causes problems in another. I can't believe I had to go through so many years of wild mood swings, severe depression, anxiety and panic, to finally find a combo that works for me. (Nardil and Lamictal).
If I had to do it all over again, I would assert myself more with the doctors and trust my own judgement and sense of whether I am doing better on a particular medication.
I'm grateful I now have a pdoc that really listens to me.
Posted by sydney on January 29, 2003, at 15:31:33
In reply to Neurontin: solution or problem?, posted by not exactly on January 28, 2003, at 6:42:51
While Neurontin may not be miracle drug, It is a gross overgeneralization to claim it has no place in psychopharmacology. For example:
Neurontin has been shown to be more effective than placebo in double-blind studies for the treatment of social anxiety order. See J Clin Psychiatry 2001;62 Suppl 1:50-3 Jefferson, JW; Madison Institute of Medicine, Inc., and the University of Wisconsin Medical School, USA.
The therapeutic efficacy of Neurontin has been shown in relieving pain from Guillain-Barre syndrome in a randomized, double-blinded, placebo-controlled, crossover study of 18 patients. Anesth Analg 2002 Dec;95(6):1719-23
Its been shown to help people with restless leg syndrome in placebo controlled studies. Neurology 2002 Nov 26;59(10):1573-9.
And last but not least, Neurontin is certainly an effective anti-epileptic.
The point is this: Neurontin was oversold by the manufacturer. Now the pendulum has swung too far the other way and it is being overlooked by people who could genuinely benefit from it.
Posted by luka62 on January 29, 2003, at 17:44:36
In reply to Re: Neurontin: solution or problem?, posted by sydney on January 29, 2003, at 15:31:33
Certainly Neurontin has a place in psychopharmacology. However, the drug company was indeed taken to court (in the state of New York I believe. Many of the studies, inc. double-blind studies, were done by the manufacturer itself. They grossly misrepresented themselves, the studies, and the results to the public. I do know many people benefit from Neurontin for things other than epilepsy, as well as other non-labeled problems. It was ineffective and even harmful to me. But not disclosing that they sponsored the studies, and reported on them favorably is still a question of ethics, in my opinion, or lack therof.
Posted by not exactly on January 29, 2003, at 18:01:11
In reply to Re: Neurontin: solution or problem?, posted by sydney on January 29, 2003, at 15:31:33
> While Neurontin may not be miracle drug, It is a gross overgeneralization to claim it has no place in psychopharmacology.
> it is being overlooked by people who could genuinely benefit from it.I never claimed that it was ineffective, even (especially) for its "off-label" uses. I am quite sure that it has helped my social anxiety and improved my self-esteem. My mother takes it to relieve her severe chronic back pain, and it has enabled her to walk and sleep without using narcotics. It is clearly a useful drug.
My concern is about some of the side effects which I have experienced. Specifically, I feel that it has had a negative impact on my memory, intellectual ability, and the capacity to truly care about things that matter. While these side effects may not be common, I find hard to believe that I'm the only one experiencing them.
These negative effects are subtle, and some may not notice them. The Catch-22 is that such effects can reduce one's ability to notice or care about the problems!
In my case, the solution may be to switch to another med, such as a benzo or perhaps Buspar. I hope I can find something else that works as well but doesn't have these side effects. If I discover a successful substitute, will I conclude that Neurontin was a mistake and a "bad drug"? No.
Neurontin has its place (which IMO extends beyond its approved uses). But it's not a panacea, nor is it devoid of side effects. All drugs entail a tradeoff between potential benefit and risk of harm. Let's use them wisely. Openly & honestly discussing the pros & cons here (on Psycho-Babble) contributes to that wisdom.
- Bob
Posted by Alan on January 29, 2003, at 19:03:40
In reply to Re: Neurontin, etc., posted by Alan on January 29, 2003, at 18:52:25
The best way to receive the least comercially driven information would be to take oversight of clinical trials away from the FDA and give it to the NIH. That is, accept as evidence only trials designed and supervised by the NIH.
Failing that, ban cross-employment between the FDA and any company that it regulates for 10 or 15 years in either direction. Right now, there is a revolving door between the fox's house and the henhouse. It's bad enough that regulators are hired directly from the regulated companies. It's even worse that the FDA's "internal advocate" for a drug can and often does leave the FDA after approval of the drug to earn hundreds of thousands of dollars a year working for the maker of the drug.
Actually, we probably need both of the steps above.
And of course we need a law placing all directly or indirectly maker-funded research about a drug into the public domain when that drug receives FDA approval.
To review:
National Public Radio Reportage on Neurontin...
http://www.npr.org/display_pages/features/feature_920362.html
It turns out there are a number of stories on the illegal mis-marketing of Neurontin at this page, both print and audio.
I think it's important to understand the ramifications of the mis-marketing of Neurontin. Many, many millions were spent to get out the news that it works magically for all these unapproved conditions (for which it doesn't work in reality). But who is going to spend comparable amounts to reverse that message now that it has been show to be illegal and usually false?
These stories also give you some insight into how pharmaceutical research works here in the US, where many of the articles published in medical journals are not written by the doctors whose names appear on them. Instead they're written by professional advertising writers and doctors are paid to put their name at the top.
There's no evidence Neurontin is systematically effective against anxiety. Of course there's always SOMEBODY who'll get a beneficial response from anything, including pickled herring. But the makers of Neurontin have faced FDA sanctions here in the United States, plus massive civil lawsuits, because they pushed Neurontin for ALL kinds of conditions for which there is either no evidence it's effective or for which there IS evidence that it's NOT effective.
Maybe one's doctor is unaware of these developments, or maybe he has had one or two of those patients with an exceptional response. Or maybe one's anxiety or panic is biologically related to seizures. There's good evidence for a connection like that, though it still doesn't prove Neurontin would help the anxiety.
I post this because I was on the receiving end of this kind of thing and as aresult, my anxiety went untreated in the mean time...the "side effects" of that untreated anxiety being much worse than the side effects of those medications that were actually theraputic such as, in my case, benzodiazepines.
Posted by hildi on January 29, 2003, at 23:09:39
In reply to Re: The Neurontin Scandal » hildi, posted by Luka62 on January 28, 2003, at 19:16:02
> > > My doc kept me on Neurontin much longer than I wanted to be on it. It did nothing to help my mood swings, and I was put on Lamictal 1 1/2 yrs ago, which works well.
> > > I finally made a decision to go off the Neurontin, against my doc's advice, (I now have a new doc, happily.) I've been off of it since last July, and never in 25 years have I been this stable. I'd swear up and down that Neurontin made me Worse!!
> > > When my teen son's doc took him off Neurontin and switched his med, his mood stability also improved dramatically.
> > > Anyone else out there who had worsening symptoms on Neurontin??
> >
> > Hi. I Cannot answer you on that one, since I'm still trying to figure out whether to try either one of these meds and am trying to obtain as much information as possible, first.
> > But can you tell me if you are bipolar? Did you ever try other AD's and if so, how did you do on them? And your son, what is his diagosis? Similar to yours?
> > I don't mean to be nosey, I'm wondering because of the different variables and the different effects/responses so many have had on these meds, and if I want to chance trying either one of these.
> > Hildi
>
>
>
> <<<<<<<<<<Yes, I am bipolar. My son is also bipolar as well as ADHD. Over the years I've tried Prozac, lithium, depakote, Wellbrutin,Elavil Tegretol, Buspar,not to mention the benzo's. I had bad side effects from several,none of which had any therapeutic value for me. I hate that it's trial and error, but it is. What works for one, may causes problems in another. I can't believe I had to go through so many years of wild mood swings, severe depression, anxiety and panic, to finally find a combo that works for me. (Nardil and Lamictal).
> If I had to do it all over again, I would assert myself more with the doctors and trust my own judgement and sense of whether I am doing better on a particular medication.
> I'm grateful I now have a pdoc that really listens to me.
>
> I am glad you finally found some relief and I agree it really is frustrating to have to find out things through trial and error- which can take years, especially if you have a dr. who will not listen to you or 'appreciate' a patients' assertiveness. I am in the process of changing dr.'s now, and I hope my new one will actually listen to me and my suggestions, and take me seriously when I say that something is not working for me. My last dr. didn't.
Because you are bipolar the lamictal seemed to work well for you, and your son. While the neurontin doesn't sound like it has mood stabilizing effects. Curious though how one med can work so well while other 'similar' meds will not, such as the depakote. Some people with bipolar do great on dep- such as my fiance, he has felt great on this med alone-while other people do not do as well.
I still don't know what to do. I hope to gain as much info as I can and pray that this new dr. can help me find the right med.
Thanks for you response, and be well.
Hildi
>
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