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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by linkadge on December 21, 2004, at 12:39:20
I understand that SJW, and Ginkgo have mild MAO-B inhibiting properties. Are there any vitamins, minerals, or other herbs which have an effect on MAO-B ?
Linkadge
Posted by Mistermindmasta on December 21, 2004, at 13:43:36
In reply to Naturally modifying MAO-B, posted by linkadge on December 21, 2004, at 12:39:20
> I understand that SJW, and Ginkgo have mild MAO-B inhibiting properties. Are there any vitamins, minerals, or other herbs which have an effect on MAO-B ?
>
> LinkadgeCertain studies showed that Kava inhibited MAO-B. If I had to determine whether I "felt" like this was true from my personal experience of kava and knowledge of the effects of MAO-B inhibition, I'd say that Kava does indeed have this effect, but only in higher doses. If not, I cannot determine what causes the increased energy and motivation that I feel after 3 or 4 days of about 300 - 400 mg lactones / day.
Rhodiola might inhibit MAO-B, but the studies are not very legit, so who knows.
Posted by jujube on December 21, 2004, at 14:11:49
In reply to Re: Naturally modifying MAO-B, posted by Mistermindmasta on December 21, 2004, at 13:43:36
> > I understand that SJW, and Ginkgo have mild MAO-B inhibiting properties. Are there any vitamins, minerals, or other herbs which have an effect on MAO-B ?
> >
> > Linkadge
>
> Certain studies showed that Kava inhibited MAO-B. If I had to determine whether I "felt" like this was true from my personal experience of kava and knowledge of the effects of MAO-B inhibition, I'd say that Kava does indeed have this effect, but only in higher doses. If not, I cannot determine what causes the increased energy and motivation that I feel after 3 or 4 days of about 300 - 400 mg lactones / day.
>
> Rhodiola might inhibit MAO-B, but the studies are not very legit, so who knows.
>
>In the lengthy literature I got when I purchased Rhodiola, it says that Rhodiola does not inhibit, but balances momoamine oxidase and aldehyde dehydrogenase, which are the two enzymes responsible for limiting the production of serotonin in the brain. It goes on to say that it is not an MAO inhibitor, such as St. John's Wort or any of the pharmaceutical MAO inhibiting drugs.
I just start using Rhodiola (2 days ago), but it is too early to says whether it has an effect (either positive or negative) yet. About a week ago, I also added 7.5 mg of NADH (3 - 4 times a week) and 250 mg of DMAE. I will likely increase the dose of NADH to 10 mg next week. I have noticed positive effects on motivation, energy and mood when I added these two natural supplements. Whether these positive effects will be sustained in the long term is something to be seen.
Tamara
Posted by linkadge on December 21, 2004, at 14:26:12
In reply to Re: Naturally modifying MAO-B, posted by jujube on December 21, 2004, at 14:11:49
I read that the herb fo-ti can inhibit MAO-B quite extensivly. I purchased some (rather inexpensivly) at my local health food store, and will give it a whirl. I am very attuned to drug effects, so we will see if I can detect anything.
Linkadge
Posted by jujube on December 21, 2004, at 15:28:10
In reply to Re: Naturally modifying MAO-B, posted by linkadge on December 21, 2004, at 14:26:12
Cool. I can't wait to hear how your trial with the Fo-ti goes. Guess what, Fo-ti goes on my list of things to try if the NADH, DMAE and Rhodiola don't pan out. You know, you would make a great Naturopathic doctor. You know so much about this stuff. You're as smart of a whip! Good work man!
Tamara
> I read that the herb fo-ti can inhibit MAO-B quite extensivly. I purchased some (rather inexpensivly) at my local health food store, and will give it a whirl. I am very attuned to drug effects, so we will see if I can detect anything.
>
>
> Linkadge
Posted by linkadge on December 21, 2004, at 15:33:19
In reply to Re: Naturally modifying MAO-B » linkadge, posted by jujube on December 21, 2004, at 15:28:10
I don't know how selectivly it inhibits MAO-B though. It may have effects on MAO-A, in which case I have to watch for interaction with the celexa.
Linkadge
Posted by jujube on December 21, 2004, at 18:31:53
In reply to Re: Naturally modifying MAO-B, posted by linkadge on December 21, 2004, at 15:33:19
I'm pretty new at this stuff, so I am going to ask probably an obvious question and, no doubt, a stupid one. What is the difference between MAO-B and MAO-A and why would the two differ in terms of interaction with ADs, particularly Celexa?
Thanks.
Tamara
> I don't know how selectivly it inhibits MAO-B though. It may have effects on MAO-A, in which case I have to watch for interaction with the celexa.
>
> Linkadge
Posted by linkadge on December 21, 2004, at 20:01:38
In reply to Re: Naturally modifying MAO-B » linkadge, posted by jujube on December 21, 2004, at 18:31:53
MAO-B acts to metabolize primarily dopamine, and norepinephrine, whereas MAO-A acts to metabolize serotonin, and norepinephrine (a bit of overlap)
Anyhow, if the herb acts to inhibit MAO-B only, then I would likely get a boost in norepinephrine and dopamine. However, it it inhibits MAO-A as well then it could drive serotonin levels too high and create serotonin syndrome. This is why they say not to combine SSRI's with MAOI's. However this restriction does not apply to selective MAO-B inhibitors like L-deprenyl.
Linkadge
Posted by jujube on December 21, 2004, at 20:07:29
In reply to Re: Naturally modifying MAO-B, posted by linkadge on December 21, 2004, at 20:01:38
Thanks for the explanation. Now I understand. I hope I don't run into problems combining the Rhodiola with Anafranil (I'm only taking 25 mg). It's been two days since I started the Rhodiola, and I have not experienced any adverse effects. So, I think I should be ok.
Good luck with the Fo-Ti. Hope it helps you.
Tamara
Posted by KaraS on December 21, 2004, at 22:40:17
In reply to Re: Naturally modifying MAO-B, posted by linkadge on December 21, 2004, at 20:01:38
> MAO-B acts to metabolize primarily dopamine, and norepinephrine, whereas MAO-A acts to metabolize serotonin, and norepinephrine (a bit of overlap)
>
> Anyhow, if the herb acts to inhibit MAO-B only, then I would likely get a boost in norepinephrine and dopamine. However, it it inhibits MAO-A as well then it could drive serotonin levels too high and create serotonin syndrome. This is why they say not to combine SSRI's with MAOI's. However this restriction does not apply to selective MAO-B inhibitors like L-deprenyl.
>
> Linkadge
Just wanted to add that L-deprenyl is only selective for MAO-B in dosages of 10 mg. or less.
Posted by linkadge on December 22, 2004, at 10:30:23
In reply to Re: Naturally modifying MAO-B » linkadge, posted by KaraS on December 21, 2004, at 22:40:17
This is true.
Linkadge
Posted by gromit on January 7, 2005, at 5:33:55
In reply to Re: Naturally modifying MAO-B, posted by linkadge on December 21, 2004, at 14:26:12
> I read that the herb fo-ti can inhibit MAO-B quite extensivly. I purchased some (rather inexpensivly) at my local health food store, and will give it a whirl. I am very attuned to drug effects, so we will see if I can detect anything.
It's been a little while, do you have anything to report?
Thanks
Rick
Posted by linkadge on January 10, 2005, at 20:00:46
In reply to Re: Naturally modifying MAO-B, posted by gromit on January 7, 2005, at 5:33:55
It worked, but read it causes hepatic failure. Had to stop.
Linkadge
Posted by Chairman_MAO on January 11, 2005, at 16:22:38
In reply to Naturally modifying MAO-B, posted by linkadge on December 21, 2004, at 12:39:20
If you're adventurous, you could try getting your hands on some isatin, which is the body's own MAO-B inhibitor. If you find an herb which contains this chemical, I'd try that herb.
Posted by gromit on January 16, 2005, at 0:54:40
In reply to Re: Naturally modifying MAO-B, posted by linkadge on January 10, 2005, at 20:00:46
> It worked, but read it causes hepatic failure. Had to stop.
Hmmm, I tried it anyway and didn't notice anything, but I am not tuned in at all to drug responses anyway, it would have to really clobber me to register at all. With supplements I usually can only tell what the effects are when I stop taking it. Maybe I should try it with some Tyrosine or DLPA, didn't think of that till right now. Do you have a link that talks about the liver problems?
Thanks
Rick
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