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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 3 to 27 of 27. Go back in thread:
Posted by JohnB. on September 8, 1999, at 14:00:03
In reply to I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by Kim on September 8, 1999, at 12:00:47
Kim:
What you describe could be almost anything, perhaps having nothing to do with EffexorXR at all. When coming off Effexor too quickly, it has a strange and uncomfortable withdrawal syndrome, as I experienced firsthand. But what you've described is different.I'm concerned that, believe it or not, you're not taking ENOUGH Effexor, Kim. Provided you're tolerating it well, otherwise, 75mgXR daily is not generally enough of this med. for totally therapeutic results. A return of your depression is understandle at this small dose; at least 225mg/300mg needs to be maintained for at least 4 or 5 weeks to be sure Effexor is for you.
You'd be surprised what bumping the dose up can do for a "complete" response to a drug. If your doctor is not a practicing psychiatrist, ask him to consult with one about Effexor dosing. It's a remarkable drug at the right dosage.
Good luck, JohnB.
Posted by Noa on September 8, 1999, at 19:36:25
In reply to Re: I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by JohnB. on September 8, 1999, at 14:00:03
I am not sure I have any advice for you, but can only say a bit about my own experience on Effexor XR. I started taking the XR for 2 reasons: easier dosing/less likely to have varied dose times, and because it doesn't interfere as much with my sleep as when I was on the regular effexor. I had to increase my dose recently because the effect flattened and I got pretty depressed. This has happened with other ADs I have taken. When I was on the regular Effexor, there was a period of time when I was on a higher dose, something like 350 mg, but the side effects were a problem--profuse sweating, faintness when I stood up, memory problems (word retreival mostly), and more severe myoclonus (muscle twitches) when relaxed, lying down, or about to sleep. So, Iwent back down on the dose and added ritalin at that time. Now I am on the XR, and just went from 225 to 300. I accidentally took 450 the other day (I was used to taking 3x75 mg. pills, and in my sleepiness that morning, forgot that I only take 2x150 pills now. I had a hard time sleeping that night, and had really bad word retrieval problems for a day or two.
Posted by Cindy on January 6, 2000, at 21:47:07
In reply to Re: I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by Noa on September 8, 1999, at 19:36:25
I have been on Effexor 75ml with Wellbutrin and have recently stopped in order to start on a new AD. The withdrawls I feel are horrible whenever I transition from one AD to another. I feel dizzy, tired, sea sick, and very tearful, which is not like me at all. Does anyone know how to make this transition easier? My psychiatrist says I just have to go through it, and I should be appreciative because now I know it was working. As if I ever felt this sick just being depressed.
My equalibrium is shaky and I can't stand it.
Posted by Kev on January 9, 2000, at 12:43:20
In reply to Re: I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by Cindy on January 6, 2000, at 21:47:07
> I have been on Effexor 75ml with Wellbutrin and have recently stopped in order to start on a new AD. The withdrawls I feel are horrible whenever I transition from one AD to another. I feel dizzy, tired, sea sick, and very tearful, which is not like me at all. Does anyone know how to make this transition easier? My psychiatrist says I just have to go through it, and I should be appreciative because now I know it was working. As if I ever felt this sick just being depressed.
> My equalibrium is shaky and I can't stand it.****There's nothing you can do about this, as far as I know. But it goes away, or at least subsides dramatically, after about 3 weeks. I am personally just begin to emerge from a particularly diagreeable w/drawal from Effexor myself. Take heart: things will get better very soon.
Regards,
-Kev
Posted by Cindy W on January 10, 2000, at 9:09:33
In reply to Re: I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by Kev on January 9, 2000, at 12:43:20
> > I have been on Effexor 75ml with Wellbutrin and have recently stopped in order to start on a new AD. The withdrawls I feel are horrible whenever I transition from one AD to another. I feel dizzy, tired, sea sick, and very tearful, which is not like me at all. Does anyone know how to make this transition easier? My psychiatrist says I just have to go through it, and I should be appreciative because now I know it was working. As if I ever felt this sick just being depressed.
> > My equalibrium is shaky and I can't stand it.
>
> ****There's nothing you can do about this, as far as I know. But it goes away, or at least subsides dramatically, after about 3 weeks. I am personally just begin to emerge from a particularly diagreeable w/drawal from Effexor myself. Take heart: things will get better very soon.
>
> Regards,
>
> -KevCindy, why did you stop the Effexor-XR? I'm on it right now and feel it is helping. Hope your change to a new AD gets easier.--Cindy W.
Posted by Cindy on January 10, 2000, at 13:38:30
In reply to Re: I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by Cindy W on January 10, 2000, at 9:09:33
Thanks for your kind input. I'm now on the 8th day without the Effexor and Wellbutrin and feeling better in very small incriments each day. But I'm in the right direction now. I stopped these totry a new AD Reboxetine. Wish me luck and thaks for your posts.
> > ****There's nothing you can do about this, as far as I know. But it goes away, or at least subsides dramatically, after about 3 weeks. I am personally just begin to emerge from a particularly diagreeable w/drawal from Effexor myself. Take heart: things will get better very soon.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > -Kev
>
> Cindy, why did you stop the Effexor-XR? I'm on it right now and feel it is helping. Hope your change to a new AD gets easier.--Cindy W.
Posted by Lew on January 18, 2000, at 8:16:07
In reply to Re: I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by Cindy on January 10, 2000, at 13:38:30
I've been taking Effexor XR for 2 years. Inside the capsule are dozens of tiny white beads. Well, for a long time now I have noticed tiny white beads in my stool. For a long while I didn't think much of it, but I finally put two and two together and realized it was the medication. Is this any cause for concern? Am I still recieving maximum benefit from this drug? Does it have anything to do with the extended release aspect and proper digestion?
Posted by Dani on March 20, 2000, at 7:28:49
In reply to Re: I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by Lew on January 18, 2000, at 8:16:07
I recently stopped using Effexor XR 150/day. Doctor Idiot admitted she did not allow enough time for withdrawal and now I am just too to sick to try anything else yet. I am nauseous constantly, light-headed and dizzy, headachy and my stomach is such a mess, get all gassed up from eating even non-gaseous foods. Living on Maalox and Pepto Bismal. Went thru worse situation from Xanax, but Idiot Doc says "oh it can't be from withdrawal from Effexor". Thanks to folks like you, at least we can learn the real truth. Dani
Posted by Jeff on April 5, 2000, at 17:54:44
In reply to Re: I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by Dani on March 20, 2000, at 7:28:49
> I recently stopped using Effexor XR 150/day. Doctor Idiot admitted she did not allow enough time for withdrawal and now I am just too to sick to try anything else yet. I am nauseous constantly, light-headed and dizzy, headachy and my stomach is such a mess, get all gassed up from eating even non-gaseous foods. Living on Maalox and Pepto Bismal. Went thru worse situation from Xanax, but Idiot Doc says "oh it can't be from withdrawal from Effexor". Thanks to folks like you, at least we can learn the real truth. Dani
Dr. Idiot sounds like Dr. Mengele. (They're all
just experimenting on us.) I can't believe the
miserable withdrawal from Effexor XR 150/day
and I was only on it for 3 months before a full
1-month taper. It's been a week since completely
quitting and the brain shocks and dizziness are
killing me. Luckily I'm between jobs. This is
crazy.
Posted by David on April 6, 2000, at 1:11:20
In reply to Re: I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by Jeff on April 5, 2000, at 17:54:44
> > I recently stopped using Effexor XR 150/day. Doctor Idiot admitted she did not allow enough time for withdrawal and now I am just too to sick to try anything else yet. I am nauseous constantly, light-headed and dizzy, headachy and my stomach is such a mess, get all gassed up from eating even non-gaseous foods. Living on Maalox and Pepto Bismal. Went thru worse situation from Xanax, but Idiot Doc says "oh it can't be from withdrawal from Effexor". Thanks to folks like you, at least we can learn the real truth. Dani
>
> Dr. Idiot sounds like Dr. Mengele. (They're all
> just experimenting on us.) I can't believe the
> miserable withdrawal from Effexor XR 150/day
> and I was only on it for 3 months before a full
> 1-month taper. It's been a week since completely
> quitting and the brain shocks and dizziness are
> killing me. Luckily I'm between jobs. This is
> crazy.I don't have any personal experience withdrawing from Effexor, but I have read suggestions from several people. Some suggest a short regimen of Prozac since it has a half life of several weeks. The long half life eases the tapering off.
Posted by Jennifer on April 25, 2000, at 22:55:06
In reply to Re: I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by Cindy on January 6, 2000, at 21:47:07
>I cannot believe your doctor pulled you off of those drugs without tapering. Some side effects are to be expected, but your sound as though you are not taking any medicine at all right now. Did he taper you off of the dosing?
Posted by bj on April 26, 2000, at 1:31:04
In reply to Re: I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by Jeff on April 5, 2000, at 17:54:44
Two readings anyone on Effexor or anyone considering using Effexor MUST read:
"Prozac Backlash" by Joseph Glenmullen, M.D.
check out "www.washingtonian.com" July 97 issue on antidepressants!
Effexor is VERY POWERFUL AND VERY DANGEROUS AND EXTREMELY DIFFICULT (or impossible?) to get off of!
Posted by Don't we trust our drs? on April 26, 2000, at 18:07:42
In reply to Re: I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by Lew on January 18, 2000, at 8:16:07
What's interesting is that HERE WE ARE -- all of us on Effexor or trying to get off of it -- and instead of asking our doctors -- we are asking EACHOTHER.
It seems whenever one of us asks our doctors, they minimize what we're feeling. Now, that says to me that we feel our doctors are simply NOT telling us the truth.
Any comments on this?
Posted by Cindy W on April 26, 2000, at 21:29:39
In reply to withdrawal, posted by Don't we trust our drs? on April 26, 2000, at 18:07:42
> What's interesting is that HERE WE ARE -- all of us on Effexor or trying to get off of it -- and instead of asking our doctors -- we are asking EACHOTHER.
> It seems whenever one of us asks our doctors, they minimize what we're feeling. Now, that says to me that we feel our doctors are simply NOT telling us the truth.
> Any comments on this?
Don't know about your doctors, but I trust my pdoc. He's been willing to be open about things, and I always take him interesting things from the net too. I think they are telling us the truth, to the best of their ability. Not enough is known about how the AD's work, yet.
Posted by saint james on April 28, 2000, at 16:01:12
In reply to withdrawal, posted by Don't we trust our drs? on April 26, 2000, at 18:07:42
> What's interesting is that HERE WE ARE -- all of us on Effexor or trying to get off of it -- and instead of asking our doctors -- we are asking EACHOTHER.
> It seems whenever one of us asks our doctors, they minimize what we're feeling. Now, that says to me that we feel our doctors are simply NOT telling us the truth.
> Any comments on this?James here....
Yes, I have a comment. EFFEXOR HAS WORKED BETTER THAN ANY AD AND AT PRESENT IS THE ONLY AD THAT WORKS FOR ME AND I HAVE FEW SIDEEFFECTS. I have taken it since 1995.
Anyone can open the PDR and write an article from the "adverse reactions" section on water or asprin that will scare the shit out of the general public.
james
Posted by Cam W. on April 28, 2000, at 18:24:48
In reply to Re: withdrawal, posted by saint james on April 28, 2000, at 16:01:12
> Anyone can open the PDR and write an article from the "adverse reactions" section on water or asprin that will scare the shit out of the general public.
>
> jamesJames - Right on the money, as usual. - Cam W.
Posted by Noa on April 29, 2000, at 11:49:40
In reply to Re: withdrawal - Well said James!, posted by Cam W. on April 28, 2000, at 18:24:48
James, I think the only thing we can be certain of is that mileage may vary. I am glad you chimed in with your experience because it is too bad when one person's bad experience might scare someone off trying some medication that just might turn out to be what would help them.
I saw my pdoc today, and at one point in the discussion he mused that psychopharmocology is a job for masochists, because no matter what, you will usually be wrong about something, as each patient's response to medications is so different.
Posted by bob on May 7, 2000, at 11:25:18
In reply to Re: withdrawal - Well said James!, posted by Noa on April 29, 2000, at 11:49:40
> I saw my pdoc today, and at one point in the discussion he mused that psychopharmocology is a job for masochists, because no matter what, you will usually be wrong about something, as each patient's response to medications is so different.
Well, Noa, good for you he said "masochist" and not "sadist" ...
;^)
bob
Posted by Noa on May 7, 2000, at 12:08:55
In reply to Re: psychofar, er, pharm -- S or M?, posted by bob on May 7, 2000, at 11:25:18
Hi, bob. How ya been?
Posted by bob on May 7, 2000, at 12:38:48
In reply to Re: psychobob, posted by Noa on May 7, 2000, at 12:08:55
> Hi, bob. How ya been?
Hey, that subject line says it all. ;^)
Working. Working. Even more.
BTW, I got that grant I had mentioned a bit back -- problem now is that I actually have to do the (you guessed it) Work. It never ends.
Otherwise, seeing my pdoc tomorrow to hopefully get a boost on my desipramine. According to a handbook I got right next to me, dosing guidelines for desip are twice that of nortrip, but my pdoc started me off at the same # of mgs and I've been backsliding a little. Nothing major, tho.
cheers,
bob
Posted by Jerzy on July 29, 2000, at 0:50:40
In reply to REQUIRED READING --EFFEXOR XR!, posted by bj on April 26, 2000, at 1:31:04
> Two readings anyone on Effexor or anyone considering using Effexor MUST read:
> "Prozac Backlash" by Joseph Glenmullen, M.D.
> check out "www.washingtonian.com" July 97 issue on antidepressants!
> Effexor is VERY POWERFUL AND VERY DANGEROUS AND EXTREMELY DIFFICULT (or impossible?) to get off of!Effexor is a little trickier to get off of than many ADs, in part due to its short half life (especially with the
regular formulation). But it is by no means "impossible" -- I've done it twice, actually.
It didn't feel quite as bad as Zoloft for me (odd, considering the much longer half-life...) Anyway,
the trick is to *taper slowly*: from a maintenance dose of 150mg, I went to 75mg, then to 37.5mg
tablet a day for a couple of weeks, then I would take half a tablet (so 18.75mg) for a while,
then one half-tablet every other day (simply because the withdrawal effects were worse the second day),
then I just rode out the rest with minimal effects. The idea of taking an SSRI with a really long
half-life (i.e. Prozac) seems like a worthwhile option too. Of course, everyone's experience of these
drugs is different, so bear that in mind as well.A word about these drug-bashers like Glenmullen and Peter Breggin: while they are right on when they point out that
North American society is overmedicated, they're also rather alarmist and seem to have lost sight of the notion of
weighing a drug's negative effects vs. its benefits; they also seem to reason that just because there have been a
number of reports of really bad effects (akathisia, cognitve problems, etc.), everyone is *bound* to experience
these effects eventually. In fact, Breggin seems to imply that the majority of psychoactive drugs (ADs, stims,
benzos) are equivalent to chemical lobotomies and will have roughly the same effects as neuroleptics (i.e.
akathisia and tardive dyskinesia) in the long run. Bad science, if you ask me...
Posted by Jerzy on July 29, 2000, at 0:58:45
In reply to Re: I Need Effexor XR Advice!, posted by Jennifer on April 25, 2000, at 22:55:06
I've seen reports of "poop-out" for every SSRI, which worries me because I am currently
taking Celexa. However, I haven't seen any reports of Effexor "poop-out" as such.
There was an earlier posting in this thread about someone experiencing "withdrawal"
symptoms before taking their next dose, which I experienced as well on Effexor. But
this seems to respond to a dose increase, i.e. it looks like a classic tolerance
issue. The "poop-out" phenomenon, however, seems to involve the drug ceasing to have
effects no matter what the dose. This is not classic tolerance...
So, has anyone had the "poop-out" thing with Effexor?
What about poop-out with tricyclics, or other ADs?
Posted by Anna P. on August 2, 2000, at 17:02:18
In reply to effexor poop-out?, posted by Jerzy on July 29, 2000, at 0:58:45
> I've seen reports of "poop-out" for every SSRI, which worries me because I am currently
> taking Celexa. However, I haven't seen any reports of Effexor "poop-out" as such.
> There was an earlier posting in this thread about someone experiencing "withdrawal"
> symptoms before taking their next dose, which I experienced as well on Effexor. But
> this seems to respond to a dose increase, i.e. it looks like a classic tolerance
> issue. The "poop-out" phenomenon, however, seems to involve the drug ceasing to have
> effects no matter what the dose. This is not classic tolerance...
> So, has anyone had the "poop-out" thing with Effexor?
> What about poop-out with tricyclics, or other ADs?Hi Jerzy,
I've experienced the similar phenomenon with Effexor,
tricyclics and Moclobemide, no matter what doze.P.S.
Are you from Poland? Please feel free to e-mail me at Kazimierz.PL@worldnet.att.netAnna P.
Posted by Jerzy on August 5, 2000, at 15:40:47
In reply to Re: effexor poop-out/Jerzy, posted by Anna P. on August 2, 2000, at 17:02:18
> > I've seen reports of "poop-out" for every SSRI, which worries me because I am currently
> > taking Celexa. However, I haven't seen any reports of Effexor "poop-out" as such.
> > There was an earlier posting in this thread about someone experiencing "withdrawal"
> > symptoms before taking their next dose, which I experienced as well on Effexor. But
> > this seems to respond to a dose increase, i.e. it looks like a classic tolerance
> > issue. The "poop-out" phenomenon, however, seems to involve the drug ceasing to have
> > effects no matter what the dose. This is not classic tolerance...
> > So, has anyone had the "poop-out" thing with Effexor?
> > What about poop-out with tricyclics, or other ADs?
>
> Hi Jerzy,
>
> I've experienced the similar phenomenon with Effexor,
> tricyclics and Moclobemide, no matter what doze.Anna: What exactly did you experience? Did you need to regularly
increase your doses (tolerance)? Or did the drugs simply stop
working, no matter what the dose (poop-out)?BTW, I'm half-Polish, on my dad's side :-)
Posted by Anna P. on August 5, 2000, at 16:21:40
In reply to Re: effexor poop-out/Anna, posted by Jerzy on August 5, 2000, at 15:40:47
> > >
> >
> Anna: What exactly did you experience? Did you need to regularly
> increase your doses (tolerance)? Or did the drugs simply stop
> working, no matter what the dose (poop-out)?
>
> BTW, I'm half-Polish, on my dad's side :-)Jerzy: At first, I experience the classic tolerance with Zoloft, and I had to increase the dose to the maximum.
Then, when finally switched to various different AD, they basically stopped working, no matter what the dose. They just worked at the beginning.
As I read, this may be a sign of bipolar II, but I'm not convinced to the end, as I don't have mania.
This is the end of the thread.
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