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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 8 of 8. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by andyboy on August 8, 2002, at 8:11:25
Ok
Ive heard so many different stories....
Klonopin to Xanax strength ratio....
whats the real deal?????
andy
Posted by Squiggles on August 8, 2002, at 8:43:54
In reply to Benzo Potency Question....., posted by andyboy on August 8, 2002, at 8:11:25
There are different stories; when i was
working with Ray Nimmo on this we found
many variations on the net;from my personal experience withdrawing I would
say Xanax is anywhere from 1/5 to 1/10th LESS
potent than Klonopin.However, here is an "average" chart
found on Dr. Bob's site:
http://www.dr-bob.org/tips/bzd.html
Squiggles
Posted by Maximus on August 8, 2002, at 13:40:57
In reply to Benzo Potency Question....., posted by andyboy on August 8, 2002, at 8:11:25
> Ive heard so many different stories....
> Klonopin to Xanax strength ratio....
> whats the real deal?????Andy, this isn't the good question to ask yourself. Yes Klonopin is approx. 5 times the potency of Xanax.
But the real deal is that Xanax is a very short action benzo and Klonopin a long action benzo. Xanax half-life is somewhere between 4 to 18 hours. The half-life of Klonopin is 18 to 50 hours.
The result. You have to take Xanax at least 3 times a day to get a substained effect. It is very annoying. However, you can take Klonopin just once a day. It is a big difference.
Hope that helps!
Posted by gheld on August 8, 2002, at 21:59:22
In reply to Re: Benzo Potency Question..... » andyboy, posted by Maximus on August 8, 2002, at 13:40:57
You can feel the Xanax or Ativan "whoosh" into or out of your system, or at least I could. Klonopin is a much easier ride, and I certainly prefer that; although I wouldn't if I still had immediate panic attacks that needed stopping. If you need the quick action of Xanax, use it. If you don't, take the easier ride with Klonopin.
I find that 0.5 mg of Klonopin works for me about the same as 1.0 mg of Xanax.
Posted by Hiba on August 12, 2002, at 0:11:07
In reply to Re: Benzo Potency Question..... » andyboy, posted by Squiggles on August 8, 2002, at 8:43:54
Dear Squiggles,
Sorry to offend you once again. The equivalency table given with your message is confusing. Not two tables are alike. Anyway I suggest you to check with American Psychiatric Association task force report on Benzodiazepines. Clonazepam is only half potent than alprazolam. The reason people think it is much potent than alprazolam is because it is more sedating. The rate of sedation is not an indicative of potency. In agitated patients 0.5 mg of alprazolam can quickly control their agitation. whereas it takes 1 or 1.5 mg of clonazepam to get this same effect. I have worked in a detoxification center and I know it from my experience.
HIBA
Posted by Squiggles on August 12, 2002, at 7:54:59
In reply to Re: Benzo Potency Question....., posted by Hiba on August 12, 2002, at 0:11:07
I recall my husband and I did a search and
came up with something like 20 equivalence tables;
most show K to be twice as potent as X; however,
this is not a meaningful comparison for as you
state it may be something like sedation.If it has any meaning i would say look at the
effects when the drug is taken away and compare
and look at the other effects. Xanax is good
for quick acute anxiety, having a short half life,
whereas K is good for a longer period AND is
a strong anti-convulsant.So there may actually be a qualitative difference.
And comparing them must beg the question comparing
what.
Squiggles
Posted by Hiba on August 13, 2002, at 0:32:48
In reply to Re: Benzo Potency Question..... » Hiba, posted by Squiggles on August 12, 2002, at 7:54:59
Dear Squiggles,
There are more than twenty equivalency tables available on the net only to make us confused. what I wrote is from experience. I had got an easy accessibility to benzodiazepines years ago while I was working as a volunteer in a detoxification center. I have seen many agitated,overanxious patients effectively controlled on benzodiazepines. See the initial dosage of different benzos used in the center to calm such patients.
Alprazolam 0.5 to 1 mg
clonazepam 1 to 2 mg
Diazepam 10 to 15 mg
Lorazepam 1 to 2 mgApart from benzos chlorpromazine(a phenothiazine) was used intravenously. Diazepam was also given in injections. Lorazepam intravenous preparation is not available in India.
Clonazepam stays in your system for a long time, that is not because of its potency but because of its long half life. Look at the lowest available dosage forms in the market. alprazolam is available in 0.25 mg while lowest available form of clonazepam is 0.5 mg. Doesn't it ring any bell?
Clonazepam has stronger anti-convulsant properties than alprazolam. But not anti-anxiety properties. The amount to make an anxiolysis in anxious patients is the true indication of potency. Because we are discussing about anxiolytic potency. If you are used to alprazolam for anxiolysis, you will have to take twice the amount of clonazepam to get the same effect. Still doubtful? try it yourself.HIBA
Posted by Squiggles on August 13, 2002, at 6:05:39
In reply to Re: Benzo Potency Question....., posted by Hiba on August 13, 2002, at 0:32:48
Hi,
Regarding anxiolytic effect, i think XANAX is
best for panic attacks, and K and others for
long-term anxiety or GAD - i think you are probably
aware of that.After using Xanax for many yrs. at the same dose
I got panic attacks far worse than the intitial
ones i was prescribed for and about 3 to 4 times
per day - they really were incapacitating. That
was tolerance; when I weaned off the Xanax, the
panic attacks stopped. I have not had one since.The Klonopin never bothered me except in conjunction
with Xanax, which also after some yrs. at the same
dose started giving severe dyspnea upon injestion.Have you seen Ray's site? It has some rather
fervent ideas, but also a superb collection of
benzo information; some articles in the index
about the use of benzos in India too;Tolerance is an important fact in benzo and
any other drug addiction; potency - well,
potency of what; also there must be a reason
why there are more than one benzo if all were
directed entirely at anxiety, but some are
for epilepsy.cheers,
Squiggles
This is the end of the thread.
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