Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 82421

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what counters amphetamine effects?

Posted by alex01 on October 27, 2001, at 0:29:03

Hi
wondering if anyone has any idea if there are any meds which act as opposites to stimulants. I took some dexamphetamine (on prescription) for depression/anxiety and got a big overdose/anxiety reaction, but now, three months later, the reaction is still here. I think that the dex may have changed the way my brain works and Im wondering if there's anything which acts to reduce the release of whatever dex stimulates, and hopefully push my head back to the way it was.
any advice appreciated

 

Re: what counters amphetamine effects? alex01

Posted by JohnX2 on October 27, 2001, at 10:58:08

In reply to what counters amphetamine effects?, posted by alex01 on October 27, 2001, at 0:29:03

Alex,

Over time stimulatants like dextroamphetamine
may induce something called "reverse tolerance".
It is believed that the dopamine receptors that
are the given extra dopamine start to
change themselves in terms of their receptor
sensitivity. Curiously , one of the dopamine
receptors responsible for the therapeutic affect
also is used to tell the brain in a feed-back
mecanism to stop releasing dopamine. This can
cause a paradoxical up-regulation of those receptors
making them more sensitive (a potentiating the
side effects for you).

I've seen a few promising routes for treating
this, most aren't available treatment. Probably the
best bet is to take a medication holiday (to help
the brain naturally readjust) every now and then.

These things are believed to help for sure:
- meds that are NMDA antagonists.
Memantine is a research med available in europe
in clinical testing in the us (but not specifically
for this).
Amantadine is similar to memantine and may help
to prevent stimulant poop-out, but amantadine has
some irritating side effects for some.
- Benzodiazepines like Klonopin. Again, this is
a hard sell to the doctor because both meds are
addictive, but klonopin can actually make the
stimulant less addictive and more smooth
acting (although the klonopin
can poop-out).

Some fringe ideas without anything but anecdotal
evidence to support:

Anti-convulsants:
- Some people have noticed improvements on Lamictal
or Neurontin. Neurontin is particularly good for
anxiety.
Anti-depressants:
- Serzone. I think it has some anxioltyitic and
depressant qualities that may offset the stimulant.
Anti-psychotics:
- Zyprexa. This will probably help reduce the irritability
induced by the stim and may help with the funny
reverse tolerance. Zyprexa is very anti-anxiety,
anti-paranoia, and may complement the stim. Again
mostly anecdoctal data.

others I'm sure have more ideas.

regards,
john

> Hi
> wondering if anyone has any idea if there are any meds which act as opposites to stimulants. I took some dexamphetamine (on prescription) for depression/anxiety and got a big overdose/anxiety reaction, but now, three months later, the reaction is still here. I think that the dex may have changed the way my brain works and Im wondering if there's anything which acts to reduce the release of whatever dex stimulates, and hopefully push my head back to the way it was.
> any advice appreciated

 

Re: what counters amphetamine effects?

Posted by paxvox on October 27, 2001, at 16:30:59

In reply to Re: what counters amphetamine effects? alex01, posted by JohnX2 on October 27, 2001, at 10:58:08

JohnX2 makes some interesting points. The effects you mention commonly happen to abusers of cocaine and other street (or re-directed legit med) stimulants. Eventually, your brain chemistry gets rewired (sorry for the cross-analogism).

What to do, what to do...
How long were you on it? Have you told your Pdoc what's going on?

I concur with JohnX that a benzo will take the edge off. I take Wellbutrin, which mimics many effects of the psycho-stimulants like amphetamine, and I have taken clonazepam (Klonopin) and now clorazepate (Tranzene) to help smooth me out.

Long term damage? Possibly. Reversable? Probably.
The brain, albeit sensitive, can be "forgiving" over time.

PAX

 

Re: what counters amphetamine effects? alex01

Posted by Elizabeth on October 28, 2001, at 11:00:35

In reply to what counters amphetamine effects?, posted by alex01 on October 27, 2001, at 0:29:03

Have you tried benzodiazepines? The effect of amphetamine doesn't last for three months, but it may have triggered an anxiety disorder.

What has the doctor who prescribed the stimulant suggested?

-elizabeth

 

Re: what counters amphetamine effects?

Posted by alex01 on November 2, 2001, at 23:11:10

In reply to Re: what counters amphetamine effects? alex01, posted by Elizabeth on October 28, 2001, at 11:00:35

thank you all so much for your responses I really appreciate them.

I only took a very small flake of dex once, but my metabolism is VERY sensitive and I can only take a small crumb of whatever med I am taking and still get a big effect. I am currently taking about 1 mg of a beta blocker spread out over a day which does help a lot with reducing the dex related symptoms.

I have tried Zyprexa which was ok but I could still feel the effects of the dex through it and it felt very uncomfortable.

the pdoc who prescribed it for me had no idea. My current doc has tried Zyprexa and bblockers.

The dex related rush doesnt feel like a panic/anxiety rush, it feels like an overdose of something, like my head is full of some chemical , just like when I took the dex 3 months ago. I have tried to have a med holiday but it is extremely uncomfortable and scary, so beta blockers it is for the time being.

feeling a bit better from the hope that all your suggestions have given me.

 

Re: what counters amphetamine effects? alex01

Posted by JohnX2 on November 3, 2001, at 4:54:04

In reply to Re: what counters amphetamine effects?, posted by alex01 on November 2, 2001, at 23:11:10


The beta-blocker was a good idea, and I should
have mentioned it. Glad it is helping. I have
used beta-blockers to offset med induced anxiety
on selegiline and remeron.

good luck,
john


> thank you all so much for your responses I really appreciate them.
>
> I only took a very small flake of dex once, but my metabolism is VERY sensitive and I can only take a small crumb of whatever med I am taking and still get a big effect. I am currently taking about 1 mg of a beta blocker spread out over a day which does help a lot with reducing the dex related symptoms.
>
> I have tried Zyprexa which was ok but I could still feel the effects of the dex through it and it felt very uncomfortable.
>
> the pdoc who prescribed it for me had no idea. My current doc has tried Zyprexa and bblockers.
>
> The dex related rush doesnt feel like a panic/anxiety rush, it feels like an overdose of something, like my head is full of some chemical , just like when I took the dex 3 months ago. I have tried to have a med holiday but it is extremely uncomfortable and scary, so beta blockers it is for the time being.
>
> feeling a bit better from the hope that all your suggestions have given me.

 

Be careful w. speed if u r overly anxious

Posted by Cressida on November 5, 2001, at 0:06:27

In reply to Re: what counters amphetamine effects?, posted by alex01 on November 2, 2001, at 23:11:10

Amphetamines, and CNS stimulants in general, are contraindicted if you have a known hypersensitivity or idiosyncrasy to them. Further, doctors normally don't prescribe them if you appear agitated or extremely anxious, because they can often worsen your condition. I'm only speculating, but I would think docs reserve meds like Dexedrine and Adderall for patients with ADD/ADHD or narcolepsy, as they are highly addictive and widely abused.

You said you're on 1mg of a beta adrenergic blocker. I take 100mg of Atenolol and 20mg of Prinivil, an ACE inhibitor, every day. I can't imagine 1mg doing much unless it's a potent beta blocker, or a sugar pill. Well, as it is commonly written here as an acronym, YMMV. Stick with whatever works.

 

Re: what counters amphetamine effects?

Posted by alex01 on November 5, 2001, at 4:42:52

In reply to Re: what counters amphetamine effects? alex01, posted by JohnX2 on November 3, 2001, at 4:54:04

just wondering, i am thinking of trying melatonin to help me get to sleep but i am worried about it interacting with my beta-blocker, inderal. I may also have a recurring reaction to dexamphetamine which I am also concerned aboout.

Does you have any advice about inderal and melatonin or dex interactions?

Thanks.


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