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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 22 of 22. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by nicole1011 on November 18, 2002, at 21:15:49
i'm looking for others who are suffering from this debilitating condition......is there anyone out there?
Posted by Larry Hoover on November 18, 2002, at 22:58:31
In reply to anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder?, posted by nicole1011 on November 18, 2002, at 21:15:49
Posted by nicole1011 on November 18, 2002, at 23:31:43
In reply to Re:PTSD...Yup! ,waving his hand (nm), posted by Larry Hoover on November 18, 2002, at 22:58:31
how do you deal with it? I am recently diagnosed so could use a little advice on what to expect. is this a chronic long term condition or will it ever go away? any thing you could tell me would be great since this isn't one of those disorders that everyone has
Posted by Larry Hoover on November 19, 2002, at 9:14:54
In reply to Re:PTSD...Yup! ,waving his hand, posted by nicole1011 on November 18, 2002, at 23:31:43
> how do you deal with it?
I could talk all day (but I don't have the time right now).
>I am recently diagnosed so could use a little advice on what to expect. is this a chronic long term condition or will it ever go away? any thing you could tell me would be great since this isn't one of those disorders that everyone has
Tell me more about the diagnosis. Is this chronic or acute PTSD? An example of chronic PTSD would be lasting effects from childhood abuse. An acute PTSD might arise, say, after Sept. 11, or a car wreck. You can also have a mix of the two (like me). Treatments and such differ.
Cognitive behavioural therapy is a good idea, in both cases. Acute PTSD seems to respond well to EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing). I wish I could say it will go away, but I think it's unlikely. You can learn how to manage it.
Lar
Posted by nicole1011 on November 19, 2002, at 9:24:08
In reply to Re:PTSD...Yup! ,waving his hand, posted by Larry Hoover on November 19, 2002, at 9:14:54
mine was the result of a fire and car accident happening within 2 months of each other, so i guess i have the acute form, not quite sure yet, i will have to ask my pdoc. i will do research on the rapid eye movement therapy as well. Thank you so much for responding to me. I'm a student and i just learned in one of my psych classes that PTSD is pretty difficult to treat and it rarely ever goes away. that made me feel really down, but i am going to be an exception to the rule. I believe human beings can overcome anything. Good luck to you in to in your recovery as well
Posted by Larry Hoover on November 19, 2002, at 10:10:19
In reply to Re:PTSD...Yup! ,waving his hand, posted by nicole1011 on November 19, 2002, at 9:24:08
> mine was the result of a fire and car accident happening within 2 months of each other, so i guess i have the acute form, not quite sure yet, i will have to ask my pdoc. i will do research on the rapid eye movement therapy as well.
About EMDR. You're going to see a lot of negative commentary about EMDR. But they don't address its effectiveness. They attack the theory behind it. I don't need to know how something works, to know that it does work. If the explanations are weak, that doesn't impact on the outcome. EMDR was enormously cathartic for me.
About acute vs. chronic. Some theorists believe that one must already have experienced sub-clinical PTSD prior to the expression of acute PTSD. It's called kindling. Kind of like priming the pump. This theory is useful, as it helps to explain why PTSD really doesn't fully go away. It's just theory.
>Thank you so much for responding to me. I'm a student and i just learned in one of my psych classes that PTSD is pretty difficult to treat and it rarely ever goes away. that made me feel really down, but i am going to be an exception to the rule. I believe human beings can overcome anything. Good luck to you in to in your recovery as well
Glad to interact with you on this. It is a chance to remind myself about self-care.
At the risk of sounding like a broken friggin' record, I just came across a study that promotes fish oil for PTSD. Apparently, fish oil (actually DHA) dampens the excitatory stimulation of ACTH, and improves the feed-back inhibition process.
I personally believe that the length of time between activation of PTSD and beginning treatment is an important determinant of severity of outcome. So, your own success is greatly enhanced.
Posted by sebastian on November 19, 2002, at 12:44:32
In reply to Re:PTSD...Yup! ,waving his hand, posted by Larry Hoover on November 19, 2002, at 10:10:19
I witnessed my freind on fire go into a coma and die 6 years later. I'm prity sure its accute PTSD.
I've been undergoing therapy now for 7 years. Last October 18 was the aniversary of the accident.
I've been taking lots of drugs with the undieing hope that I will some day get better.
Sebastian
Posted by sebastian on November 19, 2002, at 12:51:00
In reply to anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder?, posted by nicole1011 on November 18, 2002, at 21:15:49
Anyone taking a good anti-psycotic for this disese?
I'm taking Zyprexa right now, and it does a great job on my mind. I just wish it didn't make me gain the 50lbs I did. Any other good ideas, would be greatly apreciated.
Sebastian
Posted by nicole1011 on November 19, 2002, at 15:11:16
In reply to Re: anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder?, posted by sebastian on November 19, 2002, at 12:51:00
i'm not taking any anti-psychotics but i am taking a lot of pills.....
50mg of paxil, 37.5 mg of effexor, 15 mg of serax, and 1mg of xanax 4 times a day if needed.........so far not working so good :(
Posted by jflange on November 19, 2002, at 15:47:57
In reply to Re:PTSD...Yup! ,waving his hand, posted by nicole1011 on November 19, 2002, at 9:24:08
I have also experienced PTSD after a confluence of traumatic events in college. In those days there really were no guidelines for drug therapy but I found great benefit in talk therapy - mostly cognitive-behavioral - and after about 7-8 months, I really did overcome many of the symptoms. So it >is< possible to overcome PTSD.
However, I will say that many years later, after a long remission period, I began to struggle with similar illnesses (GAD, panic disorder) and part of me wonders if this is not simply a part of the long arm of PTSD. That is, I wonder if, like other illnesses, PTSD has both an acute AND a chronic manifestation. Certainly, one can "get over" the original traumatic events, but I would think revisiting some of the PTSD issues later on down the road should also be part of the expected course of recovery.
Perhaps other modes of therapy and/or therapy/med combinations that are today the "first line" of treatment will eliminate the later return of symptoms I have experienced?
jflange
Posted by nicole1011 on November 19, 2002, at 19:51:25
In reply to Re:PTSD...acute and chronic?, posted by jflange on November 19, 2002, at 15:47:57
i always thought acute PTSD only lasted for 3 months or less and chronic was anything over 3 months, so you probably have chronic if you still experience symptoms years later. as for overcoming it, i read that it is not curable but treatable. meaning that it never ever goes away but you can learn to live with it. in fact, they charactorize it as a severe mental disorder
Posted by Ritch on November 19, 2002, at 22:04:40
In reply to Re: anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder?, posted by nicole1011 on November 19, 2002, at 15:11:16
> i'm not taking any anti-psychotics but i am taking a lot of pills.....
>
> 50mg of paxil, 37.5 mg of effexor, 15 mg of serax, and 1mg of xanax 4 times a day if needed.........so far not working so good :(Nicole, have you ever tried any Topamax or Zoloft for PTSD? I always had heard that Zoloft was *the* SSRI for PTSD. Topamax has had some efficacy from what I have read. hope this helps,
Mitch
Posted by Pfinstegg on November 21, 2002, at 10:26:07
In reply to anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder?, posted by nicole1011 on November 18, 2002, at 21:15:49
To my way of thinking, which has been greatly influenced by all the posts here, including the ones in the archives, and the research these have led me to do, I think nearly everyone here can be considered to have some variety of PTSD. Maternal stress and depresson during fetal life begins by setting the HPA axis to "high", childhood neglect and abuse and later life experiences of loss, fear, conflict etc. along with whatever genetic predisposition we may have, all lead to a common pathway of excessive CRH-ACTH-cortisol production in response to minimal stimuli. The presence of excessive cortisol and mineralocorticoids excreted by over-active adrenals damages the hippocampus and prefrontal cortex and thus the neurotransmitters which regulate the output and uptake of all the neurotransmitters- for serotonin, dopamine and epinephrine, and undoubtedly others not as well understood yet.I don't think the actual psychiatric diagnosis, whether it is bipolar or monopolar depression, panic disorder, social phobia, borderline or schizoid personality disorder- is very significant any longer, except in the sense that certain medications may be better for one or another of these. The two disorders which seem less related to stress, and more to genetic or physiological abnormalities, would be schizophrenia and OCD, although stress clearly does play a role in both of these also.
Because of having begun to think in this way, I am looking forward, very much, to treatments which will address the basic HPA axis dysregulation- they are definitely coming!
I also continue to value psychotherapy highly, when it is done well- I think that the sense of growth and mastery which one can gain from psychotherapy may be due to the power of a good human relationship to help moderate the HPA axis dysregulation. Well, I'll stop here, but would really like to know what others think of these ideas!
Pfinstegg
Posted by Kari on November 22, 2002, at 9:56:57
In reply to Re: anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder? » nicole1011, posted by Pfinstegg on November 21, 2002, at 10:26:07
Hi Pfinstegg,
Your ideas are very interesting and it can be assumed that most psychiatric disorders are triggered by stress and that their severity depends on how early on that stress began, how prolonged, as well as genetic sensitivity. The resulting chronic hyperarousal and overstimulation seem to have similar manifestations regardless of the diagnosis.
I hope the new treatments you have mentioned will be available soon and that you will be able to somehow get your problem with elevated cortisol levels under control.
Take care,
Kari.
Posted by Pfinstegg on November 22, 2002, at 10:14:40
In reply to Re: anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder? » Pfinstegg, posted by Kari on November 22, 2002, at 9:56:57
Thank you Kari...doing my best!
Pfinstegg
Posted by Larry Hoover on November 22, 2002, at 18:25:45
In reply to Re: anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder? » nicole1011, posted by Pfinstegg on November 21, 2002, at 10:26:07
Very well said.
I'd like to add something more.....we get more from our parents than just genes.....we get their behaviours. We learn from them how to act/react to the environment.
Posted by syringachalet on November 23, 2002, at 13:12:12
In reply to Re: anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder? » Pfinstegg, posted by Kari on November 22, 2002, at 9:56:57
I too have PTSD and multiple visual/audiotry flashbacks on a daily basis. Although I cannot drive a car(I dont feel safe), I am able for the most part to take care of my basic needs. My biggest problem is that I am not able to have anyone touch me except my husband and my sister.(the rest of my family are all dead). Even someone touching me at the market causes me to have an anxiety attack. My husband asked me more than once.. what if you had an accident and had to have emergency staff provide you care to save your life? I have no answer for this. I gues I will have to work through this somehow.....
Posted by Pfinstegg on November 23, 2002, at 13:30:44
In reply to Re: anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder?, posted by syringachalet on November 23, 2002, at 13:12:12
That is such a tough situation to be in. I'm assuming that you are involved in psychotherapy, and possibly medications as well. I do have a suggestion: really well-trained, professional massage therapists work effectively with people with acute PTSD- they have been taught how to proceed so that their clients do not re-experience anxiety or panic; they may do very little for a long time, and always keep their client's emotional well-being foremost. I just happened to learn about this recently, when I began going to one myself; I was amazed at the complexity of her psychological training, and what she told me about approaching PTSD. I'm sure that massage therapists this well-trained are in a minority, but it might be worth contacting your local professional association and asking whether they have therapists trained in this way in your area.
Pfinstegg
Posted by syringachalet on November 23, 2002, at 19:45:53
In reply to Re: anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder? » syringachalet, posted by Pfinstegg on November 23, 2002, at 13:30:44
Pfinstegg, Thanks for your suggestion. I am glad to have found someplace that the people really understand and dont just give lip service.
for me to even think of having anyone...even a doctor or a dentist touch me..would cause me to have an anxiety attack that last for hours. For this reason, I have not had a medical exam/ dental for..I dont know how long.
Thanks just for letting me vent. syringa
Posted by Pfinstegg on November 24, 2002, at 1:21:35
In reply to Re: anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder?, posted by syringachalet on November 23, 2002, at 19:45:53
From what you told me, I guess the last thing you would want to consider right now is going to a massage therapist. I was just very surprised to learn that the recently-trained ones are taught so much about dealing with PTSD, and actually receive referrals from psychotherapists and work co-operatively with them. They work very slowly and patiently to reintroduce the concept of safe, non-sexual touch, with their clients retaining control over what happens. I don't have that difficulty myself, but my massage therapist told me of how she was treating a young client with a similiar situation to yours- most of the time has been spent talking about touching, so far, but not doing it unless it is requested- and then only exactly as her client specifies. I brought this up again only because I was so surprised to know that this kind of treatment exists, and also because the massage therapist told me that she has been very successful, over time, in helping people overcome some basic PTSD symptoms. She feels that the improvement takes place at a very basic, non-verbal level, and that it can be remarkable. Maybe something to file away for future consideration..
Pfinstegg
Posted by syringachalet on November 24, 2002, at 11:38:28
In reply to Re: anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder? » syringachalet, posted by Pfinstegg on November 24, 2002, at 1:21:35
Pfinstegg,
Thank you so much for your thoughtfullness.
I think when Im ready to take a step like that, that it might be a viable option for me.
Thanks again.
Posted by Michael D on November 24, 2002, at 13:19:31
In reply to Re: anyone have Post traumatic stress disorder? » nicole1011, posted by Pfinstegg on November 21, 2002, at 10:26:07
> the research these have led me to do, I think nearly everyone here can be considered to have some variety of PTSD. Maternal stress and depresson during fetal life begins by setting the HPA axis to "high", childhood neglect and abuse and later life experiences of loss, fear, conflict etc.
I have also read that fetal and post-birth environmental conditions are the single biggest contributer to many mental illnesses.
It's interesting to read about the mechanism that might be behind this.
What I've read, is that early-life creates the susceptibility to mental illness, and that conditions and experiences in later life are the trigger. Of course, nothing is black and white.
The hard part is: where to go from here.
I know that if I would have a job that didn't cause me to be anxious, friends, and other meaningful things, that I would be able to hold up.
My problem is how to get there. I find most workplaces too stressful to be at and get on my feet.
Michael Dewolf
This is the end of the thread.
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