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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Joslynn on January 15, 2004, at 13:29:09
In reply to a long link, will it work?, posted by Joslynn on January 15, 2004, at 13:24:46
The previous link was from a college psychology course I am guessing? Looked like it.
Now, here is a link from a legal standpoint, not that you are off to court or anything, just to show you what can get therps in trouble http://kspope.com/ethics/malpractice.php
Posted by Joslynn on January 15, 2004, at 13:49:57
In reply to Re: a long link, will it work?, posted by Joslynn on January 15, 2004, at 13:29:09
Two more links, and then I better get back to work!
This is about doctors, not therps, but go to the "Verbal Behavior" paragraph, and it explains what I have been trying to say. http://216.239.39.104/search?q=cache:eyTpONRdrhkJ:www.bmp.state.mn.us/Newsletters/fall97.pdf+%22boundary+violations%22+%22inappropriate+self-disclosure%22+%22boundary+violations%22&hl=en&ie=UTF-8
Another link. Scroll down to Avoid sexual misconduct, the "Client signs" and "Therapist signs" sections. http://cmhs.utoledo.edu/npiazza/Courses/Orientation/Dual.htm
Posted by crushedout on January 15, 2004, at 14:09:18
In reply to Re: a long link, will it work?, posted by Joslynn on January 15, 2004, at 13:29:09
Posted by pinkeye on January 15, 2004, at 14:14:56
In reply to Re: Ummm uh oh? » Karen_kay, posted by Dinah on January 15, 2004, at 12:59:39
I think your therapist did the right thing. But I don't know if that falls under guidelines (the fact that he mentioned that he masturbates to you).
Btw, what is the standard guideline for sexual contact between a therapist and a client? How long after termination is that acceptable?
Posted by All Done on January 15, 2004, at 14:29:44
In reply to Re: Are we all cookies? (long) » All Done, posted by DaisyM on January 15, 2004, at 1:22:21
> I told my Therapist that if they ended up in therapy at 40, I want them to talk about their DAD, not me! LOL
That's so funny! I said almost the same thing to my therapist when he made the comment he did. I told him I'll just let my husband screw our son up instead. Right, like I'm not going to take full responsibility for everything that happens to my kid. Well, I should say for all of the *bad* things that happen, but I suppose that's a topic for another day...
Posted by Penny on January 15, 2004, at 14:32:38
In reply to Re: Ummm uh oh?, posted by pinkeye on January 15, 2004, at 14:14:56
> Btw, what is the standard guideline for sexual contact between a therapist and a client? How long after termination is that acceptable?
The APA says 2 years I think (I think it's in one of the articles Joslynn linked to), but some groups say never. Never is the safe standard - sexual contact even with a former client could end a therapist's career, if a lawsuit should arise or something of that nature. And I can't see how it could ever be truly mentally or emotionally healthy for the former client. I guess there are always exceptions to the rules, but IMO, too many chances...
P
Posted by All Done on January 15, 2004, at 14:33:46
In reply to Re: Are we all cookies? (long), posted by All Done on January 15, 2004, at 14:29:44
Posted by All Done on January 15, 2004, at 14:42:35
In reply to Re: Are we all cookies? (long) » All Done, posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 7:33:04
> I just appreciate the fact that he doesn't always ask, "Why do you want to know the answer to that questin, ect." when we've been working together and it's fairly obvious.I hate that kind of response, too. But I know it's probably good for me most of the time. *sigh*
> I sometimes wonder if when I have children, if I'll cause themto be in therapy. I only hope if they are that they'll have a good therapist and they don't ask their therapist the type of questions I do. I'd have to punish them, regardless of age!I like your thinking. If you don't mind, I'm going to borrow it. If my son needs therapy, I will just hope he has a therapist as good as mine. And I hope he'll be brave enough to make the therapy work for him by asking the kinds of questions you do (don't sell yourself short). I've only been going for seven months, but I truly believe this is a turning point in my life and someday, maybe my son will be able to use therapy as a life changing/enhancing tool as well. But I digress...
Karen, we can only hope you procreate! You must pass down your fantastic sense of humor and of course your fabulous sense of style and good looks! : )
Posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 14:47:32
In reply to Re: Ummm uh oh?, posted by pinkeye on January 15, 2004, at 14:14:56
He DID NOT say that he ever fantasized about me. He said that he has fantasized about clients, now that could mean past clients. I didn't feel like getting into great detail, as I felt I was prying (as well as other women he has been with and other people as well). He NEVER ONCE mentioned me. NEVER EVER EVER mentioned, made reference hinted at, looked lovingly into my eyes, ect ect, you get the hint....
I'm sorry... One could say that maybe he does or doesn't. One could say that he thinks about my mom on occassion to. Come to think of it, I mentiojned how beautiful my sister is and he asked if I had a picture. One could say that when I bring in a picture of my sister next week, he may have fantasies about me AND my sister. However, I doubt that highly! (And the reference to my sister is too much!! We were actually talking about how I believe she was abused, and I have a knack for bringing in pictures of my family...) I just had to bring that example up...
Posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 15:01:34
In reply to a link, posted by Joslynn on January 15, 2004, at 13:17:49
Ok, I know (or am fairly certain) that the reason for disclosing the one petty and one rather serious arguments were somewhat relative to therapy. One that he constantly gets into with her is the fact that when he does something forgettful or silly like leaving the lid off the peanut butter, and she busts him, he lies about it. Now, I wonder what that had to do with in the first place. And he told me another story, but he wasn't going to but he started to and stopped. And of course I wouldn't have it. But, it related to how stopping negative thoughts and calming yourself down can change a situation. I guess his wife went out shopping with her mother and he was supposed to meet her but he couldn't find his car keys and his child took his diaper off and went #2 on the carpet (ICK!) and so he couldn't meet his wife and she kept calling to find out why he wasn't there, but he changed his thoughts,ect and she got take out and they lived happily ever after. And I also know about a rather big fight they had where his wife was griping about him not helping with the children while he was studying for his big test (?? anyone know what test??) and he got mad and stormed out.. I can't remember how that related but I'm sure it did. He doesn't just tell me these things because I say, "How's your week been?" or anything, but hmmm....
Our relationship is really headed in the right direction. So, I don't see that it is interfering with therapy if he is overdisclosing on occassion... And it helps to fill up the dead air sometimes.
Posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 15:12:28
In reply to Re: Are we all cookies? (long) » Karen_kay, posted by All Done on January 15, 2004, at 14:42:35
Sorry Elle and Miss Honey, you've been officially bumped in rank. If you don't know why, see this post :) By the way All Done, we're planning a sleep over in DC, wanna go? Gonna be lots'o fun!
Oh, and did you mention something about a son?I want a therapist with a motto similar to Radio Shack, "You've got questions, We've got answers!" I was also talking to my therapist about how I tend to be passive agressive towards my friends and promise them things (clothes, visits, ect) and dont' always come through if they slight me. He said that your word is all you have. I said, "When I die and God judges me, I want him to say "Now Karen, you didn't always keep your word, but while you were on Earth, you were one hell of an entertainer and for that I'm granting you a spot in heaven. Come on down!" We both got a kick out of that one and that's how I feel. I'm not good at keeping my word and I'm quick to promises things that I try to deliver. But I'm pretty good at entertaining people. I should try harder to stick to what I'm good at...
So, about your son....
Posted by All Done on January 15, 2004, at 15:31:33
In reply to AllDone's my fav :) » All Done, posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 15:12:28
> Sorry Elle and Miss Honey, you've been officially bumped in rank. If you don't know why, see this post :) By the way All Done, we're planning a sleep over in DC, wanna go? Gonna be lots'o fun!
> Oh, and did you mention something about a son?
>
> I want a therapist with a motto similar to Radio Shack, "You've got questions, We've got answers!" I was also talking to my therapist about how I tend to be passive agressive towards my friends and promise them things (clothes, visits, ect) and dont' always come through if they slight me. He said that your word is all you have. I said, "When I die and God judges me, I want him to say "Now Karen, you didn't always keep your word, but while you were on Earth, you were one hell of an entertainer and for that I'm granting you a spot in heaven. Come on down!" We both got a kick out of that one and that's how I feel. I'm not good at keeping my word and I'm quick to promises things that I try to deliver. But I'm pretty good at entertaining people. I should try harder to stick to what I'm good at...
>
> So, about your son....Wow Karen! I would love to join you guys and I'm glad I'm your "fav", but I like Miss Honey and Elle a lot, too. So don't make them sad : (. But if you're wanting me to bring my son (I think that's what your wanting - correct me if I'm wrong), I must alert you to the fact that he's only 19.
MONTHS!
Although he did get a marriage proposal from one of his daycare teachers the other day. She said she's going to marry him 18 years from now. Hmm...I wasn't quite sure if I should accept for him or not. ; )
Posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 15:32:21
In reply to two more links, posted by Joslynn on January 15, 2004, at 13:49:57
Darn you and your stupid links.....
Ok, so there are two things that were said during that session that I just kinda let go.
Number one. In my dream about him he referred to a vineyard, whcih didn't apply to me, which could because the town that I used to live in had a winery that shared my last name. He doesn't know this and I said that. He said that in my dream my illusion of him being my father figure and also my crush is dying. He said that the vineyard could represent the crush as in "Let's go get drunk and have sex." (not as in an offer, just that was his explanation) We went on to describe the second part of the dream.
Also, I think everyone knows that I have anxiety and I have "issues" with changing my clothes several times a day, ect. The more anxiety I have, the more effort I put in to looking nice. I had to reschedule early in the morning next week and he said, "Well, you don't have to get all dressed up just for me." This isn't so strange, as I have gotten all dressed up for him in the past. That particular day however, I looked nice because I was anxious about the session. It jsut bugged me.... Now I'm thinking to much into little stuff I think. Someone needs to do a ride along with me next week. Any takers?
Posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 15:51:11
In reply to Re: Ummm uh oh? » Karen_kay, posted by Penny on January 15, 2004, at 12:47:54
Penny,
It will be a year in February. And he's only been doing it for maybe a few years. Not long. He admits he's new at this. And he admits he makes mistakes. And I'm quick to point them out when I feel he's done something wrong. But, I honestly don't think he has in this case. Maybe I will approach the subject again jsut to let him know he shouldn't tell anyone else that sort of information. That isn't something you want getting out you know. He admits that he learns a lot from working with me. I only wonder if that's a good thing or bad? :(
Posted by Dinah on January 15, 2004, at 18:45:04
In reply to a link, posted by Joslynn on January 15, 2004, at 13:17:49
I liked the first link. I think my therapist would fare very well under it.
But some of the legal links bothered me quite a bit. If a therapist is going to go around terminating clients because they have feelings for them because they're afraid of being sued, they just shouldn't be in the helping professions. The therapist/client relationship shouldn't be an adversarial one, and the lawyers will make it into that if you let them. I would be enormously disappointed in my therapist if he behaved in a manner harmful to a client for fear of being sued.
There's very little more harmful to a client than abandonment. And abandonment for expressing your feelings is cruel beyond measure.
(But I would like to sit on my therapist's lap sometimes, and have him smooth my hair back. Nothing sexual and not that he or I would ever act on it, but wouldn't it be soothing?)
Posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 18:47:30
In reply to stupid links..., posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 15:32:21
I'm just upset to find my therapist fit the description... Also, there is another thing I remember that he said that bothers me and I just remembered it. I mentioned that I recently found out that my boyfriend opposes same sex marriages, and my therapist said, "Why does he have something against anal sex?" And of course in that situation I overdisclosed, but it led to a discussion on prolife/prochoice (where he asked if I were to become pregnant and possibly considered an abortion what would my boyfriend think and I said, "It wouldn't be his decision. It is my body and choice." He gave me a thumbs up for that.) But looking back I'm a little shaky about his joke...It would have been acceptable for me to have made such a comment, but I now realize I not there to listen to his innapropriate jokes. He's there to listen to mine. (insert half smile)
Posted by Penny on January 15, 2004, at 19:05:21
In reply to Re: Ummm uh oh? » Penny, posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 15:51:11
At 29 he would have to be new at it, if he has a Ph.D. in psychology. Those are typically long programs!
And I'm sure all therapists, no matter how much experience they have, make mistakes. Our discussions on this board are evidence of that!
And truly, Karen, it sounds like he really wants to do a good job as a therapist. But, to me, he needs a little guidance, hence the supervision idea. I think most/all therapists, no, I'll just say all therapists should occasionally undergo supervision of some sort. Because it's a tough profession. And it's intended to protect his clients and himself. Being so new at this, I would hope he is already being mentored or supervised by someone in a way, but if not, he really should consider it (IMO).
I think it's great that he's such a good fit with you, and I would imagine that he isn't so frank with his clients who aren't as laid-back as you are, but if he is, he's really opening himself to a lawsuit.
Anyway...I hope this came across the way I meant it! It's so hard to tell when writing.
P
Posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 19:09:19
In reply to Re: a link » Joslynn, posted by Dinah on January 15, 2004, at 18:45:04
(But I would like to sit on my therapist's lap sometimes, and have him smooth my hair back. Nothing sexual and not that he or I would ever act on it, but wouldn't it be soothing?)
**Umm, no. I can honestly say I don't even find the thought of this soothing. I can't get past the sexual thought that is associated with sitting on a member of the opposite sex's lap though. I could say that him holding me and smoothing my hair back would be soothing, until I look up and he kisses me...... Darn it....
Posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 19:29:08
In reply to Re: Ummm uh oh? » Karen_kay, posted by Penny on January 15, 2004, at 19:05:21
I think it came across just swell! :) And I'm fairly certain he seeks supervision of some sort. On my way out of the session this week, I made the comment, "I'd like to speak to your supervisor. Of course it would only be to tell him/her what an excellent job you're doing." And he made the comment that, "No news is good news in that department." He's the youngest therapist in the building, so I highly doubt they would throw him out there to the wolves. (me being a wolf :)
Posted by Dinah on January 15, 2004, at 19:35:49
In reply to Re: a link » Dinah, posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 19:09:19
He's the opposite sex??!!! :-O
I think of him as a mommy.
Posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 19:57:36
In reply to Re: a link » Karen_kay, posted by Dinah on January 15, 2004, at 19:35:49
Of course your therapist isn't the opposite sex. Your therapist doesn't have a gender. I was only referring to other therapists. Now, if I ever in the future make the mistake of calling your therapist a man, please forgive me. I tend to forget that sometimes there are gender neutral therapists out there and you happen to see one of them.
Posted by Dinah on January 15, 2004, at 19:58:58
In reply to Darn it, I'm Sorry Dinah :(, posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 19:57:36
Posted by Dinah on January 15, 2004, at 19:59:36
In reply to Darn it, I'm Sorry Dinah :(, posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 19:57:36
Did I tell you I found out in one of my dreams that he was a eunuch?
Posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 20:10:12
In reply to Re: Darn it, I'm Sorry Dinah :( » Karen_kay, posted by Dinah on January 15, 2004, at 19:59:36
Posted by Dinah on January 15, 2004, at 20:12:44
In reply to He was what? (nm) » Dinah, posted by Karen_kay on January 15, 2004, at 20:10:12
I had called him a few times that week on unrelated matters and had added a quarter hour to his fee. He wanted to refuse but I told him it was the least I could do since I had castrated him in my dreams (well, I didn't - he just was).
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