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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by garnet71 on March 29, 2009, at 23:36:32
I always hear it's because of the sugar content, yet I don't understand how fruit can be harmful to one's health.
My son and I have been drinking a lot of fruit smoothies; I add greens to them too, like kale, parsely, cilantro-but not everyday 'cause my son always begs me to make the ones without green stuff in them, though he'll drink the green ones sometimes. It's hard for me to eat breakfast, but these work.
I'll mix up the fruits to mix up the vitamins and antioxidants-like I'll take a ripened banana (to sweeten), pear, frozen mixed berries, a kiwi, and some frozen papaya. Or apples, pinapple, frozen strawberries, etc. Usually have to add some orange juice or milk, water works too if out of those.
Just think of all the vitamins and good stuff in these..Then I read all the time that fruits should be limited in diet.
???
Posted by 10derHeart on March 30, 2009, at 0:35:22
In reply to How can fruit be bad for you?, posted by garnet71 on March 29, 2009, at 23:36:32
Funny you should post this as my PCP (want to write PCM so badly - military-specific acronyms die hard! lol) and I just talked about this 2 weeks ago.
I can only think of 2 reasons: worry about weight gain and/or difficulty losing due to straight math >>> i.e., excess calories in, not enough exercise. It's so easy to consume a lot of daily calories with fruit as fructose delivers quite a few, but in a good way with other nutrients and fiber, too. The other concern in U.S. society for sure, would be diabetes, and the group who are pre-diabetic (me). If insulin resistance *might* be going on, or is, even slightly then my doc figures don't tempt fate with so much simple sugar, even in the healthy form of fruit, but try to increase the complex carbs instead, to stabilize BS and not stress out the insulin producing and delivery system so much.
(My fasting BS hovers around 104 - 115)
Other that those, fruit is wonderful, compared to the simple sugars we *could* be eating!
Do you think that's probably why you remember always reading they should be limited? Makes sense to me, but I hate doing it. I love most of them, fresh, frozen, etc. You made me crave a smoothie, but I am waaaay too lazy to get out the blender - if I used it, then I'd have to {gasp} - clean it!! lol.
Posted by obsidian on March 30, 2009, at 0:38:25
In reply to How can fruit be bad for you?, posted by garnet71 on March 29, 2009, at 23:36:32
I think that's just because of the sugar, in the case of fruit-fructose, but since fruit comes along with fiber and lots of other good stuff it's far healthier than sweets would be
I suppose you could eat too much fruit, but we all know that's not what gets people into trouble
Posted by Sigismund on March 30, 2009, at 2:22:32
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you? » garnet71, posted by obsidian on March 30, 2009, at 0:38:25
Fruit is not a problem as long as the fibre is consumed.
It seems to be protective against adverse effects from the fructose.
Whether this is affected by blending fruit I have no idea.
Posted by garnet71 on March 30, 2009, at 12:31:09
In reply to How can fruit be bad for you?, posted by garnet71 on March 29, 2009, at 23:36:32
You guys are great :D
I remember the aspect of the fiber now that you mentioned it; i think i was mixing up the blood sugar affects of fruit juices rather than the whole fruit that has fiber, and leaving the skins on some (though eating pesticides is not good!)
I suppose any risk of a spike in blood sugar would be mitigated by the fiber aspect and could be helped by adding protein? like yogurt or milk?
It seems the benefits outweigh the risks. I've just been reading alot about the glycemic index lately, and of certain fruits and veggies (like corn is high) and wondered if that has adverse affects. Also, reading that excess blood sugar is one of the highest 'aging' factors you can do to your body has given me incentive to read up on this subject a bit more. Hey, I have to make up for the years I didn't take care of myself and at times, seemingly abused my body. Regrets, regrets...
10der, that was cute what you said about the blender. I don't even have a dishwasher, so I it doesn't make much of a difference to me. If you rinse the blender in hot water right after mixing, it cleans easier. it is a pain to wash it every day though, i hate seeing it unwashed on the counter if I need to make a smoothie. lol
BTW-Military acronyms ok with me.
Posted by desolationrower on March 31, 2009, at 22:51:44
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you?, posted by garnet71 on March 30, 2009, at 12:31:09
> I always hear it's because of the sugar content, yet I don't understand how fruit can be harmful to one's health.
>
> My son and I have been drinking a lot of fruit smoothies; I add greens to them too, like kale, parsely, cilantro-but not everyday 'cause my son always begs me to make the ones without green stuff in them, though he'll drink the green ones sometimes. It's hard for me to eat breakfast, but these work.
>well putting veg in your fruit smoothy sounds a bit ick (hippie), but there isn't a health problem here. Btw, the main thing that breakfast is good for is avoiding mornign hunger and eating lots of vending machine snacks. if i'm going to lose weight i usually do 20h fasting and then eat dinner.
> I'll mix up the fruits to mix up the vitamins and antioxidants-like I'll take a ripened banana (to sweeten), pear, frozen mixed berries, a kiwi, and some frozen papaya. Or apples, pinapple, frozen strawberries, etc. Usually have to add some orange juice or milk, water works too if out of those.
>
> Just think of all the vitamins and good stuff in these..Then I read all the time that fruits should be limited in diet.
>
> ???nutrition has one of the worst signal/noise ratios of anything i can think of.
>I can only think of 2 reasons: worry about weight gain and/or difficulty losing due to straight math >>> i.e., excess calories in, not enough exercise. It's so easy to consume a lot of daily calories with fruit
?? maybe fruit juice, but actual fruit is pretty good as far as satiety. fruit is one of the last things to worry about.
> as fructose delivers quite a few, but in a good way with other nutrients and fiber, too. The other concern in U.S. society for sure, would be diabetes, and the group who are pre-diabetic (me). If insulin resistance *might* be going on, or is, even slightly then my doc figures don't tempt fate with so much simple sugar, even in the healthy form of fruit, but try to increase the complex carbs instead, to stabilize BS and not stress out the insulin producing and delivery system so much.
ok. hm. arg.
fruit (and fructose generally) causes less insulin to be used than glucose (including 'complex carb' starch, which digests into glucose). Fructose (and galactose, from milk) is used by the liver (since most of the body can't use it) so it doesn't need insulin. The bad thing with fructose is if your liver is 'full', it can cause tryglyceride formation. So, solution->don't eat fructose when you're eating other things or have eaten recently; eat it when you're coming off a fast - like, you know, <i>breakfast</i>. At any rate, 'complex carbs' probably means grains, which are worse for prediabetic. legumes, those are pretty good. But for people who should restrict carbs, fruit is the most nutritious option. carb intake should generally follow activity level -> if you spend hours a week playing basketball, biking to work, whatever, more carbs. inactive, overweight ->few carbs. fats a bit more level and protein .5g/lbs for inactive, 1g/lbs if lift/endurance sports. most important though is diet is enjoyable and maintainable long terms without return to bad eating habits.
> You guys are great :Dthey are. unfortunately wading into food ideas makes me grumpy. :\
> I remember the aspect of the fiber now that you mentioned it; i think i was mixing up the blood sugar affects of fruit juices rather than the whole fruit that has fiber, and leaving the skins on some (though eating pesticides is not good!)
i never found a great answer to this, i think blending will result in finer particles than just chewing with teeth, but the fiber/sugar type etc. still results in reasonable gi. and skins are good.
> I suppose any risk of a spike in blood sugar would be mitigated by the fiber aspect and could be helped by adding protein? like yogurt or milk?
proteins or fat, yes (although milkfat=bad). one thing is that milk may bind to many of the polyphenol type components in teh fruit, which either delays their absorbtion or prevents it; this is analagous to teh binding milk does to harmful things. i still add yoghurt to my smoothies, though. i try to cluster my milk consumption during the day, but thats pretty crazy.
> It seems the benefits outweigh the risks. I've just been reading alot about the glycemic index lately, and of certain fruits and veggies (like corn is high) and wondered if that has adverse affects. Also, reading that excess blood sugar is one of the highest 'aging' factors you can do to your body has given me incentive to read up on this subject a bit more. Hey, I have to make up for the years I didn't take care of myself and at times, seemingly abused my body. Regrets, regrets...
more important if you are prediabetic; an analogy: As long as you aren't 'full' (liver and muscle stores of sugar), and your insulin and everything systems re working well, the amount/gi of carb isn't a big deal. Once you fill up, they start to overflow and mess stuff up. So being healthy weight, and exercising regularly (which deplete glycogen stores) allows for more carb intake. All the bad stuff from obesity/diabetes happens when your storage systems get full.
> 10der, that was cute what you said about the blender. I don't even have a dishwasher, so I it doesn't make much of a difference to me. If you rinse the blender in hot water right after mixing, it cleans easier. it is a pain to wash it every day though, i hate seeing it unwashed on the counter if I need to make a smoothie. lol
>
> BTW-Military acronyms ok with me.i make a full blender full and freeze them individually. it really is a lot of work ot make them.
ah. i feel a bit more relaxed now.
-d/r
Posted by Phillipa on March 31, 2009, at 23:53:07
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you?, posted by desolationrower on March 31, 2009, at 22:51:44
Protein shakes to stabalize blood sugar. Half a piece of fruit allowed but eat own fruit as fiber keeps things moving and slows down absorption of fructose so blood sugar stays stable. Too much fruit not good. Vegtables okay. But carrots are high in sugar content also. Love Phillipa
Posted by 10derHeart on April 1, 2009, at 16:59:36
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you?, posted by desolationrower on March 31, 2009, at 22:51:44
Sorry if I gave any incorrect information. I didn't mean to.
Posted by desolationrower on April 1, 2009, at 20:31:53
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you?, posted by 10derHeart on April 1, 2009, at 16:59:36
> Sorry if I gave any incorrect information. I didn't mean to.
oh, this is probably because of what i wrote? you were just passing on what your doc said. i do find it frustrating when professionals aren't aware of current research.
-d/r
Posted by garnet71 on April 2, 2009, at 20:27:08
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you?, posted by desolationrower on March 31, 2009, at 22:51:44
I didn't know you were a nutrionist too d/r. lol
Thanks for the education. I never knew that about the milk or that fruit is a better option than whole grains for some.
Blending, well according to greesmoothiegirl, allows more absorption of nutrients? But you have to have a good blender-the one I used doesn't break the particles down that small.
I agree about nutrition and signals/noise - its hard to sort through and it also has bipolar characteristics - one day something is good for you - the next day its bad.
It's important too for anxiety suffers. Blood sugar deviations are really bad for anxiety. I've tried to tell this to my son, who has adopted vending-machine breakfasts like I used to do when I was younger. He has ADD and anxiety, but contends pills make you worse. I worry about his health when he goes all day w/o eating, but at least he has a pain in the *ss mother who always tells him about nutrition and mental health. I keep telling him "you don't want to end up like me". Some of it sinks in-not all-but some.
Des, it's not as much work to make the smoothies if you buy the frozen berries (blueberries blackberries and strawberries). Saves a lot of time; they are already washed and cleaned. actually they are much fresher-1/2 the berries in the stores have mold in them if you look at the bottom of the container or real closely. But I get motivated to buy fresh pineapples when they are on sale for $1.99 - they are a pain. But good for grilling with fish or chicken too.
It's tough keeping up with healthful eating for anyone that suffers anxiety or depression, etc. When I'm at my worst, I've sometimes gone a few weeks cooking everything from scratch/nothing with a label, but then can't keep up with it. I go back and forth. It really is a lot of work. It seems though recently, my healthy stretches are a lot longer than they used to last, despite being ill.
Sorry you were grumpy :(
Posted by desolationrower on April 4, 2009, at 1:36:08
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you? » desolationrower, posted by garnet71 on April 2, 2009, at 20:27:08
oh, i have never even though of buying fresh berries. i wonder what kind of person would, they seem decadent that way.
(and being grumpy can be fun.)
-des
Posted by garnet71 on April 4, 2009, at 6:30:34
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you? » garnet71, posted by desolationrower on April 4, 2009, at 1:36:08
you are cute when you're grumpy
Posted by Phillipa on April 4, 2009, at 21:23:10
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you? » garnet71, posted by desolationrower on April 4, 2009, at 1:36:08
Well grumpy if you have no taste and smell like me fresh blackberries on cereal can taste the sourness of them so wouldn't be without them. So it's des now getting closer to a real first name. Can you solve my problem? I spend too much money on the berries year round. Ummm what does other food taste like forgot??? Love Phillipa
Posted by desolationrower on April 4, 2009, at 22:30:26
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you? » desolationrower, posted by Phillipa on April 4, 2009, at 21:23:10
how can eating lots of berries be a problem? they are so very healthy. i don't think i have a strong sense of taste, so i end up eating lots of very spicy food, esp. curry.
-d/r
Posted by Phillipa on April 5, 2009, at 0:11:12
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you?, posted by desolationrower on April 4, 2009, at 22:30:26
des it's not bad for me I get some taste. Seriously you don't taste well either? Someone said some meds can alter taste or take it away. We need to talk as went to two taste and smell centers and both said I got a virus in the neurons of my nose and it distroyed the smell receptors no smell no tasted. Only taste buds sweet, sour, bitter, spicy. Love Phillipa/ Jan
Posted by desolationrower on April 6, 2009, at 3:58:10
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you? » desolationrower, posted by Phillipa on April 5, 2009, at 0:11:12
wow a virus? do you remember it happening when you got sick once?
thats sounds much worse than i've got. i just often don't smell things others notice, and need way more spices on my food than most people. also not too good at telling apart beers or wines or chocolates or that kind of thing.
-d/r
Posted by Phillipa on April 6, 2009, at 19:41:31
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you?, posted by desolationrower on April 6, 2009, at 3:58:10
d/r that's the thing never even had a cold but had just had prk lasix surgery on eyes to correct distance so no glasses and it worked. Could the laser have ruined the receptors in nose? No smell no taste. Love Phillipa
Posted by desolationrower on April 8, 2009, at 18:12:09
In reply to Re: How can fruit be bad for you? » desolationrower, posted by Phillipa on April 6, 2009, at 19:41:31
hm, probably not the lasix. that is odd.
-d/r
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