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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 4 of 4. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Melanie on January 19, 2000, at 14:54:41
I started taking Trazodone (Desyrel) about a month ago for depression with sleep disorder. For years I've had trouble sleeping- I sleep very shallow and wake up at the slightest provocation, then have trouble falling back asleep. I've been chronically tired mentally and physically and have aches and pains all over my body. I have been struggling with depression and anxiety all my life it seems, with occasional panic attacks from PTSD.
I tried all kinds of "natural" medicine but nothing really helped. A friend suggested I try Zoloft.
I went to my doctor and asked him for a trial of Zoloft but he suggested that I first try Trazodone. It has been a Godsend!
It helps me to sleep deeply and I'm sleeping 9-10 hours a night, like my body's catching up on years of missed sleep. I read that it increases the time the body spends in slow wave Delta sleep.
Well, here's the kicker:
I just did some reading about Human Growth Hormone and it's possible connection to Fibromyalgia and Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. It seems that HGH is manufactured in the body during slow wave Delta sleep. Lack of Delta sleep causes a lack of HGH. A deficiency in HGH has the same symptoms as FM and CFS: fatigue, depression, irritability, mental confusion, poor immunity, sensitivity to cold, body aches, sleeplessness, etc...
I am not a doctor and I don't know if this stuff about HGH and sleep is true or not, or if Trazodone would help other people with the same combination of problems, but it sure is intriguing to me.
Since i've been on the Trazodone I'm waking up feeling clear-headed, incredibly refreshed, and not in pain!
It didn't help much with the anxiety/PTSD and Zoloft seems to be helping me a lot with that. Maybe I've found a combination that works.
CFS and FM are such confounding diseases and so often cause depression and anxiety. I just thought someone else might be able to benefit from this.
Any feedback, anyone?
Melanie
Posted by Scott L. Schofield on January 21, 2000, at 11:33:17
In reply to Trazodone for Chronic Fatigue and Fibromyalgia?, posted by Melanie on January 19, 2000, at 14:54:41
> I just did some reading about Human Growth Hormone and it's possible connection to Fibromyalgia and Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. It seems that HGH is manufactured in the body during slow wave Delta sleep. Lack of Delta sleep causes a lack of HGH. A deficiency in HGH has the same symptoms as FM and CFS: fatigue, depression, irritability, mental confusion, poor immunity, sensitivity to cold, body aches, sleeplessness, etc...
> I am not a doctor and I don't know if this stuff about HGH and sleep is true or not, or if Trazodone would help other people with the same combination of problems, but it sure is intriguing to me.
> Since i've been on the Trazodone I'm waking up feeling clear-headed, incredibly refreshed, and not in pain!
> CFS and FM are such confounding diseases and so often cause depression and anxiety. I just thought someone else might be able to benefit from this.
> Any feedback, anyone?
I found your post intriguing as well, so I decided to take a quick trip down the Medline super-highway. I found a very few abstracts involving trazodone and growth hormone (GH).I have known for quite a while that the secretion of growth hormone by the pituitary gland occurs about two hours (?) after the onset of sleep. I didn't know that it was a function of the phases of sleep architecture. As a former bodybuilder, I was particularly interested to learn how to maximize, or at least prevent the inhibition of, the release of growth hormone. Besides "growing" muscles, it is also lipolytic. It burns fat. I thought that this was pretty neat.
mCPP (m-Chlorophenylpiperazine)is a metabolite of trazodone. If one is taking trazodone, he will have some mCCP floating around.
mCPP stimulates the release of GH. Perhaps this increase in GH is additive or synergistic to that which occurs naturally.I think...
GH is actually comprised of two hormones - somatotropin and somatostatin. Somatotropin is the one responsible for muscle growth and the burning of fat. Somatostatin, on the other hand, is targeted for skeletal soft tissues, including ligaments and tendons. Perhaps a trazodone-induced (via mCCP) increase in GH is the cause of your relief from the pain of fibromyalgia.
Thanks for your post.
- Scott- Scott
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Int Clin Psychopharmacol 1994 Sep;9(3):173-8The effects of administration of mCPP on psychological, cognitive, cardiovascular, hormonal and MHPG measurements in human volunteers.
Silverstone PH, Rue JE, Franklin M, Hallis K, Camplin G, Laver D, Cowen PJ
MRC Unit of Clinical Pharmacology, Littlemore Hospital, Oxford, UK.m-Chlorophenylpiperazine (mCPP) is a metabolite of the antidepressant trazodone which has been widely used in psychopharmacology research as a probe of serotonin (5-hydroxytryptamine; 5-HT) function. However, in addition to binding at 5-HT receptors it also binds strongly to alpha 2-adrenoceptors, and it is conceivable that some of the physical and psychological symptoms previously reported following mCPP infusion are due to effects upon central noradrenergic neurotransmitter function. In this double-blind placebo-controlled balanced-crossover study in 12 healthy male volunteers we have examined the effects of infusion of mCPP (0.08 mg/kg over 2 min) on symptoms of anxiety, cognitive performance, pulse and blood pressure, and plasma concentrations of adrenocorticotrophic hormone (ACTH), cortisol, prolactin, growth hormone, and the noradrenaline metabolite 3-methoxy-4-hydroxyphenyl glycerol (MHPG). The results confirm previous findings that in humans mCPP causes significant increases in the symptoms of anxiety, and in the plasma concentrations of cortisol, prolactin and growth hormone. In addition, our results demonstrate that mCPP causes no significant changes in cognitive performance, in pulse or systolic blood pressure, or in the plasma concentration of MHPG. Since pulse, systolic blood pressure and MHPG plasma concentrations all to some degree reflect central noradrenergic activity, we believe it unlikely that the psychological and hormonal effects of mCPP are due primarily to effects on noradrenergic neurotransmission. Further studies to address this specific issue are needed, however, before firm conclusions can be reached.
Posted by Sigolene on January 22, 2000, at 2:44:04
In reply to Trazodone for Chronic Fatigue and Fibromyalgia?, posted by Melanie on January 19, 2000, at 14:54:41
Could you tell me when you take Desyrel, if you are tired and feeling like going back to sleep the whole day, because it's a very sedating med.
I woudl like to try it for my depression and sleeping problem, but i'm afraid i won't be able to work properly the following day. And did you have agitation in the legs at the beginning?
Posted by anna on January 25, 2000, at 19:05:48
In reply to Re: Trazodone for Chronic Fatigue and Fibromyalgia?, posted by Sigolene on January 22, 2000, at 2:44:04
> Could you tell me when you take Desyrel, if you are tired and feeling like going back to sleep the whole day, because it's a very sedating med.
> I woudl like to try it for my depression and sleeping problem, but i'm afraid i won't be able to work properly the following day. And did you have agitation in the legs at the beginning?I have taken both Zoloft in the am and desyrel in the pm for sleep for years. I doubt I could take the desyrl during the day due to the sedation. However, it took me a bit to get the right dose of desyrl--such that I could sleep but could also get up!!! This changES depending on how much zoloft I am on--I just went down a bit and also cut back the desyl when I found I was too sedated in the am. I use a pill cutter--I take 3/4 of a pill now....I found a little change in the desyl can make big differences.
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