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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by shellie on August 27, 2000, at 12:55:42
I've been successfully on nardil for about twenty years (before ssris existed). I can't take tricyclics. About five years ago, I experienced Nardil poopout, pdoc tried me on various ssris, none successful, went back on nardil, worked again.
Starting last January, same thing again. I've tried to augment the nardil with aricept (shakey, drugged feeling),revia (same reaction), lamictal (good, but large weight gain), ritalin (no benefit), dexadrine (no benefit), provigal (slept all the time) and now I'm stopping tomopax (sleeping 16 hours a day, muscles hurt--got up to 150, no benefit for depression).
Basically between the provigal and topomax, I have slept the summer away. I am wondering where to get information on what the odds are if I stop the nardil for a week to ten days then go back on it. How big a chance am I taking. I know I will crash, but it might be worth it if it brings me another 3 to 5 years. I can't find any data on this on the internet.
Any information would be appreciated. Also, if you can think of something I've missed in the augmentation process (I am taking thyroid; I've tried lithium, deserel and sam-e unsuccessfully), but at this point I am really tired of trying different meds. The one thing I might be willing to do is change from nardil to parnate, but my preference would still be to stay on nardil since I know it so well and it produces very few side effects for me. Thanks, Shellie
Posted by Lankry on August 27, 2000, at 15:16:52
In reply to Stopping, Restarting an MAOI-----: Cam, Sunnely, posted by shellie on August 27, 2000, at 12:55:42
Just started Paxil 10 Mg. 5 days ago. It has relieved my anxiety and depression so far, however, all I want to do is lie in bed to alleviate the speedy feeling that occurs inside my body as soon as I start to move around. Also, any stimulation - phone ringing , kids talking etc... drives me crazy. Once I lie down and get rid of the speedy feeling I sleep - I feel like I just want to sleep 24 hours a day. I don't want to stop because the depression and anxiety I was experiencing in severity last week has dramatically decreased. Can someone please tell me if these side effects will subside over the next few weeks.
Much appreciated
Posted by shellie on August 27, 2000, at 18:13:07
In reply to PAXIL NEW USER - PLEASE HELP, posted by Lankry on August 27, 2000, at 15:16:52
Dr. Bob. I'd really like to my question answered about stopping, restarting an maoi. Likewise, I'm sure lankry would like help with his/her problem. But the two are not related and I'm afraid my question will be overlooked. Is there a way to move lankry's concern to it's own thread? Thanks, Shellie
Posted by Danny on August 27, 2000, at 22:04:43
In reply to PAXIL NEW USER - PLEASE HELP, posted by Lankry on August 27, 2000, at 15:16:52
Hi Lankry
5 days is a pretty short test period. The fact that it's working already is great. I used Paxil for 3 years at 5mg. This is a low dosage, but I'm sensitive to medications across the board. It's possible that a lower dose might work without all the side effects you're experiencing. Paxil does make many people sleepy; I always took it at bedtime. This effect should wear off some with time. I know the feeling when you find a med that gives relief, but causes other problems. Hang in there. Keep asking for help. Also, I highly recommend, as do most psychiatrists, some kind of therapy. best of luck.
> Just started Paxil 10 Mg. 5 days ago. It has relieved my anxiety and depression so far, however, all I want to do is lie in bed to alleviate the speedy feeling that occurs inside my body as soon as I start to move around. Also, any stimulation - phone ringing , kids talking etc... drives me crazy. Once I lie down and get rid of the speedy feeling I sleep - I feel like I just want to sleep 24 hours a day. I don't want to stop because the depression and anxiety I was experiencing in severity last week has dramatically decreased. Can someone please tell me if these side effects will subside over the next few weeks.
>
> Much appreciated
Posted by shar on August 27, 2000, at 23:25:11
In reply to Dr. Bob-untangling threads, posted by shellie on August 27, 2000, at 18:13:07
Shellie,
FWIW, I would just start a new thread again. Maybe use the name of the med in the title and people who have experience with it, plus Cam/Sunnely, can respond.
Shar
> Dr. Bob. I'd really like to my question answered about stopping, restarting an maoi. Likewise, I'm sure lankry would like help with his/her problem. But the two are not related and I'm afraid my question will be overlooked. Is there a way to move lankry's concern to it's own thread? Thanks, Shellie
Posted by shellie on August 31, 2000, at 9:09:53
In reply to Re: Stopping, Restarting an MAOI 2 Shellie, posted by Jennifer on August 31, 2000, at 4:26:28
Hi Jennifer. I have been on 30mg of nardil (45 premenstrually). I have just tried upping the nardil to 60mg. I'm afraid it's going to knock me out, but maybe I'll be wrong. Just got off of topomax where I was sleeping about 16 hours a day and tired the rest of the time, so I can't tell yet--it's still in my body. But maybe a higher dose of nardil as a booster for a while might work; I'm running out of ideas. Thanks for the info, Shellie
Posted by Jennifer on September 1, 2000, at 2:46:47
In reply to Re: Stopping, Restarting an MAOI 2 Shellie » Jennifer, posted by shellie on August 31, 2000, at 9:09:53
Hi Shellie, I haven't had any sense of sleepiness or being "knocked out" on my 90mg per day dose. Hope it works for you. Jennifer
> Hi Jennifer. I have been on 30mg of nardil (45 premenstrually). I have just tried upping the nardil to 60mg. I'm afraid it's going to knock me out, but maybe I'll be wrong. Just got off of topomax where I was sleeping about 16 hours a day and tired the rest of the time, so I can't tell yet--it's still in my body. But maybe a higher dose of nardil as a booster for a while might work; I'm running out of ideas. Thanks for the info, Shellie
Posted by shellie on September 1, 2000, at 5:16:37
In reply to Re: Stopping, Restarting an MAOI 2 Shellie, posted by Jennifer on September 1, 2000, at 2:46:47
Jennifer. I went to bed at 12am then woke up at 3am and am still up. I can't fall back to sleep despite taking klonopin, and aderex. Now I remember that happened years ago when they started me on 45 mg of nardil. Do you have any problems with sleep at night? Are you taking something to sleep though the night. Maybe this is another one of those freak problems that only I have. Thanks, Shellie
Posted by SLS on September 1, 2000, at 8:46:52
In reply to Re: Stopping, Restarting an MAOI 2 » Jennifer, posted by shellie on September 1, 2000, at 5:16:37
> Jennifer. I went to bed at 12am then woke up at 3am and am still up. I can't fall back to sleep despite taking klonopin, and aderex. Now I remember that happened years ago when they started me on 45 mg of nardil. Do you have any problems with sleep at night? Are you taking something to sleep though the night. Maybe this is another one of those freak problems that only I have. Thanks, Shellie
I find that MAOI-induced insomnia is a good prognosticator of an antidepressant response. I hope this is so for you.Good luck.
- Scott
Posted by stephanie l. on September 10, 2000, at 19:35:16
In reply to Re: Stopping, Restarting an MAOI 2 Shellie, posted by Jennifer on August 31, 2000, at 4:26:28
> Shellie,
> You didn't say what your dose of Nardil is and I'm wondering if it could be "upped" for awhile. I took Nardil 30mg twice a day for years. Then after being off it for a couple years, my symptoms returned and I found that the 30mg no longer worked. My pdoc said that up to 10% of those that restart MAOI's do not respond as well the second time. That was scary since nothing else worked. Ended up increasing my dose to 45mg (3tabs) twice a day for the last year, and have just started to lower it back. It took the increased dose for awhile to "kick the poop-out", and now I feel as though I don't need as much.
> I don't know if this helps, but at least you might feel better increasing you dose (within an acceptable dose range) and knowing that you might not always need as much. Jennifer
>
> > I've been successfully on nardil for about twenty years (before ssris existed). I can't take tricyclics. About five years ago, I experienced Nardil poopout, pdoc tried me on various ssris, none successful, went back on nardil, worked again.
> >
> > Starting last January, same thing again. I've tried to augment the nardil with aricept (shakey, drugged feeling),revia (same reaction), lamictal (good, but large weight gain), ritalin (no benefit), dexadrine (no benefit), provigal (slept all the time) and now I'm stopping tomopax (sleeping 16 hours a day, muscles hurt--got up to 150, no benefit for depression).
> >
> > Basically between the provigal and topomax, I have slept the summer away. I am wondering where to get information on what the odds are if I stop the nardil for a week to ten days then go back on it. How big a chance am I taking. I know I will crash, but it might be worth it if it brings me another 3 to 5 years. I can't find any data on this on the internet.
> >
> > Any information would be appreciated. Also, if you can think of something I've missed in the augmentation process (I am taking thyroid; I've tried lithium, deserel and sam-e unsuccessfully), but at this point I am really tired of trying different meds. The one thing I might be willing to do is change from nardil to parnate, but my preference would still be to stay on nardil since I know it so well and it produces very few side effects for me. Thanks, ShellieShellie: My experience has been very similar to yours. I took Marplan, then Nardil, for 11 years.
Then it pooped out. I began trying med after med, new combination after new combination.
I ended up on my current combination of Nardil, Wellbutrin, Vivactil -- I later added dexedrine and Yohimbe. I know that this is an unusual combination, but I have had no serious problems from it. As I experimented with meds, I realized that stimulating meds were the only ones worth trying for me, and not to waste my time on any more "sedating type" medications (which included SSRIs). Vivactil -- which is a tricyclic -- affected me much differently than the other two I tried --- amitriptaline and desipramine. With both of these, I was sleeping l8 hours a day (even after a long trial period.) But Vivactil (protriptyline) was more stimulatiing.
I don''t think the dexedrine is helping much anymore; I've gotten used to it. But the yohimbe is continuing to work at a very small dose. I am resigned to the fact that I will have to keep finding new stimulants as the current ones lose their effectiveness. Basically, I am just waiting to try reboxetine. I hope you find what you need and soon. I know how frustrating it is to go through endless trials of medications.
Stephanie
Posted by SLS on September 11, 2000, at 9:53:23
In reply to Re: Stopping, Restarting an MAOI 2 Shellie, posted by stephanie l. on September 10, 2000, at 19:35:16
> I don''t think the dexedrine is helping much anymore; I've gotten used to it. But the yohimbe is continuing to work at a very small dose. I am resigned to the fact that I will have to keep finding new stimulants as the current ones lose their effectiveness. Basically, I am just waiting to try reboxetine.
Hi Stephanie.I am very interested to know in what way yohimbine has helped you. How much are you taking, and when do you take it?
How would you describe the importance of yohimbine in your treatment? How would you describe how it has benefited you? What did you feel?
I recently started a combination of Parnate and desipramine. I was desperate, and things were getting dangerous. This combination was the only thing ever to work for me thirteen years ago. Unfortunately, my doctor at the time decided to discontinue it, and it has never worked since. This time, I am taking Lamictal 300mg along with it. If this combo proves partially effective, I would consider adding yohimbine to it.
Stephanie, hopefully, you will have no need of stimulants. My doctor had no problem with the idea of combining reboxetine with Nardil. I would have tried it had I not reacted badly to the reboxetine alone. What are your reasons for wanting to try reboxetine? Are you dissatisfied with the way you are currently feeling? Are you going to add it to everything you are already taking?
Are you waiting for reboxetine to be approved in the U.S. before trying it?
In what order did you add your medications to Nardil?
With each addition, how did it affect you?
Have you tried any of the dopaminergic anti-Parkinson's drugs?
Parlodel (bromocryptine)
Mirapex (pramipexole)
Permax (pergolide)I experienced a brief improvement with Parlodel while taking Parnate. A research clinician recently suggested that I try Mirapex.
I hope everything works out.
Thanks for any input you can give me.
- Scott
This is the end of the thread.
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