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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 12 of 12. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by utopizen on December 25, 2002, at 23:25:28
Um, read article of Celexa 10mg in healthy patients trial, where study observed social interactions of healthy patients on it and versus Effexor. Celexa patients moved their hands a lot, Effexor patients were more social. Interesting, but I took both of these drugs for my social anxiety and felt no different in social situations that provoke my anxiety.
Anyway read similar studies on other drugs? Like I wish Nardil was studied in healthy patients, for example. Never tried the stuff, but everything doesn't work except Klonopin. I'm thinking, mmm, should I risk dying of sudden blood pressure attack for a drug that may or may not even do anything for my social anxiety??
Posted by Sebastian on December 26, 2002, at 12:04:45
In reply to Social anxiety drugs in normal patients, posted by utopizen on December 25, 2002, at 23:25:28
How about Paxil? Does that not treat social anxiety and anxiety? Have you tried it already?
Posted by utopizen on December 26, 2002, at 14:19:15
In reply to Re: Social anxiety drugs in normal patients, posted by Sebastian on December 26, 2002, at 12:04:45
> How about Paxil? Does that not treat social anxiety and anxiety? Have you tried it already?
>I doubt it- I took 20mg of Celexa. I tried Paxil after 8 mos. of no differenceo on Celexa. Unfortunately I thought Paxil was the cause of my vivid nightmares, so I stopped it after a week (in retrospect, it was simply Celexa withdrawl to blame).
But I've also tried Effexor XR 300mg, which I tried for 6 mos. and am going off now. Also tried Buspar. If I were to try anything now, I'd probably go with Serzone or Nardil, but I've grown so impatient and cynical over these things I'd rather just go to Klonopin.
Posted by Sebastian on December 26, 2002, at 18:51:19
In reply to Re: Social anxiety drugs in normal patients, posted by utopizen on December 26, 2002, at 14:19:15
I would go for the Paxil. I have heard from 2 people that it definitly takes "4 weeks" befor you feel better.
Sebastian
Posted by Aadika on December 27, 2002, at 20:41:36
In reply to Re: Social anxiety drugs in normal patients, posted by Sebastian on December 26, 2002, at 18:51:19
Seeing as how the dangers of hypertensive crisis with the use of MAO inhibitors are HIGHLY overstated, I would absolutely give Nardil a try first. And Nardil with low-dose Klonopin taken either regularly or as-needed is quite a potent combination. Just a little input derived from years of experience.
~ Aadika
Posted by Alara on December 27, 2002, at 21:16:46
In reply to Social anxiety drugs in normal patients, posted by utopizen on December 25, 2002, at 23:25:28
Utopizen, do you have the URL link for that study? I'd be interested to read it. Thanks,
Alara
Posted by Caleb462 on December 28, 2002, at 1:30:22
In reply to Social anxiety drugs in normal patients, posted by utopizen on December 25, 2002, at 23:25:28
Paxil worked excellent for my social anxiety, I felt like a new person... and effexor has worked just as good if not better. Paxil had tons of side effects for me though. Effexor, on the other hand, has had very few.
This is just my experience of course.
Posted by utopizen on December 28, 2002, at 9:48:20
In reply to Re: Social anxiety drugs in normal patients, posted by Caleb462 on December 28, 2002, at 1:30:22
Even if Nardil were to work, it would probably give me some problems sex-wise, which unlike the SSRIs, cannot be dealt with using Viagra, because I think even Sour Patch Kids is contraindicated in an MAOI. Okay, so that's an exagerration, but it seems like you can't read the back of a package of cough drops without reading that it shouldn't be used by MAOI. Okay, that's an exagerration as well.
Okay, um, still, it's like, I think it's a massive conspiracy, like those companies are trying to hint to you, "if you're so messed up you must resort to a 1960's drug, you shouldn't be allowed to use our products." okay, just some humor, sorry...
Posted by Aadika on December 28, 2002, at 10:28:11
In reply to Nardil and sex, posted by utopizen on December 28, 2002, at 9:48:20
FWIW, there are plenty of drugs that can counteract the sexual side-effects that accompany phenelzine usage. Dopaminergic agents such as Mirapex (pramipexole), Symmetrel (amantadine), Parlodel (bromocryptine), Wellbutrin (bupropion), and even stimulants such as Ritalin (methylphenidate), Dexedrine (d-amphetamine), Adderall (amphetamine/d-amphetamine), and Desoxyn (methamphetamine) can be a big help. The serotonin antagonist/antihistamine Periactin (cyproheptadine) is also often quite helpful (provided that you're not the type to fall asleep on antihistamines!). And one other that I know of is Urecholine (bethanechol), a cholinergic stimulant most commonly used for urinary retention. I know that the stimulants, Periactin, and Urecholine can be taken on an as needed basis, while Wellbutrin must be taken regularly. As for the others, I'm not so sure... But I will say that Periactin was a miracle for me through all the sexually-inhibiting drugs I've been on.
~ Aadika
Posted by Jumpy on December 28, 2002, at 15:40:15
In reply to Social anxiety drugs in normal patients, posted by utopizen on December 25, 2002, at 23:25:28
Like I wish Nardil was studied in healthy patients, for example. Never tried the stuff, but everything doesn't work except Klonopin. I'm thinking, mmm, should I risk dying of sudden blood pressure attack for a drug that may or may not even do anything for my social anxiety??
Hey Utopizen,
Have you heard of the story behind the discovery of MAOIs for depression. Iproniazid is a medication that was use to treat tuberculosis decades ago. It also has MAOI activity. Doctors noted that patients being treated with iproniazid were out "dancing and singing" in the streets. So it was hypothesized that iproniazid or any MAOI medication would be an effective antidepressant.
So to answer you question, there are no studies on Nardil on normal individuals that I know of. But iproniazid has been noted to induce a mild euphoria in "normal" individuals.
Hope this helps.
Jumpy
PS I have found only Nardil, Klonopin, Neurontin and ECT helpful for my anxiety and depression
Posted by Jumpy on December 28, 2002, at 15:44:46
In reply to Nardil and sex, posted by utopizen on December 28, 2002, at 9:48:20
PS Nardil does give me tremendous sexual dysfunction! Although less so then the SSRIs which make sex both physicially and emotional difficult. At least with Nardil I am still interested in sex.
Jumpy
Posted by utopizen on December 28, 2002, at 17:58:24
In reply to MAOIs in normal individuals » utopizen, posted by Jumpy on December 28, 2002, at 15:40:15
My problem is rather minor social anxiety, yet treatment resistant beyond Klonopin. Of course, it's illegal to be shy in America, so that's why I'm seeking treatment (me being 19 now, I figure it's best if I plan to avoid depression from starting). So clearly I'm not a candidate for ECT.
As far as Nardil and sex goes, I never got why stims are used in impotence. I can't use them because they increase my blood pressure so much that it takes me out of breath when I try to have sex. In other words, it leaves me winded. I'm not sure why others wouldn't experience a similar difficulty. Also, any stim is iffy with an MAOI, and really needs to be watched while on one..
Also, I mentioned to my doc I read a journal article that summed up the treatments for SP (your usual beta blocker, Klonopin, SSRI, Nardil advice given as if it's news) and stated that Nardil was a "gold standard" for SP and had a 60% efficacy rate. My p-doc laughed when I mentioned this. Maybe he was thinking of it in terms of depression efficacy though. Still, 60% isn't much brag about, and it's likely it's closer to under 20-30% like the SSRIs anyway.
This is the end of the thread.
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