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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 34. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 10:28:00
In a session I had recently, (bear with me, this has gotten long) something rather amazing happened. We had been talking about how my "greatest fear" is that I will reach out to others for assistance, support, comfort, etc., and be rejected. I have this fear for good reason, I said, and he agreed. At any rate, a few moments later, when I was still crying (as usual...gosh, I hate getting all snotty in front of someone else!), I said, "Now you look bored."
I proceeded to babble on a bit (pardon the pun)about how "he must be tired of seeing me cry all the time"--"I know I would be"--"well, maybe I wouldn't, I don't know". I was getting all flustered.
First he said very seriously with strong eye contact, "If boredom is present, it means that the good stuff is being repressed. But if someone is pouring their heart out, giving you the privilege of hearing their deepest fears and vulnerabilities, and you are BORED??" He kind of left that hanging, but then went on to tell me that he indeed had noticed his attention begin to wander at the same time I said he looked bored. He interpreted what happened as a re-enactment of me asking for support (via talking about my stuff and needing comfort) and him "rejecting me" by having his attention wander. We had earlier been talking about how my parents were never ones who comforted or soothed, and I had been thinking about this recently when I was sitting up Sunday night watching the radar and worrying about the hurricane (from the Midwest, for Pete's sake). At any rate, it would have been nice to have someone hold me and say that everything's going to be okay. (Of course it's not okay, but that's a different matter).
I was very surprised that I mentioned him looking bored. I've had that thought a couple of other times in the last two years, but I've never mentioned it in the moment like that. I don't know what "possessed me". He said it was an authentic moment. I mentioned that there was no way I could ever or could have ever said something like that to my father, and I certainly would not have received such a caring and thoughtful response. I thanked him for that repsonse, and it was just all warm and nice and safe.
I want to take that moment and the feeling and tuck it away somewhere so that I can have it again when I need it.
I'm trying to think of what the next session was like, but it's escaping me at the moment. But that warm feeling towards him remained. And I also was feeling less anxious and was not dwelling on a future loss of the relationship, which was nice.
Just had to share that.
gg
Posted by Shortelise on September 3, 2005, at 13:36:49
In reply to One of those therapy moments...kinda long, posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 10:28:00
Yes, indeed, that was "one of those therapy moments" wasn't it! You write about it so well, so clearly. Thanks
ShortE
Posted by fallsfall on September 3, 2005, at 13:56:05
In reply to One of those therapy moments...kinda long, posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 10:28:00
Hold on to that moment. It will help you through some bad spot in the future.
Don't you wish you could bottle it? We could make a fortune if we could bottle that feeling and sell it! But then it wouldn't be so special, and so it might not be worth much. Never mind.
I'm so glad you had such a nice moment.
Posted by madeline on September 3, 2005, at 17:30:23
In reply to One of those therapy moments...kinda long, posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 10:28:00
I love those moments too. It is so nice to be heard, you know really really heard.
That is the therapy in therapy I think. It shows us how relationships can be.
Posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 21:06:41
In reply to Re: One of those therapy moments...kinda long, posted by madeline on September 3, 2005, at 17:30:23
> I love those moments too. It is so nice to be heard, you know really really heard.
>
> That is the therapy in therapy I think. It shows us how relationships can be.Exactly! Well put, thanks.
gg
>
Posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 21:07:31
In reply to Re: One of those therapy moments...kinda long » gardenergirl, posted by Shortelise on September 3, 2005, at 13:36:49
Thanks shortE,
I bet you've had a number of those moments.How are you doing with your transition?
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 21:08:35
In reply to Re: One of those therapy moments...kinda long » gardenergirl, posted by fallsfall on September 3, 2005, at 13:56:05
Hmmm, we could bottle it and sell it as Therapy No. 5. You know, really highlight the value?
:)You're right about holding onto that feeling, though. I need to tuck it under my pillow.
:)
gg
Posted by fairywings on September 3, 2005, at 21:16:15
In reply to Re: One of those therapy moments...kinda long » fallsfall, posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 21:08:35
You're really good at doing therapy gg, you're so honest, open, and sincere. You have a good T, and I appreciate hearing that you have your struggles right along with the rest of us and aren't afraid to admit them. You're such a wonderful person, and will be the best T.
fw
Posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 23:03:06
In reply to Re: One of those therapy moments...kinda long, posted by fairywings on September 3, 2005, at 21:16:15
Awww, something else I want to hug tight.
Thanks, sweetie.
gg
Posted by fairywings on September 4, 2005, at 12:45:29
In reply to Re: One of those therapy moments...kinda long » fairywings, posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 23:03:06
Posted by alexandra_k on September 4, 2005, at 16:55:14
In reply to One of those therapy moments...kinda long, posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 10:28:00
I love those therapy moments too :-)
And sometimes you get them in life in general. Things just seem to click into place.
I love those too :-)
Posted by daisym on September 4, 2005, at 19:23:40
In reply to One of those therapy moments...kinda long, posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 10:28:00
Thank you for sharing your special moment, GG. It is nice to hear about those things when they seem so few and far between for me right now.
I think you are doing incredible work and your therapist just sounds amazing. I'm so glad you get to work with him. I hope you can wrap up that warm fuzzy feeling and tuck it away. We should have a Babble vault for those moments. :)
Hugs from me,
Daisy
Posted by Dinah on September 4, 2005, at 19:25:30
In reply to One of those therapy moments...kinda long, posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 10:28:00
What a wonderful moment. Therapeutic honesty. I'm glad you shared it.
Posted by 64bowtie on September 5, 2005, at 14:48:54
In reply to One of those therapy moments...kinda long, posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 10:28:00
GG, Again, thanks for the honest clarity...
> And I also was feeling less anxious and was not dwelling on a future loss of the relationship, which was nice.
><<< I wonder how any single session could be the end of the relationship... Yet thats the scenario that plays out for you in the background for most sessions, as you stated... Are you holding onto a 'family-of-origin' notion that everything happens 'right now', such that life is a series events, each followed by boredom...? What I am relating is known as the 'event-driven-life'... It is entrapping to children and suffocating to adults (that continue to hold on long after childhood)... I am certain you could write a thesis on how therapy is a process and not just a series of events, yet your rhetoric belys that you might still have doubts when it comes to therapy you hold precious; yours... I am only asking... And I am suggesting you try folding my thoughts in, to answer your outreach to us about your own internal longings... Whatever answers you discover, will always be yours! We all just like to help a little, to ease the process for you...
Rod
Posted by gardenergirl on September 5, 2005, at 20:46:41
In reply to Does session=event for you? » gardenergirl, posted by 64bowtie on September 5, 2005, at 14:48:54
>
> <<< I wonder how any single session could be the end of the relationship... Yet thats the scenario that plays out for you in the background for most sessions, as you stated...Rod, I'm not sure from where you are pulling your inferences, but maybe it's because I posted about a single session? I have every faith that eventual termination will be a process and will be planned. I don't go into each session worrying, even in the background, that this session might be my last.
I'm not familiar with the construct you are describing, and I'm afraid that I don't really uderstand much of your post. I can sense that you are wishing me well in my process, and for that I thank you.
gg
Posted by 64bowtie on September 6, 2005, at 3:00:06
In reply to Re: Does session=event for you? » 64bowtie, posted by gardenergirl on September 5, 2005, at 20:46:41
...out of your ending comment:
> And I also was feeling less anxious and was not dwelling on a future loss of the relationship, which was nice.
><<< ...which I took to mean that, "It was nice for a change not to be anxious and not to be dwelling on a future loss of the relationship"... But guess that's not what it sounds like when you say:
> I don't go into each session worrying, even in the background, that this session might be my last.
><<< Like I said, I was only asking... From my experience, there is a common thread here... If you are certain that your childhood was not 'event driven', and that you have no blind spot for any such hanging over from that childhood, then lets go on...
Rod
Posted by terrics on September 6, 2005, at 7:29:43
In reply to One of those therapy moments...kinda long, posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 10:28:00
Hi gg, Your experience seems so 'real',like at that moment you connected with your T. Do think this connection will strenghten your relationship and your ability to talk freely with him? P.S. Are you still persuing your career? terrics
Posted by JenStar on September 6, 2005, at 11:52:11
In reply to One of those therapy moments...kinda long, posted by gardenergirl on September 3, 2005, at 10:28:00
hi gg,
thanks for sharing such a difficult and important moment in therapy. :)I'm still a bit confused by his response. Did he admit he WAS bored, and say that it was your fault for not talking about interesting-enough things?
Or did he imply that you and he were subconsciously playing the roles of you-as-a-child and the father figure, and he was imititating the father figure and being inaccessible for comfort?
In any case, I'm glad he gave you a response that was not fake, and I'm glad you got a warm feeling about it.
I also think it shows that you can and should trust your instincts about other people and their reactions. You sensed his attention was wandering; he confirmed it. That means that your observational skills are good -- trust them! :)
JenStar
Posted by gardenergirl on September 8, 2005, at 22:51:10
In reply to Re: One of those therapy moments...kinda long » gardenergirl, posted by alexandra_k on September 4, 2005, at 16:55:14
> I love those therapy moments too :-)
>
> And sometimes you get them in life in general. Things just seem to click into place.
>
> I love those too :-)Yeah, real life ones are pretty awesome, too.
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on September 8, 2005, at 22:54:04
In reply to Re: One of those therapy moments...kinda long » gardenergirl, posted by daisym on September 4, 2005, at 19:23:40
> Thank you for sharing your special moment, GG. It is nice to hear about those things when they seem so few and far between for me right now.
I'm sorry you've been missing them. Hopefully there is a whole mass of them just around the corner.
>
> I think you are doing incredible work and your therapist just sounds amazing. I'm so glad you get to work with him. I hope you can wrap up that warm fuzzy feeling and tuck it away. We should have a Babble vault for those moments. :)Thanks, I think he's pretty great, too.
> Hugs from me,
And back to you. :)
gg
> Daisy
Posted by gardenergirl on September 8, 2005, at 22:55:08
In reply to Re: One of those therapy moments...kinda long » gardenergirl, posted by Dinah on September 4, 2005, at 19:25:30
Thanks.
I like how you call it therapeutic honesty. That's pretty much how I characterized it when we talked about this past session. :)
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on September 8, 2005, at 23:04:23
In reply to I guess I got way toooo much information » gardenergirl, posted by 64bowtie on September 6, 2005, at 3:00:06
> ...out of your ending comment:
> > And I also was feeling less anxious and was not dwelling on a future loss of the relationship, which was nice.
> >
>
> <<< ...which I took to mean that, "It was nice for a change not to be anxious and not to be dwelling on a future loss of the relationship"...That's true, but I'm thinking ahead in the process, and when I do think about eventual termination, I feel sad.
>
> <<< Like I said, I was only asking... From my experience, there is a common thread here... If you are certain that your childhood was not 'event driven', and that you have no blind spot for any such hanging over from that childhood, then lets go on...Well, not knowing the construct, I really have no way of being certain if what you are talking about matches my experience.
Could you explain further or perhaps provide examples?
gg
>
> Rod
Posted by gardenergirl on September 8, 2005, at 23:13:27
In reply to Re: One of those therapy moments...kinda long » gardenergirl, posted by terrics on September 6, 2005, at 7:29:43
> Hi gg, Your experience seems so 'real',like at that moment you connected with your T. Do think this connection will strenghten your relationship and your ability to talk freely with him?
Hi terrics. Yes, it did feel very real, very honest, and very much like mutual respect. I do think it helps, because I know that it's okay to ask him something that might look like I am upset with him about something.
Although, in my session this week, I was just at such a loss for what to talk about. This is very very weird for me. Usually I can eventually get started with something. I could just feel myself sit there, not knowing what to say and feeling kind of flat and disconnected.
I finally laughed and asked him what he wanted to talk about. For once he actually answered. I had described how I was feeling a twinge of sadness "aroudn the edges", but the edges of WHAT, I didn't know. He suggested that perahps there was something "right here" (meaning in the room between us) to talk about. And after more spinning around talking about a jumble of things that didn't really make sense to me, I finally came out with telling him how I long to be held physically by someone who I feel so comfortable with emotionally. Namely, someone like him.
I laughed, though, because I had my gym shoes on that day, which I never wear. I called them my "runaway shoes" since I must have "known" I was going to approach a "runaway" topic. :)
So at any rate, he seemed to understand what I was saying, and I was so surprised this came out of my mouth. So I must have at least felt like it was okay to say this to him, and I could trust that I'd get an honest answer. Of course it was nearly the end of the session, so I didn't get much of a response other than him seeming to understand.
P.S. Are you still persuing your career?
Yep! Hopefully I'm entering the home stretch! Thanks for asking.
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on September 8, 2005, at 23:22:48
In reply to Re: One of those therapy moments...kinda long » gardenergirl, posted by JenStar on September 6, 2005, at 11:52:11
> hi gg,
> thanks for sharing such a difficult and important moment in therapy. :)Thanks.
>
> I'm still a bit confused by his response. Did he admit he WAS bored, and say that it was your fault for not talking about interesting-enough things?No, that's not what he was saying. He admitted his attention had just wandered, and that wandering caught his attention at the same time I commented on it. I think what he meant by saying "if boredom is present than the more interesting stuff is being repressed" was that it's perhaps kind of diagnostic for a therapist to realize they might be feeling bored. They can ask themselves what's going on or NOT going on that they are not their usual attentive self. And if something's repressed, I don't think he views that as the client's "fault". I think he views it as a defense mechanism--something that prevents the "good stuff"...meaning the meatier,more important stuff (?) from being expressed. I suppose in my update post to terrics, I was repressing the longing for being held, and that's why I was just sort of spinning around topics and not really feeling like anything was taking hold. I was unconsciously avoiding what was the most anxiety-provoking...risking telling him my longings and perhaps feeling rejected.
>
> Or did he imply that you and he were subconsciously playing the roles of you-as-a-child and the father figure, and he was imititating the father figure and being inaccessible for comfort?Yes, I think that's what he meant, although he was not consciously playing that role. We just somehow fell into it. I have to admit, I have a hard time explaining and even understanding exactly HOW this can happen. I suppose it comes from my telling him about stuff that showed him my deep fear of rejection and the neglectful responses (or non-responses) I would get from my parents. So for whatever reason, maybe because we had been talking about how I seem to ask for or wish for guidance and reassurance a lot, what usually happened in childhood between me and my parents happened in the room. I suppose you could say I projected enough onto him to lead him to act the same way. And then his response and our relationship allowed me to experience that differently, and better than it was in childhood. A healing moment. :)
???? shrugs At least I think that's it.
>
>
> I also think it shows that you can and should trust your instincts about other people and their reactions. You sensed his attention was wandering; he confirmed it. That means that your observational skills are good -- trust them! :)Thanks! I didn't think of that. :)
gg
>
Posted by fairywings on September 9, 2005, at 8:19:53
In reply to projection and boredom » JenStar, posted by gardenergirl on September 8, 2005, at 23:22:48
> > I'm still a bit confused by his response. Did he admit he WAS bored, and say that it was your fault for not talking about interesting-enough things?
>
> No, that's not what he was saying. He admitted his attention had just wandered, . I think what he meant by saying "if boredom is present than the more interesting stuff is being repressed" was that it's perhaps kind of diagnostic for a therapist to realize they might be feeling bored. They can ask themselves what's going on or NOT going on that they are not their usual attentive self. And if something's repressed, I don't think he views that as the client's "fault".I was confused by this too. That's really interesting. I wonder if all T's would think if they were bored the client's repressing feelings? Or if some would think that if they're bored, "gee, this person sure is boring!" LOL Seemed like my last T couldn't wait to get to the end of 40 minutes! This one actually makes me feel like what I have to say is important, and goes over, which is his normal style.
So, did you take a risk and tell him your longings and that you were feeling rejected? That would sure feel like a leap to me! Whew! I can see how, if you have a stable, even tempered, normal therapist, who is logical and rational, and always "there for you", that you can try to make them into the parent you never had and always wished you had. That's seems like a pretty normal thing to do unconsciously, and before you know it, it could be consuming for at least one person.
So did you and your T get that worked out gg? Is he back to being T, and you're back to being comfortable with him in the T role, and not the father/parent role? I sure would like a mom/dad, but I'm too old for that! ; )
fw
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